Why were people complaining about "Hide and go res"?

General Discussion
01/28/2018 05:14 PMPosted by Nebbyindabag
Mercy is literally a walking target
Too bad she is flying.

01/28/2018 05:14 PMPosted by Nebbyindabag
she cannot defend herself and your acting in a scenario where you got a 5 man kill that also happens to have mercy as the sole survivor which is not likely, since she is so fragile.
Because they hid behind a wall or on the roof near/on the point, just waiting for them to die, add in that she got invulnerable while popping her ult, you had to act incredibly quick to be able to shut her down.
Every ult you listed can be canceled and negated during its duration, except for Mercy.
01/28/2018 05:01 PMPosted by Mouse534
Repositioning to maximize DPS is not hiding, they are not the same thing.


"Repositioning to maximize Resurrect is not hiding, they are not the same thing"

01/28/2018 05:19 PMPosted by SpaceJester
Every ult you listed can be canceled and negated during its duration, except for Mercy.


Which is why tons of people have suggested bringing back old Rez, but nerfing it so she can be countered a bit more easily, similar to how her Rez is right now. Dont forget that she didnt always have invulnerability during Rez. They added her invulnerability because it was always a suicide mission to try for a big Rez on point.
01/28/2018 04:50 PMPosted by Velociraptor
01/28/2018 04:02 PMPosted by Crypticarts
The big problem was that you would have a Mercy on your team who wouldnt do her job, she would let you all die on the point, come in rez. You all would flounder for a bit extending the fight. Get wiped out and lose the game. You lose a bunch of SR and the Mercy won a bunch of SR for her game changing move.


Why would Mercy gain SR if she lost the game? She would lose SR as well.


We asked ourselves the same question, but thats how it was happening.
01/28/2018 05:14 PMPosted by Nebbyindabag
Mercy is literally a walking target
Too bad she is flying.

... Mercy 1.0 doesn't fly.

01/28/2018 05:14 PMPosted by Nebbyindabag
she cannot defend herself and your acting in a scenario where you got a 5 man kill that also happens to have mercy as the sole survivor which is not likely, since she is so fragile.
01/28/2018 05:17 PMPosted by KaKao
Because they hid behind a wall or on the roof near/on the point, just waiting for them to die, add in that she got invulnerable while popping her ult, you had to act incredibly quick to be able to shut her down.
People like Tracer and Genji can just... y'know... go behind that wall and kill her? and how would Mercy get on the roof?
My personal experience is that a lot of the time people cried about a hiding Mercy it was just a Mercy out of sight (and no, those are not the same thing).

People argue whether Pharah or Genji is Mercy's true love, when in reality everyone who plays her knows her undying love is for corners.
People don't like winning a fight, just to have Mercy fly in and reset it for them. At that point the winning team might be several players down, so rez was an easy win for engagements unless both teams had a Mercy.

It got to the point where people planned every engagement around rez because having two chances is easier than simply playing better than the enemy. This also meant Mercy's gameplay was very limited because it was her one job to heal, get her ult, then use it to win a fight.
Everything you just mentioned needs line of sight and has either an activation time or deals its effect over time so none of this is applicable.
01/28/2018 05:46 PMPosted by Terranguard
Everything you just mentioned needs line of sight and has either an activation time or deals its effect over time so none of this is applicable.
since when did junkrat and d.va need LOS? and I'm not opposed to making huge res need LOS, so thats a good idea
OP appears to be confusing flanking with hiding with points 1-3.
I agree with point 4, junkrat does hide when using his ult, however the rip-tire is very counterable and junkrat is a sitting duck if not in a good position.
Point 5 is getting a bit ridiculous, D.Va "hiding" behind a wall to use her ult, lol. Using terrain to help the ult be successful is not hiding, the bomb still needs to go off on top of their heads too.

Rez in an FPS is just a straight up bad mechanic and an incredibly powerful one at that. It should be ridiculously hard to pull off, especially bringing an entire team back from the dead.
If Mercy 1.0 were to return, it would have to be altered to something along the lines of so that she cannot cast it through walls, has no invincibility AND keeps the 1.75 second cast time.

Getting off a 5 man Res would be (and should be) virtually impossible and only allowed through the enemy team making a huge error in judgement. If she does it with 1 or 2 alive then the probability of it getting off increases, but still tough, and so on.
01/28/2018 04:10 PMPosted by HANA
She sould be healing instead of leaving her team to die on purpose just to get a potg.


This would have been easily fixable, though.

