To Fly or Not to Fly...that is the question 2

General Discussion
Prev 1 10 11 12 26 Next
http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1112/11123556/2495218-4311524226-beati.gif
Not even beta wait for beta before you make suggestions you have no idea what the game will be like without flying so you can't voice a valid argument because you lack evidence. This isn't an attack on flying btw honestly both sides need to present evidence which they cant yet until they experience it.
05/09/2014 06:31 AMPosted by Aehl
The decision is already made.


No it is not.


It's as made as its going to be for now; No flying unless it severely doesn't work out. At the very least, until 6.1. Would not be surprised if it's until the final patch of WoD or the pre patch for the expansion after.

I'd be much, much more surprised if they go back on this. And I guess, frankly, a teesny bit disapointed.
Remember "New Coke?" Feedback for that fiasco came way too late. It's good players are giving their feedback -- on the concept -- now. We'll see if Blizzard takes this conceptual feedback into account or whether they proceed with a risky move in spite of it. Either way, I feel as if I'm doing my job as a consumer to provide fair warning of my likely opinion of the finished product.
05/09/2014 06:44 AMPosted by Sufia
Remember "New Coke?" Feedback for that fiasco came way too late. It's good players are giving their feedback -- on the concept -- now. We'll see if Blizzard takes this conceptual feedback into account or whether they proceed with a risky move in spite of it. Either way, I feel as if I'm doing my job as a consumer to provide fair warning of my likely opinion of the finished product.


Theyre not taking conceptual feedback nearly as seriously as hands on feedback.
05/09/2014 06:32 AMPosted by Uorokku
http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1112/11123556/2495218-4311524226-beati.gif
Not even beta wait for beta before you make suggestions you have no idea what the game will be like without flying so you can't voice a valid argument because you lack evidence. This isn't an attack on flying btw honestly both sides need to present evidence which they cant yet until they experience it.


We don't need to wait, no fly zones are not a new feature.


It's as made as its going to be for now; No flying unless it severely doesn't work out. At the very least, until 6.1. Would not be surprised if it's until the final patch of WoD or the pre patch for the expansion after.


From what we've heard some of the lead devs want no flying ever again and are using "wait and see" to avoid having to take a stand, that's what the issue is.
05/09/2014 06:46 AMPosted by Killgraft
Theyre not taking conceptual feedback nearly as seriously as hands on feedback.

It's their prerogative, their money on the line.
You know, just a thought.

If they really want us to believe that WOD is a dangerous place, how about making it so that there are consequences to dieing?

In UO, when you died, you would have to run around and FIND a spirit healer. Not just be teleported to one. Then, after you raised, you were naked! You had to go to your body and spend some time removing your gear. The whole time your gear was losing durability and you were still under the threat of getting ganked by the same mob that did you in the first time. Many many times you died multiple times. That would be real danger.

But we all know what an uproar that would be.

And on PVP, since it is one of the apparent reasons of flight removal. How about we actually lose 9% durability every time we die in PVP. I mean, we lose 9% when a mob crushes us, why is PVP death so soft? Because the 1% or less we do lose makes the PVP death irrelevant. People might get better and care a little more if it came out of their pocket book so to speak.

Or even better. In UO, PVP death meant that the winning player got to loot your body! Oh sure, we do now for a pittance of the real loot on a body. (AB loot per body is below 1 silver). Want to make PVP and wPVP matter? Make it worth the time.

How many of the PVPer are for this? Will definitely make better PVP players if there is a larger cost. "I think I will solo the farm! Forget getting the Lumber mill!" How many times have we seen this on both sides?
05/09/2014 06:51 AMPosted by Nepheena
In UO, when you died, you would have to run around and FIND a spirit healer. Not just be teleported to one. Then, after you raised, you were naked! You had to go to your body and spend some time removing your gear. The whole time your gear was losing durability and you were still under the threat of getting ganked by the same mob that did you in the first time. Many many times you died multiple times. That would be real danger.


When they came out with the ability to insure items, my thieving days were over sadly... For the amount of gear that you could lose and take.. That game was pretty fun.. Also really is the best example imo of how professions played a big role in a game because of how quick you could lose everything.

PKing as well.. damn statloss! ha!
05/09/2014 06:49 AMPosted by Ziryus


From what we've heard some of the lead devs want no flying ever again and are using "wait and see" to avoid having to take a stand, that's what the issue is.


