Nerf Blink DIRECTLY.

General Discussion
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03/18/2014 04:12 AMPosted by Kero
I think best is increase both cost and time, make it cost 200/200 and research time of equivalent to a making a spire.
If you mean to change the time to making a spire, then thats actually BUFFING blink cause the build time of a spire is 100 seconds. Blink research time is 170 seconds.

If you mean adding 100 seconds, then I understand you better.
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


This is the problem most people have pointed out and I think we can all agree the map pool is mostly responsible for. Thanks for addressing this.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.
Good to hear. Although I'd recommend changing blink at some point, as we'd like blink all-ins not to be so easy, but not to be undoable either. Also would not like map design to be limited because of blink.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


Give this guy a raise. I don't care if he's new.
03/18/2014 01:34 PMPosted by laughup
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.
Good to hear. Although I'd recommend changing blink at some point, as we'd like blink all-ins not to be so easy, but not to be undoable either. Also would not like map design to be limited because of blink.

+1 great post
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


Thanks for letting us know. I guess we'll know in season 2 if a map pool change is sufficient to remedy the problem or further action is required.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


ARE YOU SERIOUS?

How many months do you need to gather data to understand that something is terribly terribly wrong with this race. Im not only talking about blink..... Storm can end a great 30-40 minute match in 2 secs, protoss proxyteching certain buildings is just disgusting and of course lets not forget about PO, the most broken spell in the game which requires absolutely NO skill at all. I guess after reading david kims AMA I should probably thank you because honestly, after reading this it can only get better. So yeah, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR A NOT BLINK FRIENDLY MAPPOOL IN THE FUTURE. In other words: Thanks for nothing.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


Thanks for the update! I'm looking forward to better and more interesting maps for the upcoming season :D
03/15/2014 08:40 PMPosted by Qendel
Random thought. Would making Blink require a Dark Shrine be too much of a nerf?


It would be weird. You would have to prepare for DTs and blink but there would be other problems too.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


So, I'm assuming you would make bases closer to their natural making it easier to defend. But wouldn't this cause problems for ZvT if Zerg wants to be aggressive?
03/18/2014 02:05 PMPosted by Shahzad
It would be weird. You would have to prepare for DTs and blink but there would be other problems too.


I thought so as well, I just wanted to try thinking outside the box :D
Changes to the maps just seems like a way of avoiding the problem. So from now on every time anyone makes maps they just gotta make sure blink stalkers wont autowin on it. It just limits what kinda maps we will see in the future. Why not go directly at the problem instead of picking around the edges like that.

That's the same line of thinking they are employing with regards to SH for that matter. Trying to do all these cute things instead of just fixing the real problem. That's just my opinion.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


I hope you guys won't forget that making bad blink maps also hinders the ability of the reaper to scout, therefore affecting terran in all 3 matchups. Good example is how reapers are much less valuable on a map like Habitation station than for example Heavy Rain.

Good blink maps are often good reaper maps. And while protoss doesn't need to go blink every time on every map, terran does have to scout in every game and on every map. And in every matchup.
03/18/2014 02:29 PMPosted by Davidkimchi
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


I hope you guys won't forget that making bad blink maps also hinders the ability of the reaper to scout, therefore affecting terran in all 3 matchups. Good example is how reapers are much less valuable on a map like Habitation station than for example Heavy Rain.

Good blink maps are often good reaper maps. And while protoss doesn't need to go blink every time on every map, terran does have to scout in every game and on every map. And in every matchup.


From past decisions it is likely that they will ignore this part and in 4 months only start to realize how bad this decision was for reapers.

Also wer'e gonna have a stale map pool because of this. Instead of just increasing research time by 30 seconds.
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


Ok to begin with, how exactly is blink fixed by the msc vision? Because i haven't seen any indication that the vision change fixed it at all. Its still rampant with an absurd win rate in tournaments, it ruined IEM, and its like half the TvPs in masters.

Tell me by removing Dedelus point, Heavy Rain, Yeonsu, and Polar night. (which is what would be needed to fix this if your doing it by maps) Are you just going to never make maps anymore that have wide cliffs? essentially every map will have to be an isolated main?

Not to mention, how does terran reaper scout? Scouting in tvp is only possible because your reaper can get in the main in many different paths, if you remove that, how do you scout the mains?

No one asked for you to change blink, NO ONE. I don't know where you came up with that idea. Just increase research time or cost, and that eliminates the timing.
03/18/2014 02:29 PMPosted by Davidkimchi
03/18/2014 01:31 PMPosted by Psione
After testing changes to Blink in our balance update test map, we felt that altering Blink directly was not a change we wanted to pursue at this time. We’re still gathering data on how recent balance updates have affected the various match-ups, and so far we’re seeing that the Mothership Core vision change has affected certain Blink strategies as intended.

Additionally, we have some changes planned for the Season 2 map pool that we feel will further affect Blink builds in the upcoming season. You can expect more information on the Season 2 map pool changes in the coming weeks.


I hope you guys won't forget that making bad blink maps also hinders the ability of the reaper to scout, therefore affecting terran in all 3 matchups. Good example is how reapers are much less valuable on a map like Habitation station than for example Heavy Rain.

Good blink maps are often good reaper maps. And while protoss doesn't need to go blink every time on every map, terran does have to scout in every game and on every map. And in every matchup.


This TvP win rates will simply plummet further if terran is not able to get reliable scouting information at all times vs protoss. While blink is definitely the strongest timing protoss currently has vs terran it's just one of the many deadly timings / all-ins and pressure that protoss can utilize vs terran at all times.

This would be fine if terran would also be able to punish protoss before the 10 minute mark as well which simply isn't the case at the moment.
03/18/2014 02:29 PMPosted by Davidkimchi
I hope you guys won't forget that making bad blink maps also hinders the ability of the reaper to scout, therefore affecting terran in all 3 matchups. Good example is how reapers are much less valuable on a map like Habitation station than for example Heavy Rain.

Good blink maps are often good reaper maps. And while protoss doesn't need to go blink every time on every map, terran does have to scout in every game and on every map. And in every matchup.


Just an additional concern worthy to consider:
Possibly it will affect Toss defence vs Mutas and Drops more than actually directly nerfing Stalkers, not to mention adding additional pressure to map makers where maps will become copy paste colossi/blinkers-proof with just a different decals.
As a lousy silver terran my issue is that lousy silver protons can employ this easily without scouting or consequences.

if they screw it up they just recall. If they don't screw up they win. There is no drawback because of the msc.
Heh, protoss. Thx autocorrect.

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