What about McCree?

General Discussion
Can we please NOT have another hero changed because OP is stuck in silver on McCree.

How can you be "bored" of a hero you obviously have not mastered.
02/15/2018 01:51 AMPosted by Radiance
the only thing he's used for is his left click. Not good imo.
Also has a buggy !@# flash and a useless roll
Can you give some videos of this "buggy !@# flash"? I don't see how it's buggy
Roll is not useless, it's just not a movement ability, it's made for quick reload.
You can see people using flashbang+right click all the time.
And even if all those things was really useless like you're saying, if his primary fire makes up for it, then he is in a good place and the little changes (not buffs) he could receive can wait.
02/15/2018 08:53 AMPosted by Chrystian
02/15/2018 01:51 AMPosted by Radiance
the only thing he's used for is his left click. Not good imo.
Also has a buggy !@# flash and a useless roll
Can you give some videos of this "buggy !@# flash"? I don't see how it's buggy
Roll is not useless, it's just not a movement ability, it's made for quick reload.
You can see people using flashbang+right click all the time.
And even if all those things was really useless like you're saying, if his primary fire makes up for it, then he is in a good place and the little changes (not buffs) he could receive can wait.


Hey here is a video from a YEAR AGO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaLyO1abZvU
that shows how Flash bang is not consistent and behaves how it wants, I'm not going to say he is useless because he is not, he was overpowered at the start of the game with Jesse Mcsniping Mccree, but of all his kit flash bang is the one that irks me, I do get my kills with the combo and save it for ulting enemies and works most of the time, but this inconsistencies just make shake my head, I'm not even sure to used it against Genji's or Doomfist since it behaves pretty weird on them

I don't think he needs a buff since he would be unstoppable but his kit needs to be looked at with the weirdly behaviour of his flash and the only to reload roll that gives him zero mobility
02/15/2018 01:48 AMPosted by Jessicka
He sees a ton of use at all levels and his win rates aren't bad either, so I don't really see any particular balance issues with him.

That's not really true. His winrate is actually the lowest of any dps besides Hanzo.
02/15/2018 08:40 AMPosted by Ph4yte
02/15/2018 08:30 AMPosted by Raisins
Anybody can be insanely powerful with McCree, but that's not everyone, just the most dedicated, immersed and borderline obsessed can reach those levels. (But that applies to every single hero)

Kaplan's post was, for lack of a better word, "insulting", basically "Git gut", a troll level response.

In regards to this "Left click is insane" argument, here are others who's left click is "insane" and with no fall off damage: Junkrat, Phara, Hanzo, Genji, S76.
I know, only one is hitscan, but guess what, he has a self heal and unlimited sprint.

What I have noticed in these boards is that as soon as a hero is called to have some kind of tweak, a lot of people will take out the "It will be too OP" card out of their @ss pocket. Or claim that Silver people are sh1t , or gold, or diamond or w/e, but fail to recognize that there a ton of people who don't give a flying f#ck about Competitive and all they want is enjoy QP or Arcade games with their friends with a reliable hero they like or identify with.


His response wasn't a git gud post. The OP of that post asked what his role was... And Jeff answered it.
I am sure you didn't even read the context of that post and the response itself. It wasn't a literal "Git gud", it was the message. :P
02/15/2018 07:19 AMPosted by UndertheSea
02/15/2018 07:11 AMPosted by DigitalNinja
...

This is a problem, he's got one hell of a left click, that's it. The amount of play he sees and win rate statistics shouldn't really come into play when the Hero has one thing that decent and the rest is wonky.


His flashbang is very effective against a ton of heroes. I hate to sound elitest- but if they gave him any buffs he would be unstoppable at higher elo's. His usefulness is based more on raw mechanical skill so it may be more difficult to have an impact with him at lower levels.


Unstoppable within 13meters, and he's slower than a fat kid. If he gets within 13 meters of you without a shield or anyone else on your team around, he deserves it. Junk can throw mines further than McCree can throw flash.

Widow sees much more playtime in OWL than him because he doesn't fit in anywhere now.
02/14/2018 01:50 PMPosted by DigitalNinja
and the occasional flashbang, because we all know how often that thing works.


I have played a decent amount of McCree and I have watched a lot of Calvin streams..... I haven't seen any problems with flashbang. I see a lot of complaints about flashbang and deflect, but that's a deflect issue not flashbang.
i mean really all mccree uses is left click, just watch the pros play and his ultimate is still only used for zoning or free reload
I love McCree. I find him to be pretty damn balanced for the most part. I'm not sure what I would change about him other than potentially giving him a slight health boost to 225? Maybe 250? Or, longer flash range, fast cooldown on his roll... there are some small changes that could be made, but I think he's solid as is -- absolutely lethal in the right hands.

I think the easiest change would be to allow him to move faster when ulting... that'd be nice.
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
I love McCree. I find him to be pretty damn balanced for the most part. I'm not sure what I would change about him other than potentially giving him a slight health boost to 225? Maybe 250? Or, longer flash range, fast cooldown on his roll... there are some small changes that could be made, but I think he's solid as is -- absolutely lethal in the right hands.

I think the easiest change would be to allow him to move faster when ulting... that'd be nice.
So you think he's "solid" but thought of at least 3 changes/improvements...hmm...solid as water, I get it.
02/15/2018 08:44 AMPosted by CoolMercy
Can we please NOT have another hero changed because OP is stuck in silver on McCree.

How can you be "bored" of a hero you obviously have not mastered.

