Balance Status Update

General Discussion
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We’d like to share our current thoughts and gather more detailed feedback from you on the current state of HotS balance.

PvT
Following the balance patch and then the Season 2 map update, we’re seeing that this matchup has gotten much better. However, we do believe the matchup is still slightly in favor of Protoss. Whether this is actually the case or another balance adjustment is needed remains in question.

ZvT
This matchup may have shifted slightly in-favor of Zerg recently. While we believe full army vs. army-play is fine, Zerg players seem to be getting to the later stages with an advantage more often than not. We’re investigating whether we can make a slight tweak earlier in the game to keep Zerg economy from scaling too quickly.

We believe ZvP is in a good place with a lot of diversity.

While we don’t currently believe that we need to take action hastily, we’d like to continue discussions with you and prepare well-tested changes, if they’re needed. There’s not a clear problem, and we may not issue a balance patch at this time, but we’re constantly on the lookout for signs that we need to get a balance test map going.

With that said, we have a couple of proposed changes that we could test. Please keep in mind, as always, this is an open discussion and nothing is even close to final. We do not yet have a balance test map.

Option 1:
- Terran infantry level 2 upgrade costs down from 175/175 to 150/150.
- Terran infantry level 3 upgrade costs down from 250/250 to 200/200.

The main thought behind this option is to allow Terran to pressure both Protoss and Zerg a bit more, so that they can keep up in army strength throughout the game. As you can see, saving 25/25 per upgrade at level 2 isn’t huge, but because it affects the core Terran army, we believe it will be fairly big in-game.

Option 2:
- Remove the transformation servos upgrade.
- Allow Hellions to transform to Hellbats when Hellbats are enabled with the armory.

This option addresses the concern that PvT is trending better than we expected, and ZvT worse than expected. At this point, we’re fairly certain that Protoss isn’t struggling against Terran (which runs contrary to pro feedback we’ve been receiving), but we’re also receiving pro feedback on ZvT that indicates we might want to have a bigger change lined up.

We saw the strength of not having this upgrade for the transform in the early HotS beta. However, since then, Hellbats have had their damage reduced and require the blue flame upgrade to be at their max strength. The main cool factor of reverting this upgrade is: being able to save the initial Hellions that players use to harass vs. not being able to do so will have a huge impact on the rest of the game. This means that players who are capable of microing well will be rewarded heavily.

Again, we want to hear what you think as we explore the possibilities. Thank you very much for your feedback.
Awesome to hear. I like option 2 ALOT.

Edit: just wanted to add that I think the main problem isn't zerg having an advantage going into the late game. But the ability to buy so much time with mutalisks to get that advantage. Something needs to be done to make defending against mutalisks easier late game (especially when zerg tries to force a base trade) without taking away the ability for them to harass mid game (which rewards skill). Something like reducing the cost of missle turrets(might make them too good TvT) or giving them a +damage to bio tag, increasing thor splash radius or splash damage. Not sure but definitely need something vs mutas.
I like #2 because it would more than likely add more strategies compared to #1. However, transformation servos was added in Patch 15 of beta because of a timing attack that terrans were using in TvZ with hellions transforming to hellbats. Do you think that is no longer an issue now? Just curious.

Thanks for the update!

EDIT: Thanks for answering my question, David!
Option one FREAKING SUCKS FOR SO MANY REASONS. Option is freaking amazing because it will help bring hellcats back into play
A Terran army doesn't cost gas already and you want to cut the gas investment Terran has to make to be on par late game ? ROFL !! Please go for option 2, Dayvie :3...
Glad to hear Blizzard finally acknowledge that Terran is under performing at the highest levels mostly in TvZ and somewhat in TvP. I prefer option 2 as it would encourage bio bat usage alongside bio mine in TvP and TvZ. Option 2 also buffs Mech as well alongside bio bat so that's another bonus. Option 1 is decent, but not as good as option 2 imo.
Alright well here are my thoughts with regards to ZvT. To sum it up in one word: STAGNATION.

The match up is so bland. 90% of the time it goes the same way. Terran opens up with either early reaper/hellion/banshee pressure. Zerg goes mass ling bling muta. It then becomes a war of who can contain the other player and deny expos.

That is pretty much it. Every game even at the pro level. Same thing.

