Classic Discussion

Nov 7 World of Warcraft: Classic We’re pleased to announce the development of a “classic server” option for World of Warcraft. We’ll have more information to share in the future. In the mean time, check out the World of Warcraft: Classic announcement video!Ornyx0 Nov 7
Nov 7 Welcome - Please Read! Welcome to the Classic Discussion forum! This forum is here to provide you with a friendly environment where you can discuss all aspects of World of Warcraft: Classic with your fellow players. Community forums work best when participants treat their fellow posters with respect and courtesy, so we ask that you take the time to read through the forum Code of Conduct and guidelines before posting. Code of Conduct: Getting the Most Out of the Forums: Important Reminders: Search The search function at the top of the World of Warcraft community site is extremely effective and robust. Before you create a new forum topic, please be use it to search for similar topics, blog posts, or web pages that may contain the answer for which you are looking. Making a new thread on an existing subject can result in your thread being deleted or, if you continue to re-post the same content, the loss of your forum privileges for spamming. Rating The forum rating system can be used to promote positive discussion and even report posts that violate the forum Code of Conduct. By hovering over a post you'll be presented with several options, including a "thumbs up" (Like) icon. Clicking the "thumbs up" icon will rate the post up. If enough people like a post, it will gain a Highly Rated status and appear at the top of related search results. Highly Rated posts will also have a highlighted background. You can also quickly report a post as trolling or spam, or use the report function to fill out a more comprehensive description of a violation. Please note that you can only rate each post once. Use your power wisely to help foster a positive and helpful forum community.Ornyx1 Nov 7
11m Percent of New players quit What % of new players will quit when they find out it's a grind and things are not handed to them? For me I'm guessing 100% of new players will quit before hitting level 30!Dropdeadfear11 11m
11m box art for classic if you could design the box art for classic wow what would it be? i would say onyxia what is more classic then onyxia!Aevelamue22 11m
21m make multiboxing bannable title edit: don't post unless you're going to try to have a meaningful discussion and/or you're at least somewhat knowledgeable about anything i'm going to post a video compilation since people for some reason like to be incredibly dense - Asmongold talking about multi-boxing in 2015 which was when multi-boxing started to die out completely almost. - Swifty killing king of stormwind in 40 man raid with multiboxer, caused massive server lag. - preparedwow from mop multiboxing 66 characters and (maxed out at 80 characters) There's also clips of people on the newest pserver starting to multibox by leveling 5 at a time which is incredibly easy if multi-boxing is evident on pservers what's stopping people from multi-boxing on retail? "Money, Money, and Money?" it only takes 1 40 man multi-boxer to ruin and crash a server... And it'll most likely happen daily like it did in MoP. On various big servers.. Like Emerald Dream, Darkspear, and a lot more. This isn't even just WPVP, you can multibox dungeons and I believe.. Not 100% sure you can use /follow in bgs in vanilla.. Just imagine vsing a multiboxer in a bg.. This is an issue that needs to be addressed by a blue post and I'll make sure it does. I'll post every day on this thread. if your only refute is money or they've always allowed. then don't bother posting. they've always allowed it because nobody has petitioned for them to ban it I WILL SAY IT AGAIN. DON'T POST UNLESS YOU HAVE HALF A BRAIN THERE'S WAY TOO MANY DUMB POSTS ON THIS THREAD. I don't care if you refute what I said, just don't make a dumb response.Floissais209 21m
23m Why did they destroy the game? So as a lot of us wait for Classic to be released, to relive the game we loved, a game we played for far so many hours, days, weeks ..... I have to say ... I will never understand why they took one of the greatest games ever made and reduced it to a bland 4 button rotation with little depth, pointless mini games, farming meaningless pets/mounts/armors that you will most likely forget as soon as you have obtained them and even less social interaction than an isolation ward. This game had it all, great classes, great story, an amazing world, PVP, PVE, great community, a social environment where you knew the other people, it was like a second life. The most successful MMO by so far the competition is not even in the same sphere. And they choose to change it. To make the world irrelevant. Too dumb it down. To change it from a social experience where you play with the same people for years only to lump you in with strangers for a 10 minute irrelevant instance. 12 million subs at its peak. If they kept the original philosophy that made WOW great I have no doubt the sub levels would be 15 million + probably more. They had a Golden Goose. instead of cherishing it and making it better they decided to kill it and butcher it until it was unrecognizable. /rant over.Terska216 23m
25m Straw Poll, what class are you? 25m
40m Paladin: Class & Patch Discussion Hello All, I have consolidated a list of many of the changes per class, per patch. I felt this might be useful to review each class's development over the lifetime of Classic. If I have missed any class specific changes, or general changes that effect each class, please let me know in the comments below. I think it might be useful to discuss the pros and cons of any class changes made throughout the course of its life. Please keep the discussion limited to only the changes listed below. Its not unreasonable to discuss scaling particular changes (i.e. If you think a particular ability is over or under tuned for some specific reason), or the order in which the abilities were implemented. However, please refrain from proposing additional abilities or changes that aren't listed in the patch notes. [Series] Class & Patch Discussion – List Paladin: Class & Patch Discussion Patch 1.1.0 Retribution Aura: Moved to level 16. Judgement: Moved to level 50, renamed Holy Wrath. Removed facing requirement from Hammer of Justice and Turn Undead. Cleanse: Moved to level 42, mana cost increased. Holy Light: Causes less threat, heal effect and mana cost increased. Purify: Mana cost increased. Turn Undead: Increased the chance of breaking early. Holy Strike: Removed. Crusader Strike: Removed. Seal of Reckoning: Removed. Healing Aura: Removed. Dominance Aura: Removed. Wisdom Aura: Removed. Redemption: Removed. Resurrection: renamed Redemption, no longer usable in combat. **All Seals renamed Blessings. Several new spells have been added, which now use the naming convention "Seal". New Spell: Seal of the Crusader (Level 12). New Spell: Seal of Justice (Level 22). New Spell: Seal of Light (Level 30). New Spell: Seal of Wisdom (Level 38). New Spell: Flash of Light (Level 20). New Spell: Judgement (Level 10). New Spell: Blessing of Might (Level 8). New Spell: Blessing of Wisdom (Level 14). New Spell: Blessing of Light (Level 40). New Spell: Concentration Aura (Level 22). New Spell: Divine Intervention (Level 30). Resistance Aura: Split up into 3 new spells... Shadow Resistance Aura (Level 28), Frost Resistance Aura (Level 32), and Fire Resistance Aura (Level 36). Seal of Fury has changed significantly. Seal of Righteousness has changed significantly. Blessing of Sacrifice: Moved to level 46, now transfers a flat amount of damage per hit, and has replacements. Blessing of Salvation: Moved to level 26, duration increased, cooldown removed, effect reduced. Blessing of Freedom: Moved to level 18. Blessing of Protection: Moved to level 10. Patch 1.1.1 The effect chance of Seal of Command has been reduced slightly. Redoubt now lasts either 10 seconds or five blocks, whichever comes first. Judgment: Moved to level 4. Divine Protection: Moved to level 6. Purify: Moved to level 8. Seal of the Crusader: Now introduced at level 6. Patch 1.2.0 Sense Undead: No longer available via the trainer; quest reward only. Patch 1.2.2 Seal of the Crusader: Fixed a bug where damage per swing was increasing instead of decreasing when Seal of the Crusader was active.This resulted in a dramatic increase in damage per second (DPS) that was unintended. The tooltip for the spell displays the intent of the spell: "Fills the Paladin with the spirit of a crusader, granting additional attack power. The Paladin also attacks faster, but deals less damage with each attack." The overall increase in DPS from Seal of the Crusader should only result from the increase in attack power and not from the increase in attack speed. We understand this is a significant decrease in the power of this spell, but was a necessary bug fix to ensure both overall game balance and the viability of different Paladin Seals. Patch 1.3.0 Training costs adjusted. Total training cost was decreased. Seal of Command - The damage effects can now be resisted instead of dodged, blocked, or parried. Blessing of Protection - Now castable on all raid targets. Blessing of Sacrifice - Now castable on all raid targets. Blessing of Salvation - Now castable on all raid targets. Divine Intervention - Now castable on all raid targets. Patch 1.4.0 Seal of Wisdom and Seal of Light should now replace each other properly as well as stack properly when used by different paladins. Paladin Epic Mount quest added. To begin, talk to the paladin trainers Duthroian Rall