Bring back mass rez WITHOUT a revert

General Discussion
Mercy 1.0 was fun, but actually only a little less underpowered then she is now.

The reason why: Mercy had no abilities in her base kit that let her actively participate in the fight. This railroaded Mercy players into basing their entire playstyle around the only active ability Mercy had: her ult, mass rez.

Adressing hide n rez: this tactic came down to two sources - SR abusers and people who went waaay out of their way to hide in buildings, rooms below the point, and generally areas that took a while to get to (but was still in range of rez, since it didn't require LoS). The SR abuse problem has been retroactiely solved with the removal of preformance based SR in diamond and above, and a LoS restriction would force Mercy to put herself out in the open to rez (giving enemies a chance to cc/kill her and eliminating the hide-and-seek minigame).

And one last thing: most Mercy players hated doing hide and rez - it was THEIR TEAMMATES who demanded it, and got toxic if the Mercy didn't. The standard playstyle of Mercy is to stay with your team as long as possible, only ducking into cover if your team is taking more damage than you can heal/if you see an ult wipe incoming.

I don't want to go back to a version of Mercy that doesn't have the GA bunnyhop, but I also hate rez on E with a passion and don't even consider Valkyrie to be an ultimate. The best solution (to me) seems to be putting a balanced version of Mass Rez on Q, and figuring out an E ability that incentivises Mercy to stay with her team and use it to directly participate in the fight.
And how would you balance it? Mercy got reworked because 1) she was never used in pro play, since Huge Res is very easy to counter when you have a disciplined team working together and 2) Huge Res was not only busted in low ranks, but an absolute nightmare in terms of performance based SR and boosting.

Oh, and LoS restrictions wouldn't get rid of Hide-and-go-Res. You have no clue what the strategy even was judging by your statement.
wouldn't bringing back mass res be in of itself a revert
02/20/2018 10:25 AMPosted by Blam320
And how would you balance it? Mercy got reworked because 1) she was never used in pro play, since Huge Res is very easy to counter when you have a disciplined team working together

Which is why Mercy needs an E so her entire character isn't just a walking ult.
and 2) Huge Res was not only busted in low ranks, but an absolute nightmare in terms of performance based SR and boosting.

Retroactively solved with the elimination of preformance based SR in diamond and above.
Oh, and LoS restrictions wouldn't get rid of Hide-and-go-Res. You have no clue what the strategy even was judging by your statement.

The remainder of Hide n Rez was Mercy players abusing the lack of LoS requirements, by hiding in buildings or above/below the point to rez, places that take a while to reach and caused the boring "hide and seek" that people don't like.

Requireing LoS means that the Mercy has to put herself out in the open before rezzing, which gives the enemy a chance to cc/kill her before she gets the rez off.

And finally: most Mercy players hate hide n rez - it was THEIR TEAMMATES who insisted that they do it, and got toxic if the Mercy didn't. The standard playstyle for Mercy is to stay with your team as long as possible, then duck behind cover when you see an ult incoming/when your team is taking much more damage than you can heal.
02/20/2018 10:25 AMPosted by Blam320
Oh, and LoS restrictions wouldn't get rid of Hide-and-go-Res.
Can we drop this? I still hide all the time as Mercy because I'm not gonna stand out in the open and die when my team can't afford for me to respawn or an ult is going off.

Edit: THIS!!!
02/20/2018 10:34 AMPosted by Silawatsi
The standard playstyle for Mercy is to stay with your team as long as possible, then duck behind cover when you see an ult incoming/when your team is taking much more damage than you can heal.
02/20/2018 10:29 AMPosted by Txboyd1
wouldn't bringing back mass res be in of itself a revert

No. Bringing back a modified mass rez, keeping the GA buff and adding an E ability would be another rework.
02/20/2018 10:29 AMPosted by Txboyd1
wouldn't bringing back mass res be in of itself a revert
Technically no, as you're still potentially giving her a different kit than she had before even though it's similar.

In spirit, kind of, since mass res was the focus of the rework in the first place.
02/20/2018 10:25 AMPosted by Blam320
And how would you balance it? Mercy got reworked because 1) she was never used in pro play, since Huge Res is very easy to counter when you have a disciplined team working together

Which is why Mercy needs an E so her entire character isn't just a walking ult.
and 2) Huge Res was not only busted in low ranks, but an absolute nightmare in terms of performance based SR and boosting.

Retroactively solved with the elimination of preformance based SR in diamond and above.
Oh, and LoS restrictions wouldn't get rid of Hide-and-go-Res. You have no clue what the strategy even was judging by your statement.

The remainder of Hide n Rez was Mercy players abusing the lack of LoS requirements, by hiding in buildings or above/below the point to rez, places that take a while to reach and caused the boring "hide and seek" that people don't like.

