Feb 6 Assassination=flaming pile of garbage Is this spec ever going to get a buff or does blizz want everyone playing subtelty?Gnár18 Feb 6
Feb 6 Rogue 2pc & Venomous Wounds Is the extra bleed damage from Mutilate's 2pc bonus supposed to proc Venomous Wounds for energy regen? Cause it doesn't. I was also kinda sad when I saw Moroes' Bloodstained Handkerchief didn't either.Contumelius2 Feb 6
Feb 6 Sin versus Sub 1v1 I'm a casual player, mainly do BGs, questing, Wpvp and limited dungeons (usually don't raid). I'm trying to decide between Sin and Sub. Like Sub better but right now as a fresh 110 I can't kill anything 1v1 in PvP (BGs and WpvP). Sin is less fun but feels like way more damage. I read that sub gets closer to sin on 1v1 damage with more AP, honor and gear but is that at the legendary/higher raid level or can someone like me make sub damage close to sin if I grind honor/AP? Thanks for any help!Jefelobo12 Feb 6
Feb 6 WPVP Change? So looks like they are planning to give classes resilience to our damage in WPVP. Like right now it's amazing, but I suspect it's going to be like BG's soon. (where I am a "utility" class) Here's the post, maybe I am just being paranoid? (not that I have anything to be worried about right?) Feb 6
Feb 6 Really wanna main Sin, but But I'm kinda casual. The thought of being under the tank for weeks if not months before I'm ready for m10+ is just painful. Why no AOE finisher?Tingoodoo8 Feb 6
Feb 6 Legendary Ring question I've got the sephuz ring and the fan of knives cloak, just picked up the Ravenholdt ring. What's a better combo mainly for raiding, both rings together or splitting the cloak with one of them?Infamøus2 Feb 6
Feb 6 7.2 Champion Lilian Voss Lilian Voss 7.2 is slated for the Horde rogue companion, with Tess Greymane for the Alliance. What I haven't found, though, is whether Lilian will be a bodyguard like Vanessa, or just a spell/summon like Garona. Anyone find which she will be?Embalmo1 Feb 6
Feb 6 Honest opinions about the state of pvp I'll start of by saying I'm not the best at pvp. I've played off and on since Burning crusade as a rogue. This expansion I feel so underwhelming. I BG with 900 ilvl and I hardly hurt anyone in a 1v1. I leveled up a Demonhunter and with 820 ilvl and I deal (what it feels) like is double damage to my rogue. What are they balancing rogues around? A a lot of classes have a no resource cost stun and cc and deal damage. I feel like rogues dont do a whole lot other than annoy healers. I just want to know what to do as a rogue in pvp because I feel like a free kill to anyone who happens to aoe too close to me.Blazeiam22 Feb 6
Feb 6 Agonizing vs Deadly for PvP Which one is used primarily? I notice a lot of people running Alacrity. Is this primarily due to cleanses screwing up our energy Regen and the extra haste helping that?Vaudreon8 Feb 6
Feb 5 A Legendary Question I gotta' know, because with my current gear I sim 435-440k~ And I usually meet those parses, if not a 5-10k difference. But I am still only in the 30th percentile of my ilvl. So I simmed 3 of the considered BiS legendaries for Assassination (Duskwalker's/Zoldycks, or Duskwalker's/Ravenholdt) and basically brings me up 75-80k~ and I gotta' know if Legendaries are honestly a crutch right now, because I am certain my rotation is correct as I meet my sims (sometimes i go over it), and when I sim the legendaries I find items that would keep me at the same ilvl with the same stats of the Prydaz and Sephuz I replace so I'll give that about a 5k margin. I just have to know if there's something else I can do to meet those numbers, or if it's really just the Legendary Wall I'm hitting with my Magnum Op and Sephuz. My opener is: Garrote > Mut > Rupture > Mut to 5 CP > Vendetta > Vanish > Rupture Then my rotation is refresh Rupture between 4-6 seconds if I can, or if I'm feeling ballsy I wait until like 2 seconds and use my CP on Envenom with a pre-port and pot on lust if it's somewhere in the fight that's not the beginning (but if the lust is at the beginning, I pot when my Vendetta is up) and I use my CDs when they are up instead of waiting until they're all up to repeat my opener. I don't have Duskwalker's or Convergence. I just have 2 Master Assassin relics for my Vendetta CD.Pendant8 Feb 5
Feb 5 Looking for a rough stat % for sin. Currently I have haste, that I wish I didn't, but the upgrades were too big ilvl wise to ignore. What's the ideal % amount of mastery, vers, crit, and haste? My assumption is: As much mastery as possible. Above 30% crit Above 10% vers 0% haste.Mido5 Feb 5
Feb 5 Outlaw relics? Help! Do I go double fatebringer. Reduce energy by 8. or is there another combo I should use? PVE spec. ThanksLunasin1 Feb 5
Feb 5 Is there a sim that you can... Plug in your armory and have it tell you what dps you should be pulling? I got my first legendary and my dps is spiking all over the place. 10th here, 6th there, 3rd on trilliax. I'm not even close to 35 traits, much less 54, no flasks or food buffs, and I have 2 useless backstab relics, but I feel like my dps is awful. I'm consistently pulling around 260-280k currently.Heartléss4 Feb 5
Feb 5 Where to place this new relic? I need help please. Last night I looted an 890 shadow relic. It has Toxic Blades for the trait. My current Shadow relic for sin is a MA relic but only 860. I was under the impression yo don't replace MA relics. NOW, I wanted to main sub, because I had mained sin for nearly 8 years, just to change it up a bit, and I even got the Sub boots. My dub Daggers are holding 2x865 relic and 1 860. Trait aside my sub dps is garbage even fed and flasked, compared to sin. I changed my enchants and gem back over for sin a couple days ago, because Sub is depressing. Without running a sim, should I use the relic in sub, and would that bring my dps back up? or drop the MA relic in sin and place it in there to make my Kingslayers ever more powerful. Example: sub full buffed I was pulling 350ish, as sin I can do that easy without buffs. I am 886 ilvl, sub dps should not be that abysmal.Varanid6 Feb 5
Feb 5 energy buff with all these speed pulls in mythics. would be nice if our energy recovered faster in between pulls. maybe im doing something wrong but just a thoughtGuttèrpunk1 Feb 5
Feb 5 Sub PvE first: im really bad ok what should i be looking for in gear i can peak mastery around 104% but my dps actually drops when i lose all the versatility to get there.(maybe because im not using deep strat) i also heard to ignore secondary stats on gear and just stack ilvl for the higher agility? and maybe just focus on rings and neck(no agil) for pushing a certain secondary stat? what i thought was my pve gear im around 886ilvl with the 4set pcs or i can push ilvl like i use in pvp..ignoring stats.. up to 892. i avg 400-550k sustained using my pvp talents w/flask but w/o old war pots should i always respec deeper strat if i know ima get in to NH? i know i need new relics i have 2 dodge relics just so i could boost weapon for pvp and havent gotten a close ilvl pve upgrade since if i run 4set pc with legendary bracers and convergence of fates trinket should i try anticipation to profit on what is often lost combo points?Octáve1 Feb 5
Feb 5 DoS in Rotation When do I want to use DoS in my opener and when during my rotations? Is it ideal to use Vendetta and KB up, refreshed Garrote/Rupture/SoT then use DoS? I see a few threads saying CoF and DoS are BiS trinkets and could use help on how to extract the most DPS from DoS.Rikii0 Feb 5
Feb 5 Bloodstained from karazhan and the 4 set The bleed appears to count towards the envenom buff. Anyone else agree? Training dummy is saying yes for me. 2 mil crits compared to 1.85 not sure If ill use it though, the only reason I am considering it is because it's 880 titanforged. I have 890 + trinkets from heroic NH though. So many different choices....Lêbronjamês5 Feb 5
Feb 5 Showing my appreciation. Thank you. I recently picked the game back up and started playing my goblin rogue again. After getting it to 110 and running around the broken isles I can say it's still as much fun. PvP quests or World Bosses or getting a Dungeon group together has hooked me again. I hope you have success for many more years. I am still running low Mythic + dungeons as subtlety but it's because I like hitting a lot of buttons and feeling like my high damage is because of that. I think the class runs smoothly at the price of damage too often in the talent tree. Being able to shadow dance three times may balance PvP but in PvE I get into trouble more than that and need more vanishes or cloak of shadows. I don't think a lot of rogues would rather have this than damage. The spec feels to me as if feint or cloak of shadows needs a charge.Guwzshanty1 Feb 5
Feb 5 A Few Rogue Questions for Experienced Rogue I have a few questions for a Rogue which ive been playing for about a month now and really enjoy it. First question is- Which is a better talent for Raiding, Nightstalker or Subterfuge? Nightstalker only seems to be good for bursting but is subterfuge better for the over all fight ? or is nightstalker still beter? Second question- I hear that the vendetta relics which are the best for the rogue, (the ones that reduce vendetta cooldown by 30%) I got one but it is only 840 ilvl, and id have to replace it out for a 885 ilvl Relic, is it still worth though ? or should I wait for the relics out of Nighhold ? Please reply with serious awnsers and I'm in need and confused!Sydnei3 Feb 5
Feb 5 Sub question Currently lvling a sub spec rogue because I like the spec, but when in fights i'm noticing at lvl 106 mind you my eviscerate says at 5 points does 202k dmg with symbols of death up. Ok so i'll use 5 point evis and it will normally crit for 280-300k dmg. Other times on the same target nothing changed same buffs and everything. I'll use 5 point evis, and it will crit for 140ishK. Is this a bug or something that is making it do half the dmg. I've seen it happen several times already while out soloing. I mean even without the symbol buff it's base dmg non crit says 164k. I just find this weird is all.Goyal1 Feb 5
Feb 5 Lets talk about the shortcomings of Vendetta This has been bugging me for a while. The majority of the current problems with Assassination all come from one core thing: Vendetta. Vendetta is a debuff, it has a long 20 second duration, and a short cooldown, sometimes as short as 40 seconds in the most extreme examples. Vendetta potentially has a 50% uptime. This means in order to make full use of our large DPS cooldown, we need to sit on the boss at least 50% of the time. But that's not all. Because it's a debuff with a long duration, this means we can't pop it on the majority of adds, which will die before the Vendetta runs its full course. It also does nothing for us when it comes to AoE, since it only affects one target. I rolled a Rogue in Legion because my experience with Rogues in previous tiers was that they were proactive members of a raid group who took advantage of their mobility and toolkit of cooldowns to deal with many raid mechanics. Instead I find myself asking the raid leader to let me ignore mechanics completely and tunnel the boss because we've been balanced around sitting on one target for 50% of the fight due to Vendetta. Vendetta needs to go back to being 2 minutes, or better yet, be scrapped completely and a cooldown that's actually cool added in its place, something like Curse of the Dreadblades that actually changes up the way we play. I'm currently considering re-rolling a Demon Hunter. Not because of my DPS or any nerfs to Assassination, not because I don't like the spec or class, but because I want to meaningfully contribute to my raid group. I don't want to be pigeon holed into tunneling the boss all the time. I want to help my raid.Ripposte18 Feb 5
Feb 5 Assassin vs Sub PvE; Which is harder to play? I'm a fresh 110 Rogue and trying to find my spec to play. Mind you I see being harder (higher skill cap) to play as a good thing. Most people say Assassin is pretty faceroll but then I see Neverrz's guide saying it's pretty tricky so I'm a little confused. So to reiterate; What spec requires a better player to make work? Trying to ignore 5% differences here and there and focusing mostly on play style.Catfat7 Feb 5
Feb 5 A simple plan quest bug *spoilers* Idk if its buged but after shaw tells his story, how do you cast the vote ? i cant seem to find out how and nothing happened after he speaks.Jordy3 Feb 5
Feb 5 I really want to play sub but DPS sucks Hey guys so I have always enjoyed playing sub but with my awful RNG I only managed to get the legendary neck (that give you a shield) and valeera pants (heals you when you use feint). At the start of EN I was outlaw/sin and was topping the charts however from H EN and NH I went from top of the charts to dead last. I have tried swapping specs and sin seems to be the only spec that will even put me close towards the top (like 4th-7th) in dps. I am just being crushed by DH and locks when it comes to DPS for ST AND AOE. Is there anyway that sub will work or am I stuck playing sin and being middle of the pack/bottom of the charts. I keep getting gear with TONS of mastery or for example I crafted the new 880 eng goggles and of course I got stats with Crit/Haste. Could you offer some advice on what I should play? all of my weapon's are 30+ the sub weapon is ilvl 901/sin is 894 and outlaw is 891.Shinji13 Feb 5
Feb 5 Assassination UI or Addon for Bleed Tracking Hi Everyone! I have recently switched to assassination because I was getting dominated in the DPS charts as outlaw and the one thing i think I could improve on is timing my garrote and rupture better. I've noticed that it's pretty hard to see my DoTs on the boss, I have 4-5 affects on them at any one time and I'm struggling to see which one is garrote and which is rupture to see which is dropping off soon. I often even have to mouse over them to see the name. So I was wondering if anyone has a UI or Addon that helps you see your DoTs better or even gives you a timer for your DoTs somewhere else on the screen. Thanks!Axebodyspray4 Feb 5
Feb 5 Shadowcraft simming I'm havin' issues gettin' to work at all and the forums at Ravenholdt haven't had any posts since around last October. Anyone else having issues with ShadowCraft?Xyogan4 Feb 5
Feb 5 Outlaw Appearance Farm Group Alliance (VotW) Edit: I was able to get my binding. Good luck, everyone.Krythor0 Feb 5
Feb 4 Totally confused Trying to get back into more then just LFR raiding after a long break and not playing full time. Been looking at the various sites for stats and gear and everyone of the main ones tells me a different set of stats. As an outlaw rogue other then agil, vers then crit which way do I go? And what is the best site to use other then shadowcraft. been following that as much as i can?Upirlupirina7 Feb 4
Feb 4 Legion: escapabilty and restealth for Mut One way we stealthy types defeat our foes is getting separation and restealthing or, sometimes, cloak/vanish just to lick our wounds after some heavy damage we took. It *sounds* as though Legion reduces both our ability to separate (and restealth) as well as how often we can restealth. Is this a fundamental change in play style, which we will have to offset with more offense and alternative defensives?Stabbue8 Feb 4
Feb 4 What simulation engine/site do you use? Between Icy Veins, Noxxic, Ask Mr. Robot, and Shadowcraft, I am not actually sure what my stat priority is anymore. Two say versatility, one says mastery, the other says HASTE. Speaking for Outlaw here. I think Shadowcraft is broken atm, tbh. And Icy Veins is for raiding. Everyone flames on Noxxic, so I'm guessing AMR is the best choice if I want to figure out what to stack for Mythic+. Still seeking advice, though.Streetcarp18 Feb 4
Feb 4 Sub boots are best by far. So the investigations of a crying bad player led me to the conclusion. Sub boots are still the best by far. Was looking at the logs of the top dps and ALL of them have the boots. The best combo is Boots + Wrist then Boots + shoulders which is about the same as Boots +ring. Even wearing just plain boots + neck piece... nelbur finally pulled his game together after I explain to him he should be doing 650+ single target in a mythic. Still all about Sub boots.. Sub boots are still the best. Will next patch let me choose my next legendary? They need another nerf.Brutain6 Feb 4
Feb 4 Sin DPS help? Logs included. I recently ran through what I logged for my recent N NH run (Krosus onwards) and I feel there's a whole lot that I could be doing better, but at this point and time I'm not completely sure what that would be. Could anyone go through my logs and critique what I'm doing? It would be greatly appreciated. After 7.1.5 I feel like i'm pulling decent dps, but not doing nearly as well as I could be. Thanks everyone! Edit: I know I need to get rid of my two haste pieces, I just haven't found anything better. I generally swap between Agonizing and Deadly poison depending on the fight, and I also swap between my EoC (865) and Memento (860) trinkets depending on if its single target or a cleave fight. Sometimes I forget, but I generally try to.Pacífist10 Feb 4
Feb 4 Sub stealth glitch? So I know duels don't matter...I'm just curious if this guy played it good or if this is a glitch. He opened me and never came out of stealth for 20 seconds while attacking me? I've duel alot of rogues and have never seen this before? Any one have any ideas? Did he out play me or did I get cheesed?Blindweebs9 Feb 4
Feb 4 Agonizing poison ? Anyone know what percentage mastery is minimum to make agonizing poison work best...currently i'm sitting at about 94% mastery. Not sure if another build like MP/Alacrity would be better?Nôxx2 Feb 4
Feb 4 7.1.5 Outlaw relic question So I got a relic drop and I was wondering if the relic value/weight still holds true now for Fate's Thirst and Fatebringer post-7.1.5 (I haven't checked 7.2 for further changes and it's entirely possible anything we know about 7.2 will change) I got Collapsing Epoch heroic - 890 (increases BTE to 18%) It would replace a Trueflight arrow - 850 Fatebringer. My other two relics are an 850 and an 860 Fate's Thirst. I feel like the increase in energy expense as a result won't be worth the bump. Thoughts? edit: Also, feel free to comment on whether the old paradigm of 2 fate thirsts 1 fatebringer is no longer desirable. Should I be aiming for AR reduction relics instead? Or perhaps 2 fatebringers?Wulm5 Feb 4
Feb 4 low outlaw DPS at 889 I am having issues with low DPS after the patch and was wondering what people think. I know off the bat my crit and haste are low, mast and vers are high - my stats are 27%, 5%, 49% and 18%. With that being said I am curious to see what we should properly be doing for RTB. I have wrist and bracers for legendaries. currently my opener will be either ambush>saber> pistol>RTB - if it is a 2 proc i will then use adrenaline rush>curse of the dreadblades> horn of valor and then saber>between the eyes> pistol shot/blunderbuss. if true bearing is up i will spam saber>between the eyes> pistol shot in that order instead of run through because i have the wrists as stated. Afterward I will pop vanish to proc my shoudlers and then saber > saber > run through etc etc. when i look for a 2 proc without AR and CDB up, I specifically look for broadsides and true bearing or burried treasure and true bearing. If i have my AR and CDB up i look for shark infested waters and true bearing or broadsides and true bearing again. My uptime on RTB in general is about 95% or higher. does anyone have any recommendations for RTB strats, or different utilization of abilities? maybe im missing something? also i am using deeper strategem and MFD - MFD i use on CD regardless of a fight, either to reroll or to deal additional damage. My guarm kill had my ability casts within the top 5% parses so i dont think its an issue of not using finishers enough. idk what to do x.x also i sustain about 350-400k as of right now single target, maybe a little higher depending on how it goes with RTBDrïïzzt14 Feb 4
Feb 4 Draught of souls discuss So I am outlaw rogue and just got my guldan trink lastnight.... now I'm not really sure if it's bis for outlaw or not...any thoughts? Or tips on how you would utilize this in your rotation?Pepperrss9 Feb 4
Feb 4 Confused about my neck Just a little unsure about which is better i have an 875 warforged from EN but the one im wearing HAS agi on it, should i just rock this as i was under the impression agi was my best stat. Sorry returning player still a little rustyBlindz1 Feb 4
Feb 4 I'm terrible So after playing this game off and on since vanilla, playing every class in pvp in that time, and playing shaman, warrior, rogue, and mage at 110, i have come to the conclusion that i just suck. The classes that i enjoy (see above) become just terrible because i just can't do well with them and i can't see it being any better with a class i don't like in the first place. I think it's time that i let my sub run out and quit the game for good. I have enjoyed watching this community discuss and do well in the game, and may still drop by to read the discussions and see the progress some are making. Keep up the good work everyone and try not to suck as bad as i do. TLDR; i can't L2PRunhide4 Feb 4
Feb 4 Sub Rogue rotation help Hey everyone, I recently picked up Sub, started fooling around with it, and realized that I have no idea what I'm doing- and would like to become better at the spec and as a Rogue player in general. I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction or explain the Sub rotation, which I am struggling with. I know the proper stat priorities, talents, etc. it's just the rotation I'm having a hard time mastering. It seems if I slip up a little bit I am punished a lot for those mistakes. Thanks in advance.Kruphix6 Feb 4
Feb 4 Outlaw Roll the Bones change suggestions I am unsure if this has been posted before, Or thought up for Outlaw rogues. I have only been leveling my rogue (level 106) and have noticed people talk about how they do not really care for the "Roll the Bones" ability do to its high RNG. I understand that there are 6 different buffs, certain buffs being far more beneficial then others, and getting all 6 is the absolute best. But getting all 6, sounds to be fairly annoying, and sometimes a waste of combo points. So, My idea would be to change the Roll the Bones ability to either give Haste / Crit / Mastery. Selecting one of said three per roll. Making it easier use Roll the Bones, and hopefully making the whole specialization smoother when relying on the ability itself. And hey, maybe I do not know what the heck I am talking about. But who knows right? Maybe we might come up with something that is, not too overpowered, but works far better than the current state of roll the bones. Making the class more enjoyable for all of you die-hard rogue fans.Priorities1 Feb 4
Feb 4 Please make sub dps less clunky The amount of RNG in a standard rotation is too much. Throwing eviscerate at non-6 or non-10 combo points makes me die a little bit inside every time. Why does it happen? Because we have 2 random cp sources that just feel like giving excess or not enough. (fortunes bite 2cp and T19 4p extra cp) Double relentless strike refund when your shadowdance charges are almost full, lol, decision making time again, waste charges or waste energy. Energetic stabbing proc non stop during lust, but never procs during slow pace times. I know we tend to remember the !@#$ty moments, but those moments makes players feels super frustrated. Are you trying to cure my OCD, Blizzard? Am I supposed to feel good when I wasted either shadowdance recharge, cp or energy not to mention skill CDs. During burst phase, you can't even sqeeze in goremaw because of the list and nonstop proc keeping my energy bar full. Four resources to deal with, cp, energy, shadowdance cd, other cds. Two of them are heavily influenced by RNG, and if the other two resources don't align, you will have a bad time dpsing. I mean I can pull good numbers. But why do you make a specs playstyle feels so clunky? PLEASE BLIZZARD, I WANT TO KNOW YOUR THOUGHTS ON SUB ROGUE DESIGN.Shadyrules16 Feb 4
Feb 3 Krosus Sin DPS Our guild dropped Heroic Krosus last night for the first time ( we are casual ). I did 568K and was top dps by a good margin. Was feeling pretty good until I went to check myself on Warcraft Logs lol. 568k was good for 1,922nd place in my ilevel range of 890 lol. I sim at 602K and with being a behaved raider I don't just tunnel boss and go to soak swirlies when I'm supposed to. I figured 568k on a 602K sim and behaving mechanics was pretty good. Am I missing something or is it just legendaries making that big of a difference?? Seems like there's a ton of people in the 700s at my ilevel which is a big gapEswann7 Feb 3
Feb 3 Just Wondering if a Better X-Mog Exists Can anyone find a better set than what I'm wearing? I can't :(Sevit41 Feb 3
Feb 3 Rogue Hidden Weapon Skins Question I recently got my sub and Sin hidden skins... on the appearance tab it says to open different color variations I have to do dungeons , WQ and kill enemy players with the weapon equipped... Does anyone know if this is pvp kills or can npc pve kills count?Ravenscar1 Feb 3
Feb 3 Sub rogue 4 set Is it even worth it? I recently got it, and having to work around using anticipation is an awkward thing. Not only that, but it seems like it is only worth it to exploit the finality bug/buff. Am I the only one who feels like if you have the 4 set, just do everything the way you would and let the time during shadowblades be normal because a proc from the 4 set is useless? I do understand in aoe the set/anticipation would be nice, but for single target, or few targets (like 2) it just seems lackluster at best.Evielth5 Feb 3
Feb 3 having damage problems as assass my damage feels completely lackluster when its not a full opener with kingsbane and vendetta. is assass kind of dependent on artifact traits? im only 22 points in. when im not bursting the damage just feels gross and im constantly energy starved, even with vigor and venom rush in arenas i feel like im doing zero damage when kingsbane and vendetta are on cd. also, exsanguinate any good?Trixalot7 Feb 3
Feb 3 Legion Rogue play broke my WoW addiction Rogues are limp noodles... impotent, tired old men in Legion. Level 105 demon hunters can kill us if we're caught off guard. On world quests I see all other classes effortlessly handling multiple mobs where I have difficulty with one. I've been addicted to my rogue since Vanilla and now i find myself procrastinating play. Thank you, Blizzard, i can now focus on the real world.Syleril22 Feb 3
Feb 3 UI/ targeting improvements Does anyone have any suggestions for target management? Since Sin needs to manage several different debuffs on as many different targets its easy to let some slip through the cracks. I have found the stock UI disappointing in the respect. Are there any good add ons to help with this issue? If they aren't plug and play any set up profiles would be appreciated.Bclmj2 Feb 3