or Brandur Ironhammer. Paladins who have completed their Epic Mount quest can repeat the final event in Scholomance for fun (and loot) by speaking with Lord Grayson Shadowbreaker. Sanctity Aura - Fixed a bug where the spell/talent was unlearned after logging out if learned before level 40. Resistance Auras - Paladins should now be able to switch from a resistance aura to any other resistance aura without canceling the current one first. Improved Seal of Justice - Fixed a bug that caused the talent to have no effect. It will now increase the frequency that the stun effect will land. Patch 1.5.0 Fixed a bug where a Hunter's magic shots were missing too frequently when used on a target with Blessing of Protection active. Patch 1.6.0 Blessing of Freedom - Will now counter the movement impairing effects of Frostbolt, Cone of Cold, Frost Shock. It will no longer prevent the damage taken by Frost Nova, Hamstring, Wing Clip, Mind Flay, Counterattack, or Blast Wave or the melee and ranged attack speed slowing effects of Cripple. Consecration - No longer resets weapon timer when cast. Improved Seal of Justice - Tooltip updated to be more clear. Seal of Command - Should now correctly report damage in the overhead display and the combat log. Summon Charger - New icon. Fixed a bug where the Paladin did not always die when using the Divine Intervention spell. Fixed a bug where Seal of Command prevented other On Hit weapon effects from occurring. Patch 1.7.0 New Spell: Hammer of Wrath (Level 44) - Hurls a hammer that strikes an enemy for Holy damage. Only usable on a wounded target. Blessing of Sacrifice no longer shares damage with dead Paladins (You can no longer kill Paladin Ghosts). Paladins can no longer activate Divine Favor on the previously cast healing spell. Seal of the Crusader - Fixed a bug that displayed the incorrect amount of attack power increased by ranks 2, 3 and 5 of the spell. Patch 1.8.0 Judgement of Light and Judgement of Wisdom will now benefit players that are immune to Holy effects (e.g. Divine Shield). Patch 1.9.0 Due to significant talent changes, all Paladins' talent points will be refunded and can be respent. Training costs for all talent spell/ability replacements have been significantly reduced. Paladins can now learn Greater Blessings for the following spells: Blessing of Might Blessing of Wisdom Blessing of Kings Blessing of Sanctuary Blessing of Salvation Greater Blessings will cast the associated blessing on all raid members that share the same class as the target. For example, if you cast Greater Blessing of Might on a warrior in your raid, all warriors in the raid party will receive Blessing of Might from you. Additionally, Greater Blessings have an increased duration of 15 minutes. These blessings require twice as much mana as the single target version, as well as a reagent. Paladins can purchase these new Greater Blessing spells from their class trainers. Seals and Judgements - Added or increased damage per level so that these spells keep pace between replacements. Judgements - Judgements that place a debuff on their victim will now all have their duration refreshed when the judging paladin strikes the victim with his or her melee swings. All these debuffs have had their duration decreased to 10 seconds. In addition, Judgements that place debuffs can no longer be resisted. Seal of Righteousness - Now does holy damage on every swing. It can now proc correctly as well. The Judgement effect has been renamed "Judgement of Righteousness" to differentiate it from the Seal damage in the combat log. Judgement of the Crusader - The holy damage bonus has been decreased as part of rebalancing paladin damage (which is still increased overall). Seal of Command - The proc will occur more often, but will only do 70% of weapon-swing damage. Judgement of Command - Instead of placing a debuff on the victim, this spell now does immediate damage. If the victim is not stunned, they only take 50% of the total damage. The damage on this Judgement was increased significantly. Judgement of Wisdom - Arcane Shot will no longer cause this to proc twice on one shot. Channeling spells can now trigger this proc as well. Vengeance - Special ability critical hits can now trigger Vengeance. Judgement of Righteousness - The damage of this judgement was increased significantly. This judgement can now trigger procs. The bonus from spell damage items has been increased slightly. Holy Shock - Now heals friendly targets and damages enemy targets. Mana cost reduced. Bonus from spell damage and healing items increased. All Seals and Judgements have had their bonus coefficient from plus spell damage re-evaluated. Some holy damage effects had no coefficient before and now have a coefficient. Vengeance - Clarified the tooltip to indicate procs will not trigger Vengeance. Summon Warhorse - Mana cost reduced. Summon Charger - Mana cost reduced. Consecration - No longer displays a debuff icon on targets in the area of effect. Updated Aura tooltips to be more clear (include radius, fix grammatical errors etc...). Judgement - Range increased, cooldown decreased, mana cost decreased. Using Judgement will now initiate melee combat. Exorcism - Now usable on Demon targets in addition to Undead targets. Holy Wrath - Now usable on Demon targets in addition to Undead targets. Seal of Justice - Mana cost slightly increased. The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...). Seal of Righteousness - The damage bonus from +Holy damage has been reevaluated on this seal. Since the damage is delivered on every swing, the bonus has been reduced. However, paladins attacking with faster weapons should see an overall increase in the bonus from + spell damage gear. Mana Cost slightly increased. Seal of Command - Damage bonus from +Holy damage items slightly increased. Seal of the Crusader - Mana cost slightly increased. Seal of Fury - The seal and judgement have been removed and replaced with a new self-buff, Righteous Fury, which will increase threat from holy damage. Seal of Light - Mana cost slightly increased. Seal of Wisdom - Mana cost slightly increased. Seal of Command - Mana cost slightly increased. Hammer of Wrath - Missile speed of the flying hammer increased. Divine Protection, Divine Shield and Blessing of Protection - Targets of these spells will now receive the "Forbearance" effect, preventing another of these three spells from being applied to that target for one minute. New Spell: Righteous Fury (level 16) - Increases the threat generated by the Paladin's Holy attacks by 60%. Lasts 30 minutes. Blessing of Sanctuary - Now causes Holy damage to the attacker when the blessed target blocks an attack in addition to the current effect. Hammer of Justice - Is now a Protection spell. Repentance - Is now considered an Incapacitate effect. Blessing of Wisdom - Mana regeneration over time will no longer generate threat. Purify - Mana cost now based on a percentage of base mana. Cleanse - Mana cost now based on a percentage of base mana. Patch 1.9.3 Eye for an Eye - This talent will now still do damage when the paladin is stunned. In addition, if the critical hit kills the paladin, damage will still be dealt to the spellcaster. Greater Blessing of Sanctuary - Paladins with Righteous Fury will now generate extra threat correctly when this Blessing procs. Patch 1.10.0 Blessing of Light - Different ranks of this spell were stacking without causing additional effect. It was never intended for them to be able to stack, so they can no longer stack. Judgement of Justice - This judgement will now always hit. Righteous Fury - Righteous Fury will now always generate the correct amount of additional threat on all holy damage. There were some abilities, such as Retribution Aura, where this did not work correctly. Holy Shock - This ability now works with Divine Favor and Illumination. Holy Shield - Mana cost reduced approximately 15%. The effect now has a small bonus coefficient from spell damage items and effects. Eye for an Eye - This talent can now trigger while you are mounted. Blessing of Sacrifice - This Blessing can no longer be used to prevent the death of a target that is supposed to die for a spell effect (e.g.: Sacrifice, Demonic Sacrifice, Divine Intervention, Ritual of Doom). Seal of Command - Will now be able to proc when the Paladin is silenced. Improved Seal of Righteousness - Tooltip updated to reflect actual functionality. This talent increases Seal of Righteousness and Judgement of Righteousness by 3-15%. Lay on Hands - Range increased. Divine Intervention - Range increased. Holy Shield - Tooltip updated to reflect that damage caused by Holy Shield causes 20% additional threat. This has been active since 1.9, but was undocumented. All Greater Blessings now have increased range. Holy Shock - Mana cost reduced. Most creatures that were previously immune to Scorpid Sting are now also immune to the Paladin Talent Vindication. Fixed problem where occasionally repeated casts of Consecration will not deal damage. If a paladin avoids damage with Divine Shield, Eye for an Eye will not react. Fixed stacking of paladin auras so they overlap, but only the best aura in a given category is in effect. Patch 1.10.1 Fixed a bug that occasionally prevented the Seal of Command talent from casting. Patch 1.10.2 Holy Shock will now be guaranteed to crit when used offensively while Divine Favor is active. Eye for an Eye will now properly produce its damage effect on the attacking caster. Patch 1.11.0 Benediction: This talent will no longer incorrectly provide a double discount to Seal of Justice. Blessing of Light: It is no longer possible for a target to appear to have multiple ranks of Blessing of Light. These multiple auras had no beneficial effect, merely causing confusion. Problems with targeting the spell when the caster has Blessing of Light effect on them have also been fixed. Divine Favor: It is no longer possible to cast this immediately after a healing spell and "retroactively" make it a critical hit. Illumination: When several critical effect healing spells are cast very quickly, you will now receive the correct mana refund for each one. Judgement of Command: Now consumes a charge of the Zandalarian Hero Charm. In addition, when this spell is resisted it will no longer erroneously still do damage. Judgement of Righteousness: Now consumes a charge of the Zandalarian Hero Charm. Seal of Command: Clarified tooltip. Vengeance: Seal of Command critical hits can now trigger this ability. Vindication: This effect will no longer be absorbed by Grounding Totem. Patch 1.11.2 Seal of Righteousness will now benefit properly from wizard oil and other effects which give bonus damage against specific creature types. Fixed a bug where sometimes casting a spell immediately after a swing would prevent Seal of Command from triggering. Patch 1.12.0 Divine Shield: Due to the haste effect change, the tooltip has been changed to 100%.Usui42 40m