I'm in diamond and would still like to see minor tweaks on McCree. But, I think a number of other heroes take priority over McCree -- I just feel like he's worthless up against a Genji. i find it sort of sickening I can 1v1 a Winston or Roadhog if I land the headshots, but with a Genji and his twitchy !@#, I have next to no chance thanks to his deflect. But then again, every hero needs a counter, I suppose. On second thought, ignore this post.
02/15/2018 09:39 AMPosted by Raisins
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
I love McCree. I find him to be pretty damn balanced for the most part. I'm not sure what I would change about him other than potentially giving him a slight health boost to 225? Maybe 250? Or, longer flash range, fast cooldown on his roll... there are some small changes that could be made, but I think he's solid as is -- absolutely lethal in the right hands.

I think the easiest change would be to allow him to move faster when ulting... that'd be nice.
So you think he's "solid" but thought of at least 3 changes/improvements...hmm...solid as water, I get it.


Because I do think he's fine. I was entertaining the idea of what *could* be changed if changes were made. God forbid someone use hypotheticals in a web forum.
I just want a mobility buff....he feels painfully slow

EDIT
02/15/2018 09:40 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
02/15/2018 08:44 AMPosted by CoolMercy
Can we please NOT have another hero changed because OP is stuck in silver on McCree.

How can you be "bored" of a hero you obviously have not mastered.

I'm in diamond and would still like to see minor tweaks on McCree. But, I think a number of other heroes take priority over McCree -- I just feel like he's worthless up against a Genji. i find it sort of sickening I can 1v1 a Winston or Roadhog if I land the headshots, but with a Genji and his twitchy !@#, I have next to no chance thanks to his deflect. But then again, every hero needs a counter, I suppose. On second thought, ignore this post.


I just find it funny that in his description it list him as a counter to Genji when the opposite is true
A lower cooldown on roll is way overdue. There is literally no reason for this not to happen. It will be a QOL buff more than anything.
Roll still will suck.

Moiras Fade is on a shorter cooldown than roll and its probably the best movement ability in the game.
02/15/2018 08:40 AMPosted by Ph4yte
02/15/2018 08:30 AMPosted by Raisins
Anybody can be insanely powerful with McCree, but that's not everyone, just the most dedicated, immersed and borderline obsessed can reach those levels. (But that applies to every single hero)

Kaplan's post was, for lack of a better word, "insulting", basically "Git gut", a troll level response.

In regards to this "Left click is insane" argument, here are others who's left click is "insane" and with no fall off damage: Junkrat, Phara, Hanzo, Genji, S76.
I know, only one is hitscan, but guess what, he has a self heal and unlimited sprint.

What I have noticed in these boards is that as soon as a hero is called to have some kind of tweak, a lot of people will take out the "It will be too OP" card out of their @ss pocket. Or claim that Silver people are sh1t , or gold, or diamond or w/e, but fail to recognize that there a ton of people who don't give a flying f#ck about Competitive and all they want is enjoy QP or Arcade games with their friends with a reliable hero they like or identify with.


His response wasn't a git gud post. The OP of that post asked what his role was... And Jeff answered it.


He really didn't
02/15/2018 09:44 AMPosted by DVS
A lower cooldown on roll is way overdue. There is literally no reason for this not to happen. It will be a QOL buff more than anything.
Roll still will suck.

Moiras Fade is on a 6 second cooldown and its probably the best movement ability in the game.


Moira is the single most broken hero in the game right now. Fight me on that, people. Any time I use her in QP, I manage five golds in at least half my matches. That should NEVER HAPPEN with any hero, let alone a support.
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
I love McCree. I find him to be pretty damn balanced for the most part. I'm not sure what I would change about him other than potentially giving him a slight health boost to 225? Maybe 250? Or, longer flash range, fast cooldown on his roll... there are some small changes that could be made, but I think he's solid as is -- absolutely lethal in the right hands.

I think the easiest change would be to allow him to move faster when ulting... that'd be nice.


Again, expect no buffs without nerfing left click i would imagine
02/15/2018 09:49 AMPosted by CamKitty
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
I love McCree. I find him to be pretty damn balanced for the most part. I'm not sure what I would change about him other than potentially giving him a slight health boost to 225? Maybe 250? Or, longer flash range, fast cooldown on his roll... there are some small changes that could be made, but I think he's solid as is -- absolutely lethal in the right hands.

I think the easiest change would be to allow him to move faster when ulting... that'd be nice.


Again, expect no buffs without nerfing left click i would imagine


A lower cooldown on roll would be a huge QOL change without making him OP. He just needs some mobility. He has byfar the most pathetic mobility of the DPS heroes. His primary is fine -- it rewards those who have good aim.
02/15/2018 09:52 AMPosted by OrdealByFire
02/15/2018 09:49 AMPosted by CamKitty
...

Again, expect no buffs without nerfing left click i would imagine


A lower cooldown on roll would be a huge QOL change without making him OP. He just needs some mobility. He has byfar the most pathetic mobility of the DPS heroes. His primary is fine -- it rewards those who have good aim.


It's still over bearing if the rest of him is not clunky
Make fan the hammer reliable against genji/tracer. Decrease the spread or increase the rof so that it kills them reliably before the flashbang duration runs out.

Fix flashbang again

And can he seriously get something for more mobility? Be creative.

Idea 1 : McCree stores 2 rolls. Roll keeps the same CD. Reload only applies when roll is used when 2 are stored

Idea 2 : Reduce roll cd to 6 seconds

Idea 3 : Roll stays the same but now grants invincibility frames

Im sure that you guys or the dev team could come up with something even better tbh.

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