Why Can't Doomfist Ult out of Grav if it Makes Him Immune?

General Discussion
I actually wouldn’t mind this being a thing.
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by Terranguard
I'm not sure at what point he gets immunity btw. Is it as soon as you push the button?

Yes
02/15/2018 09:40 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by Terranguard
I'm not sure at what point he gets immunity btw. Is it as soon as you push the button?

Yes
Then he should be able to use it in grav because he's immune before he jumps.
02/15/2018 09:39 AMPosted by Terranguard
Fade and Wraith form aren't movement

Nice joke. Fade literally allows you to gain 20m distance in .8s
02/15/2018 09:39 AMPosted by Caution
because !@#$ doomfist! that's why! -with love the devs

xD
02/15/2018 09:42 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 09:39 AMPosted by Terranguard
Fade and Wraith form aren't movement

Nice joke. Fade literally allows you to gain 20m distance in .8s
If you stand still, you're not moving.Movement abilities force movement. It's just a massive buff like fortify. Also you're complaining about DF not having it then complaining that they do for a similar ability.

Genji moves at about 11.5 meters per second while using dragonblade so does that make it a movement ability?
02/15/2018 09:44 AMPosted by Terranguard
If you stand still, you're not moving.Movement abilities force movement

I highly appreciate your custom definition of what is a movement ability.
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Edited by moderator for harassment. Calling out other players is considered harassment and will result in the suspension of posting privileges. Please adhere to the code of conduct when posting.
02/15/2018 09:50 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 09:44 AMPosted by Terranguard
If you stand still, you're not moving.Movement abilities force movement

I highly appreciate your custom definition of what is a movement ability.

<Removed>

In every single game I've ever played, that would be a buff. It increases some stat or other or maybe multiple while active, but doesn't force you to do anything. You could stand there like an idiot doing nothing, or you could move.

Every single movement ability in the game forces you to move. Her's only buffs your movement speed and makes you invulnerable. It's not a movement ability. This isn't "my definition" this is an observation.
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Edited by moderator for harassment. Calling out other players is considered harassment and will result in the suspension of posting privileges. Please adhere to the code of conduct when posting.
02/15/2018 09:44 AMPosted by Terranguard
Movement abilities force movement.


Movement abilities buff movement. So the part where fade increases the speed that Moira is normally able to move at, it is a movement ability. It is also an invulnerability move.

To me, the reasoning as to why Doomfist can't ult out of grav is pretty straightforward. Meteor Strike is intended to be used primarily as an offensive maneuver. The 3 invulnerability moves that get people out of grav are all inherently defensive maneuvers.

I don't personally like that seemingly arbitrary distinction as a Doom player (especially since I ult for defensive purposes just as often as I use it to attack someone), but it makes enough sense that I can accept it for what it is.
02/15/2018 08:49 AMPosted by iSinner
Every immunity skill allows to get out of grav, whats the deal with doomfist ult?

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Edit: responses to "popular" posts for the lazy ones who don't like scrolling:
02/15/2018 08:54 AMPosted by KulstorEbrou
Because he literally springs off the ground.

I'd imagine that would have something to do with it because all players are stuck floating in the grav.


He doesn't need a floor for that. He can do it from anywhere. Did you even play doomfist once?


Because the game really needed another way to counter Doomfist. Only half of the heroes in the game counter him, obviously he needed more.
02/15/2018 09:40 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 09:38 AMPosted by Terranguard
I'm not sure at what point he gets immunity btw. Is it as soon as you push the button?

Yes


Actually it is VERY slightly after you hit the button. I have died many, MANY times during the beginning of hit Ult activating.
02/15/2018 09:34 AMPosted by Raisins
02/15/2018 09:04 AMPosted by Sheevah
...

Reaper, Moira, and Orisa can all escape.
I wasn't sure about Reaper, but I had no idea Orisa could. Is it an effect of Fortify? If it is, I am surprised, since Fortify is not immunity, it's just a small extra layer of defense.
Part of Fortify's description is "You cannot be stopped" this, in layman's terms, means that Orisa is impervious to CC
02/15/2018 09:56 AMPosted by Sheevah
Meteor Strike is intended to be used primarily as an offensive maneuver

How do you know that? any sources?
Also provide any sources where it says "offensive maneuver" are blocked by grav.

My point is, stop making stuff up.

02/15/2018 10:04 AMPosted by Rightwardsky
Actually it is VERY slightly after you hit the button. I have died many, MANY times during the beginning of hit Ult activating.

Did it drain your ult meter? if not, that's latency, if yes, there is a window of vulnerability. I've been killed after pressing the button many times, none of them drained my ult meter which means that was a latency issue.

I know for a fact that it is impossible to kill doomfist so that he loses his ult, which means there is no window of vulnerability.
02/15/2018 10:57 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 09:56 AMPosted by Sheevah
Meteor Strike is intended to be used primarily as an offensive maneuver

How do you know that? any sources?
Also provide any sources where it says "offensive maneuver" are blocked by grav.