What you've "heard" is going against what they've actually said and putting some kind of conspiracy angle on it.

The devs DONT want flying anymore in current content, and I dont blame em, but thats whats happening: No flying in draenor unless this change really doesnt work out.

05/09/2014 06:51 AMPosted by Sufia
05/09/2014 06:46 AMPosted by Killgraft
Theyre not taking conceptual feedback nearly as seriously as hands on feedback.

It's their prerogative, their money on the line.


This obviously a calculated ordeal and they've probably gone through every point of conversation that people here have. They think it's worth this risk to make a tough choice. If it doesnt work, theyll put flying in. Until then, they dont seem to care what people who havent played it think, and I dont blame em. This is all nothing but knee jerk reactions. Beta and live will be the time for actual feedback.

Until then, nothing on this is changing.
<span class="truncated">...</span>

all crz did was populate zones to their intended population. Nothing about it changed how players could play other than add people to play with. you know, like an mmo should have.

oh but wait, it was viewed as an inconvenience to some individual players, who didn't/dont care about the overall health of the game.

that viewpoint sounds familiar.


Seems I STILL have to educate people about what CRZ really did. This is becoming exhausting. CRZ is garbage. Yes it gave you the ability to see people in a zone and group with them for quests...oh wait group quests were converted to solo quests... well there went that reason for it. So what benefit is there for merging several realms per zone? Dualing in Goldshire and outside Orgrimmar is serious business? How about that trolling in each zone when there actually is someone else in the zone with you. Maybe you noticed you still can not report them.

When did you actually see someone in the same zone as you from another server that was not in Elwynn or Durotar? I haven't seen anyone out in the world since before CRZ. People would rather boost and or dungeon to 90 rather than deal with all the garbage listed below. Maybe that was the plan to make the boost popular?

What did CRZ bring to the table?
1) Can not trade gold to someone cross realm.
2) You can not fly your friend around on your multi-person flying mount because they'll fall to their death.
3) You still have the rubber band lag when crossing boarders.
4) Still have disconnection issues.
5) Multiple severs sharing the resources on a single server.
6) Multiple servers competing for a single servers rare spawns.
7) Off server 90's killing quest giving NPC's/Town NPC's.
9) Off server 90's camping low level players.

Yep sounds like an awesome time.

Back on topic. I'll bet at the end of WoD that 90 boost becomes a 100 boost, and after Blizzard figures out no flying is not popular, the ability to fly your flying mounts will be in the next expansion. No one will want to deal with not being able to fly so we'll skip right over WoD and get back to being able to fly.


That makes me think moreso the execution of CRZ is very flawed, but I've always liked the idea of it and what it can bring to the table. All of these things could be fixed, and I hope they will, but dont know(except for the gold thing, which is more of a deliberate choice).

And yea, reactions from this(flying) will probably effect the next expansion. If it goes that badly, itll probably be added fairly early into WoD's lifetime.
05/09/2014 07:00 AMPosted by Killgraft
What you've "heard" is going against what they've actually said and putting some kind of conspiracy angle on it.

The devs DONT want flying anymore in current content, and I dont blame em, but thats whats happening: No flying in draenor unless this change really doesnt work out.


Go read the last interview with a lead dev. I'm not trying to bad mouth Bashiok he's stating blizzard's official stance which is "wait and see" and he did it very well. The last we heard from an actual dev they just don't want flying as a thing anymore for reasons that don't really make sense.
05/09/2014 06:49 AMPosted by Ziryus
05/09/2014 06:32 AMPosted by Uorokku
http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1112/11123556/2495218-4311524226-beati.gif
Not even beta wait for beta before you make suggestions you have no idea what the game will be like without flying so you can't voice a valid argument because you lack evidence. This isn't an attack on flying btw honestly both sides need to present evidence which they cant yet until they experience it.


We don't need to wait, no fly zones are not a new feature.


It's as made as its going to be for now; No flying unless it severely doesn't work out. At the very least, until 6.1. Would not be surprised if it's until the final patch of WoD or the pre patch for the expansion after.


From what we've heard some of the lead devs want no flying ever again and are using "wait and see" to avoid having to take a stand, that's what the issue is.

