Story Forum

Oct 26, 2010 Welcome: Please Read! Welcome to the Warcraft Story Forum! This forum is here as a means for players to discuss the storylines of the Warcraft universe, as told in-game and through the novels, manga, comics, and short stories that Blizzard publishes. Community forums work best when participants treat their fellow posters with respect and courtesy, so we ask that you take the time to read through the forum Code of Conduct ( and guidelines ( before posting. Important Reminders: Search The search function at the top of the World of Warcraft community site is extremely effective and robust. Before you create a new forum topic, please be use it to search for similar topics, blog posts, or web pages that may contain the answer for which you are looking. Making a new thread on an existing subject can result in your thread being deleted or, if you continue to re-post the same content, the loss of your forum privileges for spamming. Rating The forum rating system can be used to promote positive discussion, demote unhelpful comments, and even report posts that violate the forum Code of Conduct. By hovering over a post you'll be presented with several options, including a "thumbs up" (Like) and a "thumbs down" (Dislike) icon. Clicking the "thumbs up" icon will rate the post up. If enough people like a post, it will gain a Highly Rated status and appear at the top of related search results. Highly Rated posts will also have a highlighted background. Clicking the "thumbs down" icon will expand a drop-down menu which will include "Dislike," "Trolling, "Spam" and "Report" options. "Dislike" will rate the post down. If enough people dislike a post, it will be darkened, and with a lot of dislikes it will be hidden completely. You can also quickly report a post as trolling or spam, or use the report function to fill out a more comprehensive description of a violation. Please note that you can only rate each post once. Use your power wisely to help foster a positive and helpful forum community. While the community team will be moderating this forum as normal, members of the Creative Development team will also be monitoring discussions and looking for constructive feedback. Have fun posting on these forums, and good luck with your adventures in Azeroth!Lylirra1 Oct 26, 2010
Nov 9, 2010 Meet Creative Development What is Creative Development? Creative Development (CDev) is a "hub" within Blizzard, facilitating the development of ancillary products and services that tie into Blizzard's game universes. While there are several different divisions of CDev, this Warcraft Story forum focuses on the efforts of the Publishing division. What does Creative Development's Publishing division have to do with Warcraft's stories and lore? The Publishing division within Creative Development is the driving force behind every published story you've seen outside of the game: short stories, novels, comics, and manga. Who comprises the Publishing division of Creative Development? Publishing is made of two groups: Story Development: This group focuses on story idea creation, story outlining, and story development for licensed fiction, as well as for internally-written stories. Historians: This group is the repository for all Blizzard lore, providing counsel for the game development teams and the CDev Story Development group. What is the Publishing division's usual process for developing a story? Idea Generation & Outline Creation: Working with Chris Metzen and the designers on the respective game's development team, the Story Development team generates an idea and an outline for a story. The writer on the project is typically invited to our offices at this point in the project, so that they can be in on the ground floor of the story's creation. Story Development & Lore Checking: Over the course of the project, the Story Development team talks constantly with the writer, as well as with Chris Metzen and the game developers, in order to help hone the story into a Blizzard-quality tale. At the same time, our Historian team combs through the iterations of the story in order ensure that the story adheres to the universe's established canon. * Please note that the CDev Publishing division has only been fully staffed since early 2009, allowing for more resources and manpower to dedicate to each published product. What does the Publishing division hope to accomplish with this Warcraft Story forum? We'd like to give the community a chance to influence the development of our upcoming stories, so we're trying something new; this forum will serve as a direct line to our story developers. Please note that we're not looking for fully-formed stories - save those for the Global Writing Contest (which we operate and judge) - but rather we're looking for specific examples of what people like, don't like, and what they would like to see (story-wise) from us in the future. Lylirra0 Nov 9, 2010
May 1, 2017 Read This Before You Post For whatever reason, this forum is seeing a massive influx of new posters. Whether it's due to the imminent launch of an expansion (and the tidal wave of lore accompanying it) or just a surge of passion, I feel like I need to reiterate some ground rules and common courtesies. 1). Be Objective! Do not come into this forum and make threads that begin with "So and so is such a terrible character" or loaded questions with heavy bias, i.e. "Why is the Horde so evil?" Doing so is just going to incite other posters an inevitably turn the thread into a flame war. On certain occasions this can also be grounds for disciplinary action. Play nice and keep an open mind. We're here to discuss story elements, not argue over opinions. Try to think like a writer. This is especially true for highly controversial topics like the Forsaken. 2). This Forum Is Not For Fan-Made Fiction! Despite what the name may imply, the Story Forum is not for sharing or discussing fan-made material. It is for discussing officially sanctioned lore/stories only. In short, if it doesn't have a Blizzard logo, it doesn't belong here. That doesn't mean you're forbidden from linking any fiction you may have written (it can be useful in explaining your position on a topic, for instance) or posting the odd paragraph; however, copying large amounts of text or creating threads specifically for any fiction you've written will be deleted or moved. If you want to discuss your own material please take it to the fine folks at the World's End Tavern Forum (otherwise known as the RP forum): 3). If You Have A Question, Chances Are Someone Else Has Already Asked It World of Warcraft has a lot of content, and the expanded universe of Warcraft as a whole has even more. However, there are several very popular topics that get addressed again and again. Before you create a new thread please check through the past few pages to see if there's already an existing thread on your topic. Not only does this keep the forum nice and tidy but it benefits you as well. Long threads tend to already have a very healthy discussion of its topic, and you may find through reading it that your particular insight has already been brought up, discussed, and concluded. If not, it's always better to stimulate an existing discussion than to try and start a new one from scratch. Don't worry, those of us who frequent this forum do carefully read each others posts. You don't need to start a new thread to draw attention. Furthermore, the regulars of this forum get very sick of answering the same questions all day long. I know the Search function hasn't always been the kindest tool, but again please take a few moments to quickly browse through the first few pages. 4). We Are Not Your Personal Encyclopedia On that note, this is not a Q&A forum. Think of it like a book club. You wouldn't show up to your group meeting and then start asking everyone what happened in the last chapter. You're expected to do your own research before coming here and opening topics for discussion. If you're looking for some direction there are many very helpful resources at your disposal: The Story Starter Guide, a sticky at the top of this forum. It includes information and links to out-of-game novels that are a great investment if you're interested in the lore of Warcraft: WoWPedia (formally WoWWiki), a crowd-sourced wiki on nearly everything you could possibly want to know about the Warcraft universe. A superb first-stop and excellent reference material for discussions: TvTropes, while not specific to Warcraft or Blizzard, is a great way to familiarize yourself with various writing or storytelling techniques. Potentially confusing points in the story of Warcraft can seem much more approachable when you realize it's all just part of a larger plan, and many posters on this forum like to reference popular tropes. Be warned, this website will devour countless hours of your time: That said, if there's something that's notably vague or unclear, by all means bring it up! Just avoid questions that can be solved easier and quicker with a search engine than a forum post. 5). Back Up What You Have To Say Be clear and concise with what you're trying to say and provide as much source material as is helpful. The more information you provide, the easier it will be for others to understand and respond to what you are trying to say. This is especially true for potentially obscure in-game quests. 6). This Is A Warcraft Forum Blizzard has many successful franchises with many rich, engaging stories. However, this is a Warcraft forum. Any threads pertaining to Starcraft, Diablo, or any other Blizzard product aren't allowed. Each of those games has their own forums specifically dedicated for their own lore. The Starcraft lore forum can be found here: Diablo lore can be discussed on the Legacy forum here: 7). Have Fun! This forum enjoys a very close relationship with its posters. Everyone here loves the work that Blizzard does, and on some level yearns to make it better. So be respectful to your fellow posters and don't make inflammatory attacks against Blizzard or members of its staff. This forum has a rather unique dynamic that is much... healthier than other forums, so don't come in here with a poisonous attitude. New ideas or insights are always welcome, as are humor and witty banter. Engage in topics that you find really exciting, but don't openly scoff at those that don't. Don't be afraid to change your mind. The past, present, and future are all fair game. Just be mindful of the rules and common courtesies, and above all else, have fun geeking out. Oh, and the Like and Dislike buttons exist for a reason!Odok112 May 1, 2017
Nov 9, 2010 Story Starter Guide Looking for more Warcraft information, but don't know where to start? Whether you've played Warcraft I, II, or III, these books will showcase the people and events that have shaped the Warcraft universe over the last few (in-game) decades: Rise of the Horde by Christie Golden - Set before the orcs invade Azeroth for the first time, this story explores what the orc race was like before its clans were forged into a single savage Horde under the influence of the demonic Burning Legion. Part of the novel focuses on the orc Orgrim Doomhammer and his childhood friend, Durotan (who would later become Thrall's father). Other parts of the story depict the aging shaman Ner'zhul; his ambitious apprentice, Gul'dan; the mighty Grommash Hellscream; the wise draenei leader, Velen; and several other significant characters. The Last Guardian by Jeff Grubb - This is a good introduction to older human history in Warcraft, with emphasis on the events of the First War (Warcraft I). Medivh, the Guardian of Tirisfal, decides to take on an apprentice: the young mage Khadgar. As time goes on, Khadgar learns that a half-orc named Garona is acting as a secret emissary to the nation of Stormwind. While he and Garona try to reach an understanding, Khadgar realizes that Medivh's behavior is growing increasingly erratic. Ultimately he and Sir Anduin Lothar, the childhood friend of both Medivh and King Llane Wrynn of Stormwind, reach a terrible realization: Medivh, an incredibly powerful wizard, is under the control of Sargeras, Destroyer of Worlds, creator of the demonic Burning Legion. This novel is also in print as part of the Warcraft Archive. Beyond the Dark Portal by Aaron Rosenberg and Christie Golden – Currently Out of Stock in Blizzard Store, but can be found on here: This is a good introduction to Alliance and Horde history during the events of Warcraft IIx. Instead of starting a new war, the shaman Ner'zhul has decided to open dimensional rifts from the orc homeworld of Draenor into fresh new worlds to conquer. Horrified at the possibility, Sir Lothar's former lieutenant, the human paladin Turalyon, leads an Alliance expedition into Draenor to stop Ner'zhul. With Turalyon are the mage Khadgar and the ranger Alleria Windrunner (the older sister of Sylvanas and Vereesa). Alleria and Turalyon began falling in love with one another in the Second War, but Alleria turned her back on Turalyon after the Horde invaded Quel'Thalas and killed many of her people. In the midst of battle on an alien world, can their relationship be mended? And can the Alliance expedition reach Ner'zhul in time to stop the Horde from bringing death and destruction into new worlds? Lord of the Clans by Christie Golden - This story depicts the life of Warchief Thrall, starting only a short while after Thrall was born. Raised among humans as a slave, Thrall became a master gladiator before deciding that he would escape his slavery. The story depicts Thrall's subsequent friendship with Grom Hellscream, as well as Thrall's journey to rejoin his clan and master the shamanic arts. When a disguised Warchief Orgrim Doomhammer provokes Thrall into a challenge to single combat, Thrall fights his first truly momentous battle: a fight whose consequences will change the course of history. This novel is also in print as part of the Warcraft Archive. Arthas: Rise of the Lich King by Christie Golden - Currently Out of Stock in Blizzard Store, but can be found on here: This story explores the life and character of Prince Arthas Menethil leading up to the events of the Third War (Warcraft III) and Warcraft IIIx. As the plague of undeath ravaged Lordaeron, fear and desperation drove the prince to more ruthless measures until he had utterly lost his way. The story also explores the romance he shared with Lady Jaina Proudmoore, in addition to the unrequited love that the high elf prince, Kael'thas Sunstrider, bore for Jaina. The above stories are but the tip of the iceberg.Lylirra0 Nov 9, 2010
49s All hail Sylvanosh Windscreamer! So.... another garrosh storyline? Come on why did you ruin a great character and turned her into another garrosh? A good story about faction squabbles does not mean the same side is continually the aggressor. It's boring and I can't seem to like the direction the story is going anymore. I had hope that when Sylvanas became warchief, we'd have a completely different rule. Now is it every other warchief will be evil? The whole good and evil is but a point of view narrative is irrelevant, our morals outside the game will always affect the way we see things and what you guys directed Sylvanas to be is definitely evil. Either way.... well played blizzard. Got me more emotionally invested into the universe. I legitimately felt angry about the direction you guys took Sylvanas and I hate it. Because the longer this goes on the more faith I lose in the company to devise a story line i'm interested in.Dylana22 49s
2m Who I think they are going to kill off I think they are going to kill off the people who really hate the other faction. The people who would start a war with the other faction. I think they are going to kill off Jaina and Sylvanas.Xoroth33 2m
2m Jaina Never Stopped Fighting the Legion In the new comic, it's shown she went on ahead and took on the demons alone after her exit from Dalaran, instead of simply abandoning the fight altogether. Looks like even less ammo for pro-Hordies to use against her because they want her to die for daring to be hostile to the Horde. I love Jaina as a character. Here's hoping she has a great character arc in the next expansion.Karzerus200 2m
15m WoW Story in One Line; The Game WoW in a nutshell challenge; I'll start. Long-standing civil war between trolls spills over into much younger civil war between titan-forged.Samadi52 15m
18m The Alliance started the war. SI:7 Operatives are killing horde heros ON SIGHT at the Silithus operation. How is this not a motive to shut their main hub at Kalimdor then?Vladimiria103 18m
23m Spoilers!!!! Horde War Campaign Lets talk about how the Horde is about to bring back not just Marshal M. Valentine, but also Derek Proudmoore!! How bad will Jaina's wrath be? Also is it just me or does the Horde's war campaign look an awful lot like the DK Order Hall quest line? Getting the gang back together. lolRancore103 23m
30m A Nightborne Sunstrider? Its not impossible that there could have been a relative of Dath'Remar Sunstrider in Suramar that got stuck there when the Shield went up. But if there were one who is still alive, in theory, could this now Nightborne relative of Dath'Remar be eligible for the Throne of Quel'Thalas?Thalassius7 30m
40m Open Question About Tirion I don't know how anyone else felt about Tirion, but I couldn't get over the fact that the dev team would take such a beloved character and kill him so pointlessly in a scenario just to free up his sword. There were a lot of cool weapons we should have gotten and simply did not. Varian's Swords, Broxigar's Axe. Then I thought more about the character. Tirion was Chris Metzen's self insert. For those of you who don't know, a self insert is a character some writers model to be just like themselves and place into a story to interact on a personal level. I believe everyone does this to some extent, but they cool thing about writing is you can craft a convincing backstory and interact with the imaginary world you love. For a long while I thought maybe Thrall was Metzen's self-insert, but then I remembered his short story Blood and Honor, the one that introduced Tirion. Although both Eitrigg and Tirion were introduced during that time, Tirion was always the focus of the story, then and later during WotLK, and so I came to the conclusion Tirion was probably who Metzen imagined himself as. With that in mind, it suddenly makes sense. What better FU to Metzen than to kill off his favorite character, his literal avatar in Azeroth in a very pointless and humiliating way? Suddenly all the destructive lore decisions make a lot of sense. My question is this, are you guys just trying to give Metzen the finger? Or are you actively trying to destroy the soul of WoW by turning the lore into a literal steaming pile of Kodo refuse?Dëathstörm24 40m
1h If the Light Has No Inherent Virtue... If the Light is an impersonal cosmic force and has no inherent virtue, then it follows that: 1. There is nothing virtuous about serving it. 2. There is nothing edgy about bending it to your will. 3. Therefore, there is no qualitative difference between "classic" paladins and old-school Blood Knights, just different attitudes. Yes or no? If no, why not?Zuleika46 1h
1h Something I never understood about Kael'thas. Flashback to TBC. Blood Elves are introduced, with their primary theme being their magic addiction. Ever since the Scourge made the Sunwell unusable, they have been seeking a resolution, Kael'thas especially. Illidan grants Kael'thas the fel crystals as the first solution. Rommath makes use of them claiming they were Kael'thas' discovery alone because he knew his people would throw a fit if they knew their leader was in cahoots with a demon. At some point during his exodus to Outland, Kael'thas makes a deal with Kil'Jaeden... ...but at the same time he also solves the magic addiction problem. As soon as his forces started taking over the Netherstorm mana forges, they had a solution. They could drink directly from the Twisting Nether. They collected and stacked crates of this stuff in their stolen Naaru ships. So... why not just stop there? Netherstorm was the answer. That's where Kael'thas could have walked away. He didn't need to go any further to cure his people.Malefic15 1h
1h Alliance campaign spoilers I just finished the campaign. (as far as one can go due to you need to do stromgarde). chapter 3 has you hunt and kill goblins. Umbric gives you a void stone to use to send shredders into the void. We find out Gallywix is looting Atal'dazar and stealing their gold. We chase him to his pleasure palace in azshara and kill a bunch of golfers and subathers. He escapes using a decoy. Chapter 4 This takes place during the time the horde has the player find derek body. Shandris and falstad takes on the horde. You nearly die to Nathanos, but falstad hammers him and saves you. You corner blood prince draven on the other boat. You bring him to 40% health as he tries to bubble hearth, but shandris kills him. final chapter involves you infiltrating the harbor. You plant bombs on two major zandalari flagships. Slay 3 horde spymasters. Steal their naval charts. Send 6 emissaries of the horde elsewhere (They get voided away). Then wipe out an entire zandalari ship. The other two ships are safe for now. The alliance plans to launch a naval invasion eventually, and when that happens.... BOOOM! Here is a screenshot of a burning Zandalari vessel. Also, we get void elf dark iron and void elf night elf interactions. Shandris and umbric debating the usage of the void. 1h
1h Sylvanas new Voice Over First of all Patty is doing da dayum thang! Second of all it seems Sylvanas, Garona and Lillan are more personal than I anticipated.Deathisfinal44 1h
4h Can we get someone else writing the novels? The latest excerpts are, to be quite honest, disgusting. That's the only word I have for it. Golden is making a mockery of WoW with this novel, writing characters in such a way that entirely betrays previously established lore. It's a bad fanfiction piece written in such a way as to build up Anduin and tear everyone else down around him, Alliance or Horde, to serve that purpose. Please, for the love of WoW, do not let her write *anything* anymore. This is truly a betrayal of anyone who still has hope and cares for the lore of WoW.Kheldan326 4h
6h Wrathion: The boy king? Ok, so I have a theory and I hope someone reads it. Wrathion is ~2-5 years old and Anduin is ~18-20 years old. Anduin is more of a teenager/man than a boy, where Wrathion is much easier to call a boy. We learned from Onxiya when she impersonated Lady Prestor and got the ear of the king. She was a black dragon who manipulated and pulled political strings to incite many things that affected the world still today such as the Defias Brotherhood. Next, we know that Wrathion has the Ravenholt guild behind him, a band of thieves, pickpockets, and assassins. They helped him hunt down and kill the remainder of the black dragonflight, those they could find at least. So...Heres the first part of my theory. Wrathion didn't get what he was aiming for in Mist by trying to manipulate the heros of Azeroth but he wanted to try again. But after Mist we didn't really hear from him much, why? What if at some point after Mist he had the Ravenholt kidnap Anduin so that he could replace the Prince of Stormwind himself. Be in a prime position to get the ear and slowly change the politics of the Alliance, just like dear Aunt Onyixa did as Lady Prestor. Remember what Wrathions true goal was in Mist, not unite the factions but to have one win so the strongest could take on the Legion that he knew was on its way. So, it would make sense he picked a side and decided to convince the alliance to win or lose depending on who he actually wanted to win. Next, we have the events of legion and the death of Varian. Now the king is dead and Anduin (Wrathion) is now leader of the Alliance, he has his army and he has the legion to deal with just like he wanted, the biggest problem is, in his mind it's an impossible battle because the horde is involved. But, in the end we claimed victory against the legion. Wrathion knows there is a bigger threat though, his father, Neltharion fell to the corruption of the Old Gods and he would know more about that than anyone. So, why give up this power, this army and these heros...Use them as pawns in a battle against the Old Gods, build this world into a utopia and do the job of the Earthwarder and protect Azeroth. We still need to get rid of this Horde for him to continue, he believes that a single united faction is better than two warring factions. So, we end legion and go into battle for Azeroth, a faction war. The battle of Lordaeron happens and the burning of Teldrasil. We currently don't know who started the war, but we know a war has begun and its just what someone like Wrathion would want. Whose to say he didn't kickstart this war? Not to mention the whole incident with Sylvanas and the undead meeting their living relatives. It was a bad idea to start with and would just exacerbate the issue of animosity to fuel the fires of war in the hearts of faction. So, now we have the war. But there are a few other clues that might lead one to think this. Look at the speech that Anduin gave to the people, specifically this line, "We did the impossible, we defeated the burning legion." Wrathion would of thought it was impossiable if both factions were still around when the legion attacked, where Anduin believed in unitiy and peace, he wanted to fight alongside the Horde instead of against them so it would of been tough but Anduin was always a dreamer of hopeful. Anduin and Wrathion got to know eachother very well during their time together in Mist, long enough for Wrathion to study him and probe his mind in their many talks. Build that persona and learn to pass as the man if need be in the future. Now we have the last clue that I think is damning. "The boy-king serves at the master's table. Three lies will he offer you." from Il'gynoth in the Emerald Dream who is tied to the Old Gods. The Old Gods corrupted Naltheron, Deathwing, the original Earthwarder a pawn of the Old Gods, driven mad and corrupted. The Old Gods know of Dragons and they have a strong history with them. Wrathion is more of a "Boy" than Anduin is by a long shot in terms of maturity and age. As Wrathion is pretending to be Anduin he is now a "king" a fake king...One could say he is lieing about being a king, a lie about his very being that he is offering us. By slowly corrupting Wrathion like they did his father, he will sit at their table like his father did. Corrupting and poisioning his mind to make him weaken Azeroths defenses by going along and fueling this war of hero against hero, horde versus alliance. Giving them a prime chance to start commanding the Naga to prepare to invade. Why? Why put Wrathion in Anduins place? Why fuel the war? Why weaken the heros of Azeroth and the forces of both the Horde and Alliance who are already weaker after fighting the legion? Why get the Naga ready to go into battle as foot soldiers? ...Because now is the best time, Azeroth itself is wounded from the blade of Sargas and she is bleeding azerite into the land. What don't the Old Gods want more than anything right now? Azeroth to be healed...Because with wounds, infection seeps in easier...Infection of madness, infection of the Old Gods. I think the next two lies have yet to be revealed. I think we can expect to see them in the next expansion. We will be fighting one another and eventually face off against the Queen of the Naga, Queen Ashara. But many people speculate she is not the final boss of the expansion. I don't think she is either. What if we get our other two lies in this expansion...What if we get the lies and figure out whats going on and Wrathion is taken over by madness and corruption and we have to take down a power old god infused black dragon. But then there are no more black dragons! A whole aspect gone! Why would blizzard do this? They wouldn't...Don't forget about Ebonhorn...The guardian of the Highmountian Tauren, the one who wants to protect the earth and its people...One might say an Earthwarden. Tell me what you think, any of this add up? Any huge holes in this theory? I didn't see anyone else with a similar theory so Im curious if anyone agrees with me.Zarador7 6h
6h New Build! Will it be less boring this time? Hopefully!Jongie55 6h
6h What role should Maiev play in the future? One of, if not her strongest trait is that she was obsessed with hunting down Illidan. When he died, he said she was nothing without the hunt. Fast forward to Stormrage, and she appears unhinged. We see Maiev attack the highborne, Malfurion, and her own brother. Fast forward to Legion, and we see a recovered Maiev. She still hates Illidan, but is willing to work with him and the demon hunters to save the world. What should she do now? Can she ever be accepted back into society?Arlifrex37 6h
6h Story Forum Community Lounge 142 Link to the Archive: Link to the last lounge: Story Forum Discord: 1) The thread must be called "Story Forum Community Lounge" followed by its number. 2) No serious lore discussion. 3) No hating, flaming, or serious debates unless all sides wish to engage in the talk. 4) You must post these rules in the Original Post, so all can see the rules in future lounge.Threeslotbag151 6h
7h Void elves age. A couple of questions I had.. with last years audio drama saying the sunwell made blood elves have something akin to immortality. And we can assume the void elves have been cut off from the sunwell does that mean the void elves now are back to being just long lived? Does the void shorten life spans? What about really old blood elves that turn into a void elf. If they even survived the transition would they look like they are about to die in a week?Aerhailan9 7h
7h Can we just consider sylvanas an anti hero... She's not evil, but neither is she entirely good or a hero. She cares mostly for her self interests, she's not physically strong and she's willing to go to places most others wouldn't consider going to in order to protect the hoard for example, making undead which can be seen as pretty screwed up. But she's not Garrosh, she still cares for the horde- at least for the undead. This is my personal view on Sylvanas and opinion on the argument. However her main flaw that makes her more of an anti hero is in the fact that she cares most about keeping herself alive and the fact she is almost entirely merciless. Pretty much she puts her agenda before the agenda of the horde. She might want to find something to keep her alive that also can make more forsaken. But her main motive is still keeping her self away from the after life which she saw. It's for these reasons I believe her to be an anti hero. She might be a villain to the alliance but so far she's not towards the horde. and there for she is not a villain or evil.Padamodin23 7h
9h If Vol'jin had lived.. ..and the events of Legion had remained the same (Sylvanas and the Forsaken being attacked by Genn, Silithus miners being killed by SI:7), would things still escalate to war?Makgorr15 9h
10h Life Binder(s) There is something I'm confused with and am hoping someone can clarify it for me. Which is the true Life Binder? Is it Alexstrasza of the Aspects or is it Eonar of the Titans? or are there actually two Life Binders? Just wondering... :-)Eaglewolf4 10h
12h If Lordaeron was first... Most of our criticisms of the narrative would cease to exist. On the Alliance side, the complaints of the Alliance never being proactive would've ceased to exist. While it would've fostered new complaints about Anduin being aggressive, the Alliance have reasonable cause to march on the Horde and it could've easily have been used to frame a new narrative. Have Anduin bend to Genn's fear of Azerite in the hands of Sylvanas and it would've fit the ending cinematic of Legion, the Silithus questing and would've made Stormheim relevant because it's all about Genn's constant fear of Sylvanas. He wouldn't have been wrong to fear, though how would he react once the Night Elves--his people's saviors--paid the price once Teldrassil burned? How would the Night Elves react, knowing their place in the Alliance isn't as rigid as they thought? On the other hand, the Horde would've been defensive for once. The complaints about everyone being on board with Sylvanas and her crazy wacky schemes wouldn't be nonsensical as it currently stands, Teldrassil would've been rationalized as a reaction to Lordaeron. The argument about "Is it OK to abandon honor if it means victory?" would have much more credence when the Horde's defending themselves from an overwhelming enemy, the Horde would feel justified in hitting hard and hitting fast because they almost got eradicated moments ago. Garona, Rexxar and Voss would feel more meshed together and being on-board with this would still be a bit OOC but far less than at the moment. Rexxar would be back in his WC3 role of defending the Horde, Garona might see it as a necessary action and Voss might just want to see it as the humans acting like the Scarlets did.Tewdee91 12h
12h The light and WoD Draenor So if the light helped create the universe in WoW, and the light has basically taken over that Draenor in WoD. Would it be able to create a universe out of that pocket dimension? I think it would be great if after we rescue the orcs, we find out during BfA that the light created a universe in which its dominant. They have a vast armada in which they have ships ready to invade our universe and the nether. Or they already invaded our universe and are attacking the void directly causing it to spill out into “normal” space.Absalom3 12h
12h Give Sylvanas Garrosh's promised development TLDR: Garrosh was set up to be a heroic warchief then becomes insane and evil out of nowhere. Sylvanas as a warchief seems to be going straight to insane and evil. The Horde lost a good leader (Thrall), then was cheated out getting of a good leader (Garrosh), then lost a good leader (Vol’jin). Please don’t add Sylvanas to this list. Give Sylvanas the positive development that was promised for Garrosh. Throughout the pre-WotLK (A Council for War) and WotLK events, Garrosh Hellscream showed himself to be hot-headed, reckless, and belligerent. Therefore, when Blizzard first revealed that Garrosh was going to be the new warchief (starting in the pre-Cataclysm events), many players were dismayed, as they thought these characteristics would make Garrosh a poor warchief, and possibly lead the Horde down a path to being demonized and portrayed/perceived as “villains” or “evil”. Given Garrosh’s flaws and what they could lead to, many players and in-game characters also questioned why Thrall would appoint Garrosh as warchief. In response to these concerns, Blizzard employees made several posts that strongly implied Garrosh would grow, learn, and change for the better over time and in response to certain events. Thrall even has an ingame quote that matches these statements. (bold added for emphasis): Ancilorn: “Garrosh has so much to prove. It's no secret lots of people are concerned that Garrosh has so far displayed a wide variety of negative and faulted traits, and it's to be expected that folks will be worried should an Orc with a temper as hot as the one Garrosh has shown so far take lead of the Horde. With that said, what's to say that in time, or given certain events that his temperament won't be altered?” Zarhym: “I'm confident that, in due time, you may better understand the many tribulations facing both Garrosh and Varian. You might not agree with all of their actions, but their ideals might not end up seeming to you so unforgivably malicious, or even misguided.” Kisirani: “Garrosh is a character with a lot to prove. I realize there's a great deal of consternation out there concerning the tales of what's to come, but I want to reassure you that we understand that concern. We know where you're coming from. Why are we still going this route? With all respect, you haven't seen the entirety of who Garrosh is. You've seen a great deal of his faults, certainly, but people grow over time, and you may find, come Cataclysm, that he is not quite the disaster you portend.” Thrall to Chiefton Vol'jin (Quest: An Ancient Enemy): Vision of Thrall: I did not make this decision lightly. Vol'jin. I know our alliances will suffer for it. I know the Horde will be irreversibly changed. But I made this choice with confidence that Garrosh is exactly what the Horde needs.Faelinthia19 12h
13h Highmountain "tattoos" Would their tattoos actually more likely be warpaint? I wouldn't think tattoos would work on fur. Unless it's magic tattoos? Also does the color represent tribe? Blue for Rivermane Green for Skyhorn Red for Bloodtotem or HighmountainHobbez1 13h
13h why do certain classes take sides? Why do shaman, pally, demon hunters, and druids take sides on either the alliance and the horde? Its just weird to think that they would kill each other in open warfare especially after legion.Sanies15 13h
13h Saurok Playable Race I cant really say much since there are other non playable races like naga with much more lore and many more fans but if they ever do decide to make another Pandaria race, it should definitely be the Saurok.Halls26 13h
16h Teldrassil - fleeing civilians dialogue "Please! Help me! I cannot find my daughter! Please! Help me! I cannot find my daughter! Please, anybody! Please find my family! Please, anybody! Please find my family! I cannot leave without my child! Please, somebody, help! I cannot leave without my child! Please, somebody, help! Ishala! Ishala! Are you out there?!? Please, Ishala -- listen to my voice! Ishala! Ishala! Are you out there?!? Please, Ishala -- listen to my voice! The flames are clear! Get to the Temple of the Moon! The flames are clear! Get to the Temple of the Moon! Hero... Hero? Can you hear my voice? I am... so... glad I found you... Thank you! I hope the others made it out... ... I don't... understand... Curse the Horde. Curse them all! Darnassus cannot be lost... It cannot end like this! Elune save us! Water! Please! Please!! AAAHHH!! Why is this happening?! It's so... hot... Put it out! Someone! Anyone! Please, help me!" Ouch, my heart. Sounds like there will be lost children and Night Elves burning alive during the evacuation effort, brutal.Gashy126 16h
16h Favorite Legion Zone or Instance Okay, here's something to distract people from BfA leaks. Now that we're through the expansion, what has been your favorite zone to experience? -Stormheim -Highmountain -Val'shara -Azsuna -Suramar -Broken Shore -Mac'Aree -Antorus -Krokuun -Eye of Azshara -Cathedral of Eternal Night -Arcway -Court of Stars -Darkheart Thicket -Blackrook Hold -Neltharion's Lair -Maw of Souls -Halls of Valor -Vault of Wardens -Violet Hold 2.0 -Karazhan 2.0 -Seat of Triumvirate -Emerald Nightmare -Trial of Valor -Nighthold -Tomb of Sargeras -Antorus -Hall of the Guardian -Netherlight Temple -The Wandering Island -Hall of Shadows -Skyhold -Dreamgrove -Trueshot Lodge -Heart of Azeroth -Dreadscar Rift -Acherus -Sanctum of Light -Fel Hammer ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ For me personally, my favorite zone is Suramar, particularly Suramar City. Hands down, the best city in the game. It feels lived in and alive, plenty of rp spots, enemy odds, neat hidden corners and things to investigate. Favorite instance is probably Blackrook Hold. I like the Nighhold, but Blackrook Hold is just brilliantly awesome, combining Night Elves and demons with Gothic atmosphere. Out of all the class halls, while I main mage and really like the Mage hall, part of me just really likes the Sanctum of Light. It has a truly legendary feel to it.Vesiana23 16h
17h I feel like the Sunwell needs to be tainted. And the Void Elves / Ren'dorei should be responsible. This is not only for the benefit of having story presence for the Void Elves, but also to bring Blood Elves back in line with the "morally questionable" Horde. If the Sunwell becomes Void-addled, it would become a fountain of Void magic to sustain only Alleria and the Ren'dorei. That, or, it'll be completely unuseable as it was when it was tainted by death magic from Kel'Thuzad's resurrection. Blood Elves would return to their mana addiction, a defining trait for the race introduced in Burning Crusade. Blood Elves would need a new source to sustain their addiction, assuming the Nightwell was also extinquished by Elisande/Gul'dan during Nighthold. And with the antagonistic direction they took Xe'ra and the Light in general in, enslaving another Naaru, the original birth of the Blood Knights, isn't exactly the most vile of ideas anymore. In fact, thanks to the Mag'har scenario, the Horde has more than enough reason to be direct enemies with the Naaru. Blood Elves might lose Silvermoon, or at the least it might be contested, which turns it into more of a "who does Silvermoon truly belong to" sort of conflict. Maybe even to throw a wrench in the entire conflict, Velen (or the Elves) finds out Mu'ru sacrificed itself to reforge the Sunwell in an attempt to eventually "Lightforge" the Blood Elves into servitude, making the Void Elves' act of tainting the Sunwell "justified" in a way. Any thoughts?Malefic73 17h
17h Where I read "Vol'jin: Shadows of the Horde" The only World of Warcraft novels I've read so far have been the War of the Ancients trilogy. So I decided to read some more while waiting for the new expansion, and I'm starting with Vol'jin: Shadows of the Horde. As something of a break from the BFA speculation, I thought I'd post my thoughts here. By the way, I'm listening to the audiobook version. Chapter 1 Chen Stormstout! And Li Li! My goodness, I didn't realize how much I was missing those two. And the land of Pandaria in general. Can we go back there sometime, please? I also like the succinct explanation of Huojin versus Tushui. And I'm interested that Chen considers Li Li to be an exemplar of Huojin philosophy. As a primarily Horde-focused player, I'm happy to have such a non-sinister character on "our side." It's a dose of positivism that I sorely need right now. Chapter 2 This chapter has some interesting stuff in light of future developments. I don't know how much of what's currently happening was being planned at the time this book was written, but it's fun to speculate. Vol'jin's spirit-conversation with Bwonsamdi is interesting, particularly this line: "But, Shadow Hunter, know this: the battle you face be more terrible than any you have known before. You gonna be wishing you had surrendered, for the burden your victory earns gonna be one that will grind you into dust." Does he mean the burden of being warchief? If so, that prophecy didn't really come true. Vol'jin didn't have a lot of burdens as warchief, and he didn't really have time to be "ground into dust" by them. Then Vol'jin has a vision of the Zandalari empire at its height. It's not clear where they are supposed to be. It has a stepped pyramid, and Vol'jin recognizes the place as one he has seen in a ruined state. He reflects on how the Zandalari are held back by their failure to come to terms with how the world has changed since the days of their greatness. Suddenly, the vision shifts to an image of the Darkspear, and Vol'jin thinks of how he could command them to conquer Durotar or Stranglethorn. These visions seem to be Bwonsamdi's way of trying to encourage Vol'jin to be more aggressive so that Bwonsamdi can have his sacrifices. Vol'jin isn't quite ready to go along with them, though he does find them somewhat tempting. Bwonsamdi tells him it is "what your troll nature demands," and Vol'jin asks, "Is that all we be meant for?" More later, as I get further into the book.Pellex41 17h
19h But what about Silvermoo- Blizzard: In this bold new vision, the Horde has been COMPLETELY ERADICATED from the Eastern Kingdoms! Fans: But what about Silvermoo- Blzzard: COMPLETELY ERRADICATED! Fans: Dude, I see Silvermoon. It's right there! Blizzard: Look, kid...back off, alright? Nobody even uses that city. Just be cool. Fans: That's fair. It's not like anyone uses that place. Or the Exodar. Blizzard: The Exo-wha...? Alright, kid, if you're just gonna start makin' up names on the spot-Samadi28 19h
19h Best leveling stories? Hi story forum! I apologize if this is a tired topic and I missed something, but I don’t have the best luck when searching the forums. I’m currently leveling a void elf hunter and a nightborne mage and I’m hoping to find the best stories to level with on both factions! I haven’t really paid much attention to quest text in a long, long time and I have the opportunity to just take my time and enjoy the story right now. Help me out? What are your favorite quest storylines in WoW? I really enjoyed the “real people” problems while questing in Westfall, but on the flip side I also love anything dragonflight so I don’t mind a variety of “vibes”. I don’t particularly enjoy entirely “goofy” questlines but if you know of some that start out a little silly and get more serious, I’d be happy to give them a try. Like I said, I haven’t paid attention to the quest text in ages so pretty much all zones in all pre-legion expansions are up. I just moved on from Westfall on my hunter and I’m mid Silverpine on my mage. Really just looking for some stories to sink into :) Thanks for the help and take care!Elsebe12 19h
20h Who are Calia's allies? So regardless of BfA spoilers that upset everyone. If Calia Menethil went around the world in Legion to gather up allies, who would come to her aid? Scarlets - Maybe not the onslaught expansion since they were too radical for the radicals. But what do you guys think about these guys? They want to reclaim Lordaeron and were remnants of Knights of the Silverhand. Do you think they'd follow Calia Menethil if she just showed up to Scarlet Monastery? 1st Legion - In Dragonblight there are a bunch of ghosts who are neared wrecked ships. I believe they are the ghost of the men Arthas's expedition force that he killed. So they are soldiers of Lordaeron. Not sure how many there are in lore, but there are some mobs in Northrend. I'm not sure about others. I know there were some major players like Tirion Fordring who were affiliated with Lordaeron, but since his passing I'm not sure his factions would have the same affiliation. Additionally since Alonsus Faol is the only NPC we see with Calia. It really got me thinking about their relationship. Naturally they have the mentor-student relationship of sorts. But Alonsus made the first paladins to defend Lordaeron. He might still believe Calia is Lordaeron. So would the others share Alonsus's thoughts?Menard9 20h
20h lilian voss and nathanos am i the only one who feels like voss is being turned into nathanos's little pet. when he says jump she asks how high. what happened to the old anti necromancer girl who would hunt down necromancers and kill them, now she just follows nathanos around to help him find new corpses like a good little soldierWithpuppys85 20h
20h Vol'jin and Bwonsamdi SPOILERS So didn't see this get brought up in it's own thread, but relations between Vol'jin and Bwonsamdi seem to be... tense. For those who don't know, Vol'jin broke some deal with Bwonsamdi which is how Zalazane was freed. After Vol'jin kills Zalazane, Talanji and Rokhan try to spread his ashes to which Bwonsamdi stops them and tells them about the broken deal, and says to bring his ashes to the necropolis, where he and Vol'jin can have a face to face. Is this setting up for a Vol'jin vs Bwonsamdi fight?Zalzim52 20h
22h Tyrande was not mean to the Nightborne Now for some reason I keep seeing people say the reason the nightborne join the horde is because Tyrande was mean to them. I find this is generally "backed up" by poorly remembering some world quest or something else. One thing that is brought up is a world quest people say she wants the nightborne to die. This is not true. She wants more Shal'dorei to take up the fight against the legion to help take back their city. Like any good commander she is concerned about the loss of her troops, but if you are trying to liberate a city you always want the help of the locals. Then someone said she said that she wants them to die to their face, which isn't true. ... They mixed up the meaning of former and latter. She hopes they survive without the nightwell. This is just two examples of what I've seen people say. Tyrande helps to liberate suramar, there is nothing to indicate here that Tyrande would be the reason. If someone does have an example of why Tyrande is the reason, post proof of the quest text because people seem to try to cast her in the worst possible light when they attempt to remember something and mix up words. In my opinion the questline where they join the horde is going to be the reason, not because of something Tyrande did when she was liberating Suramar.Mystheal448 22h
22h Dwarf Life Span Reading through chronicles it seems like dwarves no longer live up to 200-400. The events after the war of three hammers is described to have at least 2 to 3 generations of dwarves amongst the dwarf clans with dark irons being described to be enslaved for 300 years. I'm starting to think dwarves only live from 100 to 150 at most.Thormil21 22h
1d Sylvanas is not Evil---not like you think. Sylvanas isn't making a faux-180 like Garrosh did. Sylvanas is desperate for immortality. She is deathly afraid of what she saw when she was impaled by the saronite. This is what "changed" when Cataclysm hit that people like that Argent Forsaken at Plaguewood tower refer to. She has fallen multiple times. She is intensely focused on the immortality of the Forsaken. Why? Not only because they can't reproduce but because they don't get a good afterlife, just as she saw. A fan theory is that Sylvanas intended to take over the Halls of Valor in Stormheim for her own people. Not only do the val'kyr give her people a future (Helya could probably provide those without Eyir) but they might even get an afterlife if they steal the Halls. Greymane ruined that. The REAL question is what she gave Helya for the soulcage to subjugate the Val'kyr. The answer is in that secret deal with Helya. THAT is the missing link between Sylvanas as we know her in Legion and what we will know in BFA.Benezet20 1d
