"Tracer is balanced she just has no counters"

General Discussion
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02/07/2018 04:51 PMPosted by solfizz
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https://www.overbuff.com/heroes

An overall losing winrate and a 3.52% pickrate is a problem now? Yes, she does get better pickrate as you go up the ranks, but that's good game design. More skill should mean more reward. Also her winrate is comparable to all the other offensive heroes in high levels.


That's not a good metric to go by and I suspect you know just as much. So Symmetra is overpowered and Winston is underpowered too then?

There are a lot of people who play Overwatch, many who play simpler characters, but also a portion of whom try someone advanced like Tracer who don't utilize her properly and hence the statistics we have. With improved skill, Tracer outshines the others. On Page 4 I've made a suggestion that would make it not so detrimental to the lower ranks, but hopefully would affect those who are more mechanically gifted.


But she's not clearly the best DPS as you claim. For the average player, she's a liability to have on your team. Blizzard goes on a lot about the "perception" of balance and it's clearly shown with Tracer. People see she's doing well in the pros and just assume she's clearly the best when in reality she has mediocre performance for the large majority of the player base.
02/07/2018 03:43 AMPosted by Mango
She has counters but they just arent used because theyre deemed useless or troll pick.
Watch Jardio one hit t500 tracers all day on Mei ....... Watch Fitzy kill T500 tracers on Sombra all day ...... The counters are in game its just ppl don't play them or they lack the skill accumulated over time with that hero .
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That's not a good metric to go by and I suspect you know just as much. So Symmetra is overpowered and Winston is underpowered too then?

There are a lot of people who play Overwatch, many who play simpler characters, but also a portion of whom try someone advanced like Tracer who don't utilize her properly and hence the statistics we have. With improved skill, Tracer outshines the others. On Page 4 I've made a suggestion that would make it not so detrimental to the lower ranks, but hopefully would affect those who are more mechanically gifted.


But she's not clearly the best DPS as you claim. For the average player, she's a liability to have on your team. Blizzard goes on a lot about the "perception" of balance and it's clearly shown with Tracer. People see she's doing well in the pros and just assume she's clearly the best when in reality she has mediocre performance for the large majority of the player base.


True about the vast majority of the player base not doing well with her, but that goes back to my point that she's an advanced character who benefits the most from time and skill investment. It's okay to have a character who excels the more you invest into them, but not at the expense of the rest of the cast underperforming in comparison.
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But she's not clearly the best DPS as you claim. For the average player, she's a liability to have on your team. Blizzard goes on a lot about the "perception" of balance and it's clearly shown with Tracer. People see she's doing well in the pros and just assume she's clearly the best when in reality she has mediocre performance for the large majority of the player base.


True about the vast majority of the player base not doing well with her, but that goes back to my point that she's an advanced character who benefits the most from time and skill investment. It's okay to have a character who excels the more you invest into them, but not at the expense of the rest of the cast underperforming in comparison.


They are not remotely underperforming. And something else to point out, she herself doesn't counter anyone, and literally anyone can kill her. She's not like Pharah or some other character where you need to switch off to a counter to win. You play the matchup well, and you win.

She doesn't invalidate any character in the game. There's no oh good, they have a Tracer. I need to switch off X. Strong counters ruin freedom of choice in the game.
02/07/2018 05:14 PMPosted by Dances
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True about the vast majority of the player base not doing well with her, but that goes back to my point that she's an advanced character who benefits the most from time and skill investment. It's okay to have a character who excels the more you invest into them, but not at the expense of the rest of the cast underperforming in comparison.


They are not remotely underperforming. And something else to point out, she herself doesn't counter anyone, and literally anyone can kill her. She's not like Pharah or some other character where you need to switch off to a counter to win. You play the matchup well, and you win.

She doesn't invalidate any character in the game. There's no oh good, they have a Tracer. I need to switch off X. Strong counters ruin freedom of choice in the game.


How can you say that about other heroes not underperforming with a competent Tracer on the field? I don't think she's grossly overpowered, but it's obvious that skillful Tracers more than the majority of the OW cast make short work of the other team.

In your honest opinion, seeing as you play as Tracer the majority of your games, do you think that she's really balanced? My top played heroes are Winston and Tracer respectively and with Winston it's a "maybe" but with Tracer, it's a resounding no. So I ask you to do the same and try to be unbiased.

Again balance is not simply how well she scales with skill - yes, while that is a good characteristic - but how does she fare with everything else factored in?
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They are not remotely underperforming. And something else to point out, she herself doesn't counter anyone, and literally anyone can kill her. She's not like Pharah or some other character where you need to switch off to a counter to win. You play the matchup well, and you win.

She doesn't invalidate any character in the game. There's no oh good, they have a Tracer. I need to switch off X. Strong counters ruin freedom of choice in the game.


How can you say that about other heroes not underperforming with a competent Tracer on the field? I don't think she's grossly overpowered, but it's obvious that skillful Tracers more than the majority of the OW cast make short work of the other team.

In your honest opinion, seeing as you play as Tracer the majority of your games, do you think that she's really balanced? My top played heroes are Winston and Tracer respectively and with Winston it's a "maybe" but with Tracer, it's a resounding no. So I ask you to do the same and try to be unbiased.

Again balance is not simply how well she scales with skill - yes, while that is a good characteristic - but how does she fare with everything else factored in?


Considering that I've been out played by every other character in the game, yes. If the other player is better than me, I will lose to them.

I've also never played against a Tracer that felt oppressive. I'm an average player so my experience is pretty indicative of most of the player base.

I feel like I can deal with her because I know her tricks and I know what annoys her. Conversely, I played against Genjis who ran away with the game. Is Genji OP? No. I just don't know how to deal with him because I don't play him.
Jeff will answer in this way to this topic lol

"Why all characters must have a counter"? "All the gorilas can climb up but overwatch is a exception" Not all the gorilas are the same

The problem with a LOGIC like that is. "You created a game based in character swaps and counterplay". but you haven't make hard counters for tracer, genji etc.

I would love OW dev-team add Competitive-Mode like a MOBA. You pick your character before queue, in a fixed team-comp 1 tank, 2 healers and 3 dps. You can't swap characters. The game will be a lot more interesing cuz you will actualy to use the brain to win instead of press "AUTO-WIN" button playing to counter
02/07/2018 03:42 AMPosted by ShinyPants
02/07/2018 03:05 AMPosted by Avian
Lucio is balanced and doesn't have a counter, is he OP then?


Symmetra destroys Lucio.
Boop?
02/07/2018 03:06 AMPosted by EquinoX
02/07/2018 03:05 AMPosted by Raven
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sombra.


Sombra doesn't counter lucio at all

sombra's emp removes the effects of lucio's sound barrier and charges much faster, how is that not a counter.
02/07/2018 03:15 AMPosted by Rohkah
Well done! You just made a hero completely useless!


Welcome to nerfed Defense, I'm your host Junkrat, and our lustrous hostess Mei will be here in a minute, She's getting the otter-pops.
02/07/2018 03:04 AMPosted by Hayaishi
Then how exactly is she balanced?


You can buff / nerf heroes both directly, and indirectly.

A direct change is (obviously), a change to the character itself.

An indirect change is a change that affects a character either positively or negatively, without having to touch that character at all. For example, if Mercy ends up falling out of the meta completely now, that'll also hurt Pharah, because Pharah is immensely more effective with a Mercy pocket. That change alone could bring Moira into the meta to take Mercy's place, which will negatively impact Genji, and so on. People are saying that Tracer needs an indirect nerf, which would be buffing a hero to counter her, or introducing a new hero that counters her. I think directly nerfing Tracer is not a good idea. There is very little that they could do to the hero itself to not make her completely useless in mid - lower tiers.

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