Multi Dotting Nameplates?

Druid
Looking for some tips/ideas/addons (addon profiles) that will help me with applying dots in large groups of mobs. Specifically spreading moonfire and sunfire on my moonkin, but I imagine a setup that works for any class that multi dots would work.

I currently use tidy plates and while I'm happy with my profile for a few targets, the name plates get cluttered/overlap when the group gets larger. Tabbing through targets seems so inefficient. I'd like to be able to clearly target each mob through their name plate. I don't necessarily need timers on my dots since this is large group where I'm applying as fast as they expire anyway.

Thanks in advance.
I'm not sure of an addon like that, I use ElvUI which has their own name plate addon built in, but once you run into a large amount of mobs like you said, it's pretty difficult to tab target or click through them.
You can change nameplates to stack or spread so that they dont overlap.
Use the "Stacking" method in the Blizzard UI options.

Some addons you can use:
PlateBuffs -- I use this one specifically for CC on units, it shows a giant icon over their nameplate with timer. I have it set up specifically to show only CC on the target via the giant icon.

TidyPlates + TidyPlates: ThreatPlates -- Great for showing a metric !@#$ton of information in a small nameplate. One of those "must have" AddOns. (These are 2 different addons, ThreatPlates requires TidyPlates)
For PvE

#showtooltip Moonfire
/targetenemy
/cast moonfire

After hitting this macro key, wait for the GCD to expire, then press your sunfire key. After that, press your moonfire macro key again. Rinse and repeat till you've dotted to your heart's desire.

For PvP
#showtooltip Moonfire
/targetenemyplayer
/cast moonfire
After hitting this macro key, wait for the GCD to expire, then press your sunfire key. After that, press your moonfire macro key again. Rinse and repeat till you've dotted to your heart's desire.

That is a DPS loss of 25%
10/17/2013 01:54 PMPosted by Cyous
After hitting this macro key, wait for the GCD to expire, then press your sunfire key. After that, press your moonfire macro key again. Rinse and repeat till you've dotted to your heart's desire.

That is a DPS loss of 25%


He asked for useful tips concerning speading his DoTs with ease. This is a very easy way to do it. As for it being a dps loss, he could simply avoid the non eclipsed DoT and just hit the key again.

Also, I've watched some of your previous posts. I know that "numbers are your thing," but are these right? There have been errors in the past :)

Seeing the math that supports your statement would be interesting. Feel free to wall-of-text.
Also, I've watched some of your previous posts. I know that "numbers are your thing," but are these right? There have been errors in the past :)

Seeing the math that supports your statement would be interesting. Feel free to wall-of-text.

(X * 1.5) + (X * 1.5) = 3X
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

3X > 2.5X = It's a DPS loss to MF/SnF/MF/SnF/MF/SnF.

20%, not 25% also. (using different mastery values; its 26% with 70% mastery -> DOC)

Aka.

A lot.

This math lesson brough to you by Cyous.
~ Cyous, because LFR is harder than Heroic (the number of wipes prove it).
(X * 1.5) + (X * 1.5) = 3X
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

3X > 2.5X = It's a DPS loss to MF/SnF/MF/SnF/MF/SnF.

20%, not 25% also. (using different mastery values; its 26% with 70% mastery -> DOC)

Aka.

A lot.


This does not take into account any additional damage-over-time damage caused by maintaining an additional non-eclipsed DoT.

So from the perspective of a pure spam (assuming a 50% damage increase from eclipse)

[1.5x + 1.5x = 3x] > [1.5x + x =2.5x] is true.

But if dot damage is included you get:

[z(1.5x + x) + m(1.5d + d)] > [1.5xz + 1.5dm]

Where x is equal to the damage caused by a non eclipsed moonfire or sunfire, d is equal to the damage caused by a non-eclipsed moonfire or sunfire dot, m is equal to the number of targets affected by both dots, and z is equal to the number of times the moonfire/sunfire instant attack combo hits a mob. In the case of using only the eclipsed spell, z is equal to the number of times the immediate damage spell is cast.

Even without known values for d or x, we can assume the above inequality is always correct because immediate moon/sunfire damage is always less than the damage done over time by their respective DoT effects, even with three stacks of Lunar Shower up. Increasing z does increase the instant damage, but not enough to warrant removing the non-eclipsed spell from the rotation, since the DoT damage is so high (just watch recount and see it happen).

It makes sense that as m increases, the value of adding the non eclipsed DoT into the rotation also increases. Even for a single target it is still worth applying the non-eclipsed DoT before continuing to spam the eclipsed one (this is assuming that we even want to do this on a single target, and not just cast wrath of starfire instead).
P.S. Keeping up both DoTs doubles your chance for a Shooting Stars proc, since both are tracked independently and have an equal crit chance.
This does not take into account any additional damage-over-time damage caused by maintaining an additional non-eclipsed DoT.

It doesn't need to.

Here's why:

(X + X)(1.5) = 3X
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

We don't need to find out the raw value. No matter how many different ways we write this out, it's still 3X > 2.5X

When you actually want to start factoring SS procs, let me know and I'll show you how to work simcraft's basics. Good luck mathing out RNG and effective proc rates and NG uptims and their effect on DPS otherwise. :)
10/17/2013 03:19 PMPosted by Cyous
This does not take into account any additional damage-over-time damage caused by maintaining an additional non-eclipsed DoT.

It doesn't need to.

Here's why:

(X + X)(1.5) = 3X
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

We don't need to find out the raw value. No matter how many different ways we write this out, it's still 3X > 2.5X


You are still not including DoT damage, which is going to happen unless the mobs you are hitting are getting one shot.
You are still not including DoT damage, which is going to happen unless the mobs you are hitting are getting one shot.

Correct, but it's still 3X > 2.5X

X = direct damage, dot damage, crit damage, etc.

Given everything is equal on each side, it's still a 50% damage boost from mastery, which...in this case.. maths out to a 20% gain over MF/SnF/MF/SnF.

Math isn't hard. Stop trying to justify false logic.
x must always equal x, and if x equals the instant damage, it cannot equal the DoT damage, because the DoT damage is much higher than the instant damage.

http://www.wowhead.com/search?q=moonfire

http://www.wowhead.com/spells=-12.11.102?filter=na=sun
x must always equal x, and if x equals the instant damage, it cannot equal the DoT damage, because the DoT damage is much higher than the instant damage.

http://www.wowhead.com/search?q=moonfire

http://www.wowhead.com/spells=-12.11.102?filter=na=sun


No, it doesn't equal just the direct damage or damage over time.

It's all of it.

Common sense is logical.
Math is logical.
This math is common sense.

If you're stressing over 5k damage from Lunar Shower, when DOTs do ~250k on their own right... a 0.02% damage difference isnt important.
So, to clarify, you are asserting that using only the eclipsed DoT is a damage increase over using both (with SS procs factored out)?


Correction: meant to say "eclipsed spell" not "eclipsed DoT."
So, to clarify, you are asserting that using only the eclipsed DoT is a damage increase over using both (with SS procs factored out)?

No. This is a multi-dotting thread. MF/SnF/ <<TAB>> MF/SnF is a huge DPS loss.

You don't worry about SS procs. They just happen. Odds are, while you're multi-dotting, you'll waste procs as you apply DOTs.
Address this problem with your logic please:

Earlier you mentioned that (X * 1.5) + (X * 1.5) = 3X
and
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

Which is true, but the first equation represents moonfire being cast twice on TWO separate mobs. However the second equation indicates moonfire being cast once and sunfire being cast once on a SINGLE mob.

Therefore [(2.5x)*2=5x] >3x
Address this problem with your logic please:

Earlier you mentioned that (X * 1.5) + (X * 1.5) = 3X
and
(X * 1.5) + (X) = 2.5X

Which is true,


That makes sense. lol

10/17/2013 03:48 PMPosted by Arhenius
but the first equation represents moonfire being cast twice on TWO separate mobs.

This is a multi-dotting thread.

However the second equation indicates moonfire being cast once and sunfire being cast once on a SINGLE mob.

It's still two dots.

Therefore [(2.5x)*2=5x] >3x

That is 4 dots > 2 dots
where Y > X
and Y = buffed, buffed, base, base
and X = buffed, buffed

This is a moot point. thats 4 gcds, instead of 2.

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