About that Doomfist buff...

General Discussion
02/07/2018 06:23 PMPosted by Geoff Goodman
Doomfist actually has a couple things coming, one change is coming in the next update.

The change that is coming soon will help make his primary fire more consistent. We've increased the number of bullets that he fires, but lowered their individual damage. The net result is the same damage over time, but there shouldn't be as much variance from shot to the next. Along the same lines, we've changed his spread pattern to help consistency as well.

There is at least one more change we're testing that wont hit until a little bit later, which you guys still see once we get closer to the next PTR (as Jeff noted)

You guys know what you do. Despite people on the forum often disagreeing with devs, I think it's ok to give their changes a chance before judging what went right or wrong. My problem with this particular change that it isn't what Doomfist needs. Like, not even close. Why I disagree even before this change goes to live?

There was amount of questionable decisions like recent Junkrat nerf when you reworked his mines, despite people saying that main problem with Junk was that he gets his ult too quickly. But ok, that's a balance change, and devs surely know better what hero needs. I understand that.

But in case with Doomfist, his primary rework is still 100% not the right direction to go. Because hero is still bugged! When it comes to bugs, there is no question whether it's right or not that hero has bugs - bugs should be FIXED and as soon as possible, and it should be main goal for developers to find and fix any bugs that plague their game. You don't even have to find them - there is a whole bunch of threads like this one - https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20760618494 where people from the community did developer's job for them and thoroughly explained what bugs hero has. And what are your actions?

Reworking primary fire!

Reworking the only ability in Doomfist's kit that has no bugs whatsoever, just unfortunate RNG. You do understand that no amount such buffs can be enough if every hero's ability has ton of bugs that make him inconsistent, broken and frustrating to play?

Why are you buffing Doomfist?
FIX HIM FIRST


People are literally begging for you to fix Doomfist for months, and only thing you did is you made his Seismic Slam not cancel itself anymore. That's literally the only thing you actually fixed! Rocket Punch hitbox is still non-existent, people still slide off walls, Moira, Zarya and Reaper still can escape wall impact with their abilities for some reason, uppercut still has no vertical hitbox, his ult is still blocked by random ledges...
And you decide to rework his primary fire.

Please someone explain to me why developers think it is more important than bugfixes. Please. I genuinely have no clue what's going on anymore.
The buffs are deserved. Even when he works properly, it's quite apparent how bad he is in most situations. Over half the roster counters him, his hitbox is gigantic for having 250 hp, he's easy to kill in general, and the amount of skill required to play him against intelligent players is often absurb and often requires your team to carry you. Even in those few weeks when he did work properly for the most part (before the movement changes screwed everything up again), he was still pretty underwhelming.

Hand Cannon changes are good, hopefully Tracer or Genji will stop surviving 2 well aimed shots randomly because the spread pattern decided to screw you over. Rocket punch hitbox needs a buff though. Ghost punches are gone more or less but it's more prevelant now than ever before how small the hitbox is, even moreso since it was discovered how much rocket punching actually shrinks Doomfist.
The buffs are deserved. Even in those few weeks when he work correctly for the most part, (before the movement changes screwed him all up again), he was still pretty underwhelming. Every aspect of his kit could use touching up but for now they seem to be doing small changes.

Hand Cannon changes are good, hopefully Tracer will stop surviving 2 well aimed shots randomly because the spread pattern decided to screw you over. Rocket punch hitbox needs a buff though. Ghost punches are gone more or less but it's more prevelant now than ever before how small the hitbox is, even moreso since it was discovered how much rocket punching actually shrinks Doomfist.

But it can all wait. I don't care if he is underwhelming. I want to stop getting frustrated because of how buggy he is. After they fix his bugs - they can buff or nerf him all they want. They need to make him WORK first, before doing any adjustments... That's what actually Jeff said himself. But here we are - Doomfist is still broken, and is getting buffed. What.
02/08/2018 03:23 AMPosted by Iustus
The buffs are deserved. Even in those few weeks when he work correctly for the most part, (before the movement changes screwed him all up again), he was still pretty underwhelming. Every aspect of his kit could use touching up but for now they seem to be doing small changes.

