Zerg Discussion

Feb 24 The Guide to Zerg Guides I'm writing this for all the players new to the amazingness known as Zerg, for all Zerg players looking to improve their Zerg know how, as well as for myself, so I can condense all the helpful links I know of into one linkable post. I'd like to thank everyone I mention/link here for all the help you've given me along with the rest of the Zerg community, If I could sticky every one of your threads to the top of the forum I would and the world would be a better place for it, but this is the best I can do for now. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Videos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Save the best... for first! Day[9] Day[9] is the best thing ever to happen to Starcraft 2, if you want to get better at this game, every one of his dailys are a must see. Archives http://day9.tv/archives/ YouTube http://www.youtube.com/day9tv For any Zerg player looking to get better, dailys #194, #208, #252 and #263 are a must. Day[9] Daily #194 - Newbie Tuesday: Drone Timing http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4210235/ Day[9] Daily #208 - Live coaching with djWHEAT http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4321552/ Day[9] Daily #252 - Secrets of Hotkeys, APM and Mouse Movement http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4712303/ Day[9] Daily #263 - Checkin Out IdrA http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4782428/ Day[9] Daily #360 - Mental Checklist: Exercises! Part 1: http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-360-p1-mental-checklist-exercises-5635566 Part 2: http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-360-p2-mental-checklist-exercises-5635612 Part 3: http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-360-p3-mental-checklist-exercises-5635643 Day[9] Daily #235 - Zerg vs Zerg Opening Builds http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/4612990/ Day9 235 concentrates on developing and implementing a strategy for gameplay. Read post #11 below for an in depth review on why this daily is a must! Mr. Bitter Mr. Bitter may be the best thing ever to happen to the Zerg community, and his videos have by far the most in depth information on becoming an amazing Zerg player you can find. If there's any match up or strategy you're having a hard time dealing with, this is the best place to look. Archives http://mrbitter.blip.tv/posts?view=archive&nsfw=dc YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/MrBitterTV PsyStarcraft Psy is incredibly entertaining at the same time as being incredibly insightful, you're sure to learn something as you laugh during every video you watch. YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/PsyStarcraft Rekatan Helpful and insightful, his POV casts help you understand what's going on in the head of a good player and his RekCasts will help any lower league player understand how to iron out the bumps. YouTube http://www.youtube.com/user/Rekatan FilterSC Bronze to Masters Playlist: A great way to learn all the skills you need to take your Zerging from noob to master! YouTube http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7FA12E7399568F9C dApollo Zerg Tutorial Working up from Bronze League: Everything you need to up your game is in this playlist! YouTube http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0B7058D9D46661D1 ----Zerg Streams---- All the best SC2 live streams in one handy dandy link! http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Good Reading -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----How to Zerg, from A to Z---- These guides will give you everything you need to become a great Zerg! Nick's Extensive guide to Zerg -NakaNaide- From basics to builds to everything else, if there's one guide you're going to read, this should be the one! http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/933153625 Sheth's Guide -Sheth- Sheth is one of the best SC2 pros in the world, and this is how he plays Zerg. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=133023 Beginner's guide to Zerg micro, macro, & Bos -Nicholas- Everything you need to know in one easy to read post, need I say more? http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/375108296 ----Tips to improve your Zerg play---- Guides to push your game to the next level How to Improve at SC2 1v1 Efficiently -CecilSunkure- Regardless of your skill level, if you want to get better, this is the place to start. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=208343Jopirg165 Feb 24
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3h Why build roaches when I can build Hydra? Hey all, After lair tech is up and you are safe on 3 bases, why build roaches anymore? Hydra seem to be better in every way -- yet I still see some people do it. Just as an HP buffer? Or what is it?MystiKasT6 3h
13h Zerg has no advantage anymore Why is Zerg so weak right now? Blizzard has taken away every advantage Zerg could have. Zerg used to be able to get bigger eco than other races if left unchecked. That isn't the case anymore. We are stuck with weaker units but no advantage to make up for it. Crap AA, Crap harass, nydus is basically useless compared to drops/warpins, even our units are getting more and more expensive. Zerg is in a horrible state right now. Blizzard need to stop basing races on pro play and focus on the majority. You shouldn't have to have 400 apm and 200 games a week to perform.KnightsOfNii19 13h
14h Who created the Simulant Zerg? What faction do you think was responsible for creating the Simulant Zerg from the next war chest? https://bnetcmsus-a.akamaihd.net/cms/page_media/CE3ZC01FGGVS1533091263582.jpg As first I thought it might be the Purifiers, but on closer inspection the technology looks Terran. Although it looks almost too advanced for the usual Terran standards. EDIT: Based on this link, it's obviously the Dominion. http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Zerg-botNedia7 14h