In my opinion, this match up is not OK. In fact it has stagnated so bad that I don't enjoy it any more.

I will wait patiently for LOTV to see if this match up has changed any.
These changes are kinda confusing.... Guess we'll see how it goes. Part of me thinks the hellbat change is a subtle push towards using hellbats more in TvZ instead of the widow mine. I've experimented with it but for me hellbats get swarmed by big zerg armies way too easily. Also, this change doesn't help Terran defend mass mutas in any way. I admit I need more practice with hellbat comps though.
Option 1 is obviously not a viable buff for TvZ even though it would be great for TvP. But it's not warranted.

Option 2 is an amazing idea that adds strategy while also getting rid of an upgrade that is never researched.
First off, thanks for giving the community an update on where you stand. This is much appreciated.

Secondly:
04/29/2014 04:55 PMPosted by Dayvie

Option 2:
- Remove the transformation servos upgrade.
- Allow Hellions to transform to Hellbats when Hellbats are enabled with the armory.


I approve of this change a lot. Would really be interesting to see this change added.

EDIT:
04/29/2014 05:01 PMPosted by JorgeCis
However, transformation servos was added in Patch 15 of beta because of a timing attack that terrans were using in TvZ with hellions transforming to hellbats. Do you think that is no longer an issue now? Just curious.


Hellbats were nerfed hardcore afterwards, and now need the Blue Flame upgrade to be at the same strength as before. I think this change would be fine.
well good you admit terran is screwed these days though you under play it. Guess its possible one day you'll actually fix your game but since you clearly have no idea how to fix it I'm glad I still switched to LoL
04/29/2014 04:55 PMPosted by Dayvie
Option 2:
- Remove the transformation servos upgrade.
- Allow Hellions to transform to Hellbats when Hellbats are enabled with the armory.

This option addresses the concern that PvT is trending better than we expected, and ZvT worse than expected. At this point, we’re fairly certain that Protoss isn’t struggling against Terran (which runs contrary to pro feedback we’ve been receiving), but we’re also receiving pro feedback on ZvT that indicates we might want to have a bigger change lined up.

We saw the strength of not having this upgrade for the transform in the early HotS beta. However, since then, Hellbats have had their damage reduced and require the blue flame upgrade to be at their max strength. The main cool factor of reverting this upgrade is: being able to save the initial Hellions that players use to harass vs. not being able to do so will have a huge impact on the rest of the game. This means that players who are capable of microing well will be rewarded heavily.


^This

With this change, the hellion becomes much more versatile early on, as well as adding new strategic play from terran openers, and transitions as well.

I feel as if the transformation servos became a dud-upgrade, as players never really upgraded it. With that being said, the armory-unlock for the transformation, is good enough in itself.

because each mech unit can transform already, making the hellion do the same earlier than usual, can really add a bit more for terran.

It also makes sense that those who save their hellions become rewarded from micro as you say, well thought out.

Also, maybe.. this could lead to some kind of more bio-mech play? idk but,

Option 2 is definitely something I'd consider.
Option 1 shouldn't be a option.
Unless you make 3-3 for zerg at infestation pit.

Terran will get 3-3 a lot faster than they already do, which is much faster than zerg can get.
Thank you for the update.

As a zerg player (even though I am gold EU) I agree that zerg is getting the edge over terran at the moment. I was wondering why my winrate even in gold against terran (especially in macro games) shot up so dramatically lately, and I would imagine if this were true in general, it would be felt even more at the pro level.

I don't consider myself qualified to choose option 1 or 2 since I do not play terran enough to make a fair choice between the two, but I just wanted to say thanks!

EDIT:
Considering some of the comments in this thread and their justifications, I am going to lean on option 2 as well. I think this might in essence lead to more interesting games from the Terran perspective.
04/29/2014 05:11 PMPosted by roarbot
Option 1 shouldn't be a option.
Unless you make 3-3 for zerg at infestation pit.

Terran will get 3-3 a lot faster than they already do, which is much faster than zerg can get.


It's seconds difference.. not astronomical like you're making it out to be. Not that Zerg needs 3/3 to compete with terran as displayed by many pro zerg.
COOL, nice to see an update like this.
Buff WidowMines
BTW if you buff protoss this game is as good as dead.

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