Hand Cannon changes are good, hopefully Tracer will stop surviving 2 well aimed shots randomly because the spread pattern decided to screw you over. Rocket punch hitbox needs a buff though. Ghost punches are gone more or less but it's more prevelant now than ever before how small the hitbox is, even moreso since it was discovered how much rocket punching actually shrinks Doomfist.

But it can all wait. I don't care if he is underwhelming. I want to stop getting frustrated because of how buggy he is. After they fix his bugs - they can buff or nerf him all they want. They need to make him WORK first, before doing any adjustments... That's what actually Jeff said himself. But here we are - Doomfist is still broken, and is getting buffed. What.

Most Doomfist threads recently have been screaming for buffs more than fixes, so I suppose you can't please everyone at once.
Even with bugs fixed. I think his biggest problem is survivability. He’s food for snipers because he has to put himself in the enemy teams face. Also his punch makes him extremely vunerable because you have to sit in place to even use it. I think his passive needs a buff and give him 100 more health is what he needs. He’s a big target that has has to come to you.
02/08/2018 03:23 AMPosted by Iustus
...
But it can all wait. I don't care if he is underwhelming. I want to stop getting frustrated because of how buggy he is. After they fix his bugs - they can buff or nerf him all they want. They need to make him WORK first, before doing any adjustments... That's what actually Jeff said himself. But here we are - Doomfist is still broken, and is getting buffed. What.

Most Doomfist threads recently have been screaming for buffs more than fixes, so I suppose you can't please everyone at once.

But that's the point of my post... Balance changes are one thing and can be questionable, while bugs that plague an AAA game for months should be FIXED no matter what.
This primary rework isn't even a buff... They just swapped numbers 6 and 11, so you have 11 pellets that deals 6 damage each. That'll make him worse against tanks lol.
02/08/2018 03:31 AMPosted by GildTesoro
Even with bugs fixed. I think his biggest problem is survivability. He’s food for snipers because he has to put himself in the enemy teams face. Also his punch makes him extremely vunerable because you have to sit in place to even use it. I think his passive needs a buff and give him 100 more health is what he needs. He’s a big target that has has to come to you.

If he was working maybe he wouldn't need survivability buffs. Dunno. We can't know until he is fixed. Which is apparently never.
02/08/2018 03:32 AMPosted by Iustus
02/08/2018 03:31 AMPosted by GildTesoro
Even with bugs fixed. I think his biggest problem is survivability. He’s food for snipers because he has to put himself in the enemy teams face. Also his punch makes him extremely vunerable because you have to sit in place to even use it. I think his passive needs a buff and give him 100 more health is what he needs. He’s a big target that has has to come to you.

If he was working maybe he wouldn't need survivability buffs. Dunno. We can't know until he is fixed. Which is apparently never.

Even when he works properly it's apparent he needs suitability buffs.
02/08/2018 03:34 AMPosted by UNBREAKABLE
02/08/2018 03:32 AMPosted by Iustus
...
If he was working maybe he wouldn't need survivability buffs. Dunno. We can't know until he is fixed. Which is apparently never.

Even when he works properly it's apparent he needs suitability buffs.

Maybe. There are no such buffs though, even in patchnotes. Nor there are any bugfixes. Just handcannon rework. It's hilarious if you think about it.
I actually really like the sound of this buff, the one area I suffer the most in while playing Doomfist (aside from the bugs, but I haven't noticed them as much really), is in the periods between abilities when I have to shoot enemies. Many times I'll miss because of the wonky spread pattern, and often come up short in the amount of shots and die. More consistency for Doomfist all around would be a good thing.

I agree that his bugs need to be fixed, but even if they are he is still objectively bad without buffs.
Yes i agree that Doomfist need buff, but bugfix is the more important part. Still, im happy that they acknowledge theres something not right with Doomfist and has taken an action in buffing him. Lets just hope the buff will work and they'll fix him sooner.
You didn't mention 3 damage nerf "buff" vs armored targets.