14h In-game all Queens hotkey How long have people been asking for this addition for Zerg? Every couple of games I'll lose track of where all of my queens are, and it's inevitable that you miss one or two when binding and rebinding your own hotkeys over the course of games that go over 20 minutes. I use the all army hotkey as a catalogue of all of my active forces - I can find all of my lings, hydras, etc. on command. A unit as crucial to Zerg function as the Queen deserves a catalogue as well. It's nice that they don't get selected as part of inactive workers nor all army - but where's the key for Queens themselves? When I watch pro players stream, almost all of them end up making a key for all of their Queens, a process that ends up seeming fairly redundant. Any arguments that say having an all Queens key lowers the skill ceiling are completely invalid. Protoss already get a built-in hotkey for all of their warpgates, as they've had for years, and as we know, they will automatically transform in the new patch. Having another selection choice above the minimap for all Queens would be a very nice QOL change for many Zergs. It shouldn't interfere at all with players who don't feel the need for it, and it can be a nice option for those who do.Holden4 14h
14h Too much ZvZ Too much ZvZ. I play more ZvZ than ZvP plus ZvT. Can blizzard fix this? My main race is Zerg and I play more ZvZ than ever. It is really ruining the 1v1 ladder. It discourages me from playing Zerg.Irv7 14h
2d Creep Changes "Creep Building/Creep Tumor creep generation: Time between creep growth periods increased from 0.3 to 0.45. Overlord Generate Creep: Time between creep growth periods increased from 0.36 to 0.45. In the transition from Heart of the Swarm to Legacy of the Void, the Creep growth period was cut in half, from 0.6 to 0.3, to account for other changes made during that period. While this doesn’t practically translate into Creep spreading twice as fast, it has certainly had an effect on Zerg players’ ability to control the map. More recently, after much refinement on the part of Zerg players, we began receiving feedback that Creep spread might be too oppressive, allowing Zerg to control large portions of the map leading into the mid to late game." - Blizzard To fellow Zerg players, Personally, I don't like this change. Sure I understand that creep gets really far mid-late game. While this is true I think it's better that way because it forces people to move out and attack more. I think creep is very important to Zerg because after all, it is what allows Zerg to drone up until last second(like they're suppose to) and move faster. However, I think that especially after the changes of Zerg's movement speed reduction off creep this would be a weird change. Blizzard also said themselves they want Zerg to be a little more aggressive in their last big change, but also made it so stuff is faster on creep but slower off creep..? I think that if they put this change in, it will reduce Zerg's aggressive play even more and force them to take more harass without having vision of it. I don't think that Zerg should have a reduce in how much creep they form because this way it forces Terran and Protoss to move out and kill creep instead of just turtle with a little harass. Then again, this is my opinion alone. If Blizzard or anyone else has something to say, please let me know.ZerO8 2d
3d How do YOU beat Protoss Hey again, I am currently high gold stat ting to face platinum. I know for me, the answer is trying to play better. But wanted to ask how do YOU beat protoss. What works well, comps, timings etc. So I can hAve an idea of what to strive for.Azazel12 3d
3d What happened to the carbot zergling plush?! What happened to the carbot zergling plush?! how am going to build my army without them?!liyaxinli1 3d
4d Mutalisk are trash for their cost Little to no damage, gets shredded in seconds; nothing like the old mutas we all loved.MystiKasT38 4d
6d Counters to Psi Storm So right now, my biggest problem with protoss is I can generally handle anything they throw at me except storm. Once they get 4+ high templar and push with the charge/immo/ht/archon ball in the mid- late game, I have a hard time holding it. Usually can't get a ton of effective harass either, as much as i like to do runbys. I can sometimes win if I have enough hydra/lurker on the field and get a good engagement, but it's tricky. What is zerg's best response to psi storm??Maniac4 6d
6d Insane Protoss destroyed me This is the first game in a long time where i felt like i couldn't have done anything with my current skills, the other guy was way better than me in every single aspect. Also lots of mistakes, he was driving me crazy, any tips to deal with those early DT harrasment and Warp prisms?. https://drop.sc/replay/8603280Xodax4 6d
Oct 10 Help vs void ray base sniping/harass Especially after a cannon rush. Six void rays coming from a corner and then sniping a base, getting out to the dead space behind before your waddling queens could arrive. Spores are useless. Putting overlords on the dead space means sacrificing 100 minerals every time they decide to attack (not to mention getting overlord speed to replace the dead ovvies). Splitting queens mean they would just get overwhelmed by the voids.llllllllllll5 Oct 10
Oct 4 Overmind Announcer I played sc1 the other day and what I missed the most was the Overmind voice when using Zerg...can we get him back?..I love his voice.deadgrayfox7 Oct 4
Oct 3 Zerg Turtle Style Grab a coffee guys, this is a long one. Topic says it all. I know, for the most part, Terran can pull off the Turtle style best, Protoss or "skytoss" also have the potential, but I think that's more of a bad Zerg player to allow Protoss to get to that state, ultimately they have to do some big harass early on with air units to keep your eco down. But what about Zerg? SH got the nerf back when they were ridiculously good, now they're getting a price reduction? so economy wise they may be more viable unit (I actually use them now anyway, Diamond 2, Rank 4, EU) I also think the burrow infestor buff is going to make investors even more viable also for a turtle-style. I will start by giving some credit to Avilo and his more turtle-style and showing the power of late zerg, how you can honestly turn things around with their late units (no not ultras!)Turtle22 Oct 3
Oct 3 Phasing mode on creep Zerg already has a hard enough time with mobility off the creep. Don't you think it is a bit much that protoss can use the warp prism phase mode on creep?KING4 Oct 3
Sep 17 Is hatch first REALLY more economical? I’m not sure if my build is perfectly optimized or anything, but I go 14 pool, 17 hatch, and my second queen is completing right when my hatch pops. I kinda figure the build I got going is the most optimized for larva production, and more larvae equals more drones. While I do understand my method probably puts me behind a little bit economically before the first 2 injects pop and are converted into drones, I’m thinking if I’m able to be greedy at this point, I can spike ahead with superior drone production and probably get to 32/32 faster. Anyone have proof one way or the other? Opinions?Eirhead12 Sep 17
Sep 17 Fighting a cyclone rush This isn't a balance complaint but not sure what composition to tech to as I don't see it in pro games. They have Hellions, which they transform into hell bats. And cyclones. The former is strong against lings and the other is strong against roaches. So what comp would you go for.Azazel9 Sep 17
Sep 16 Would this be Worth the time? Having the Queen be able to merge with Lairs or Hives (no Hatcheries) granting the building the queens abilities (minus spawn creep tumor) and attack. Queen could not be removed once merged (supply would be freed up).PumperNickel0 Sep 16
Sep 16 Infestor Blizzard - "It would be cool if Infestors could cast Fungal Growth while burrowed, but it might be too good, so we will make it a slow instead of a root." Later Blizzard - "Being able to fungal while burrowed is too strong, so lets revert that... But let's keep Fungal Growth a slow instead of a root.........." . Blizzard 2013 - "Infested Terrans with upgrades are too good. Currently they have 8 base attack, and can get +3 attack for 11 damage. Let's nerf it by removing weapon and armor upgrades. Also not long ago we nerfed the HP of Infested Terran egg by 30 health" Later Blizzard - "Infested terrans are too weak. Let's give them their upgrades back, but nerf their base damage, so technically if you want to deal the same damage, you need +2 attack. It's a net increase of 1 damage in the late game when you have +3 attack!"BaloSaar6 Sep 16
Sep 7 What happened to the Hydra? Hey! So I played a bunch from WoL launch through HotS, but took a break before LotV, but getting back into the game.... So what exactly changed with the hydra between then and now? I know before hydra was at least perceived as weak, unoptimal unit in most match ups. But am seeing a lot more of them now. Was curious what the big changes were. Did the hydra change, was is other units? What changes exactly. Thanks in advance (hydra was always my favorite unit)Azazel10 Sep 7
Sep 4 Zerg units tier list? I'm kinda new to the game. I know there is not the best units for a zerg player, you have to adapt to every game. But after watching pro games there is some pattern I can see, for example I've never seen infestors or swarm hosts or few mutalisks or corruptors. Are there some kind of tier units (I mean usually preferred units) ? Sorry for mistakes english is not my native. Thanks,Cormaru5 Sep 4
Sep 1 Can you still infest Terran command centers?? Just what the topic title asks. I have no idea.CaptainTeft9 Sep 1
Aug 29 Need advice ZvT Hi guys, I don't play regularly but I've been laddering a little, recently, as Zerg (my offrace in the past but currently my favorite). Anyways, I'm not good and all that (and I'm fine with that, gold 2 atm), but I've been struggling a little in TvZ, specifically when terrans just power up on one base and go for a bio+3/4 tanks early push. Some maps have chokes near the natural so once the tanks are set up they basically nullify stuff like roaches or roach/hydra... Ok, I guess roach/hydra doesn't work (also the push is early so I don't have that many units if I try to add hydras....) What would be a good response though? Ling/banes (and try to surround them in the open, before they get hold of a certain position? Mass roaches (again, maybe plus trying to choose a better terrain for the fight)... Any suggestions?niteowl5 Aug 29
Aug 29 I need help with unit composition Ok so basically I think I almost have macro and micro down pat, scouting and harassing too, but where I get stuck is unit composition, any pointers please for future reference when playing against sky mech in this game - https://gggreplays.com/matches/138411 And also what to do against mass ravens?? I'm a casual plat player that can't seem to beat T/P who turtle and all my unit compositions I try don't work. I usually always use vipers, but lately they seem too weak and do jack all with there air attack (not the blinding one). :( Please do not say, 'don't let it get there', because even at an earlier stage, his siege tanks and hellions would make roast of an early unit composition too. Any help would be greatly appreciated.InsaneGame7 Aug 29
Aug 29 4 ultra rush. This is very sloppy and I'm working on it, but here is what I call the 4 ultra rush. It's a pure 4 ultra rush. No lings. Just ultra in numbers. https://www.dropbox.com/s/umqmu2rslge7r81/Redshift%20LE%20%283%29%204ultrarush.SC2Replay?dl=0 Anyone done this before. I'm starting with two extractors first then I'm going SP. I think you want: 2 extractors immediatly spawning pool. Put all 6 drones on gas the moment extractors finish Then get up to 4 drones on minerals? upgrade to lair. Then 8 drones? Then Infestation pit then overlord Then start hive and 14 workers? Working on the rest still. The point is to get as many ultras as fast as possible. I have a similar one that can get sp first but I have to compare them. This may either help get more ultras to start or, if lucky, help get an ultra den out faster than at 5 minutes. My fastest traditional match starting with immediate SP was to lay the Ultra den at approx 4:58. Then get Ultras after. I think this has the potential to be faster. It removes the time to wait for gas after the spawning pool for lair. Although it adds some time to getting the SP. Might need to adjust some workers from gas and put them on part way to increase minerals a little. Here is a second match. Still very sloppy. https://www.dropbox.com/s/ox6ntvtpw23dzhj/16-Bit%20LE%20%284%29%204ultraliskrush2.SC2Replay?dl=0 Just did another match where I actually had my den finished at 4:58 second. This is the same as my best Spawn pool first start. And I think there was room to improve. If they turn out identical there is at least one major difference. Spawning pool first can let you get one queen out while the infested building is being build before the hive starts. Extractors first doesn't have the resources to spare and you need to go all ultras. I think this is faster than spawning pool first though. Extractor first also requires a really fast beginning response to lay extractors and then to get drones into the extractors upon completely to maximize time. It took me 3 seconds to start extractors. This can be done better. And I take too long getting drones to the extractors.Aital8 Aug 29
Aug 29 Beating Mass Stalker/Chargelot Any advice? Literally mass stalker/chargelot with a couple sentries -- maybe 2 storms if it is later in the game. What comp beats this? Hive tech is not allowed. Working off about 3 gases and 22/19 bases. Protoss is playing aggressively and plans to push you all in with it.MystiKasT7 Aug 29
Aug 24 Coop spells vs Multiplayer spells Blinding cloud, Fungal, Seeker missile, maybe more I dunno. Just so annoying! In multiplayer are much better. Blinding cloud let cast spells such snipe and dont slow down your units! Fungal dont root units, and AAM misile much better.Rico1 Aug 24
Aug 18 team games zerg vs air long story short, im playing team games with the mrs to get her into the game and and later in the game im getting trashed if protoss go air. I find you have to be cheesy and go for the kill early or die later. is there some advice that someone can give for team games. i dont always want to play toss and terran. I like zerg but this is terrible for AA. hydra and corruptors melt too quick and although I love playing muta they get melted by carriers or pheonix later in the game if I dont win off them.Devastator16 Aug 18
Aug 17 Kudzu Zerg The new war chest robot-zerg skins are cool. We need plant zerg next year! It spreads like kudzu! Creep is grass ("get off my lawn!").Simon0 Aug 17
Aug 16 Unlock zerg campaigne How to unlock zerg campaign i have beaten all human missions used the battle chest to unlock all expansions but the only story available is the protoss campaigne do i need to beat that before i can play zergDARKON2 Aug 16
Aug 15 Newbie: Mastering Zerglings Newbie here. What do I have to do to take Zergling to the Nth degree. In terms of numbers built, upgrades, tactics on the field. If Zerglings is your main weapon during most of the game, what do you do to make it happen.Rich2 Aug 15
Aug 11 Baby Scourge from Mutas(stim like ability) Random idea. Trying to see if I can make it work. It's the idea of making scourge from mutas. I was coming up with the idea from several other discussions, but here is the condensed version. http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Scourge_(StarCraft_II) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Scourge Ignore the building cost. Unless you know what to put in. Because I have no idea personally how to balance building and abilities cost. Secondary evolution for Spire: Scourge Nest: Cost: ? Time: ? Abilities: Scourge Egg laying: Description: Parisitic microorganism that can turn into scourge exist within the mutalisk now. And at will mutalisk can lay scourge eggs on their bodies and hatch after a given amount of time. Each egg lays two scourge. The scourge feed from the mutalisk own body to grow. Muta gains a stim like ability that allows it to be covered in eggs and these eggs grow into scourge. Can move while covered in eggs. Take HP from muta. Cannot be used if it would bring the muta below 20 hp. Consecutive eggs stack and spawn after a given time after laying in order applied. This might give some more reason to use mutas. And some fun new strategies. Stim can also take the HP at the start of the egg laying or at the end. This could make for more means to balance the scourge. This would represent the eggs draining HP or the scourge eating after hatching. It could also slowly drain so instead of a chunk of HP it drains a given amount per second and spawning 4 eggs takes away more HP per second making the muta loose more hp compared to 1 egg for instance. Example: Baby Scourge egg: Cost: 25hp (25 gas?) 0 supply(x2 scourge per egg) HP: 12 (per baby scourge) Armor: 0 (+1) (light-biological) Attack Type: Air Range: 1 Damage: 20?(+2) (splash or no splash)(did scourge ever have splash?) Hatching time: 5 seconds (5hp per second per egg) Life Time: 15 seconds Movement: 3.75 They could be much smaller than normal scourge to make it harder to target them down. 8d Can only spawn 4 eggs(2xbaby scourge each) at a time per muta or anything that in the course of laying would produce below 20 hp at the start of the egg laying process. Instead of taking all 25hp in one gulp the scourge eggs drain 5 hp per second per egg while laying. This is countered by muta heal to a small extent. Depending on the stats and abilities it could allow mutas to be more than just harassment by both being able to deal much higher damage to air or using scourge as fodder to stop enemies from targeting them to deal more damage for longer. Possible secondary ability. Kamikaze: This upgrade allows the baby zerg to divebomb ground units as well as hit air! (Must be researched to use.) This could be balance by becoming a ground unit at a distance of up to 3 giving ground units time to hit them(assuming they have the range.). Although being spawned above ground units would allow them to drop on top of them directly as a ground unit at any distance less than 3. This may be op, or an alternative to BroodLords as it cost gas to use. It would also change the ai potentially. Unless it is a special ability requiring you to target an enemy.(it would require a click(ability activation) and targeting of a unit! Else a toggle on the muta for auto aim.) This can be balanced by making it take away 33% of max life timer. It cannot be used if the life timer would go below 0. So, if it's 15 second life timer you could kamikaze for a max of 10 seconds to destination. For a range of 37.5 range if it's a direct multiplier to speed. Hitting a ground unit or object prematurely after becoming a ground unit could cause it to explode and cause small area damage(assuming scourge should splash. Might be useful for kamikazi only as it would represent their attack vs smaller units.). But it could not go through units once becoming a ground unit to hit others. This could be countered by tight units like marines or zealots potentially. They would basically be air banelings with less damage potential and HP. Much more specialized and weaker to counters. If needed kamikaze could also provide a speed bonus to get to destination. This might be acceptable as it takes away life timer. Although it could be overpowering or unneeded.Aital5 Aug 11
Aug 11 Replace Hydra with Hunter Killer! Unit stats: https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Hydralisk https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Hydralisk_(Legacy_of_the_Void) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Roach_(Legacy_of_the_Void) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Marine_(Legacy_of_the_Void) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Marine https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Battlecruiser_(Legacy_of_the_Void) http://starcraft.wikia.com/wiki/Hunter_Killer_(StarCraft) Original ideas: SC2 Hunter Killer stats:(My proposed stats!) Cost: 150min, 75 or 50gas (2 units) Armor: 0 or 2?(Light-Bilogical)(or Armored-Biological) Damage: 16(+2) HP: 150(120 if too high. 160 if too low.) Edit: Changed it to 150hp again and 0 armor. This will make it weaker to start and slightly better in the end. Other options could be 120hp and 2 armor, or 160 hp and 0 armor. 120 and 2 armor would be interesting against marines. 120 and 2 armor could also have it be an armored unit as well to give certain ships like the voidray more damage. Final design: SC2 Hunter Killer:(My best guess) Cost: 150 Minerals; 75 Gas (2 units) Armor: 2(+1) (Armored-Biological) Damage: 16(+2) HP: 120 All other stats are the same as the current hydra.(But can obviously be adjust for balance like anything) This may give much better AA to zerg and make marines a little less scary, forcing better unit combos. I think this is fair as the pure zerg and other low end units combos get destroyed so quickly now from tech upgrades and unit combos. This would make a nice centerpiece to zerg AA and other capabilities. And what better than the old hunter killer! In fact they would make a very good counter to void rays. This setup would make it so you can only have 53.333 hydras per base instead of 80. But you potentially get more out of them which may or should make them feel more useful. And possibly open up more tactics.Aital6 Aug 11
Aug 11 ScourgeHost? Reading a few of the forums today, I noticed that a lot of people are complaining that Zerg is lacking in AA. The return of Scourge seems to be the most common comment. However I also feel that if this unit is to return it is an opportunity to bring a new life to the Swarm Host. I kinda feel like it could be fun to switch between locusts and scourge. Building requirements Roach warren = 2 Locusts Spire = 4 Scourge with a 5-10 second life span each dealing 35+15 to armored splash damagePumperNickel22 Aug 11
Aug 10 2-3 year absence from SC LF zerg builds I been away from the game for a while. where is a good place to learn some builds for the current metaYuno2 Aug 10
Aug 10 Tips for Defending Counterattacks as Zerg? Does anyone have any general guidelines or principles for defending counterattacks as Zerg, especially when your timing attack army is wiped out, and you're low on gas? It seems like the only thing I can make in this situation is a bunch of lings, and they are basically useless when I rally them directly to the fight, because they melt in a single-file line (since rallying is not an attack-move). What is the best place to rally my last-minute defenses in this situation? (Regardless of the race of my opponent.) Also, more specifically, what is the best way to defend against a counterattack that is a small cluster of marines and medivacs, if you don't have time or gas to make banes? Am I just screwed at this point?TritochHuntr6 Aug 10
