2d Vanguards Retribution Paladin PvP Guide 7.1.5 Retribution Paladin Guide This guide is written mainly for players new to playing retribution in arena / PvP. Guide is also posted in a different format on: Talents Level 15: Highly Recommended: Final Verdict This increases your Final Verdict damage by 20%. Currently the other 2 talents just don't beat out the damage you can gain from Final Verdict in a PvP scenario. Level 30 Recommended: Zeal Crusader strike is rarely used on CD in PvP, this makes Fires of Justice a bit more lackluster. Rarely do Rets run out of globals for things to do in PvP, making the longer CD on Zeal not much of a problem allowing it to buff our Crusader Strike damage significantly without a big cost. Due to this, Zeal will almost always do more damage than the other talents on this tier other than extremely specific situations. Greater Judgment is useful in fast games but keep in mind Crits have reduced effect in PvP. Over a long-game unless the other team was above 50% HP the entire game and you were getting kited a lot Zeal will be superior. Level 45 Recommended: Fist of Justice Logic here for Fist is very similar to WoD, the other 2 talents are mostly used if you want to strategize around them. Repentance is somewhat improved in the fact that it doesn't use the CD if you cast it on a Beast, but you'll require a lot of effort to land it especially on Druids. Blind is essentially the same as before, not very useful unless you want to rush a game. Level 60 Recommended: Blade of Wrath or Divine Hammer Blade of Wrath provides the best consistent damage and also good holy power generation. Crits are also 150% in PvP, making Virtue's Blade much worse than it would be in PvE. Divine Hammer received a buff in 7.1.5. If you play in a composition where AOE damage is useful it should be used against any teams that you believe will generally be stacked such as melee cleaves. As long as Divine Hammer can occasionally hit 2+ targets it will beat out Blade of Wrath. Level 75 Recommended: Any Justicar's Vengeance has a lot of synergy with Divine Purpose. Basically, you use it with the proc or when the target is stunned. This talent is excellent especially in 2v2, when you hit healers a lot during stuns. Eye for an Eye should be picked against any kind of physical damage team that will focus you. Word of Glory is a good choice against DOT cleaves that has a low physical damage component to it. Level 90 Recommended: Divine Intervention and Divine Steed Divine Intervention is an increase to our survivability. Not having to press Bubble when we get low is like a large indirect increase to our health-pool pre-bubble. This is generally my default talent. However, our Mobility is horrible, and having at least one talent to help it is nice. If you plan to for example, chase a Mistweaver Monk in 2v2 you should use the mobility talents instead. Level 100 Recommended: Divine Purpose Holy Wrath now does 35% of your missing HP as damage. This is still decent burst, but with the long CD mixed in Divine Purpose will almost always be superior outside of 2v2 Skirmishes or Duels. Crusade requires a ramp up time and is generally not as useful in PvP compared to how strong it is in PvE. Glyphs Removed Artifact Traits 1. Wake of Ashes 2. Blade of Light 3. Righteous Blade x3 4. Unbreakable Will 5. Protector of the Ashen Blade 6. Ashes to Ashes 7. Deliver the Justice x3 8. Sharpened Edge x3 9. Deflection x3 10. Echo of the Highlord 11. Wrath of the Ashbringer x3 12. Highlord's Judgment x3 13. Embrace the Light x3 14. Divine Tempest 15. Healing Storm 16. Might of the Templar x3 17. Endless Resolve From 14->17 the last points depend greatly on what you mostly do. If you do a lot of battlegrounds and some mythics get Divine Tempest and Healing Storm first. If you play AoE oriented comps such as Ret Spriest Healer it's the same thing. However, if you only PvP playing comps such as Ret / Hunter / Healer get Might of the Templar and Endless Resolve first since you rarely get to Divine Storm.Vanguardy570 2d
Feb 5 [Legion] Protection Paladin Guide Welcome to Prot Paladin Guide for Legion. Full guide in proper formatting available here : Mini TL;DR ...To Skip to Discussion : ... Abilities Offensive Shield of the Righteous Charges: Somewhat reskinned Holy Power since we can still consume it with seraphim (if talented) and it’s still the only ~resource~ we actively generate. Shield of the Righteous: 16 sec CD, reduced by haste and Judgment. Active Mitigation (AM) of protection paladins. Starting with legion it also works in reducing magical damage so it somewhat makes up for loss of of divine protection. SotR also interacts with level 100 Seraphim talent, which consumes charges (including partial) for short term buff. Avenger’s Shield: 15 sec CD, reduced by haste and reset by Grand Crusader procs. One of the key dps abilities we have, going to Legion from WoD we lose the 2 extra bounces (until we obtain legendary for it), but with an artifact trait, it can also do a small aoe pulse around each target hit; therefore we can safely pick up adds from range. Furthermore it interrupts initial target, making caster npcs come to us. Hammer of the Righteous: 4.5 sec CD, reduced by haste. Our filler ability; does extra aoe when we’re standing in consecration and has a chance to trigger Grand Crusader to reset Avenger’s Shield cooldown. When talented into Consecrated Hammer it always AoEs and when talented into Blessed Hammer, it always summons a hammer which does two full spins around us, being able to hit targets multiple times. Judgment: 6 sec CD, reduced by haste. Each cast reduces cooldown on SotR, thus making Judgment our “resource generator”. Critical hits reduce the CD by twice as much. Consecration: 9 sec CD, reduced by haste. AoE pulse ability which does not follow us, furthermore increases our SotR and Light of the Protector by 20% when we are standing in it. It’s important to note that this is multiplicative x1.2 not flat 20% increase, so 35% healing will go to 42% instead of 55%. Avenging Wrath: 2 min CD - 20 sec duration, increases damage and healing by 35%. Blessings Blessing of Protection: 5 min CD. Prevents all physical damage for 10 seconds, while also dropping threat from the target. Does not prevent target from attacking. Blessing of Sacrifice: 2.5 min CD. Redirects 30% of the damage taken by target to you for 12 seconds. Blessing of Spellwarding: (Talent) 3 min CD. Replaces Blessing of Protection, prevents all magical dmg to the target for 10 seconds, does not drop threat from target. Defensive Light of the Protector: 15 sec cd, reduced by haste. Key defensive ability along with SotR. Heals us for 25% of Missing health. Further buffed by standing in consecration and artifact abilities. Ardent Defender: 2 min CD. Reduces all damage by 20% for 8 sec. If you are to die during it’s duration it prevents the killing blow and brings you up to 12% health. Cooldown further reduced by artifact traits, making it one of more frequently used defensives. Guardian of Ancient Kings: 5 min CD. Reduces all damage by 50% for 8 sec. Due to increased CD one of the more tactical cooldowns, yet still one of the strongest. Lay on Hands: 10 min CD. Heals for your maximum health. Longest cooldown of all defensive abilities, making it generally a last resort spell. Can also be cast on allies to prevent death. Eye of Tyr: 1 min CD. Artifact ability, causes damage around you, and reduces damage taken from those enemies by 25% for 9 seconds. Important to make sure that the dmg you want to reduce is cast by the target being affected and it’s not too far away. Divine Shield: 5 min CD. Prevents all damage for 8 seconds, but removes all threat for the duration. Important to taunt the target right before casting in order to get 3 sec of aggro on the boss in single target situations, dangerous to use in AoE without final stand. Flash of Light: 16% max mana, 1.5 sec cast time no cd. Heal to top yourself off while questing, has little use while in combat outside of possibly healing yourself when out of range of healers or sitting in Divine Shield. Talents Level 15 - Tier 1 Holy Shield: (Passive) Increases your block chance, allows you to block spells, and your successful blocks deal Holy damage to your attacker. Mostly used for defensive reasons, especially against dots. Problematic to use against magic nuke’s as you can not rely on it activating. Blessed Hammer: Throws a Blessed Hammer that spirals outward, dealing Holy damage to enemies that it hits, and causing them to deal 15% less damage to you on their next auto attack. Highest DPS talent in the row, and the best one for survival vs physical damage. Can hit same target multiple times, applying damage reduction each time. Spins Clockwise. Consecrated Hammer: (Passive) Hammer of the Righteous has no cooldown. Hammer of the Righteous, Shield of the Righteous, and Light of the Protector now always gain the benefit of Consecration. Not particularly useful unless you want a faster rotation, or experience issues picking up mobs with baseline abilities. Level 30 - Tier 2 First Avenger: : (Passive) Increases the damage of Avenger's Shield by 50% to the first target, and increases the chance for its remaining cooldown to be reset by abilities and talents by 10%. With 7.1 you no longer suffer the penalty of not hitting other targets, and more frequent grand crusader procs will help you be competitive with Bastion of Light on dps in multi-target encounter. Bastion Of Light: 2 min CD - Immediately grants 3 charges of Shield of the Righteous. Good synergy for burst set up, especially if used with Seraphim. With the recent changes, it no longer gets de-sync'd from our other cooldowns, which drastically increases it's single target dps value. Crusader’s Judgment: (Passive) Completely re-designed in 7.1 : Judgment has two charges, and each Grand Crusader adds one charge back. This is good for our survival on big pulls, however, the gameplay is somewhat problematic, as we have to spend a lot more globals on using single target ability, in a multi-target setting. Level 45 - Tier 3 Fist of Justice: (Passive) Judgment reduces the remaining cooldown on Hammer of Justice by 10 sec. Can be useful if encounter has stunnable adds. Repentance: Forces an enemy target to meditate, incapacitating the target and dealing up to a maximum of 25% of the target's health in damage over 1 min. Soft Crowd Control (CC) that slowly deals damage. Doesn’t have a lot of use. Blinding Light: Emits dazzling light in all directions, blinding enemies within 10 yards, dealing Holy damage and causing them to wander disoriented for 6 sec. Non-Holy damage will break the disorient effect. Instant damage and AoE CC. Due to most abilities (Except Auto Attacks and primary target HotR) dealing holy damage, can keep mobs CCed for the entire duration, while you continue to do damage. Level 60 - Tier 4 Blessing of Spellwarding: Places a blessing on a party or raid member, protecting them from all magical attacks for 10 sec. Similar to Hand of Protection, which it replaces, except instead of Physical damage it prevents Magical damage. Cavalier: (Passive) Divine Steed has 2 charges. Fairly good for mobility. Retribution Aura: You deal Holy damage to any enemy whose melee attack strikes a party or raid member within 60 yards. With 7.1 changes to remove tank restriction, this is now the only talent in the row that gives us damage. Level 75 - Tier 5 Hand of the Protector: Calls down the Light to heal a friendly target for 25% of the target's missing health. Reduces CD and allows you to cast LotP on other players. Knight Templar: (Passive) Reduces the cooldown of Divine Steed by 50% and reduces all damage taken while mounted on your Divine Steed by 20%. Good if you require extra mobility, or if you need a 20% DR cooldown with frequent access. Final Stand: (Passive) When you use Divine Shield, you also taunt all targets within 15 yards for 8 sec. Questionably usable talent, which is likely only to be needed if you need AoE taunt. Level 90 - Tier 6 Aegis of Light: 5 Min CD - Channels an Aegis of Light that protects you and all allies standing within 10 yards behind you for 6 sec, reducing all damage taken by 20%. Awkward placement and long CD, but can be useful in some fights. Judgment of Light: (Passive) Judgment now applies Judgment of Light to the target, causing the next 40 successful attacks against the target to heal the attacker. Low healing, but can help people not tick down from weakest dmg. Generally the go to talent in tier. Consecrated Ground: (Passive) Up to 6 allies standing within your Consecration receive healing every sec, and enemies within your Consecration have 50% reduced movement speed. Even lower healing than JoL, and only works on melee, but can be useful if you need to kite adds on a fight. Level 100 - Tier 7 Righteous Protector: (Passive) Shield of the Righteous reduces the remaining cooldown on Light of the Protector and Avenging Wrath by 3 sec. Default talent on ST fights, or anything with adds not lasting a long time. Also works with HotP, which allows you to use it very frequently. Seraphim:The Light temporarily magnifies your power, increasing your Haste, Critical Strike, Mastery, and Versatility. Consumes up to 2 charges of Shield of the Righteous, and lasts 8 sec per charge. Extremely useful for dps, but not that effective for survival. Can be used with partial SotR charges. Last Defender: (Passive) Each enemy within 8 yards reduces the damage that you take and increases the damage that you deal by 3%. Good on multi-target fights, or anything with large packs of adds that are clumped together.Liminara198 Feb 5
Jan 25 Retribution (7.0.3) - Updated 8/4/16 ____________________________________________________________________ Retribution, an In-Depth Guide for PvE (7.0.3) Most recent update: 8/4/2016 ____________________________________________________________________ NOTICE - 8/11/16: I will not be supporting this guide throughout the Legion expansion due to time-consuming developments in school & career requiring most of my focus. After maintaining this thread for so long, it's difficult to just stop, but I will not have time to stay on top of everything that happens in the Retribution community for a while. I will continue to lurk on the forums and be around in-game (and in the Paladin Discord!) to answer questions, but perhaps not quite as often. Thankfully, this is far from the only Retribution Paladin resource! I greatly suggest following Rebdull's Retribution guide on Wowhead, which is updated for level 110 ( Thete's video guides are also a good source of information for those who prefer that format ( Furthermore, you should make use of the Paladin Discord. All of the information you'll need for that can be located here: Fight on, my beautiful /hairflipping Paladin brothers and sisters. (╯°□°)╯ ____________________________________________________________________ ... This is a Retribution Paladin DPS guide focused on providing a thorough understanding of the spec. This guide is a constant WIP and is being edited regularly. Check back often for updates. This guide is made possible by the collective efforts of the Paladin theorycrafting community, especially Solsacra and mserrano. While generally accepted as correct, much of the information provided here is ultimately theoretical and should be taken as suggestion, not gospel. Changes are noted in the change log (post 11). Thank you and have a nice day. :) ____________________________________________________________________ Author Information I am currently playing as Chrissinger (formerly: Svayne, Qris) @ US-Area 52. Paladin since Wrath, Retribution since Cataclysm. I maintained this guide since March 2011, but am not currently supporting it for Legion. The easiest way to get my attention is via Twitter @mfwchris. ____________________________________________________________________ Table of Contents ____________________________________________________________________ • X ... Glossary • 1 ... What's new in Legion? • 2 ... Talents • 3 ... Rotation - 3.1 ... Single Target - 3.2 ... Multiple Target - 3.3 ... Cooldown Usage • 4 ... Greater Blessings • 5 ... Utility - 5.1 ... Defensive - 5.2 ... Healing Spells - 5.3 ... Blessings - 5.4 ... Miscellaneous • 6 ... Tier Set Bonuses • 7 ... Gearing - 7.1 ... Stat Priority - 7.2 ... Gems - 7.3 ... Enchants • 8 ... Consumables • 9 ... Races - 9.1 ... Alliance - 9.2 ... Horde • 10 .. Mechanics • 11 .. Addons & Macros - 11.1 .. Addons - 11.2 .. WeakAuras • 12 .. Frequently Asked ?s • 13 .. Other Resources • 14 .. Change Log ____________________________________________________________________ Glossary ____________________________________________________________________ AtA .... Ashes to Ashes AW .... Avenging Wrath BoF .... Blessing of Freedom BoJ .... Blade of Justice BoP .... Blessing of Protection BoW .... Blade of Wrath CD .... Cooldown CS .... Crusader Strike DI .... Divine Intervention DP .... Divine Purpose DS .... Divine Storm (or Divine Shield) EfaE .... Eye for an Eye EotH .... Echo of the Highlord ES .... Execution Sentence FoJ .... Fist of Justice FoL .... Flash of Light FV .... Final Verdict GBoK .... Greater Blessing of Kings GBoM .... Greater Blessing of Might GBoW .... Greater Blessing of Wisdom GCD .... Global Cooldown GJ .... Greater Judgment HoJ .... Hammer of Justice HoPo .... Holy Power HW .... Holy Wrath JV .... Justicar's Vengeance LoH .... Lay on Hands SoL .... Seal of Light SoV .... Shield of Vengeance TFoJ .... The Fires of Justice TV .... Templar's Verdict WoA .... Wake of Ashes WoG .... Word of Glory ____________________________________________________________________Svayne780 Jan 25
Sep 22 Complete Paladin Transmogrifier Gear Guide <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> What is Transmogrification? "The Ethereals, emerging from the nether, will bring with them a new technology they call Transmogrification. They’re heading to the capital cities of Azeroth to set up shop and to offer adventurers a unique service -- copying the appearance of one magical item onto another. They only ask for a modest gold donation to recoup their costs." From what we have been told, an item can be re-skinned into an older, maybe cooler looking, piece of equipment. Example: "Tier 12 to look like Tier 2" What can be Transmogrified? "Placing an item into the Transmogrifier interface will offer a preview of how the item will appear once the change is applied. However, not all item pairings are compatible with Transmogrification. In general, only items that have stats can be used in the transmogrification process. You must also be able to wear both items when using this service. Ethereals don’t have much in the way of ethics, but allowing someone to appear as if they’re equipping unusable items crosses the line." Example: Plate to Plate; Mace to Mace; Staff to Staff; etc, etc. Wait! We can not modify Immolation Faceguard to Crown of Destruction? No. It is a safe assumption that the designers do not want cloth casters to appear as plate wearers or vice versa. This also includes set items such as "Warlock," "Hunter," "Mage," and "Shaman." Example: As a Paladin we can not wear Death Knight armor sets, but we can find same model items to transmogrify to. That is why this thread is being created - after all. A Short Note: Items will be required to have stats as well, Ethereals will not waste their time on Frost-Rimed Cloth Hat or Weather Beaten Buckler. This could be changed down the road, if business looks promising. A Short Note: Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker, Shadowmourne, or Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros will not be able to be transmogrified at initial launch. The complexity of these magical items currently surpass the knowledge held by the Ethereals. A Short Note: Tired of leveling in that old dusty Bind on Account gear? Well do not worry, BoA gear can be transmogrified! It is important to understand that transmogrified gear is character side only. You can not transmogrify your gear, mail it to an alt and look like you're in Tier 12 at level 10. But you are more than welcome to collect quest items, build an outfit, and transmogrify at your hearts content! A Short Note: Weapon art will be the only thing that is transmogrified. If you have a weapon with Power Torrent and transmogrify it to another weapon with, say crusader, the transmogrified weapon will show up with Power Torrent. <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> ... <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> All ideas, armor sets, and unique weapons are welcome! Start bragging about your favorite armor configurations! A Short Note: The Dark Moon will be bringing back some novelty items in 4.3; so get ready for some skee ball and collect those tickets! PvP Gear and Tier 3 is likely returning.[/i] Duplicate skins shared on two or more items will be listed in order of ease to acquire. <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> Ðj324 Sep 22
Oct 26, 2010 Welcome Paladins: Please Read! Welcome to the Paladin forum! This forum is here to provide you with a friendly environment where you can discuss the paladin class with your fellow World of Warcraft players. Community forums work best when participants treat their fellow posters with respect and courtesy, so we ask that you take the time to read through the forum Code of Conduct ( and guidelines ( before posting. Important Reminders: Search The search function at the top of the World of Warcraft community site is extremely effective and robust. Before you create a new forum topic, please be use it to search for similar topics, blog posts, or web pages that may contain the answer for which you are looking. Making a new thread on an existing subject can result in your thread being deleted or, if you continue to re-post the same content, the loss of your forum privileges for spamming. Rating The forum rating system can be used to promote positive discussion, demote unhelpful comments, and even report posts that violate the forum Code of Conduct. By hovering over a post you'll be presented with several options, including a "thumbs up" (Like) and a "thumbs down" (Dislike) icon. Clicking the "thumbs up" icon will rate the post up. If enough people like a post, it will gain a Highly Rated status and appear at the top of related search results. Highly Rated posts will also have a highlighted background. Clicking the "thumbs down" icon will expand a drop-down menu which will include "Dislike," "Trolling, "Spam" and "Report" options. "Dislike" will rate the post down. If enough people dislike a post, it will be darkened, and with a lot of dislikes it will be hidden completely. You can also quickly report a post as trolling or spam, or use the report function to fill out a more comprehensive description of a violation. Please note that you can only rate each post once. Use your power wisely to help foster a positive and helpful forum community. Have fun posting on these forums, and good luck with your adventures in Azeroth!Lylirra1 Oct 26, 2010
2m Hidden skin fishing.. Currently fishing for the item, 450 casts in and already feeling the grind sinking in but I've gone past the point of no return. How long does it usually take, i heard one guys had to fish 8000 times but i call bulldust. Seems way to excessive. Some people say 11 casts or 68 or like 255 (all mmochampion). Am i going to be scarred for life after this or?Skully10 2m
53m Paladins! Ratest thy Transmog +7 You know what to do! This shall never die!Cadmús442 53m
1h Neglected Justice Gaze Anyone else not even bother upgrading their Justice Gaze? All of my other legendaries are 940, but I cant even bother getting myself to do emissaries to get essences to upgrade it. Even server transferring and losing out on like 30 some essences didn't bug me one bit. Hoping it gets buffed/changed yet again.Vaerume1 1h
1h Why are you a paladin? I just started to play for the first time, and can't decide if I should go paladin or warrior, so I want to know, why are you a paladin?Bopi17 1h
1h 7.2 Paladin class mount.... It's literally nothing. Why can't we get something cool like the shamanLoomiess207 1h
2h when to upgrade drape of shame? Hey Guys, so i have the 855 cloak (Drape of Shames) with the 10% healing bonus. my question is, when is this replaceable? should i be farming for a higher ilvl version of that? i did get the highlord tier piece at 875, is drape still better? thank youMonorion6 2h
3h Holy Paladins: Light of the Martyr! My questions is....Should Light of the Martyr be spammed and used as a main healing ability in a Raid? Or should it be used minimally and in more of an emergency situation? Secondary question - Will Light of the Martyr hurt your HPS in logs?Steakbubble42 3h
4h Thinking of Jumping Ship Tried a few different rotations as holy in h.NH. I've 889ilvl with bis for a number of items (and obsidian /jewel for legendaries) On meters, I'm getting creamed by both a druid (6%-7% higher healing at 898 ilvl) and a shaman 895 ilvl). I'm thought I was throwing out the right rotation (next to no lotm), but I'm still 3rd/4th by a large margin. Think druid might be the way to go. I don't think the raw healing numbers are there to compete with the top spot. Could be my rotation, though I'm sure it's sound by this point. Anyone else having a subpar go of it lately?Moxpearl17 4h
5h DPS Help Help my DPS! Only pulling 450k on Heroic Gul'Dan. Am I screwed unless I get legendary cloak or ring?Melchizedak3 5h
6h Wisdom and Kings Anyone else getting harassment for who you buff or dont buff in pugs? its happening to me on a regular basis.Lucarìo2 6h
8h Ret PvP Struggle Hello all, figured I'd reach out to my fellow paladins. Anyone else having a difficult time with PvP on a ret? At the start of Legion it felt like we were in a good spot, I took a week break and for some reason I can't seem to do much of anything anymore. I tend to struggle when it comes to mobility and fighting certain classes, mages especially and since I'm seeing mages just about everywhere it's kind of impossible to not run into them in any pvp setting 90% of the time. My damage also feels lackluster, I know it couldn't be stats on gear since gear has no effect in pvp instances. I'm not sure what my issue is but it's made it difficult for me to enjoy pvp as a whole as I have a similar experience with my Frost DK. Though I'd reach out and see if there are others having the same problems as I am. Thank you.Xalefor11 8h
9h Ret PVP DPS?? WTH? So WTF happened to my RET Dps for arena? Last week when I played I felt I was kicking !@# in the dps department. Now...this week my dps for PvP has inexplicably tanked!!! Did something get nerfed? Stealth nerfed? I don't know for sure? But all I know is my recount dps numbers in PvP are in the toilet now....significantly LOWER in arenas than they were a week ago! Pretty bummed, discouraged and frustrated now playing my Ret! Anyone else noticing lackluster dps when PvPing as RET now?Xenophob4 9h
10h Healing advice / LoTM opinion So I'm posting this after reviewing our last night raid logs (link at the bottom). Just for a little context, The guild recently went threw a little drama and a few people who were not happy with the overall raid performance cherry picked the highest DPS parser and left. Unfortunately this set us back on progression on NH. Anyway, we have a new Hpal join the guild, he's OK but he use LoTM A LOT. My understanding was that this was a spell that should only be use when obligated to move and HolyShock was on CD. But he use it as often as holyshock on some fight. Looking at the logs and HPS meters, that seems to be working out for him most of the time. One encounter seemed to stand out to me. Trilliax, 50% of his healing came from 33 HS and 30 LoTM. But looking closely, LoTM did 13.95m and damaged him for 8.27m. That just feels wrong. Except we did roughly the same amount of healing even counting that. Anyway, I'm confused, is my opinion on LoTM wrong? Looking at the numbers it feels like wasted mana and GCD's but again, looking at numbers... it seems like it doesn't matter since he's pulling the same overall healing as me on that fight. Help tips? Feel free to scrutinize those logs and point anything I'm doing wrong. Cheers! Logs for the trilliax fight: Logs for the raid night : note: I'm really posting this for the purpose of improving myself and not anything else. I do not wish to belittle anyone here.Ivrae66 10h
11h Divine Storm Cone - Shrinks with Gold Talent Per title, the Divine Storm Radius shrinks when you get the golden talent that makes it a cone. Does anyone know if this is intended? The tooltip simply states that the golden artifact talent will "project divine storm 20 yards" it says nothing about the cone shrinking. I'm thinking this is a bug. Without trait - With trait - 11h
13h Holy Paladin Hello justice bros, For those of you that are Holy Paladins, how is HPal healing? I'm thinking of boosting my Paladin to 100, was originally going to try Prot, but I always fall back on healing. Anyway, I was comparing him to my Priest and it just seems like HPals really lack diversity in healing and it feels like it might be lack luster. I really do like the idea of Auras as it feels kind of like a support role, but when I was looking at how many healing abilities my Holy Priest had vs Holy Paladin, it just seemed like H Paladins didn't seem to have enough. Is Holy Paladin gameplay engaging enough? Thanks!Tevius13 13h
18h Ashbringer Talks!? I can't find any information on this so I am coming here to see if this happened to anybody else. I'm in Highmountain, doing the very grindy Archeology quest. I had just killed a few crocs when suddenly a disembodied voice says "The Ashbringer..." I spin the camera around and find no source for this voice. It isn't even the same voice from the original Corrupted Ashbringer from Vanilla. Has this happened to anybody else? I've been unable to duplicate the event either. Is this something new that was hidden in an update? I've been playing Legion since release and have been using Corrupted Remembrance since ToV came out (maybe before). This whole thing has me both confused and curious.Holysavior9 18h
19h Worth playing ret in pve? are the whiners are vocal minority or should i play my mage or whatBertyo5 19h
19h New animation for Justicar's Vengeance Blizz.....since you're adding some new animations for some classes, could you maybe give us a different animation for Justicar's Vengeance? It has a identical animation to Templar's Verdict...which is pretty dang lame... I mean come on Blizz.....Kasianna4 19h
21h When was the best time for Paladins? The other day a few paladins in my guild were talking about when each spec for paladin was the best. Some believed Ret was perfect in WotLK and others thought WoD Ret was best. At the same time some believed Holy was best in Cata while others like BC. When was each spec of paladin "the best" or when you believe it was perfect and why?Bryiah56 21h
23h [Holy] Aura Sacrifice is the best I crunched some numbers and I think Aura of Sacrifice is by far the best in Raid content. Aura of Protection ranks 2nd and Aura of Mercy ranks last. Back in 7.1, IcyVein crossed Aura of Sacrifice as not worth it. Now it's finally checked green, but so is Aura of Mercy even though it performs poorly in all cases. I'd like to get your feedback on my analysis. Here is my data sheet: It shows the HPS (or prevented damage per second for Aura Protection) provided by all auras during idle period and during Aura Mastery period. I'm assuming Aura Mercy always have 3 people in radius. I'm assuming Aura Protection has always me, the tank and an extra person in radius. I'm assuming Aura Mastery is popped with Avenger Wrath. I'm not assuming Aura of Sacrifice during Aura of Mastery is affected by Lightbringer (if it is, the numbers are even better). In M+, Protection > Mercy > Sacrifice. Although Protection doesn't make your HPS looks nice, it is prevents more damage than you're healing with Mercy. Sacrifice performs poorly in M+. In Raid, Sacrifice > Protection > Mercy. On top of providing better HPS, Sacrifice has some advantages: -You can place yourself wherever you like, while Protection is only good when hugging Tanks. -You are the best targets for your heals, since Lightbringer will always proc at its max on you. -You have (one of) the best responsive healing in the game for 8 seconds. Are there other Holy Paladins that have tried Aura of Sacrifice ? Did you like it or am I nuts ?Galagrum18 23h
1d Rate the Paladin Name Rate the name above you on a scale of 1-10!Laurel218 1d
1d You Old School? So I started lvling a new paladin recently and I was talking to a buddy of mine about how clunky the bc and older combat system was for pallies... Seals/Judgements: A seal is a self-buff which temporarily boosts the paladin's power for thirty minutes. The system of interactions between the various Seals and Judgements compose the main bulk of the paladin class's combat system. Seals cause an additional effect to occur on successful melee attacks. These effects vary greatly, from returning mana or health to causing high amounts of Holy damage. In addition, all seals have an "unleash" effect that is activated through using a Judgement ability. By unleashing a seal, the paladin can deal a large amount of Holy damage instantly to the target (the exact amount and effect depending on the active seal) as well as cause additional effects based on the Judgement. All seals last for 30 seconds and are treated as a magic-type non-dispellable buff Seal, judge, autoattack,re-seal,judge, autoattack, repeat till you pass out from boredom... Anyone else remember lvling during those days, or should I say months, because we did NO damage, but we couldn't die either... Memory lane Cheers!Atellus40 1d
1d Open Libram CLVI: "Zen Intervention" Title formerly: "SEF" : Sanctify, Exorcise, and Flash Heal! You all get the monk for going 14 hours with no new libram :P ... Previous Libram: Libram Archive: Paladin Social Networking: My Little Ponydins by Lobster: Vanilla Ret Pally "Melgibsmash": ____________________________________________________ Miss Kobayashi's Dragon Maid for anime of the year. That is all.Snufu168 1d
1d Stats Hi, So i am wondering, I have returned back to healing and have been doing a lot of research on the stats and gear. I have not had much luck but i am sitting at 36% crit, 38% mastery, 8% haste and 2% vers. Wondering if i should move some of the stats around a but. I really dont mind the meters, but i feel a little week and am just wonering which way most went. I also have a few trinkets i am not using like horn of valor and cocoon of enforced solitude. But was also considering getting the darkmoon deck. Thanks for any advice in advance.Spetto0 1d
1d i know im going against the grain... but i like the pally class mounts, a new high res horse model with the paladin theme is something i would enjoy can we get a glyph that turns our divine steed into the mount please? that would be perfect.Neopal0 1d
1d Should i equip my 4 piece? Armory me please. I have the tier hands and cloak but they are both LFR 860. Is it more beneficial to equip those now or wait for the appropriate ilvl upgraded versions to drop? I do use askmrrobot but i feel the simcrafting isn't accurate. Thanks in advance.Michàél4 1d
1d New paladin wondering about mobility Just made my first paladin, Im level 39 right now im really enjoying him. When I do battlegrounds my mobility is just crap, most of the classes can kite the hell out of me. I was wondering if our mobility gets better as I get into the higher level or will it be this way even at 110? Is it worth leveling a paladin for pvp and pve? I don't really like tanking or healing so Ret would be the only spec I really like..Lightstream30 1d
1d Okay it's Friday and I'm loaded, lets.. Rate that mog, go.Fayddra0 1d
1d HPal, just had a blast healing So I just reactivated this account and tried holy out as my first artifcact since I used to be one of those blasted shockadins back in vanilla and the thought of being able to dps as holy was cool. I gotta admit being able to do roughly 17% overall dmg in the dungeon was fun. With passive healing, artifact trait and using my buffed flash heal while dpsing the entire time was just damn fun. I think the micromanaging of knowing when to heal, when to move, when to dps really takes a lot of boredom out of the class. Is this normally how most other hpals play in dungeons? Also I have no clue on what talents to use so I just picked what I thought sounded the best for what I wanted. Anyways just wanted to bring a bit of happiness to the forums, there is so much negativity everywhere we are going to have a mass depression if we cant find good in stuff somewhere. ~Cheers~Dvalin2 1d
1d Prot survivability in Nighthold? Hello everyone. I've tanked on my prot paladin since early WotLK and I must say, I have never been trucked as much as I have been in H-M Nighthold. Has anyone else ran into the same problem? I have tried to compensate with stam mitigation trinkets, but man, if I get caught with SotR downtime and CDs down, things get scary quick, or I die outright. H Guldan makes me cry most of all.Mortis21 1d
1d Does anybody play both Prot and Holy? Hey guys, I finally got around to leveling my Pally after the warrior tanking playstyle was absolutely destroyed this expansion. I'm really enjoying the class. I know you can play all 3 specs now, but that seems like spreading yourself really thin and I still find it hard to get rid of the dual Talent spec thing being engraved in my mind. Anyway, my plan was that I'd tank pve and try holy PvP. I've never healed before and I thought this would be a fun way to start. Ret doesn't really interest me besides the Ashbringer. So I guess my question is, does anybody else forgo a DPS spec entirely? And do you guys find it hard to be able to do both due to the AP grind? I plan on tanking being my main focus and PvP as a side endeavor.Fålliz7 1d
1d 7.2 Hpally artifact trait feedback Okay, so in 7.2 we're getting a few new traits. There's one specifically that I'd like to talk about here. Sacrificial Martyr: Anytime you use Light of The Martyr on a target you place Blessing of sacrifice on them for a specific %. For example/ 10% of all damage they take is transferred to you. Why is this trait bad? 1. LoTM is already in a fairly awkward spot. You don't want to use it unless your on the move due to the damage you take from it. All this trait is doing is adding more damage intake on top of the damage we already take from LoTM. That's going to push this ability into an even worse spot than it is now. It also provides no extra healing and doesn't feel beneficial. How would I improve this trait? 1. Sacrificial martyr- Whenever you use LoTM, an absorb shield is placed on the target for a specific % of health lost. Not only does this help retain the fantasy of sacrificing your health in order to help/save someone else but it will also make LoTM a more viable ability to use. TLDR: Sacrifical Martyr is a very underwhelming trait in 7.2 and should be improved on. Rather than taking even more damage from LoTM, this trait should have you place a small absorb shield on the target based on a % of health lost anytime you use the ability. This helps retain the fantasy of sacrificing health for your allies and will improve LoTM as a whole.Taeldoriàn16 1d
1d Prot Pally or Guard Druid? Having trouble deciding which tank to main. Any suggestions?Billkazmaier3 1d
1d Holy T20 Bonuses Holy T20, as copied from MMO-Champion: Item - Paladin T20 Holy 2P Bonus: Light of Dawn triggers Dawn's Light, instantly healing your current friendly target within 0 to 40 yds for [ 1 + 300% of Spell Power ]. Item - Paladin T20 Holy 4P Bonus: Light of Dawn triggers up to 40% reduced cooldown based on the current health of the target of your Dawn's Light. More reduced cooldown when used on a lower health target. There are some major issues with this. TL;DR's in BOLD. The most glaring issue arises from the fact that to optimize this tier bonus, our current target should be the lowest % health target in the raid, each time we cast Light of Dawn. This is a problem for several reasons: 1. Many players use mouseover macros or addons (clique) that do not heal by targeting the player. The T20 bonus does not function well with players who optimize their healing in this way. We are essentially being asked to target a player before we cast LoD for the sole purpose of utilizing our T20 bonus. Like many pallies, my target is the boss so that I (as a "melee healer") can periodically contribute damage and maintain JoL. If not the boss, it is the tank so that I can keep track of their buffs/debuffs directly. By the time I manually target the lowest health member of the raid, make a snap decision as to the best direction to aim LoD, and then cast LoD, someone else has probably already healed that target and they are no longer the optimized target. Best case: I feel less useful because that delayed response caused me to overheal. Worst case: a player is dead because of my delayed response. 2. Timing LoD with incoming AoE damage: it's impossible to predict who will take the most damage from a boss' AoE, so it is impossible to choose the right target when you time your LoD to land as soon as the boss' damage does. Lets say I am going to cast LoD as soon as Krosus finishes his Slam. So we target some arbitrary melee DPS, or if we're really good, a melee with lower max health than others. Slam goes out, ah !@#$, that Rogue I targeted? He popped Evasion and remained at 100% HP through the Slam. Again, no good way to optimize outcome here. 3. I'm curious how this interacts with Second Sunrise? Again, how can we possibly optimize here? Does the single target heal operate off of our first cast, or both? In addition, these bonuses present other issues: 4. Pigeonholing: the bonuses force the player into a particular spec to optimize their performance (Lightbringer, Divine Purpose). If your spec is set up to optimize single-target healing (and to maximize the amount of tank healing you do through Beacon of Faith), the bonuses are practically useless. There are skilled Paladins who serve this role and whose parses feature <5% LoD healing. I can foresee a situation where paladins carry around a tier and a non-tier set, depending on their role in raid, which sucks. 5. How does this interact with Divine Purpose? Is the cooldown proc wasted? 6. LoD is notoriously ineffective in 5-mans due to ranged positioning. Unless you stack melee, or the M+ affixes encourage ranged standing in melee, LoD is rarely used. So a reduced LoD cooldown makes an ineffective M+ spell even less effective. 7. Sacred Dawn (new Artifact talent) encourages smart trajectory/positioning of LoD toward the Beacon target (also an annoyingly random benefit, but that's another thread). So Sacred Dawn + Dawn's Light add multiple levels of complexity to the LoD setup (Am I targeting the lowest health target? Am I aiming the spell optimally? Am I aiming it toward or away from my Beacon of Light? Is Sacred Dawn going to collide with a high-health target?) It will feel increasingly difficult to use the spell effectively, especially in high stress raid situations where you will want to get the most benefit from the CD reduction. 8. LoD is already available for use a LOT in a raid setting while running Divine Purpose (which anyone using LoD as a primary filler will do). Additional CD reduction feels overkill and improved AoE healing is really not adding to our niche, it is spreading us thin. Finally, only Druids have a similar bonus, where their % CD benefit is gated by optimal spell usage. However, Druids' bonus is different (slightly better). Druids already use swiftmend on the lowest health target as a clutch save heal (as we frequently do with Holy Shock), so no additional mental energy is needed to optimize their set bonus. The druid bonus just asks them to do what they already do, better: using SM on the lowest health target. This is versus HPallies, who are asked to target the lowest health target before they cast LoD, for NO OTHER REASON than to utilize their set bonus. Thanks for reading. I hope this gets re-worked!Gasherbrum14 1d
1d What do I need done Been an on and off player for years wanting get myself to a place in the game where I am working on current Raids and not feeling far behind. Recently got to 110 started doing world quests and slowly building gear. Any recommendations on what I need to do to be successful or start moving to the direction of entering end game content. Thanks in advance!Jaleon1 1d
1d PvP Holy Paladin Help Alright guys, I have recently taken up healing this expansion. My first healer was this MW monk, and now I am wanting to start a Holy Paladin. I have one at 110, no gear, but at 110. I just had a few questions. I know in arena its a lot about rotating through your CD's, but my question is. When do you use which CD's? I know this is something you learn to do over time, but If there are some general tips it would help. Such as when should I save an ally with SAC over BOP? When should I activate my Aura? Basically what are some good general tips on rotating through your defensive CD's. I know not to use them al at once thats simple, but in general when should I be using certain moves, and what moves should I hold on to for as long as possible?Jartho4 1d
1d Considering Ret for PvP... Hello fellow followers of the lite! I am considering rolling Ret Paladin for PvP. Recently I saw a Ret take on 4 people simultaneously and I said to myself "HELLLL YEAHH!" I wanna do that! I whispered the gentlemen who was controlling the paladin character and asked him a few questions. Basically found out he recently broke his hand so he was limited to what he could play (mained a Feral but said you can't play Feral with 1 hand) so he rolled to his Alt where he can do it all with his mouse. Was curious about a few things: - How long does it take to get used to ret? Can I pick it up quickly? - What classes give you the hardest time? - What legendaries are the best? If I don't get the first one I want I'll probably level another to get it. The bracers seem like the best ever. Any input is appreciated! BEHOLD THE LITE!Lewlewlelw24 1d
2d Class Hall Champion - No Dwarf... So when I got to my class hall and viewed all the champions, I was like alright, this mostly seems OK. But there was no DWARF, yet there is a NIGHT ELF paladin..... Now I just went to Wowhead and searched the night elf (delas moonfang) and apparently she's a former priest who wanted to be a holy paladin. So I'm not quite as enraged by this as I was before, but still, night elf characters can't be paladins, so it still makes very little to no sense to me. But if she wants to be a pally, fine, but why on earth is there not at least 1 dwarf paladin???? In vanilla they were one of the only 2 races that could be paladins, and of the 8 pally champions we can't have ONE dwarf? I seriously thought about quitting wow over that. I won't, but this really bothers me and I hope it bothers other people too. A lot of people love nelfs, especially the females *rolls eyes* but can we please change/add one dwarf paladin to our champion list? Are there future plans in legion to add more champions? If so, can it pleaseeee be a dwarf? Sorry to rant but this is just so frickin' ridiculous to me.... ugh!!Asagio9 2d
2d Two Aura of Mercy in raid? In my core have another pally holly, both of us can use Aura of Mercy?!Mälek3 2d
2d Why Don't Paladins Have Bres? I'm just curious. It only makes sense based off of lore, the warcraft rts history, and just straight up class concept. So I'm just curious why we don't have a Bres as Paladins?Jamessualty8 2d
2d DPS falling behind lower ilvel players My first time posting on anything, so go easy on me. Here is my problem, I've was tanking for a few months and found out I much rather do DPS. I switched to ret and begin working on my relic and gear but after maxing out my relic and getting my Ret ilevel up, I see that I'm no where near the dps other players are doing (I ave about 290 in nighthold). I've reviewed my rotation from icy viens and I seem to be doing things right, my gear seems ok (except for my tank legends), and I'm using pots and flasks. I cant figure out what the deal is.Cleaverogers17 2d
2d Best trinkets for tanking? Not really sure what the best trinkets for tanking are atm, i think the ones i have are decent. Just wondering if there is better?Aequitess4 2d
2d Fresh 110 Pally Tank I have been going through the guides and such and I am wondering if hand of the protector is better than the bubble and taunt ability for gearing up? Is my spec a mess?Saturnine9 2d
2d Blessing question/raiding. Who do you think benefits the most from blessings in a raid environment? Thanks for your time.Waterboy5 2d
2d Liadrin's Fury Unleashed Still Bugged Hey guys, I posted a while back on Bug and pally forums, made a rerlatively long winded post on each. I'll avoid that here, because I made another one in class dev forums. Basically the HP regen from Liadrin's has been bugged for a while, the post and video I included will explain it all. Head over there and show it some love. Blizz has shoved legendaries down our throats, they ought to work right.Socomm3 2d