For example.. decay her ult's radius if she isn't actively healing. Now she can't get 5 teammates because her radius sucks.
It was blizzard that didnt like the hide and go res, and they used there prerogative as the developers of the game to change it to a more active role.
Mccree, Pharah and reaper can all be knocked out of ultimate by cc, or killed before they deal more than marginal damage, or just shielded, riptyre is killable (not so easily anymore but it's there.
All those ultimates have counterplay, res as ultimate was stupid, especially on final point 2cp you would often have mercy players literally hiding in spawn where they couldn't receive damage, you either got a lucky flash before she uses ultimate (she still has it btw) and kill her, or you have to fight up to 5 enemies you just wiped with ultimate combos.
01/28/2018 06:30 PMPosted by Auro
It was blizzard that didnt like the hide and go res, and they used there prerogative as the developers of the game to change it to a more active role.


Sure.

But they could have fixed that WITHOUT revamping Mercy into the constant nerf machine she is now.
As someone who wants Mercy reverted her Ult couldn't be blocked by barrier or LOS unlike DPS ults. She needed tweaking, not reworked
01/28/2018 06:31 PMPosted by Asryam
Mccree, Pharah and reaper can all be knocked out of ultimate by cc, or killed before they deal more than marginal damage, or just shielded, riptyre is killable (not so easily anymore but it's there.
All those ultimates have counterplay, res as ultimate was stupid, especially on final point 2cp you would often have mercy players literally hiding in spawn where they couldn't receive damage, you either got a lucky flash before she uses ultimate (she still has it btw) and kill her, or you have to fight up to 5 enemies you just wiped with ultimate combos.

You miss the fact that Mercy has to fly to the teammates to get to them and rez. you can use a boop for her too. And plus, when mercy is flying/walking to the dead teammates, you can kill her easily (especially with a roadhog with his combo or a well aimed widow headshot).
Because it became somewhat of a exploit; the team that lets themselves die on point is practically rewarded for it. People eventually realized this and Mercy players would tell everyone to die on point just so she can fly in and give them that game changing Rez. It gave the team that had a Mercy a huge advantage because they could counter multiple ults with just one ult in the blink of an eye.

On a side note, it made attacking on 2CP even worse.
01/28/2018 06:31 PMPosted by Asryam
Mccree, Pharah and reaper can all be knocked out of ultimate by cc, or killed before they deal more than marginal damage, or just shielded, riptyre is killable (not so easily anymore but it's there.
All those ultimates have counterplay, res as ultimate was stupid, especially on final point 2cp you would often have mercy players literally hiding in spawn where they couldn't receive damage, you either got a lucky flash before she uses ultimate (she still has it btw) and kill her, or you have to fight up to 5 enemies you just wiped with ultimate combos.


Rez had counterplay. It's called "Don't be morons." If you flippin' KNOW the other team has a Mercy and that Mercy isn't fighting.. well, it would be kind of stupid of you to go in blowing your ults left and right.

Anyway, it's not like there weren't options to fix hiding and rezzing. They just never bothered for some reason. I don't know why.

Also, that spawn problem was like the easiest fix ever - disable ults in the spawn. Problem solved. Not like anyone needs to use ults in there in the first place. You really have to wonder why the hell they didn't do that almost instantly.
01/28/2018 06:39 PMPosted by AurielsLight
Because it became somewhat of a exploit; the team that lets themselves die on point is practically rewarded for it. People eventually realized this and Mercy players would tell everyone to die on point just so she can fly in and give them that game changing Rez. It gave the team that had a Mercy a huge advantage because they could counter multiple ults with just one ult in the blink of an eye.

On a side note, it made attacking on 2CP even worse.


The scenario you're describing could have been fixed. That's my gripe about it - we had this going on for how long?

And their solution was a Mercy 2.0 that's up for, what, her 5th change in 4 months? So, objectively, is Mercy 2.0 actually any better from a balancing standpoint? I'd argue no.
Strategic retreat I am fine with, actually watching Mercy standing there and seeing her allies die (on purpose) while not doing anything. That was the problem, feels bad man; whether playing her or not.

Her positioning at that point did not feel liked it mattered, because she flew in to the same position she would be if actively healing and ult. It would not have been a problem (in my opinion), if she never left, but she did. Players would generally leave immediately after obtaining ult, going passive mode.

Its similar to the issues peeps have with sym, they both would run off somewhere and stop providing their utility at the moment. They go from feeling active, to feeling passive. It breaks the feel, that was the prob.

Passivity is the main culprit issue in this game, where the lowest powered champs are those that are the most passive (real/perceived). Most players of overwatch want to participate, and feel bad when they don't feel that way. Likewise, teammates want to see activity as well, and this is a issue from shooters in general. Why camping is always complained about, why mines are problematic, etc.

It really culminated by the fact ults are powerful in general, and passive ults piss peeps off the most.

The character goes from actively doing something, to passively doing something. While these cases that you brought up are now 'turned off', they feel like they are actively looking for applied DPS; not passively providing it. Though I am in agreement with you here about channel ults feeling awkward though. But, if we started seeing this issue with player base for these champs, they too would receive changes.

It caused play style choices that felt contradictory to play/face her. As THE healing champ it, felt off to me. Then again, I think the new ult is WAY better then the mass res in general.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum