Community Update – January 12, 2018

General Discussion
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01/12/2018 11:37 AMPosted by Balance Team
Hydralisk
Hydralisks currently act as a powerful midgame unit against Terran and Protoss. When fully upgraded, they can help secure a late-game transition for Zerg players, or a quick victory if the opponent is unprepared. We feel that this is a good role for them, but their upgrades can come online too quickly. We’re trying to make it a little more “costly” to upgrade Hydralisks by once again splitting Muscular Augments into two separate upgrades. The cost of each upgrade will be 100 Minerals, 100 Vespene Gas, and the research time will be 71 seconds, which doubles the time it takes to fully upgrade Hydralisks.


Inb4 ling bane infestor meta is only way for zerg to win for a year xD
01/12/2018 11:37 AMPosted by Balance Team

Disruptor
In the last patch, we tried to address the fact that Disruptor drops were hard to deal with both because it killed workers too efficiently, and because ground units couldn’t pursue a Warp Prism when facing the threat of an instant Purification Nova. The delay we added seems to be weakening Disruptors too much, however, so we’re looking into various ways to address this issue.


Since stalker were nerfed maybe it would be really wise to make distruptors a robo tech (no bay required).
This will be the only way to help protoss deal with cyclone push that will be broken without stalker increased damage, will help versus terran all ins and versus any kind of 5 min timings from zergs.
It will also add some harass potential
01/13/2018 11:21 AMPosted by FriendlyProb
01/12/2018 11:37 AMPosted by Balance Team

Disruptor
In the last patch, we tried to address the fact that Disruptor drops were hard to deal with both because it killed workers too efficiently, and because ground units couldn’t pursue a Warp Prism when facing the threat of an instant Purification Nova. The delay we added seems to be weakening Disruptors too much, however, so we’re looking into various ways to address this issue.


Since stalker were nerfed maybe it would be really wise to make distruptors a robo tech (no bay required).
This will be the only way to help protoss deal with cyclone push that will be broken without stalker increased damage, will help versus terran all ins and versus any kind of 5 min timings from zergs.
It will also add some harass potential


Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Stalker damage shouldn't change against armored targets. Should only affect the vs Light interaction I thought.
01/12/2018 11:48 AMPosted by Whiteshadow
Hydra change is pretty interesting as well, delaying certain hydra mid game timings while still keeping its value im the late game and making the upgrade feels like a more strategic upgrade according to situations that can happen in mid game. Very good change


The hydra isn't used in late game (they are used to reach late game).

So we are back to the old hydralisk except +10hp. I really hope the hydralisk doesn't become niche again.

The patch delays the upgrades for 71s and costs 100-100 resources more. In early mid game zerg needs all the resources it can get and is vulnerable to attacks. I bet we will see a lot of ravager all ins and a lot of early mid game terran/protoss all ins vs zerg.

EDIT:
I also bet gsl will be won by a terran.
01/13/2018 04:57 AMPosted by Capirex
I disagree. I think zerg never had so many aggressive options in the early game vs P & T (bio handles them better than protoss, but mech has some problem too) as in LoTV (remember it's supposed to be the macro race that wins by outmacroing and overwhelming the opponent with superior numbers, fast remaxing and tech switches) and zerg is also very competitive in the endgame vs terran (but not against skytoss, i concede that is a problem in lategame ZvP that's masked by the current dominance of zerg early game aggressive option).


And you forget how bad that was for zerg. Defend defend defend until late game isn't fun. Even after a failed all in zerg had no options to end the game, instead he had to wait until late game and gave the other race the opportunity to start a second if not a third all in.

Is it really fair if a race has no aggressive options outside of some roach all ins which failed most of the time?
So you're "happy" with the roles that both hydras and stalkers play, but you go ahead and nerf the stalker anyway.

LMAO
[quote="207594078980"][quote="207593878451"]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Stalker damage shouldn't change against armored targets. Should only affect the vs Light interaction I thought.


dps won't change, but it will require more shots to kill targets now.
this shut down chances to micro stalker versus cyclones and in general versus other units while doing nice damage to them
01/13/2018 11:21 AMPosted by FriendlyProb
01/12/2018 11:37 AMPosted by Balance Team

Disruptor
In the last patch, we tried to address the fact that Disruptor drops were hard to deal with both because it killed workers too efficiently, and because ground units couldn’t pursue a Warp Prism when facing the threat of an instant Purification Nova. The delay we added seems to be weakening Disruptors too much, however, so we’re looking into various ways to address this issue.


Since stalker were nerfed maybe it would be really wise to make distruptors a robo tech (no bay required).
This will be the only way to help protoss deal with cyclone push that will be broken without stalker increased damage, will help versus terran all ins and versus any kind of 5 min timings from zergs.
It will also add some harass potential

The 99% of the problem is the 1 sec paralysis that makes disruptor totally useless.
That kind of unit will have the same impact whether it is produced from Nexus or produced after the Fleet Beacon.
You can make it 5min and 5 gas, 1000 damage on impact, but as long as it can not hit targets it's all in vain.

Blizzard is caught in a mess of it's own making, and to mitigate the disaster is digging deeper in the hole.

All this for a micro-intensive unit that even pre 4-patch was not widely used. They tried to fix a non-existant problem and generated a real one.
Stalkers are being nerfed thanks to warpgate. If Marines could be warped in they would be nerfed too.
01/13/2018 03:53 PMPosted by Candy
Stalkers are being nerfed thanks to warpgate. If Marines could be warped in they would be nerfed too.

Do you understand the b.... you are saying? From warpgates are created zealots, adepts templars and D.templars too.
Are they to be nerfed too?
After seeing how durable hydralisks are and how many cheap things protoss has as ways to win, really endless abusing of gimmicks,, I will say no regret for these zerg and protoss nerfs, totally needed.
01/13/2018 05:07 PMPosted by ImpactRange
After seeing how durable hydralisks are and how many cheap things protoss has as ways to win, really endless abusing of gimmicks,, I will say no regret for these zerg and protoss nerfs, totally needed.

But on the other hand, when your preciuos Widow Mine was nerfed you asked an Urgent Session of Security Council of United Nations.....

Scum.....
On the Raven - "This adaptability helps offset its high cost and gives Terran players more ways to make their opening moves in a game."

Are you kidding me? Terran already has the most possible opening moves and it isn't even close. I thought the Raven was nerfed because of auto turret spam. So we are back to this again? Muta is not a viable option to defend ravens because of the insane AA damage from Thor.

Please be objective blizzard. Why is it that we have small balance changes ad neaseam that always seem to benefit terran? You are seriously going to keep nerfing protoss and zerg and "fixing terran?"

You are attempting to fix ZVP with Hydra nerf = good
You are attempting to fix TVP with Stalker nerf = good (although stalkers were perfect now imo)
What are you doing about TvZ? Nothing but making it even worse.

For the love of god please do something about ZVT I cannot be the only one who thinks this has become absolute cancer and it just keeps getting worse.

All I've seen from Blizzard is an inexcusably rapid response to terran whine over and over again instead of just letting the meta play out. Why not balance the games on major patch updates instead of incessantly catering to Terran on a whim? It is the epitomy of entitlement and I'm frankly sick of it. Do something about Terran or you will be losing even more support starting with me, someone who has stuck by since BW.
Could you clarify the proposed Recall change?
Just increase the delay from 4 to 5 seconds? (and give more time)
Or make the units attackable for 1 second on defense after they were attackable for 4 seconds on offense? (nerf the 130 global cooldown defensive ability)
Don't bring back autoturret, it's just a noskill mechanic that requires way more skill from the zerg to defend and usually lasts for the entire game.
If I'm right in thinking, they're bringing back the Auto-Turret that does 18 damage per shot (3-shots all worker units regardless of armour upgrades) but only lasts for 7 seconds before it self-destructs.

The only minor complaint I have with them is the disparity between the machine gun sound effect and the heavy damage they do, but If I had to suggest something to make them a little fairer:
  • Change the Auto-Turret attack to a projectile

Given the 18 damage, it makes more sense for the Auto-Turret to fire heavy shells rather than bullets (and a sound effect to match... say, the Siege Tank when in tank mode), and the presence of projectiles will cause overkilling if they're spammed, thereby reducing their effectiveness. However, when only one or two are thrown down for light harassment, there's virtually no difference.
Nerfing hydralisk while Mech is at its strongest doesnt seem logical to me but it is what it is. Not gonna cry about it. But Auto-Turret!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!

Come on blizzard you know why u removed it please dont do that!

It makes no sense to have this strong mech army into mass raven style of play it makes no sense it is not fun for anyone....

We all know the pro terrans will use it to early harass but on the ladder from gold up to master1 its gonna be massed as it was before, dont bring a "carrier style plague" to terran....

Change to ghost makes sense.

And it is time to bring our 4 larva per inject back since we get the 9999999999th nerf back to back every seasson...

larva, BL, infestor, ravager and now hydra what is next? there is nothing left to nerf in Z anymore
SO protoss is getting nerfed pre-MSC removal.

I missed the part where MSC is back
01/13/2018 03:15 PMPosted by Goba
01/13/2018 11:21 AMPosted by FriendlyProb
...

Since stalker were nerfed maybe it would be really wise to make distruptors a robo tech (no bay required).
This will be the only way to help protoss deal with cyclone push that will be broken without stalker increased damage, will help versus terran all ins and versus any kind of 5 min timings from zergs.
It will also add some harass potential

The 99% of the problem is the 1 sec paralysis that makes disruptor totally useless.
That kind of unit will have the same impact whether it is produced from Nexus or produced after the Fleet Beacon.
You can make it 5min and 5 gas, 1000 damage on impact, but as long as it can not hit targets it's all in vain.

Blizzard is caught in a mess of it's own making, and to mitigate the disaster is digging deeper in the hole.

All this for a micro-intensive unit that even pre 4-patch was not widely used. They tried to fix a non-existant problem and generated a real one.


agree that cd is unnecessary on distruptors, still I think protoss need an early source of aoe early on.
even with 1 sec cd, a distruptor instead of an immortal, would deal way more better versus cyclone pushes.
Proxy cyclone will be free win for terrans, stalkers won't kill cyclones enough faster to make shield batteries efficient versus that kind of pushes.
Protoss will suffer also from any tank pressure or liberator pressure....it changes whole early game.
There is absolutly need a compensation for this, since 4.0 protoss early game is still such a mess.
We’re trying to make it a little more “costly” to upgrade Hydralisks by once again splitting Muscular Augments into two separate upgrades.


Hydralisks, the new bunker?

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