Aug 9 Pure mineral game undoable. +SpineCrawler2.0 Using only minerals is impossible in this game. This is a domonstration of this games inblance. If I have 10k minerals I should be able to do signifigant damage to an enemy becuase i invested macro. Even with pure minerals. This was always possible in BW to some extent. Now I can be beaten with a small group of air and ground units. Even if throwing max 200 lings at an enemy. If I invest heavy infastructure the enemy should need to keep up in said area also to some extend. A 2 base with normal tech shoudl not take on an 8 base ling with only minerals and the ability to repeatedly get a full group of 200 resource lings and throw it at their base. No amount of defense and lings can stop a group of about 16 roaches and like 4 broodlords. This game needs to be severely redone. BTW, I'm purposely playing pure mineral matches. I'm doing this to learn macro strategy and master it(which was my preference in SC1/BW). But there is no point as the game is oriented to nulify it. And i mean it is literally focused design wise to nullify it. this is a joke for starcraft. This should be nearly as viable as other strategy. Not hard countered at the beginning of a match. They were at 2/2 ground upgrades by the end of the match. But this is still too strong. I think the problem is that the Damage output of this game is so much higher. While the HP and other stats are the similar to BW. They should really tone it down a bit. Also ground static defense is too weak. Allowing zerg ground to move should not nullify it's defensive abilities. They should have more power without support as they are glass cannons(just glass technically.) because of the increased general unit damage. Didn't spine crawlers used to do like 40 damage a hit. What is with this nonsense on zerg defense with attack types. It's ground defense. There is no excuse giving it only attack vs armored. There is no ground defense for zerg against zerg. The other races aren't forced into unit types on their defense. In fact they get insanely strong defense and then extra specialization abilities. This is completely unacceptable for zerg. They took our already fairly lowly ground defense while they buffed everything elses potential into the sky. There is also no point to 2 armor when everything does 14+ attack every hit. Especially with fast attacks. There is no thought in this. The zerg defense is not made for just defending against marines...!! Zerg are completely naked. https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Sunken_Colony https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Spine_Crawler_(Legacy_of_the_Void) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Photon_Cannon_(Legacy_of_the_Void) https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Photon_Cannon *Look at the cannons damage/speed/size as a comparison. It literally cost twice as much to do half the damage. It needs at least 40 damage for the damage per area it takes up. Even if it still cost 100 to make. It is a 150m unit for gods sake. Nothing else cost that much for that little. They need to do pure mineral games as a standard balance practice. It shows you the problems with basic defense and unit balance for macro almost instantly. This give a good means to balance the rest of the game. Everything just plows through zerg defense now. Maybe they should go back to the old damage types. Or increase the damage and add some negative damage bonuses. It's like they didn't consider this at all. Medium units are now insanely powerful compared to BW. Especially as they have more damage now too. How do you keep everything the same with this big of a change to damage?! The rest of the game works this way they need to reequilize it. They could much better balance the game reconsidering those factors. I think the other problem is the resource buildup is too fast.. 8\ when will they just remake match types without 12 workers. I'd like to enjoy this game again. It's not like they can't do both. We need more match types again. I'm sick of playing 12 workers.Aital3 Aug 9
Aug 8 The Ultralisk Fix -The Spellbound Witnessing of the destruction on Timul IV; what really happened to the Terran garrison that day I still cannot forget the $&%* I saw that day...they moved with a fluid grace that belied their size, the only indicator of their presence the sound of that quaking thunder that accompanies them. It was as if every exertion was forced upon them the force of a tidal wave, a contraction of muscle and sinew that drew only release from the sole goal of its target. We fired shell after artillery shell into their midst, but they shrugged them off with barely any gaping wounds across that hard, thick shell. Thick as they come, it throws not a wrench into their workings for if only that it further enhanced their purpose as they come, a barrelling force of indestructible carnage. And they hit home, with the force of that tidal wave I was talking about, all that pent-up rage in that tortured shell, fuelling the thrusts of those massive tusks. We were mowed over in seconds. -diary entry found at the garrison on Timul IV This thread can also be called How to Fix Starcraft 2 in ONE Move. Well well well...who missed Starcraft 1's animation of the big boys? Me, I do. I was so looking forward to my favourite unit's comeback in the second installment of my favourite RTS franchise, because they fulfilled what the nightmare of the Zerg was all about and stood for, that of a evolutionary crown beast that was entirely bred for destruction, but it was to my realisation that they were no longer animated the way they were back in SC1. There is something a little lacklustre about their current incarnation, something a little less sexy, like they have no real intention to brunt their bulk into your face, but casually trod up to you and swipe with you with its right set of claws first, then its left, alternating. Sounds boring isn't it? SC1, they nailed it, the Ultralisks moved, even though not very fast, as if it was exerting all its strength in moving its huge bulk forward, and when it struck, it was as if that titanic exertion was translated into its attack, and to complete the image, it used both its tusks. This is an excerpt of a conversation I had with my friend, conveying my past sentiments on the Ultralisks, before the alterations: when they moved, they lumbered forth at a steady pace that was frightening in consideration of their great bulk, and the entire motion was as if in reckless efforts despite the weight of its great bulk, which gave the impression of a momentum of a barrelling ram of destruction just as it seems to be carried with the strain of that bulging mass of pulsing muscle, as if the muscles were contracting and propelling against a monstrous denial of the efforts required. more can be said about the sexy way it moved, but when it attacked, it is as if it orgasmed with every crushing smash of its inhumanly enormous blades it attacked with the bestial focus of every ounce and shred of muscle and sinew, propelling the crushing weight of its blades as if to certify it is a mindless being, of its tortured origins bred to be only a demon of destruction. now it is so lacklustre are you sure it is even a beast? I don't feel the energy from it I can no longer !