My point is, stop making stuff up.

02/15/2018 10:04 AMPosted by Rightwardsky
Actually it is VERY slightly after you hit the button. I have died many, MANY times during the beginning of hit Ult activating.

Did it drain your ult meter? if not, that's latency, if yes, there is a window of vulnerability. I've been killed after pressing the button many times, none of them drained my ult meter which means that was a latency issue.

I know for a fact that it is impossible to kill doomfist so that he loses his ult, which means there is no window of vulnerability.
Indeed, I have made a mistake. Apologies, iSinner. Frustratingly enough, it happens to me all too often even on decent ping.

Also, I do not think Sheeva does have any sources, since the dev team give very little information about anything regarding Doomfist.
Meteor strike is not an ability that is primarily offensive based. You can use it to solo out a target, or to get out of a bad situation that you have no chance of escaping with your normal abilities--Or they are on cooldown. Its exactly like the rest of his abilities: Mobility... Or damage.

At any rate, It will immediately provide invulnerability when used, which is in turn immunity to crowd control. The fact that it is disabled from use upon being locked in a movement disabling ability such as junkrat's trap or zarya's graviton surge, in the same manner as the rest of his abilities being disabled by the same things... I feel is for a sake of consistency with the rest of his kit.

Its annoying, sure, but those sorts of things have to exist in that consistent manner otherwise they would have reason to make doomfist's abilities work in those situations, yet they wouldn't be able to actually give him any movement. Meanwhile, that would make it so his ult can let him escape. Thats simply because those abilities don't provide immunity to crowd control and yet meteor strike in that same scenario would if it was able to be used inside of those.

That's the inherent issue with it.
02/15/2018 11:14 AMPosted by Duke
I feel is for a sake of consistency

It is not very consistent with other abilities that give invulnerability. It is consistent though in making doomfist look like a joke.
its simple, blizz is to ignorant to make logical changes to DF, hes full of bugs, and has the most counters, make grav silence every hero in this game, or give some chance for DF to do something when hes in it because atm graviton shuts down doom fist in any way possible, his !@# shotgun is weak in this kind of situation.
02/15/2018 11:20 AMPosted by iSinner
02/15/2018 11:14 AMPosted by Duke
I feel is for a sake of consistency

It is not very consistent with other abilities that give invulnerability. It is consistent though in making doomfist look like a joke.


And I agree with that. The purpose of what I've said is to point out that he would have to have his abilities enabled in grav aswell in order for them to validate him being able to use his meteor strike there--Which is what I think needs to happen.

He should be able to use all of his abilities in grav or junk trap, just without the movement as that's what they primarily disable in almost every case. That would mean he should be able to ult out of grav as it makes him immune to everything.
How do you know that? any sources?
Also provide any sources where it says "offensive maneuver" are blocked by grav.

My point is, stop making stuff up.


Please, I have an immense amount of respect for your bug threads and devotion to advocating for the character, but let's not be deliberately obtuse.

It's an offensive ultimate ability that is meant to smash people, and simply because it can be used for something else (similar to rocket punch being a viable option for mobility), it doesn't change the fact it's designed as a damage dealing ability. You don't have to have a sourced Blue post to explain that... or, if you do, you're so far down a butthurt rabbithole that you aren't really worth conversing with.

Edit: To elaborate slightly -

Wraith, Fade, and Fortify can't be used to attack somebody. To compare them to Meteor Strike is to compare apples to oranges.

I'd be happy if they changed it so Doom can get out of Grav. Heck, it even seems fair, an ult for an ult. That said, it should not be done simply because those other moves can. That's a horrible line of reasoning for it.
02/15/2018 11:25 AMPosted by Duke
And I agree with that. The purpose of what I've said is to point out that he would have to have his abilities enabled in grav aswell in order for them to validate him being able to use his meteor strike there--Which is what I think needs to happen

Not at all. None of his skills give invulnerability(beside ult), so they should be blocked like every other skill with no invulnerability.

And his ult, which gives him invulnerability, shouldn't be blocked like all skills that give invulnerability.

02/15/2018 11:34 AMPosted by Sheevah
Please, I have an immense amount of respect for your bug threads and devotion to advocating for the character, but let's not be deliberately obtuse

Not agreeing with you = obtuse? I see you think your opinion is of a highest degree, and any disagreement with you means being "obtuse". Such arrogance.

02/15/2018 11:34 AMPosted by Sheevah
It's an offensive ultimate ability that is meant to smash people, and simply because it can be used for something else (similar to rocket punch being a viable option for mobility), it doesn't change the fact it's designed as a damage dealing ability

That's just an opinion, and opinions tend to differ.

02/15/2018 11:34 AMPosted by Sheevah
Blue post to explain that

If you want to present your opinion as being objective, then yes i need a blue post or any kind of official source for that. Otherwise it is just subjective, which is fine, but don't expect me, or anyone else to agree immediately with you.

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