Lowering RNG is great, but nerfs to doomfist? madness.
Blizzard avoiding to fix Doomfist bugs is like a sitcom series.
02/08/2018 04:11 AMPosted by iSinner
You didn't mention 3 damage nerf "buff" vs armored targets.

Lowering RNG is great, but nerfs to doomfist? madness.

In general it will probably be about the same damage to armored heroes if more of the pellets are going to be landing on their head each shot. Not a huge deal in the end, overall much better against the roster. Fair trade off I think, honestly the handcannon was probably the least of Doomfist's problems, it's just the RNG behind it was really annoying.
You could also link my last bug thread, which is accurate to current bugs STILL present in the game, instead of the old one.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20760618494

02/08/2018 03:06 AMPosted by Iustus
People are literally begging for you to fix Doomfist for months, and only thing you did is you made his Seismic Slam not cancel itself anymore. That's literally the only thing you actually fixed

This is not fixed, if you look into my thread, its still in the game and happens on a regular basis.
02/08/2018 04:21 AMPosted by iSinner
You could also link my last bug thread, which is accurate to current bugs STILL present in the game, instead of the old one.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20760618494

02/08/2018 03:06 AMPosted by Iustus
People are literally begging for you to fix Doomfist for months, and only thing you did is you made his Seismic Slam not cancel itself anymore. That's literally the only thing you actually fixed

This is not fixed, if you look into my thread, its still in the game and happens on a regular basis.

Sorry, I'll link this one. Forgot the title of a new thread =)
And about Seismic Slam - I have around 200 hours on Doomfist and thought it was fine. There is no more canceling on 11 damage when you use it on the flat ground. If you are talking about SS canceling itself when you hit some obstacles or payload, yeah, that still happens. But it's not that big of a deal... You can play whole round without encountering this bug. Which is huge for Doomfist lol.
His primary fire is terrible, I'm glad to see they're trying to make it more consistent. I swear sometimes it felt like I'd have the crosshairs on someone's face who is like 4 feet in front of me and all of his bullets would miss, then other times I'd headshot a Pharah in mid air from 200 feet.

I do agree that he needs more than this though. He needs something to make his gigantic frame a little more survivable since he's so reliant on abilities that have cooldowns. He needs some sort of 'block' or defensive ability. Dude is a sitting duck in between moves, unlike someone like Genji who can smoothly combo all of his abilities, primary fire, passive movements, and just be a nightmare the whole time(in the right hands). Doomfist has too much downtime to be a be a legitimate threat in a fight like the other DPS heroes.
His primary fire is terrible, I'm glad to see they're trying to make it more consistent. I swear sometimes it felt like I'd have the crosshairs on someone's face who is like 4 feet in front of me and all of his bullets would miss.

I do agree that he needs more than this though. He needs something to make his gigantic frame a little more survivable since he's so reliant on abilities that have cooldowns. He needs some sort of 'block' or defensive ability. Dude is a sitting duck in between moves, unlike someone like Genji who can smoothly combo all of his abilities, primary fire, passive movements, and just be a nightmare the whole time(in the right hands). Doomfist has too much downtime to be a be a legitimate threat in a fight like the other DPS heroes.

Nah. He is fine in that regard. You initiate with rocket punch, use two other abilities in a combo, then disengage with rocket punch again, since it has lowest cooldown. He also can escape with ult. Bugs are what truly make him unplayable, but as for his playstyle, you just need quite some time to figure out how he works.
Though one of my old suggestions was to make him gain his ult faster. His ult is crap anyway, so having his best escape tool ready more often wouldn't hurt much.
I'm a firm believer that DF doesn't need any buffs after bug fixes.

From an ex-GM Doomfist main.
why even bother, its been moths since his release, all they done nerf and left him there, i like df but blizz dont, they are to busy making skins need sum more profit, they sold unfinished game without story its like EA game :D

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