@#$%^-*!e to it in fact omfg u @#$%^-*!@e to sc1 ultralisk? I used to think of Ultralisks barrelling down in a path of destruction, smashing apart with sheer brutality even the most stalwart and self-contained base defences, striking awesome fear into the hapless Terrans with a carnal force with every swipe of pure unbridled strength completely devouring all hope, CRUSHING EVEN ULTIMATE RESISTANCE WITH THE FURY OF A DEMONIC BEAST that was sex to me and of course I imagined them as females lol u beast boy and return the sound to its Original Starcraft voice set, it reinforced my belief it has an #$%^-* everytime it attacks So now onto how I think you should change the Ultralisk. First of all, the attack animation. There should only be one attack animation, and it should flow seamlessly from the moving animation, as if it was the SC1 Ultralisk instead. Secondly, give it an armour boost, 1 base armour for it is freaking disgraceful. And that's all folks, I leave the rest of the complaints to you. P.S. there's two other points of note, something most people might not have noted, but in SC1, the Ultralisk's attack animation would pause after several strikes. Blizzard should bring that back. And the second point of note is the Ultralisk had an attack range of 1, not ZERO. This does not mean it can attack air, BUT it is able to hit an enemy on an elevation. I know it works, I have had my Ghost killed that way before.Calixtus3 Aug 8
Aug 6 The return of the creep colony? Sounds bizarre when we have the ever efficient creep tumor doesnt it? Hear me out. Creep tumors are great, they only cost energy and can spread indefinitely, why would we ever want to waste a drone to spread creep? Mobility and defensibility are the answers here. The creep colony in SC1 could be built as soon as a player wanted. No pool or anything required, just 75 minerals. The power of this is that in SC2 units rely on creep to move faster and for sight (though creep doesnt actually give vision, but thats a post for another day). Usually a player must get a fast queen and forgo the first inject to drop a tumor. Whats more the tumor provides no added benefit to the zerg player aside from the creep. A creep colony however does. First it allows the queen to kick right into macro focusing on injects while a single drone builds a creep colony. Being a 400 hp structure it will last longer under attack from enemy forces allowing zerg to react. Sure tumors are cloaked but they drop like flies as soon as any detection is near. These structures will not, allowing slightly longer creep holding. Now for the main point. In addition to creep spreading these colonies can be morphed into spores and sunkens (or spines in this case i suppose). The difference from their crawler brethren would be that they of course, can not move. But wait! Then why would we ever want these stupid things? Time A spine crawler or spore crawler take around 50 seconds to build. Often times even if you scout the entrance of an opponents base and see a rush coming its too late, your crawlers will be 10-25 seconds from finishing before they arrive at your door. Creep colonies fix that. With a 30 second build time and a 30 second morph time, sure it takes longer overall. But the time reduction from colony to defensive structure could save you. On the attack: But wait, i said mobility and defensibility, nothing about attack. Currently to do a spine crawler push you need to get a queen + overlord or a nydus. The nydus is a dead give away with its rawr making it hard to build those 50 second crawlers and the queen is slow as sin. A drone with an overlord though, that could do it very well. This would probably be a niche strategy but it could be effective none the less. Nothing over powered, nothing crazy. Just options. Something zerg has been missing for a while.Maico11 Aug 6
Aug 4 Nydus Worms? Nydus worms are only used in cheeses/all-ins. They are never used for legitimate reasons. I propose nydus worms cost reduced to 50/50, and the nydus network cost increased to 200/200. This will have limited effect on all-ins, but will make it far more efficient to use nydus networks in a defensive manner.Shaggy5 Aug 4
Jul 31 Katowice 2018 WarChest: Primal Zerg Skin Honestly, I feel the current Primal Zerg Skin they used in the WarChest and the one for Dehaka in Co-op Missions are unique on its own and fits the theme quite well, but I do prefer the Primal Zerg Skins in the campaign, you know the more reptilian-looking ones(Especially the Ultralisk). Well what are your thoughts? Would you have preferred it to be like in the campaign? Or do you like it as it is now?OracleHD1 Jul 31
Jul 29 infested terrans blizzard now that we need infested terrans for anti air. please please please give us a way too drop them all at once.GreyLotus2 Jul 29