Requireing LoS means that the Mercy has to put herself out in the open before rezzing, which gives the enemy a chance to cc/kill her before she gets the rez off.

And finally: most Mercy players hate hide n rez - it was THEIR TEAMMATES who insisted that they do it, and got toxic if the Mercy didn't. The standard playstyle for Mercy is to stay with your team as long as possible, then duck behind cover when you see an ult incoming/when your team is taking much more damage than you can heal.


Oh no. Hide-and-go-Res wasn't LoS abuse. Far, far from it. It was where unskilled Mercy players would basically only play with their teams until they got ult, then they would hide away in some corner of the map far away from the teamfight. They would probably instruct their team to all die on point, then wait for everyone to die before swooping in virtually uncontested for a huge res. They did this to boost themselves into high ranks, because Performace SR rewarded players who performed more huge reses.

I'm well aware of the predominant Mercy strategy to hide when enemy ults come. The best Mercies I played with Tempo-resed all of the time. But that doesn't change that poor Mercies were abusing SR gain from huge res by hiding regardless of the situation.

And no, it wasn't retroactively solved by only removing performance-based SR in the highest ranks. It will need to be removed across all ranks for Hide-and-Res to become less of an issue. Want to know why? Because Hide-and-Res abusers were ruining games in Plat and even Gold as well, when they should have stayed in Silver or Bronze. It's not just Diamond+ I'm worried about.
Hey Silawatsi

Hide and Rez was not hiding out of LoS and pressing Q from behind walls and floors.

Hide and Rez was hiding out of LoS, telling team to die together, and swooping in with GA for a team Resurrect.

It sounds like you never did it since you have no idea what it was, so good for you, but please understand that a "LoS requirement" would not change a thing.
Make the ability Rez only available during Valkyrie and give her old ult back but make it line of sight.
Oh no. Hide-and-go-Res wasn't LoS abuse. Far, far from it. It was where unskilled Mercy players would basically only play with their teams until they got ult, then they would hide away in some corner of the map far away from the teamfight. They would probably instruct their team to all die on point, then wait for everyone to die before swooping in virtually uncontested for a huge res. They did this to boost themselves into high ranks, because Performace SR rewarded players who performed more huge reses.

I'm well aware of the predominant Mercy strategy to hide when enemy ults come. The best Mercies I played with Tempo-resed all of the time. But that doesn't change that poor Mercies were abusing SR gain from huge res by hiding regardless of the situation.

And no, it wasn't retroactively solved by only removing performance-based SR in the highest ranks. It will need to be removed across all ranks for Hide-and-Res to become less of an issue. Want to know why? Because Hide-and-Res abusers were ruining games in Plat and even Gold as well, when they should have stayed in Silver or Bronze. It's not just Diamond+ I'm worried about.

That's a problem with the SR system, not Mercy.

Also, either cc/kill Mercy while she's flying in (she flies in a straight line for god's sake) or save an ult for a re-wipe. A lot of ults can easily do this, including (especially) those that are normally hard to get kills with such as high noon, Dva bomb and death blossom.
No my child, No
We go back to the good old original mass rez, the Suicide 5 man that way 5 mans really are just desperate last stands. Which is what I think they ought to be for both viewing potential and gameplay potential.

Seriously suicide 5 man rez can create a lot of epic moments when you think about it, it's one final stand and even though you've got everything stacked against the rez'd team but it's still a chance beyond nothing.

And then buff her up in another way, give her an ACTUAL E ability
Not a mini ultimate that has drawbacks slapped on to look like an E but an actual E, something balanced on 6 to 10 second cooldown like a Flash Heal, a burst AOE heal, an enemy slow, something.
OH i enjoyed Mass Rez, except when the enemy teams' mercy popped out of nowhere on a Team kill and screamed her infamous lines in German, for resurrecting the whole team on the Payload and having them finish the fight. It did make mercy the wildcard in the game, because if you didn't kill mercy or find her in time, she re-started the fight. I look at this from both aspects: Positive and negative. I think the fight dynamics were most interesting before the single target rez and Valkyrie.

Valkyrie though, has opened up a box of snakes. It encourages battle mercy. The community HATES this, but battle mercy IS fun this way. I just hit Valkyrie, yes the team is spamming I am "Prick thrower" for not healing. but I just mowed down the entire enemy team with a pistol. As for Widow VS Valkyrie mercy, its gg for widow. Even with well-placed headshots, mercy is still going strong. Valkyrie allows for Revenge kills with mercy, she can fly around anywhere and go after the player she has a grudge against.
Stop asking for more changes! Please!
Mercy is currently in her healthiest state since her release. No frustration from playing vs her at all and she's very much usable thanks to her consistent heals and single rez. There is no need to make changes now

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