Q&A for Lower League Players(1Year,21 Weeks)

Protoss Discussion
Go ahead, make my day.
Ok, just finished experimenting in HOTS with a friend. I'm almost convinced nexus first PvP might be possible with the exception being proxy 2-gates. For anyone here do you think it's possible?

It relies on a rush to the mothership core and waiting for purify to defend against any early pressure.

Here is the current build order

9-pylon
scout (check for proxy gates as it presents the greatest danger)
@100% pylon chronoboost probes
13 chronoboost nexus
@25 energy chronoboost nexus (some of this is wasted)
16 Nexus
*Probe cut*
16 gateway
16 assimilator 1
*Resume Probe Production*
17 pylon
18 assimilator 2
@100% assimilator 3 in gas
@100% pylon chronoboost probes
@100% assimilator 2 3 in gas
20 @100% gateway cybernetics core
@100 minerals zealot
@100% nexus start probe production from both
@100% cybernetics core start and chronoboost out a mothership core
@100% cybernetics core warpgate and a stalker (chronoboosted)
@100% stalker chronoboost out a sentry

Mothership core should finish at about 5:10
It will have enough energy for purify at ~5:53
Sentry should finish between 5:40-5:50

This can then be followed up with a quick 5 total gateways for defense.

Against a 4-gate you can forcefield the ramp to your main and then use purify on the nexus at your natural. Purify lasts long enough that warpgate and 5 gateways will finish.

Against a zealot + stalker + mothership core force you will be able to match them with equal strength, but be able to already have a nexus and easily defend once the MSC hits 100 energy.

Against a 5 stalker rush purify will already be completed and can be used to defend your natural.

3 stalker rush is the question. If they rally 3 stalkers directly to your base they will get there slightly before purify is done. Chronoboosting out the stalker and sentry should allow the sentry to get out in time to forcefield the ramp to prevent the stalkers from entering the main. From there you may take a few probe losses at the natural, but it should give the mothership core enough time to get purify.

Thoughts?

Edit: If this ends up working credit goes to my friend fazz for having the balls to do nexus first in every matchup in HOTS.
I feel somewhat bad as you are such an excellent contributor, but I don't know how to answer this. I recently just received beta access so I'm not in a position to answer. :(

Maybe Sidewinder can critique it assuming he has been trying the beta.
What is the build order for the 4 Gate Blink Stalker allin for PvP?
I feel somewhat bad as you are such an excellent contributor, but I don't know how to answer this. I recently just received beta access so I'm not in a position to answer. :(

Maybe Sidewinder can critique it assuming he has been trying the beta.


Hahaha, it's the beta so I wasn't really expecting a serious response. You just asked for somebody to make your day so I thought I'd throw up a nexus first pvp build. XD I still have more experimenting with it myself.

01/08/2013 08:56 PMPosted by Samurai
What is the build order for the 4 Gate Blink Stalker allin for PvP?

There are variations I think. I'd open with a normal 3 stalker rush with a 2nd gas at 19 and then get the twilight. Chronoboost out blink and add 2 gateways and then just add on stalkers as money allows.
Wow, beta patch. I now have an answer to my own question. It auto-dies to a dt rush because they removed envision from the mothership core and put it on the oracle.
01/09/2013 03:25 PMPosted by wraithcube
Wow, beta patch. I now have an answer to my own question. It auto-dies to a dt rush because they removed envision from the mothership core and put it on the oracle.


Which is fine, because detection on MS Core effectively removed DTs from the game.

Nexus first PvP is probably never going to work reliably, because of how easy it is to scout before the other guy made a choice on build order. They could easily just straight up 4gate and win because while you barely have enough to cast the cannon thing on the Nexus, you really don't have the units to stop them from walking into your base. Nor would you have the units to stop them if they just waited for the cannon to wear off.

The only way I can see it working is something like taking the Nexus on 17 or so, before starting gas, then double gas and make MS Core and a couple sentries. If they 4gate, you can put the cannon up just to buy time (and not mine from the Nexus.. be prepared to lose it), and if they don't then you'll be in reasonably good economic shape.
I was actually going to respond to this earlier but got busy.

DTS would destroy this build in HoTS because of the cheaper cost of Dark shrine and the ability to get out an earlier DT.

I scout like no tomorrow and if I saw this build I would probably simply use my standard DT build in HoTS to destroy you. As sidewinder said I suspect a 4 gate or the variation of the 3 gate would kill this.

You might hold against the 4 gate or 3 gate but with no detection you would almost have to GG with a couple DTS.....even if somehow you survived the dts killing a dozen probes.....the point of nexus first is greed.......

your now far behind even if you hold the 4 gate, 3 gate or dt rush.
The idea here previously was that you could forcefield the ramp to the main to prevent anything from just running up into it (DT or 4-gate) and trap them at the natural or force them to run away for the 60 second duration. And that time was enough to get up a 5-gate and overwhelm an attacking force or at least fight for enough time for another photon overcharge.

That and you no longer have to worry about high ground warpins from pylons for stuff to get around a forcefield.

But yeah, back to the drawing board because now the MSC doesn't detect. Getting a robo means you could have an observer out in time, but you'd die to gateway pressure and getting the gateways can hold the gate attacks, but not the dts.

This makes me sad I can't be ridiculously greedy.
01/10/2013 07:20 AMPosted by wraithcube
This makes me sad I can't be ridiculously greedy.


LOL...it makes us all sad.

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