Why do people keep saying Winston soft counters Genji?

General Discussion
Winston operates by jumping into and disrupting the enemy backline.

When Winston is forced to sit by his team's supports and spray Genji-away at the local pest, Winston is not performing his own role and is in effect, being countered by Genji.

And while Winston can deter Genji, Winston cannot stop Genji given his extremely long TTK. Genji can still get in and out as well as throw shurikens from a Distance, while Winston himself is more or less rendered impotent because he has to be near his supports at all times to "counter" Genji.

If anything, this matchup, on a larger scale, favors Genji, because While Winston can't do anything but react to Genji dives that he can't even fully stop, Genji still can do what he does, just with a bit more caution.
It's because so few people actually play Winston, and they'd rather complain than learn.

Winston's ability to counter Genji is one of the most powerful counters in the game.
because he dashes away like the wussest cyborg ninja ever
That would be because he IS a soft counter. It is very easy to ignore Winston as Genji, and I speak from experience. Of course Winston wins in a 1v1, but I dont think that matters too much when comp is so Team oriented. Genji has much more mobilty and to put it simply should never be caught by Winston. If the Genji is smart with his engagements and watches his cooldowns, Winston is obsolete.
02/14/2018 12:58 AMPosted by Pakaku
I guess because he doesn't directly disable deflect and stuff, and people really hate that ability for some reason.

Check out this thread and you will learn why so many people hate deflect:
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20759150839?page=1
Because he can't prevent Genji feom doing his job, and he can lose to Genji 1v1 very easily. He's barely a soft counter.
02/14/2018 01:12 AMPosted by greyleopardd
02/14/2018 12:58 AMPosted by LilD
Well there's this thing called map geometry. Winston is a counter on paper, that's it.


What does this even mean? That the most mobile tank in the game is restricted by map geometry?

How did this even get upvotes lol it's such a vague statement

gengu dashes down a hallway or into a building, what would winston do ?
Winston, if played right, is good against Genji, but he doesn't automatically shut him down. Either you have to play it right, or the Genji has to play it wrong. One of those needs to happen, or both.

My advice? Walk up to him (DO NOT JUMP ON HIM) then Tesla him. When he tries to dash away, then jump on him. Now he has no dash to get away and hopefully no wall to climb before you can finish him. If he deflects out of panic, even better.
In all seriousness, DVa is arguably a better counter to Genji than Winston is.

DVa can bump him away from her supports with boosters.
DVa has the DPS to maybe kill him before he kills a support.
DM is significantly more difficult to avoid/work around than Winston's shield.
DM has a shorter CD than Winston's bubble.
DVa's boosters can actually follow him indoors.
No one considers DVa to be a main tank so her chasing Genji isn't her abandoning her role.
I think Zarya is a better counter because unlike Winston she can protect her Teammates from a good Genji.
The same reason Reaper isn't really a Winston hard counter, mobility and long range beats close range low mobility.
02/14/2018 01:06 AMPosted by da1337Noooob
The 1v1 matchup doesn't decide whether a hero is a counter or not. Mercy loses a 1v1 to basically any DPS hero, but that doesn't mean that she's countered by them. She serves a different role in the actual fight.

Likewise. Genji's role isn't to kill Winston. He's supposed to harass Squishies and finish off low-health targets. If Genji Right-Click>Dash combos Winston's healer, it doesn't matter how much he can zap the Ninja since his Zenyatta's dead now.

If Winston is standing next to his supports at all times, then yes, it becomes a little difficult for Genji to get a pick without dying. But then Winston can't dive the enemy team either since he's stuck peeling for his Supports.

Genji is only countered by Winston in a 1v1. It's not about the damage output, it's about who can do their job as a hero.
THIS
This is a silly post. Genji has difficulties with a Winston. Thats all thats needed to stop his flanking and force ability cooldown on the cyberninja.

Yes Winston is big and bulky but he can afford to take that damage. Genji cannot. So chunking away ever bit of health on a 200 healh pool means a lot against a Genji. For a Winston not so much. A Good Winston will have more mobility or just as much mobility as a Genji since ability management is a key part in Winston's kit unlike Genji's who can spam and spam and spam and spam and somehow come out on top.

I fry Genjis but Genjis need teammates to down me? Yeah like my teammates isn't going to help me as well then? All in all Winston can stop a Genji from being effective in many aspects. Hindering K/D ratio his time flanking his ultimate chagre and makes him weary of going near the backline. That is if the monkey isn't distracted enough. Yet we all know a Genji will be tunnel visioned which only makes the monkey's job easier.
02/14/2018 07:16 AMPosted by earlizd1
02/14/2018 01:12 AMPosted by greyleopardd
...

What does this even mean? That the most mobile tank in the game is restricted by map geometry?

How did this even get upvotes lol it's such a vague statement

gengu dashes down a hallway or into a building, what would winston do ?


Save cooldowns and wait for Gebji to get close again. Genji is not going to outright kill a monkry unless he has ultimate. So reload deal with other threats save abilities for other situations. Because now Genji has just denied his own team a healthpack and broke off giving my team a numbers avantage while he rethinks his attack plan. Which in all honesty isn't going to change.
02/14/2018 01:04 AMPosted by Eihder
Winston cant keep up with genji even with his jump. For one he cant direct it like genji can, genji can also wallclimb and has higher movement speed. He is a soft counter because genji can operate like normal even with a winston. Not to mention if it resets etc.
“Can’t direct it” make me laugh

02/14/2018 01:49 AMPosted by GreenMatius
Mobility my friend.
If you stick around to 1v1 a Winston at close range - then... well... good luck.

Meanwhile hardcounters are like
Pharah counter Reaper because there is no way Reaper could reach Pharah.

Winston counter Symm because Symm cannot outdamage Winston and Symm cannot escape Winston either.
You realize her gun builds up damage and she heals once and winston doesn’t she would win right? Because 60 va 120 high she wins

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