1d Forsaken Need A New Capital. The sheer number of them in Orgrimmar on Beta is just absurd. Probably around 500 Forsaken NPCs, easily 3x as many Forsaken in Org as Orcs. Even in Troll town there's more Forsaken than Trolls... Imagine this, every 5 inches, across the entire city: 1d
1d Comic #1 is Up Wowhead Piece: Blizzard Link: Direct Comic: 1d
1d Horde Campaign - Part 4 Thomas Zelling dies and is immediately reanimated by a Val'kyr... and looks like a typical Forsaken. It's not even about being a placeholder model, it's established in-universe that he immediately looks like a monster. That makes no damn sense. His body didn't have any time to start decomposing. We know the Forsaken look like they do because their bodies have rotted away, right? If anything, he should look close to how Nathanos now does. Another crappy oversight or a retcon for some cheap drama?Karzerus15 1d
1d Anduin and the issue of sexuality Lowkey though, expecting Anduin to be gay just because he is the anti-thesis of masculinity is in itself kind of problematic? He’s soft, sensitive, peaceful - traditionally ideal feminine traits that saw his character as a case for blatant misogyny within the community. But this doesn’t say anything about his sexuality. Just like it doesn't IRL. You can have perfectly fierce warriors who prefer the company of men (e.g. Alexander the Great and Philippe, Duc d'Orleans), just as you can have sensitive souls who are straight as a wooden plank (e.g. Louis XVI). It feels like toxic masculinity and a convenient amnesia to other sexualities besides homosexuality and heterosexuality is somewhat perpetuated through this thinking, that because he was a “different” kind of man to his father, it automatically makes him gay? I'm not addressing the Wrathion issue here because I'm not a fan of speculating the nature of relationship between teenagers once upon a blue moon.Edalla42 1d
1d Updated Chronological order of WoW Novels. **As of 1/25/18 I will be updating this list with Chronicle Vol.2, Traveler(A WoW book that is meant to be a children's book but is still considered canon), and The newest addition to the series and one that I am SUPER excited for : Before the Storm by Christie Golden. Before the Storm takes place right before the events of the upcoming expansion Battle for Azeroth so get your hands on it right when it releases so you can get the juicy details of the upcoming war between the Horde and Alliance!** Alright after several hours of scouring the web I have tracked down what I am extremely confident is the full chronological order of the WoW Novels for anyone who may wish to catch up on their lore. I am not going to include the mangas,short stories, etc. on the list at the moment this is purely just the novels. (Most people including myself recommend reading them in this order as well) 1. WarCraft Chronicle Volume 1 2. Rise of the Horde by Christie Golden 3. The Last Guardian by Jeff Grubb 4. Tides of Darkness by Aaron Rosenburg 5. Beyond the Dark Portal by Christie Golden & Aaron Rosenburg 6. Day of the Dragon by Richard A. Knaak !! The War of the Ancients Trilogy takes place before Rise of the Horde but it is highly recommended that you read it after having read Day of the Dragon which is why I have the trilogy listed as 6,7,8 instead of 1,2,3. 7. War of the Ancients: The Well of Eternity by Richard A. Knaak 8. War of the Ancients: The Demon Soul by Richard A. Knaak 9. War of the Ancients: The Sundering by Richard A. Knaak 10. Lord of the Clans by Christie Golden 11. Of Blood and Honor by Chris Metzen 12. Arthas: Rise of the Lich King by Christie Golden 13. Illidan by William King 14. Cycle of Hatred by Keith DeCandido 15. Night of The Dragon by Richard A. Knaak 16. Stormrage by Richard A. Knaak 17. The Shattering: Prelude to Cataclysm by Christie Golden 18. Wolfheart by Richard A Knaak 19. Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects by Christie Golden 20. Jaina Proudmoore: Tides of War by Christie Golden 21. Dawn of the Aspects by Richard A. Knaak 22. Vol'Jin: Shadows of the Horde by Michael A. Stackpole 23. War Crimes by Christie Golden Important if you plan to purchase: There are three books that will include 3-4 stories in one book I am adding them to this to help you save money so you can buy one of these rather than purchase each book individually. The name of these are: 1. World of Warcraft: Chronicles of War - Includes Rise of the Horde, The Last Guardian,Tides of Darkness, and lastly, Beyond the Dark portal 2. World of Warcraft: Archive - Day of the Dragon, Lord of the Clans, The Last Guardian, and lastly, Of Blood and Honor 3. WarCraft War of The Ancients Archive - Includes WotA(War of the Ancients): The Well of Eternity, WotA: The Demon Soul, WotA: The Sundering Extra things worth noting Several times throughout the books some of them will reference events in the other books that arent necessarily in the chronological order of which the book was published hence why this list was created to help clean that up a bit for your reading pleasure. However if anyone wants me to add the date published of the books happy to do so. If you have any other info you think I should add in that people should know please leave a comment and I will add it as soon as I can. Happy book hunting and enjoy the reading! :) **Rendford in the Story Forum made a post with this link and figured since this is a novel post afterall why not add it here for you guys to get a taste of the new book Illidan by William King which takes place after the events of Arthas: Rise of The Lich King and goes into detail Illidans plight in Outland. Its the prelude and chapter 1 of the new book enjoy! 1d
1d Everyone’s favorite othe dark elves Having just recently unlocked the void elves I have come to the conclusion they are in the same boat as the blood elves were at the beginning of BC. They aren’t picking up the pieces of their civilization but they are going after power with no regard. Alleria is like the blood knights, except she did the siphoning of a dark Naruu. Then we have the void elves going after power to help their nation supposedly but well they were just looking for power. So they like the blood elves of yore get thrown out and distrusted by their former allies( who were in the right) . Now they sided with the enemy of their former allies. So the BC era blood elves are kinda around just purple and not in the right.Absalom9 1d
1d Seeing a lot of criticism about BfA lore... What's the deal? I haven't really been paying much attention, but reading through here today it looks like people aren't too happy with the "train wreck." Anyone care to explain what's going on that has people so upset?Keleste59 1d