59m What do you think Classic will be? I think it will have all the non game-play features of the retail client graphics, UI and etc. To help Blizzard save time making it. The patch will be 1.13, aka a Frankenstein patch. The AV everyone wants, Buffed raids/mobs/instances for the authentic Classic feel, maybe some class buffs, no battlemasters and of course all the bug fixes.Winword8 59m
1h Will the game become too top-heavy? Since Classic will probably never really "end" I foresee a problem a few years down the road. Players will have an unlimited time in getting gear, so most serious players will be wearing the highest ranking stuff for basically eternity. Also, after a few years, there will be less and less new players, so extremely geared level 60s will completely dominate all aspects of the game. How does Classic not end up becoming extremely top-heavy?Wicker55 1h
1h Vanilla WoW sucked. I hated Vanilla WoW. They game didn't tell me crap. I remember when I made my first character I wanted a hunter. After I was level 6 I finally figured out that I had picked a warrior. I hated how when I died, I had to walk from the graveyard to my body. Where was the graveyard located? Oh it was conveniently placed on the opposite side of the zone. You'd think with how religious some races were, we'd have multiple graveyards. Nope. Walk off those kaldorei spider legs you just ate you out of shape minion. I hated how I never got a weapon. Like ever. I was still level 20 using some green weapon that dropped off of a tiger in the starting zone. I hated how when I killed a bear, it never had any meat. Naturally bears have meat. But the bears in WoW weren't normal bears. They were alien bears who lacked meat. Deal with it. I hated how when I saw an Orc the first time he killed me. He was in my forest and killed me. I then realized mercy wasn't going to be allowed. Ever. Vanilla WoW sucked. It was a poorly designed game. But then at the time it was an awesomely designed game. If a game had a bipolar disorder, it'd be Vanilla WoW because it couldn't make up it's mind on what it wanted to be. 40 man raids! Woah, awesome! Oh, you've been playing a BM hunter since level 10? Might as well abandon Scooby Doo you got there, because you're Marksmen now. Deal with it. Sitting in Ironforge all day and finally a healer joins. Oh god. It's a druid. If you're already sitting at your computer and it's 8:39 PM and you've waited an hour for this group, might as well not compromise now. You told your friends you're busy anyway. Enjoy your druid and don't die unless you like walking back. Which you will. You didn't need the "Of the Monkey" feral gear to tell you that. I hate you World of Warcraft. I hate you so much. And I can't wait to hate you again.Menard31 1h
1h Prepared for lower population servers I want to see server Realms to be visually and functionally grouped into a not-yet-used Overseeing realm, to be used as a fallback for the realms that fall beneath a certain* threshold to join the Overseeing realm. I think we can agree there is a high chance of seeing a substantial amount of lower population servers after ???? time. And that we have to be prepared for this, otherwise it's gonna end up with a lot of disapointment of 'Legion' Technology. * among other things, like the server[people] not wanting to join. I'm curious to know what u think?Hypexclassic20 1h
1h Will interest in Classic last? So, having not had a sub since WoD, and not staying very current with the happenings of modern WoW, I was extremely surprised when I started feeling the bug again and learned of Blizz's intent to launch Classic Servers. I personally have no desire to play WoW as it is today in Legion, nor do I care to spend my money on or to play BoA when it comes out. My fondest memories of WoW are from when I started playing more than a decade ago, and my interest in the game waned with each xpac and patch geared toward dumbing down the game to make it more interesting to, and to gain more subs from casual players. I WANT to have creative control over my toons' talent spreads. I WANT to have to grind for hours, or days or weeks to accomplish the task of earning my Epic Mount, or to level a profession to max. Those challenges are what made the game fun for me, and I felt far more loyalty to the Guild that I joined that shared in the accomplishment of those goals with me than I ever did to a guild that I joined just for the XP boost while leveling. All that being said, I'm not a patient person. When that bug started stirring within me, I sought out a private server that would satiate me for a while as I waited for Blizz to get around to accommodating some of their oldest and most loyal customers by keeping a promise that we've waited several years for them to make. It's not where I want to spend my time and energy; I'd much rather be committing it to a toon on Blizz servers, and I'd be more than happy to pay for the privilege. I just hope that my thirst for the game isn't fully quenched by the private server before Blizz ever decides to complete this task. Standing by for the thoughtful debate...Rexdrood36 1h
1h Gold Sellers spamming in chat. Gold sellers spamming in chat were part of Vanilla . What are the odds of it happening again? Even if you put WoW Shop in user interface bar, what would the token cost? How much gold to buy in AH? Vanilla economic conditions were tight. Don't mean to open up a can of worms, and I promise I'm not trolling. Thoughts?Pelias18 1h
2h I'm positive of the game version It will be 1.12.1 So start brushing up on which talents you want to pick. Link below :p 2h
2h Can we keep transmog in Vanilla? It's probably the best change ever put into the game and is one of the only things that wouldn't change how the community interacts with one another, the way a built in quest helper, or LFG system might. Simply adds a little fun and flavor to your character.Overpowdered208 2h
2h Community Tolerance for the Learning Curve Back when Vanilla dropped, most of us didn't know what we were doing. Rogues rolled on caster daggers. I stocked up on Int mail for my hunter. You get the picture. Sure, you had a lot of EQ transfers, but a lot of us had never played an MMO before. When Classic drops, a lot (maybe most) players will have played a ton of WoW. They may have to re-learn specific mechanics, but generally most people know what the stats do, and how a tank is supposed to work. Do you think that the community will be less tolerant of people trying new things and doing them badly? I've never played a tank before. Do you think that I'll have the opportunity to learn to play one without getting booted from my groups? *EDIT: To clarify, I'm not particularly worried for myself about jerks in dungeons. I merely used myself as an illustration of a more general question: do you think that 14 years of playing WoW has made people less tolerant of others who are just starting out?Caciorco31 2h
2h Retail Players Vs. Vanilla Players After browsing these forums and seeing the community divided, I felt that I should express my opinion that these two different communities need to be separated. Retail players who never played classic will never understand the game and its meaning beyond just a "game". You cant just demand vanilla to be catered towards your needs because of how easy or convenient retail might be. I get that the thought of a more superior wow game threatens the existence of retail and that not all players are gonna enjoy vanilla. However, it is not right for players who never played vanilla back in the day to break the vanilla community into changes vs. non changes. First the game has not even been released, if so many people enjoyed the game enough to demand a reboot of the once beloved game, maybe its worth giving it a shot before you try to sink this gem blizzard has created. If not, then this product has no relation to anyone who doesn't care and thus they should just stay out of confusing blizzard even more. The veterans who are consistently fighting for non- changes need to understand the mindset of retail players and stop this bickering since its like arguing with a child who knows nothing of this game. If a spec you play now wouldn't be viable in classic, hate to break it to you but tough S#!&. It wouldn't be vanilla if it wasn't vanilla. That being said it doesn't mean you couldn't level or pvp whatever spec you want. All the veterans are trying to say is, in a 40 man raid where everyone counts, a certain standard is held and required of each player. Why would a guild take a ret pally when a rogue or warrior would be a better melee dps? That doesn't mean you cant go ret for some dungeons or pvp. It just means that there is a standard with raiding in vanilla unlike current retail where gears core is all that matters. Instead of arguing back and forth, noobs to vanilla should simply ask their questions and accept the answers given. There is no "well ret-pallies need buffs" cause then the game is no longer the same. Its like if blizz took out Lfr, group finder, scaling zones, heirlooms and lv 20 mount speed, 60 flying and any other factor that made the game "comfortable" to people. All I ask is that, if you don't know anything about vanilla and simply have no interest, keep it that way. If you have questions and are gonna act like a civil being, then I think most people here would be fine answering questions. Thats all, thank you for your time!Lutother70 2h
3h If you could change one thing in Classic... What would it be? I'd want to have the barber shop included. I'm an aesthetics fiend and find it harder to stick to one style in current WoWNhek52 3h
3h How are hunters in pvp? Thinking of leveling one . I know they require a high skill cap but are they good at 1v1 without engineering? Hows their burst/ damage?Sanathran11 3h
4h Warrior: Class & Patch Discussion Hello All, I have consolidated a list of many of the changes per class, per patch. I felt this might be useful to review each class's development over the lifetime of Classic. If I have missed any class specific changes, or general changes that effect each class, please let me know in the comments below. I think it might be useful to discuss the pros and cons of any class changes made throughout the course of its life. Please keep the discussion limited to only the changes listed below. Its not unreasonable to discuss scaling particular changes (i.e. If you think a particular ability is over or under tuned for some specific reason), or the order in which the abilities were implemented. However, please refrain from proposing additional abilities or changes that aren't listed in the patch notes. [Series] Class & Patch Discussion – List Warrior: Class & Patch Discussion Patch 1.1.0 Inner Rage: Removed. Pummel: Removed. Heroic Strike: Now available in all Stances, damage increased on some ranks, decreased on others. Sunder Armor: Now available in all Stances. Shield Bash: Now available in all Stances. Hamstring: Now available in Battle and Berserker Stance. Rend: Now available in Battle and Defensive Stance, damage slightly increased on some ranks. Recklessness: Moved to level 50, moved to Berserker Stance, can becancelled early, now causes the Warrior to take extra damage instead of decreasing armor. Bloodrage: Available in all Stances, cooldown increased. Cleave: Moved to level 20, available in all Stances, damage reduced. Mocking Blow: Moved to level 16, damage increased, replaced more frequently. Shield Wall: Moved to level 28. Slam: Available in all Stances, damage reduced, casting is pushed back when hit. Thunder Clap: Damage increased. Defensive Stance: Now reduces damage taken and damage caused instead of increasing Defense skill. Intimidating Shout: Moved to level 22, no longer causes the targeted enemy to run in fear, but will cower in fear. The cowering effect is broken by damage. Warrior abilities that target one or more enemies now generate additional threat. Taunt: Now gives the target just enough threat to attack you. Cooldown added. Berserker Rage: Moved to level 32. New Ability: Retaliation (Level 20). New Ability: Execute (Level 24). New Ability: Intercept (Level 30). New Ability: Whirlwind (Level 40). Patch 1.1.1 Defensive Stance has been improved to hold aggro more effectively. Taunt: removed rage cost and global cooldown. Patch 1.2.0 Warriors will now resume attacking after performing a Slam attack. New Ability: Pummel (Berserker Stance) (Level 38) - Instant attack that causes damage and interrupts spellcasting for a short duration. Shield Bash: No longer usable in Berserker Stance. Intercept: Cost reduced from 15 rage to 10 rage, damage reduced accordingly. Bloodrage: Now generates 10 rage immediately and 10 rage across the duration. Improved Bloodrage: Now reduces the health cost of Bloodrage by 25% (rank 1) and 50% (rank 2). Berserker Stance: Now increases critical strike chance by 3% instead of granting 10% melee haste. Extra damage taken reduced from 20% to 10%. Patch 1.3.0 Training costs adjusted. Total training cost was slightly increased. Battle Shout - Rage cost reduced. Bloodrage - Health cost reduced. Heroic Strike - Damage increased. Parry - Moved to level 6. Thunder Clap - Now causes Physical damage instead of Nature damage; damage increased; duration increased with each new rank. Improved Sunder Armor - Now decreases rage cost by 1/1/1. Improved Thunder Clap - Now decreases rage cost by 1/1/2. Execute - Full rage is no longer consumed when the ability does not hit. Overpower - Should now be usable when a special attack is dodged. Fixed a bug where rage was not being generated when normal melee attacks were parried, dodged, and blocked. Charge has been improved so it will work through doorways and won't path you through an entire dungeon. Sweeping Strikes bug fixed. It will hit more reliably and show up in combat log correctly. Added a visual to Sword Specialization "proc" that will now show up in the combat log as well. Patch 1.4.0 Thunder Clap - Visual and animation changed. Patch 1.5.0 Overpower - Fixed a bug where the ability was sometimes blocked. Improved Cleave - Now increases damage bonus by 40/80/120%. Blood Craze - Talent design changed. It now regenerates 1/2/3% of the warrior's total health over 6 seconds after being the victim of a critical strike. New Fury Talent: Dual Wield Specialization - Increases damage with the off-hand weapon by 5/10/15/20/25%. Note: the additional damage also increases rage generation significantly. Iron Will - Fixed a bug that caused many abilities to ignore the additional resistance. Enrage - Increased the number of charges to 12. Decreased the duration to 12 seconds. The new duration is the limiting factor for slower weapons (e.g. Arcanite Reaper will typically get one less swing), while dual wielding and faster weapons will make better use of all of the charges over the duration of the ability. Concussion Blow - Changed to an instant, stunning attack and removed the damage portion. Shield Specialization - In addition to increasing % chance to block, it now gives the warrior a 20/40/60/80/100% chance to generate 1 rage on a successful block. Patch 1.6.0 Due to significant talent changes, Warriors will have all talent points refunded and can be respent. Hamstring - Will now cause damage to targets immune to movement slowing effects. Movement slowing effect improved. Improved Hamstring - Design changed. No longer improves the movement slowing effect. It is now a 3 point talent that gives a 5/10/15% chance to immobilize the target for 5 seconds. Booming Voice - In addition to increasing duration, this talent will now increase the area of effect of Battle Shout and Demoralizing Shout by 10/20/30/40/50%. Battle Shout - Tooltip updated to display area of effect (in yards). Demoralizing Shout - Tooltip updated to display area of effect (in yards). Improved Berserker Rage - No longer increases the duration of the effect. The talent will now generate 5/10 rage when Berserker Rage is used. Improved Demoralizing Shout - Effectiveness increase from talent increased to 8/16/24/32/40%. Piercing Howl - No longer has a prerequisite (Improved Demoralizing Shout). Death Wish - Is now usable while under a Fear effect, which will also remove the Fear effect. Bloodthirst - Design changed. Bloodthirst is now an instant melee attack that causes damage equal to 30% of the warrior's attack power. In addition, the next 5 successful melee attacks will restore health. Concussion Blow - No longer requires purchase of the Improved Revenge talent. Shield Discipline - Removed and replaced by the new talent Shield Slam. New Talent: Shield Slam - Slam the target with your shield, causing damage and has a 50% chance to dispel 1 magic effect on the target. Also causes a moderate amount of threat. Requires the purchase of the Concussion Blow talent. Heroic Strike/Sunder Armor/Revenge/Mocking Blow - Tooltips updated to indicate the additional threat caused by these abilities. There have been no changes to the amount of threat caused. Patch 1.6.1 Improved Shield Block - Fixed a bug where Rank 3 of the talent was not granting the extra block. Bloodthirst - Damage bonus increased to 40% of attack power. Patch 1.7.0 Deflection - Will now increase parry chance when using Fist Weapons. Retaliation - Will now cause a maximum of 30 retaliatory strikes in 15 seconds. In addition, retaliatory strikes will not be possible while stunned. Improved Revenge - The stun effect can now be resisted. Mace Specialization - The stun effect can now be resisted. Retaliation, Recklessness and Shield Wall will no longer be cancelled if you switch stances while the effect is active. Shield Slam - Threat caused increased. Shoot Bow/Gun/Crossbow - Should no longer cause a global cooldown on all other abilities. Sweeping Strikes will now ignore dead targets, and will ignore PvP enabled targets if you are not PvP enabled Patch 1.8.0 Normalization - Attack Power adjustment made to instant attacks (Not just for Warriors though) See Post Below: Concussion Blow - Will now initiate combat when used. Shoot Bow/Crossbow/Gun - Fixed a bug where these abilities could be used faster than intended. Throw - Use of this ability will now only cause a cooldown with Shoot abilities. Mortal Strike - Now uses normalized attack power. Overpower - Now uses normalized attack power. Whirlwind - Now uses normalized attack power. Warriors can immediately Intercept after using trinkets to remove immobilizing effects. Camera angles when using Charge should be improved. Patch 1.9.0 Execute - Improved Execute and other discounts to the Execute ability will now correctly convert the resulting extra rage into damage. Retaliation - This ability will no longer lose charges when the attacker is behind the warrior. Sword Specialization - Special attacks such as Sinister Strike, and Mortal Strike now properly trigger the chance to gain an extra attack. Sweeping Strikes - Whirlwind and Retaliation will now correctly consume the charges from Sweeping Strikes. Bloodthirst - The damage component has been increased to 45% of attack power. Enrage - The talent will now grant 5/10/15/20/25% extra damage when enraged, instead of 8/16/24/33/40%. Mace Specialization - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...). Improved Revenge - The stun effect's duration no longer diminishes or is diminished by controlled stun abilities and spells (e.g. Cheap Shot, Hammer of Justice, Charge etc...). Unbridled Wrath - Only normal melee swings will trigger the rage generation from this ability. Patch 1.9.1 Charge – Should no longer desync characters from the server when charging from land to water. Patch 1.9.3 Shield Block - This aura will now correctly be removed when the charges are all consumed. However, it is still possible when fighting multiple opponents to get extra blocks due to technical restrictions. Patch 1.10.0 Execute - This ability will now work with Sweeping Strikes again. If the second victim is below 20% health, they will be hit with the full Execute amount. If the second victim is not below 20% health, they will be hit with normal melee swing damage. Whirlwind - When this ability is used with Sweeping Strikes, it will burn only one charge of Sweeping Strikes and will generate only one additional attack. Flurry - Ranks 1 through 4 of this talent will now activate correctly again. Retaliation - This ability will now function correctly at full melee range. Intimidating Shout - The cowering in fear effect will no longer be applied when the target resists this shout. In addition, this shout will now affect a maximum of 5 targets. Flurry - Your haste will now last only the intended next 3 swings. Sweeping Strikes - The additional attacks generated by this ability will now properly take into account the armor of the second target. Patch 1.10.1 Fixed a bug where the Deep Wounds talent did not trigger "on next melee" attacks when the player had initial aggro. Patch 1.10.2 Rage generated from Unbridled Wrath and Shield Specialization will now display properly in the combat log. Patch 1.11.0 Improved Bloodrage talent changed to generate additional rage when the ability is used. Improved Revenge ranks evened out, resulting in an additional 5% for the final rank. Chance to stun at each rank changed to 15/30/45%. Bloodrage - Fixed a bug that caused Bloodrage to cost twice the intended health. Flurry: The tooltip for this talent has been adjusted to indicate it only works on normal melee swings. Shield Slam: This ability has received a redesign. It now costs 20 rage to use and the damage it does is modified by your shield block value. However, the base damage has been reduced. It generates more threat per rage and more damage per rage than it did previously. Sweeping Strikes: This spell has a number of fixes: When used in conjunction with Execute and the second victim is below 20% health, they will be hit with the full Execute amount. If the second victim is not below 20% health, they will be hit with normal melee swing damage; If the ability you are using does not deal damage, it will not use a charge of Sweeping Strikes; The extra attack it generates when used with Whirlwind now has the correct damage range; The additional attacks generated by this ability will now properly take into account the armor of the second target. Patch 1.11.2 Fixed an issue where the Improved Charge talent was incorrectly increasing the amount of rage generated by Charge. Patch 1.12.0 Bloodthirst: This ability will now correctly benefit from attack power bonuses versus specific creature types. Flurry: The text on the tooltip has been corrected to indicate it triggers on all types of attacks. Shield Slam: This ability will sometimes no longer remove more than one beneficial effect from the target. Thunderclap: This ability was left at 10% despite the haste effect changes. This means its potency has been reduced slightly. Patch 1.12.1 Canceling Bloodrage while in PvP or dueling will no longer remove you from combat.Usui17 4h
4h Still no news? :( Took a break from this forum hoping it be up to date with some OP news but but no :( just the same dumpster fire I left, but I low key love it..... Scratches another dash on the wall.Ughash13 4h
4h We are getting an update at Blizzcon. Blizzcon makes too much sense for an update for Classic. BFA will be out and they may talk about what’s next. But I bet we get a release date and after Blizzcon, Blizzard begins to put up either polls or has dedicated forum threads to engage with the community about changes that happened within the lifespan of vanilla.Menard31 4h
4h [Series] Class & Patch Discussion - List Hello All, I have consolidated a list of many of the changes per class, per patch. I felt this might be useful to review each class's development over the lifetime of Classic. If I have missed any class specific changes, or general changes that effect each class, please let me know in the comments below. I think it might be useful to discuss the pros and cons of any class changes made through out the course of its life. Please keep the discussion limited to only the changes patch notes. Its not unreasonable to discuss scaling particular changes (i.e. If you think a particular ability is over or under tuned for some specific reason), or the order in which the abilities were implemented. However, please refrain from proposing additional abilities or changes that aren't listed in the patch notes. The list below is a consolidation of each class thread I have created. I may update this list later for additional topics related to class specific gear, class related environmental/NPC changes, etc. However those additions and topics are still TBD. Druid: Hunter: Mage: Paladin: Priest: Rogue: Shaman: Warlock: Warrior: 4h
5h Feral DPS is a thing, and it's good! This requires powershifting "look it up". 5 points in furor and Omen of clarity are required. Pre raid BIS: Helm - - Wolfshead Helm Neck - Mark of Fordring , Then Amulet of the Darkmoon - 1200 Darkmoon Faire tickets. Shoulder - Truestrike Shoulders Back - Cape of the Black Baron Chest - Cadaverous Armour Bracers - Shadowcraft Bracer's Hands - Devilsaur Gauntlets Waist - Cloudrunner Girdle Legs - Devilsaur Leggings Feet - Sandstalker Ankleguards or Swiftfoot Treads Rings - Blackstone Ring, and Myrmidon's Signet Trinkets - Blackhand's Breadth and Hand of Justice Idol - Idol of Ferocity Weapon -Manual Crowd Pummeler. Or Fist of Omokk if you dont wanna have to farm alot of pummelers.Nibles248C0226 5h
5h Is Classic worth $15/m? This is something I've been thinking about for a while now, it didn't really bother me at first but I feel like this is a topic that needs to discussed. Value. What's the value of paying for a game with no updates? Imagine a game company today releases a game and told their community "Ok everyone, here's the complete game we've been working on. We wont be adding more content or making changes in any way, oh and btw its $15/m" That would absolutely not fly. From Blizzards perspective they're not planning on making changes or adding anything to vanilla that wasn't already there, which is great and I'm all for it - go team no change. We also know that Classic will be a server option in the retail version, which means that its a one subscription rules all scenario. Players would have the choice between playing the retail version or Classic all under one subscription. This may sound great on the surface but for those of us who have absolutely no plans on buying the 4+ expansions to play retail, it makes zero sense from a value perspective. If we allow Blizzard to do this I believe its a huge mistake and missed opportunity for the community. Its not a big of risk for Blizzard to do this anymore. Nothing even close to 2004, they already have the infrastructure, the teams and technical details are in place. So for them its enormous profits if they don't have to maintain it with patches and content. I can't find the quote but I remember one of the dev's saying that WoW would have been wildly successful with 500k active subscribers, I imagine that number today being far lower. With the popularity of Nostalrius we could easily see 5m+ register and 2m+ active. Blizzard has also mentioned they don't want to manage two mmo's but guess what my friends, money talks. For this reason I would personally advocate for more horizontal content to the vanilla experience. I'll list below but tl'dr, any content that makes the game feel more full especially at lv60, improves player interaction and doesn't effect the higher tier vanilla raiding experience. As much as we want to relive that original experience its just not going to be the same, we know the ending, we know horde pwn's alliance, so why not make it what it could have been. I want challenge and mystery again. - The big one for me would be new quests and quest chains that require some thought to complete spanning multiple levels and zones especially contested ones. - Holiday events that include cosmetic/vanity items as rewards. - More resistance focused encounters in the form of world bosses, elite/heroic farming areas. - More server wide events like the war effort, maybe include mats found in the new farming zones. - Please, Please, Please, more RP focused cosmetics. - I'm gonna get lots of flak for this but, level 60 Heroic Dungeons with slightly upgraded loot tables. I think this would add so much more content especially for smaller, more casual focused groups.(yes this would effect raiding but really only the starting tier's, its more for players who would never raid or might try Onyxia a few times. BWL+ really would't even notice a difference) - Heroic Raids (the added difficulty everyone is pining for without changing the original raids) - More dungeons like gnomeregan or Razorfen Downs, unlike retail we like difficult time sinks. - More Easter egg vendors - Let us explore as long as we don't glitch through the map, I want to jump off the waterfall again :^) - More opportunities for PvP I would wait until the game was released for a year before doing any of this but if the player base was there I don't see any issues with improving upon vanilla. *edit - I should have been more clear, I'm not advocating for FTP or a one time fee but it doesn't make sense to pay for retail dev time we won't ever use. Dungeons was a little far yes, however it doesn't take a large team to scrape RP assets and add quests in. I still think heroics is a good idea, especially before they launch the eq40 raids.Teys162 5h
6h BUFF PROT PALADINS! :)Theloras7 6h
7h Interest in Classic ^ High I have recently been playing Retail for fun, enjoying it for the time being (albeit it pales in comparison to Vanilla). One thing I have noticed is that when I am out questing and enjoying the world, the people I end up in group with due to chat, are all interested in Classic! Its rather funny, it seems like 80 percent of the people are literally ready for, Classic! Even those that have recently returned, just for Classic! Its insane. I would wager that the numbers point towards this trend and that they are aware of this fact, many have returned lately for, Classic! I wonder if they could do a legit poll that would help them be aware of this. Hopefully this helps them realize they should push for the release of Classic, that would be ideal. With BFA hitting the stores this August, hopefully by Blizzcon we can get some information and perhaps a playable Alpha/Beta at Blizzcon. I got a feeling when Classic releases its gonna be crazy, wild, and the servers are gonna go nuts.Normathord17 7h
9h My goals in classic Roll an Undead rogue. Spend 50% of my time raiding, the other 50% ganking low level players. Killing low level players because there is nothing more enjoyable than killing the max level friend that comes to help. Then watching that max level friend give up an desert his lower level friend once he realises he is unable to help. What're your goals for classic?Eeo66 9h
10h Achievements: Not Classic, but... ? I admit to be an absolute Achievement Chaser (there are more accurate words to use, but Chaser will do for now). In fact it was Achievements, not actual game content, that kept me playing long after I'd otherwise grown bored of seeing the same stuff over and over. A frequent fear I see associated with Classic is that people will quickly become bored and leave. No new content means no continued interest and the server ultimately failing. Personally I disagree with such a dire outlook, but I digress. My question is two-fold. Achievements as an actual in-game element were not Classic, but do they constitute an actual break in Classic? Secondly, if Blizzard does not specifically create Achievements for Classic, does anyone foresee an AddOn created which would mimic that game element?Dunthor17 10h
11h How to buff raids - and why Why does it make sense to make raids more challenging? It's 2018, not 2005. People know more, and the knowledge is more widespread. Average players use better talents, better gear, better "rotations", better consumables. These are reasons why raid experience will be significantly different - unless adjusted. And different raid experience implies different PvE/PvP experience. Soon after AQ is out, many players on BGs will be full T2.5. No one will farm many good items because they can easily get better items in a raid. R10 items would require quite a grind for little to no gain. Is it "authentic Classic experience"? Raids and raid gear should require significant time commitment, comparable to what was required in 2005. Easy and quick raids devaluate other aspects of the game. ============================== How to make raids more challenging? Way 1: Vanilla means Vanilla design 1.1) Revert direct raid nerfs. Sounds cool - but there barely were any. Vanilla raids have been made easier by buffing players mostly. 1.2) Start with patch 1.1 minus bugs. Sounds cool, we'd get weaker classes in a weaker gear, and raids would be as challenging as they were intended to be. But we don't know if Blizz are ready for anything similar. And it doesn't account for all the current knowledge that truly makes the raids easier. Way 2: Vanilla means Vanilla feel 2.1) Buff numbers - boss/trash HP/damage. Would make raids slower and hence less accessible. Would prevent brutefocing, i.e. ignoring boss mechanics (example - Sons of Ragnaros won't appear if you kill Rag quick enough). 2.2) Nerf numbers - consumables/worldbuffs. 2.3) Restrict addon capacities. For example, prevent them from announcing any text, doing maths, or from "reading" what your target is doing. 2.4) Complicate the mechanics. I only list it for completeness and don't see how it can work. Raids would be too different, and people would adjust soon enough anyway. 2.5) Re-create resistance bottlenecks. Why did AQ take so long to clear back in 2006? One of the reasons was nature/shadow resistance requirements - you can't farm that gear in a day. Same for Naxx and frost resistance. Even Ony scale cloak was an issue preventing guilds from clearing BWL too fast. On private servers, everything is getting pre-farmed. Is it "authentic Classic experience"? 2.5.1) Ony scale cloak should require Elementium to craft; NR craftables should require AQ40 Scarabs 2.5.2) Remove (most of) the NR/SR/FrR resistance gear from outside of the raids 2.5.3) Just buff Huhu/Visc/Twins/Sapph/KT so you need resistance epics to beat them All the above methods could be combined, of course. ============================== We can't bring 2005 back, but we can try to make the experience closer to the original. Make epics epic again!Nimeralion129 11h
12h Horde vs Alliance in Vanilla Hello everyone. Can we have a real, logical discussion on whether Blizzard favored Horde or Alliance during vanilla? I am not sure about earlier patches, I joined at around 1.11 and then I only played on Private Servers. I am mentioning this because for example Horde did not have flight path in Hinterlands, and blizzard corrected it. On the other hand, horde had 2 flight paths, boat and a zepellin in Stranglethorn Vale. Did alliance have anything to compensate? Dungeons were awful for alliance. RFD, RFK and SM were all in Horde territories. It took lot longer(and was more dangerous) to get to them for alliance. Some people mentioned at least in graveyards, Alliance had upper hand. How do you assess this guys? I am really interested in this. Hopefully some of you are too.Holylr33 12h
12h Will Classic have real PVP servers? Sorry if this is discussed somewhere already. My post history / search features are broken. So, will there be PVP realms? Since BfA is removing them I would be really interested in classic for this feature. I love hunting gankers. :) Thanks in advanced for your well thought out heartfelt friendly replies.Wyspers10 12h
12h To all you nice guys out there.... To all you nice players out there who don't kill players you come across that are far lower level because... well... what's the point? I say this to you... show no mercy. I guarantee you will rarely see mercy from the other side. Chase those bastards down and slaughter them! I've been playing on a pr***** vanilla server for a while now and I, like most reasonable people, don't see the point in chasing a lower level player half way across the map just to kill them. It's not worth the effort, it's not worth the time... and, most importantly, I was a bully in middle school so I don't have an inferiority complex. I feel so sorry for all you who feel the need to take out your frustration of life on low level players of the opposite faction. Having said that, I've become more of a pacifist latter in life. I don't really have an underlying need to kill lowby's unless they get in the way of me completing my goal, which is to hit level 60. Having played on a private server I realize that I am the minority and have changed by mind on the matter. I've been chased down and killed for no reason far too many times. F*** THE HORDE!!!! KILL EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM YOU SEE!!!!!!Skrachee44 12h
12h Fury Warriors Hey, anyone that played back in Vanilla know if Fury warriors were pretty good for PvP and raiding? I saw one of swifty's videos called something like "warrior tricks" and he was playing fury and it looked really fun, is it safe to make Fury main in vanilla? or should I just go rogue? ThanksFarkâs7 12h
13h Paladins & Shamans and bears! oh my! Blizz should release Classic with Blood Elfs and Draenei. This allows both factions to have Paladins and Shamans and won't take away from that Vanilla experience we all want. Having their starting zones won't impact on the game and I have faith in Blizz's ability to balance raids with having the composition of both Shaman and Paladins. I believe that blizz is going down the path of a remastered game with minor changes and a franken patch with hopefully gated content. I don't see Belfs or Draenei as having any impact on the immersion or balance of the game.Lightar30 13h
14h Classic 20?? will not be the same as WoW 2004 It doesn't matter what Blizzard does, Classic 20?? (2018-2020+, whenever it is released) will not be the same experience as World Of Warcraft 2004-2007. When the Classic server is released I would say over 60% of the population knows exactly what class they are choosing, know what addons they are going to use and know exactly what to do to not only get to lvl60 within a month but also get an Epic Mount. People will know exactly what gear to get to start raiding (and know exactly what dungeon and boss to get it) and people will know exactly what to do and where to go in every single encounter/dungeon/raid. The idea to preserve WoW with no change so the game will be exactly like it was in 2004-2007 is laughable and is why I really hope, and expect, for Blizzard to make minor changes so, 1) it attracts a larger audience 2) it adds more variety to the game And so with that here are two important changes I would like to see, 1) Lower respec costs so people can play the game how they want (especially for people who heal/tank raids/dungeons can now easily enjoy more of the game without being limited in ability) 2) Remove debuff limit so more people with different specs can enjoy the game. Will this involve slight balance changes? Yes but it will only be slight because your DPS is limited by tank threat and removing debuff limit will not increase tank threat, also this change will only affect raids and the adjustments will be very minor The people who NoChange for the sake of no change are diluted to the idea that Classic WoW has already changed, so if the game has all ready changed why not make intentional changes so more people can enjoy this fantastic game?Laidher81 14h
16h Class balance Vanilla I know I'm probably going to get some hate on these forums but I figured I'd just spark the conversation. As you can probably tell from my avatar I haven't played WOW for a really long time but I'm really interested in Classic. That being said I was curious to know what the communities thoughts were on balance of Vanilla. Specifically specs that were pretty much considered to be useless in PVE. For example Paladins, Shamans, and Druids were pretty much all pigeon holed into becoming healers due to the viability of their other specs. I'd truly like to see viability for other specs in Vanilla and I know that's somewhat of a controversial opinion to take. I'm not saying that there should be a total overall of the system that was in place but rather scaling/number adjustments. Thoughts?Ezrael210 16h
22h What happens after Classic? Posted this on Reddit, wanted the forums opinion. Just for the record, I'm super excited for classic and will definitely be playing it. But I was thinking, other than pure nostalgia what will keep people playing after finishing the main content? So let's say classic is released at 1.12ish for the balancing and whatnot and it's the great same old game we all remember. Blizzard decides to delay certain later Vanilla content from the release of Classic (Lord Kazzak after a few months after release, BlackWing Lair after a few more months later, just to name a few) After how ever long they will take to roll out all the old content (maybe a year or two) and people eneviably finish it, what will happen next? I know there is suggestions of a global reset back to the beginning. But in this case, what will make people want to keep grinding and getting to the end game content when they know at the end it will just all be reset and all progress goes away. Obviously Vanilla was a lengthy game and it took forever to get to the level cap, grind out professions, or explore the world, but with a global reset will people have the want to really put all the time into maxing everything out just for it to be taken away. Also, if the server is reset, when will it be? One year after release? Maybe two years? I think even every two years is not enough time for a lot of players, especially the people who will be playing Classic casually. This might cause the hard core players to leave and wait for the reset, which if its every two years they might not come back. Another suggestion is progression servers. So like making Classic servers, Blizzard would add in BC and WoTLK servers after a certain amount of time. The issue here is, when does that stop? From what I read, the player base mostly wants to stop at WoTLK. But would Blizzard stop there? Wouldn't they see that as they are admitting that the game was way better back in the day then retail is now? If they just do the Vanilla they have some leg to stand on when it comes to describing it, as something old school players can play to remember the game how it was originally released. But if they include the next few DLC's and then stop, that might paint a bad picture on current day retail; which I'm sure Blizzard wouldn't want to do. It would be saying that "Classic" wow is up to WoTLK and then every other expansion was part of "New WoW". You can see how a huge divid in the player base would be formed. I see Blizz either making every expansion have its own server, which would probably very very expensive and time consuming. Or just not have progression servers at all.Orrex25 22h
23h Allied races-we need to level Up 8 characters if we want all the heritage armor not to mention other races to come out in the future? ...and then levelling is made longer..heirlooms are nerfed..I don't think this was thought of from the veteran players point of view at all...Simu4 23h
1d Gorwarth, Eaglesgift, Azjol-Nerub I see you on here. Go post in r/classicwow or r/wowservers before this gets deleted lol.Cheater15 1d
1d Endgame Dungeons and the Dire Maul Problem The Dire Maul dungeons were 5 mans released in patch 1.3 which contained some loot equivalent to what dropped in UBRS. They were clearly introduced in order to act as a catchup mechanism in order to streamline entry into MC. Some of the loot was even better itemized than raid gear. Assuming that we are not going to have a progressive release of content due to the difficulties that presents the quality of loot available in Dire Maul should be toned down to roughly LBRS level. 5 mans should drop 5 man level gear. With this benchmark in mind UBRS level gear also dropped from the Scholo and Strat dungeons, but the key difference is that Scholo and Strat were not designed from the start as 5 man dungeons, they were changed much later in the development cycle. Therefore in order to best keep the vanilla feel Scholo and Strat should be tuned to the same level as UBRS, as either 10 mans or 15 mans. Personally I'd prefer 15 man because you'd need to have 2 tanks in either a 10 man or 15 man, but either way. Tuning the dungeons in this way creates several tiers of content and a time gating system which should serve to more meaningfully preserve the original vanilla progression.Vandal23 1d
1d Daily quests What are your opinions on daily quests? Personally, im not certain how I feel about them. I don't mind the turn x in for x repeatables though, a few existed in vanilla. Thoughts?Ephemere35 1d
1d Guilds and Players from Vanilla Hello everyone. Brahmu started a great thread listing out old guilds from vanilla in the hopes that returning players could find their old buddies. It looks like RL has taken him out of commission for a while. The guild list he was compiling was getting pretty clogged up for a forum thread. I compiled everything and put it in a google doc. This not only is easier to look at, but if I ever get super busy for some reason I can give someone write access to keep the process going. Google Doc is here: I will no longer be updating the old thread, people were getting confused thinking the thread was dead as my google doc link was buried on page 18. In addition to guilds I also put a column for character names and optional contact info, in case you want to leave an email address or steam id for old guildies to contact you at. Please use this format Server - Guild - Faction - Player Name (if you can remember) / Contact Info (optional) If you are missing to many components or bury this info in a large paragraph I wont have the time to dig it all out / ask follow up questions for more info. Old thread: ( I will no longer be looking at posts in this thread ) 1d
1d Should ninja looting be bannable? Yes or no?Fugrunk39 1d
1d Target Dummies I played this priest, healing at 60 exclusively throughout vanilla...later on in BC I took up a warlock and learnt the joys of dps, getting hit capped and working out what gear to wear, etc. I’m pretty sure target dummies weren’t in vanilla..maybe in BC? They were really useful in testing spells, items and working on your dps. Can anyone clarify when these came into use, I’m a huge vanilla fan and would like the same experience I had in 2005 without any changes...those dummies sure were handy little devils.Telfair9 1d
1d Classic WOW: What do you want the most? What is that you want the most from Classic Wow when (and if) it comes out? For me what I want the most is to have profession really matter again. I truly miss professions making a big difference in the game, whether it is crafted gear, potions or farming mats for gold. This has been my most favorite part of the game from day 1 and I loved having alts with professions that complemented each other while I progressed. Professions have been dying a slow steady death over the last several expansions and for me, with Classic WOW, I can't wait for them to really matter again. Please feel free to share your thoughts on what you want (or miss) the most from Classic WOW.Puredruid28 1d
1d Available looting methods The recent thread on "ninja looting" had me thinking back to the looting methods I remember. I'm pretty sure these were all available in 2006. Now, this is going go get long, so I'll put my questions at the top: For those who started in Beta, at release or before mid-2005, what do you remember of the group loot methods? Are we better off with the looting methods as they existed by late 2006, or the as-released version, or were there other changes over time that weren't as clearly listed in Patch notes? What stuff do you remember about /roll (manually) as a way of determining who would win an item? === FREE FOR ALL Every mob killed is lootable by any player in the group, and whoever loots first can take everything. I remember two cases this was commonly used for. One was grouping with a friend, but we weren't right next to each other and didn't want to go hunting for each other's corpses to loot. We would loot what we killed, but be in a group. The other was running someone through a dungeon, when the higher level person didn't need any of the loot, so the low level stayed well back (to avoid aggro) and then ran after looting all the corpses. The negative was when someone super-rare dropped, it just automatically went to the person looting. I remember this happening in one Deadmines carry with the parrot, and the higher level raging (and then complaining in Trade) because the lowbie wouldn't give it up. ROUND ROBIN Each mob killed cycles between players in the group, so Player 1 gets loot from Mob 1, Player 5 gets loot from Mob 5, then it starts over and Player 1 gets loot from Mob 6. This one sounded like the most reasonable and fair option, but in reality it meant RNG could give Player 2 mostly trash and Player 5 would get a lot of nice green gear. Also, it could partially be gamed by players who knew which mobs didn't have anything worth looting, so they made a point of killing one mob slower or killing others faster so their loot came off the mob with better stuff. GROUP LOOT This started with the basic idea of Round Robin, but a loot thresh-hold was set - usually defaulted to Uncommon (Green) items. If a drop was at or higher than that threshhold, everyone eligible was given a chance to Need, Greed, or Pass. If anyone chose Need, only those who chose Need were given a roll and a winner chosen. If no one chose Need, everyone who choose Greed was given a roll and a winner chosen. Patch 1.7 change ... I don't quite get this, as it sounds like Need before Greed and Group Loot were two different things, but most information I can find about Need before Greed talks about the late Wrath iteration, not an early vanilla iteration. EDIT to copy from response (thank you!): ... ... MASTER LOOTER Only one player has access to the loot on a mob's corpse. However, when they click on the loot it doesn't automatically go to them. Instead they are given a selection list of all eligible player from which they pick the person it should go to. (It's been too long, but I'm pretty sure this applied a loot thresh-hold so that stuff below a certain level still used Round Robin style.) Meant for guild raiding situations, as guilds often had their own set of rules and the Master Looter was the person trusted to apply those. === There were two more loot methods added well after vanilla, but they're not really part of this discussion (unless someone is pushing non-vanilla changes): Need Before Greed This was pretty much built for random dungeon groups with the ability to Need only if your class could equip an item, and an option to D/E if an enchanter was in the group which rolled against other Greed rolls if no one chose Need. Personal Loot This is the most recent "preferred" method which eliminates rolling against other players for a specific item. Instead, several internal rolls happen that decide how many in the group have a chance at items, which of the players in the group "win" their chance at an item, and then it delivers a piece from the mob's loot table that is considered usable by their chosen spec (either the one they're in or the one they've set their looting to consider). === Other thoughts: The Brady Guide printed and available at release implies that with Group Loot the players would talk it out, use /roll 100 if there was more than one person who needed an item, and the winner would then take the loot. It also describes "ninja looting" as someone taking the loot (set to Bind on Acquire) while the group is talking it out or rolling, which sort of implies the loot decision for Group Loot or Need Before Greed wasn't done automatically. I remember forum threads about the random number generator for /roll and the Need/Greed rolls, as well as a long blue response having to confirm that it really was random and couldn't be hacked because it was server side. I also remember multiple cases of people using tricks like /roll 100-100 in a large raid group, sometimes caught, sometimes not, by the Master Looter. I remember addons to keep track and make sure people didn't roll twice.Eilethalua5 1d
1d Should Blizzard keep achievements? One of the best features they released since WOTLK was achievements... What are your thoughts about it?Livqt21 1d
1d 1.1 Roll Out - Concept/Scheme This thread is for the discussion of patches and changes that happened. I will provide an example of what I feel would be a functional roll out within reason. Critique, Discuss, Make your own, State your agenda. Thank you! Patch 1.1: World of Warcraft Initial Launch Onyxia's Lair Released Molten Core Released Patch 1.2: Mysteries of Maraudon Maraudon Released Gurubashi Arena Event Patch 1.3: Ruins of the Dire Maul Dire Maul Released Lord Kazzak Released Azuregos Released Meeting Stones implimented Patch 1.4: The Call to War PvP Honor System implimented Priest Epic Quest Line impimented Hunter Epic Quest Line implimented Patch 1.5: Battlegrounds Alterac Valley Released Warsong Gulch Released Cloth turn in for Rep/Exp released. - Repeatable Patch 1.6: Assault on Blackwing Lair Blackwing Lair Released Darkmoon Fair Released Battlemasters in Cities Implimented Warrior and Warlock Talent Revamp Patch 1.7: Rise of the Blood God Zul'Gurub Released Arathi Basic Released STV Fishing Event Released Hunter Talent Revamp Patch 1.8: Dragons of Nightmare 4 New World Boss Dragons Released Silithus Revamped in Preparation for AQ Event Druid Talent Revamp Patch 1.9: The Gates of Ahn'Qiraj Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj Released Temple of Ahn'Qiraj Released Linked Auction Houses Paladin Talent Revamp Patch 1.10: Storms of Azeroth Dungeon 2 Set Released Priest Talent Revamp Patch 1.11: Shadow of the Necropolis Naxxramas Released. Shaman and Mage Talent Revamp Patch 1.12 Cross Realm BGs Rogue Talent Revamp My personal feelings of how this could go. I am looking for a authentic vanilla experience with all the hardships of the past. I don’t consider bugs/bug fixes as content. Programming a bug in is a ridiculous idea. Patch 1. Events and Maraudon Molten Core Released Onyxia Released Gurubashi Arena Event STV Fishing Event Holidays Implimented Maraudon Meeting Stones Implimented Linked Auction Houses The purpose of this would be for open world content releases and getting maraudon out in the open. No reason to hold off on maraudon. It does offer some Pre-Bis but that is acceptable. Most people won’t be raiding in the first month. 1.2 launched 1 month after initial wow launch. Patch 2. Diremaul and Honor System Dire Maul Released Lord Kazzak Released Azuregos Released PvP Honor System implimented Priest Epic Quest Line impimented Hunter Epic Quest Line implemented Cloth turn in for Rep/Exp released. - Repeatable Patch 3. Battlegrounds, BWL, and Talent Revamp Alterac Valley Released Warsong Gulch Released Blackwing Lair Released Arathi Basic Released Darkmoon Fair Released Battlemasters in Cities Implimented Revamp Talent Tree Launches and Spell Changes – All Classes Patch 4. Dragons, Silithis, and ZG Zul’Gurub Released 4 New World Boss Dragons Released Silithus Revamped in Preparation for AQ Event Patch 5. AQ Begins Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj Released Temple of Ahn'Qiraj Released Patch 6. Naxx and D2 Sets Naxxramas Released. Dungeon 2 Set Released Thoughts? I haven’t thought about the time frame yet. I would be hoping for a 2 Year span for everything. I don’t like rushed content. There is also a gear change that effects a lot of BRD gear and other dungeon gear in 1.8 iirc. This is a whole nother beast in itself. BRD Gear became equal to that of MC. The purpose for the talent changes in Patch 3 is it requires people to do MC, Ony, and Dire Maul with the old Talent Setups. Battlemasters with BGs is understandable. No reasons to hold off in AB as well. Darkmoon Fair has raid buffs and gear that is wonderful. It shouldn’t be in the intial patch. Dragons and ZG released at once is kind of a sticky situation. I think that combining them will make it easier to roll out. It would also take some pressure off dragons due to people being busy with ZG. I don’t know if that’s a good or bad thing. I like the conflict of raids colliding for dragons. D2 Sets and Naxx won’t be conflicting a whole lot. I think it’s a fair combination. This scheme doesn’t have Xrealm BGsCyberfriendx41 1d