Jul 27 Photon Canon Contain Hi all, I started playing Versus again after a five month hiatus, and I'm certainly extremely rusty. I have a lot to learn and relearn, and of course the game's meta has changed some during that time. I played a match last night, as Zerg, where my opponent contained me with Photon Canons (this has never happened to me before as Zerg). I briefly tried Roaches and Ravagers to try and break through and backed off quickly seeing the futility of that thanks to Shield Batteries. I then went for a Nydus Network and wiped out my opponent's main, but of course he'd been making some Void Rays and I had poor anti-air. I'm not certain what I could have done in this situation, replay below: https://lotv.spawningtool.com/39499/ Any advisement against this kind of strategy would be appreciated. I also saw this, which would be something to try: https://lotv.spawningtool.com/build/78587/ Thanks!Juxtapose7 Jul 27
Jul 22 Problem with Queen Inject Hello! I am having trouble with queen injects. I've been trying to use the method expertly shown by Lowko here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rFGzYEynaQ However, when I do this in game, around half the time, a queen tries to move to another hatchery across the map. I do not know if I'm doing it too fast (unlikely after watching scarlet do this) or too slowly?Inkogneeto3 Jul 22
Jul 20 Why are toss so op Their 4 or w/e number of gates can supply troops across the map no matter how big it is, in a matter of mere seconds, this is a fast expanding zergs worst nightmare since 2-3 spine crawlers with a handful of roaches and lingoes can't hold of 5 zealots and 10 stalkers with more reinforcements every 30 seconds, and the zerg at first may be able to reproduce units but it relies on freaking larvae which will run out after awhile, while the toss can reproduce as many units as it wants, this to me is total bs, I say nerf the warp gate more than 20 seconds more like 35, and take 20 hp away from zealots idc just de buff them, I'm tired of nooby toss players 4 gating, since that's all they know, AND if that doesn't fit them they go forna proxy or fast stargate, the effed thing is that zerg have to freaking tech up while toss has a freaking 1.5 tier unit that can they can freaking mass produce and is VERY effective against brood lords, roaches ultras, if they have blink, mutas, and corruptors, my point is that toss have waaaaay to many ways to easily killma erg player no matter how skilled he is..........DEBUFF TOSSchippedstick11 Jul 20
Jul 16 Terran player, looking to switch. Terran has gotten boring Mech in TvT and TvZ and Bio vs P.....looking for some pointers, it is VERY different and im having a hard time understanding when to drone and when to build army, also when to take my gases.Bear2 Jul 16
Jul 15 Snatcher (Lurker morph) Zerg unit concept: Snatcher Brief description: Tactical burrowing unit with the ability to grab air and ground within a vertical cylinder area, digesting the target dealing damage over time, and restoring its own health. Appearance: A stomach toothy edged mouth thing with 3 lurker legs, when snatching, it launches a long purple tendril with a smaller spikey mouth on the end to grab the prey. Stats: 100 health Armor: 0 (Light - Biological) Cargo size: 2 Regeneration while digesting/damage output: 45 per/sec vs biological, 25 per/sec vs mechanical Snatch cooldown: 10 seconds Targets: Air and Ground (Non-Massive) Range: 5 Movement speed: 3.85 Movement speed while digesting: 3.1 (19% slower movement) Trigger delay: 1.5 seconds (revealed) Trigger animation: the stomach mouth's teeth begin to emerge and get a quick glimmer shine on them to indicate that they are about to strike and to veer away Prey reel in speed: 2 seconds (becomes hidden again after the prey is engulfed) Morph time: 9 seconds Morphed from Lurker, Snatchers come in pairs. Morph cost: 50 minerals, 50 gas (this makes each Snatcher cost 100 minerals and 100 gas) Required Structure: Snatchers' Nodule is an add-on to the lurker den, it's attached to the side of the lurker den, while the nodule is growing, the lurker den can't research adaptive talons, speaking of which would also be applied to Snatchers. Stats: health: 400 Armor: 3 (Armored - Biological - Structure) Cost: 100 minerals, 125 gas Build time: 38 Requires: Lair Upgrades Available: Homogenous Acids (passive): Snatchers' acid reserviour now deals the same amount of damage to mechanical units (45) Research time: 35 seconds Cost: 50 minerals 125 gas Requires: Hive Heightened Reflexes (passive): reduces the trigger dely to 0.75 seconds and the prey reel in speed to 1 second (x2 speed) Research time: 25 seconds cost: 125 minerals and 75 gas Transfusion Tendril (active): targets friendly biological units with a thin tendril that sends bulges toward the targeted unit, which transfers the health of the Snatcher to the targeted unit. The Snatcher cannot go below 10 health when transfering health. Research time: 45 seconds cost: 150 minerals 150 gas The main focus is to have a stealth anti air option for zerg, and if you have committed to lurkers heavily the Snatcher's Nodule allows you to tech switch quickly. Also think of how fun it would be to use them on enemy worker lines, place one in each undefended mineral line and the worker kills will stack up over time (kind of like widow mines) I had a lot of fun with the concept, it would be cool if it could be implemented.NukedPenguin4 Jul 15
Jul 15 The Zerg stage 3 "training" is really hard. The bots attacked while I was following the tutorial, at that time I have 3 bases, the bots destroyed my main base, spawning pool, evolution pit along with most of my drones on the main base. I panic kited them out with my 4 roaches, using spawn larvae from 2 queens, then summoned 8 zerglings and 2 roach. I was recovering before the bots attacked me again, destroyed my 1st base, luckily the minerals are relatively ran out so I migrate to the 4th base, I quickly build ultralisk den, mutalisk den thing?, and roach warren w spawning pool then finished the enemy with a mixture of zerglings, roach, mutalisks, ultralisks. I don't need Lurkers or weird Vipers/banelings because it got too hard to macro with the bots pressure. But holly fuk it is hard. 8/10 difficulty!! But yay I beat the tutorial!!GarenOnly1 Jul 15