But thats irrelevant it isnt a continent with cities.
05/09/2014 06:58 AMPosted by Menrva
When they came out with the ability to insure items, my thieving days were over sadly... For the amount of gear that you could lose and take.. That game was pretty fun.. Also really is the best example imo of how professions played a big role in a game because of how quick you could lose everything.


Yes professions really did matter. When you made something, the stats were random within a range. Yea we kind of played around with that here and I will be honest, I personally have enjoyed that. You had to make quite a few of a single item before you got one that truly stood out. But there, at least you could destroy the subpar item and receive a percentage of the mats back.
05/09/2014 07:05 AMPosted by Ziryus
05/09/2014 07:00 AMPosted by Killgraft
What you've "heard" is going against what they've actually said and putting some kind of conspiracy angle on it.

The devs DONT want flying anymore in current content, and I dont blame em, but thats whats happening: No flying in draenor unless this change really doesnt work out.


Go read the last interview with a lead dev. I'm not trying to bad mouth Bashiok he's stating blizzard's official stance which is "wait and see" and he did it very well. The last we heard from an actual dev they just don't want flying as a thing anymore for reasons that don't really make sense.


Reasons that dont make sense to you or you dont agree with. Just wanna clear that up.

But yea, devs really dont want flying. Doesnt mean it probably wont change if people en large dont like it come live. And yea, there's a much bigger chance this is stay than going.
To summarize, it seems some developers believe no flight at all will:

(a) enable them to implement some awesome new questing system.
(b) keep players on the ground in the same zones, socializing grouping and world-pvping.
(c) enable them to update or add new quests which keep players out in the world.

However I think things won't turn out as well as they hope.

(a) Their questing system won't be that awesome (something like Timeless Isle probably) and players will soon get bored with it.
(b) Many players will wind up spending a lot of time in cities or in their garrisons. The reminder will be spread amongst the whole of Draenor.
(c) Whatever new quests or events they come up with will soon become repetitive and lose their lustre.

The system will have some success, but not enough to justify the removal of flight.
05/09/2014 07:08 AMPosted by Killgraft
05/09/2014 07:05 AMPosted by Ziryus
...

Go read the last interview with a lead dev. I'm not trying to bad mouth Bashiok he's stating blizzard's official stance which is "wait and see" and he did it very well. The last we heard from an actual dev they just don't want flying as a thing anymore for reasons that don't really make sense.


Reasons that dont make sense to you or you dont agree with. Just wanna clear that up.

But yea, devs really dont want flying. Doesnt mean it probably wont change if people en large dont like it come live. And yea, there's a much bigger chance this is stay than going.


You just agreed with me, blizzard wants flying gone. The reasons being wpvp which is meaningless to people on pve realms and that it somehow decreases immersion yet people were avoiding said immersion since the game launched look at roads they allow you to avoid pretty much as much combat as flying does, flying did not suddenly change that 8 years ago.

Which is why it doesn't make much sense, the affect on my game will be that I can't fly for no real reason in game other than an arbitrary dev decision and as has been pointed out is just odd in a world where flying mounts are obviously a thing.
05/09/2014 06:32 AMPosted by Uorokku
you have no idea what the game will be like without flying


Even though some of us played Vanilla in which there was no flying?
05/09/2014 07:25 AMPosted by Ziryus
...

Reasons that dont make sense to you or you dont agree with. Just wanna clear that up.

But yea, devs really dont want flying. Doesnt mean it probably wont change if people en large dont like it come live. And yea, there's a much bigger chance this is stay than going.


You just agreed with me, blizzard wants flying gone. The reasons being wpvp which is meaningless to people on pve realms and that it somehow decreases immersion yet people were avoiding said immersion since the game launched look at roads they allow you to avoid pretty much as much combat as flying does, flying did not suddenly change that 8 years ago.

Which is why it doesn't make much sense, the affect on my game will be that I can't fly for no real reason in game other than an arbitrary dev decision and as has been pointed out is just odd in a world where flying mounts are obviously a thing.


I know, I wasn't disagreeing with you on that part. The dev decision isnt arbitrary just because you think it is, and no dev ever said this was just a PvP decision or that had anything to do with the choice. I dont even like wPvP(asides from killing people that are ganking my beautiful hordies).

Immersion is subjective, and video games are subjective. They make a choice because THEY feel it is a good choice. Thats how games work. If they want to make this change, I support em. If it is embraced in the long run and the expansion goes well, more power to em.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum