How are people disappointed with Garrisons?

General Discussion
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01/10/2015 05:50 PMPosted by Snowfox
I'm not disappointed with the Garrison itself.

I'm just sort of.. surprised? .. there haven't been more reasons to leave it.


People have some issue about not having a reason to leave. Why would I want to leave?
Hello, commander!
Well Good Morning to you as well Fiona, did you fail another mission today?
01/10/2015 06:40 PMPosted by Heatherdruid
The only reason I am ungrateful about Garrisons is Professions are gated around them.....


This would have to be the one thing I have to complain about. While I understand wanted people to be more free with professions (which based on the purpose of many they really aren't) they lost their identity. Having buildings that can product mats and schematics? Sure. Achievements or vendors? Sure. Hell possibly even cause NPC engineers, alchemists or whatever to pop up in your garrison, that would be awesome. But the way it is now seems like they kneecapped it. I like that I have a mine and garden, so that I can pick up two professions ( I consider the gathering ones more support). But at the cost of what we have now? Not a fan. I liked the old style of crafting (classic and bc) where you had to get odd parts from around the globe and other professions. People who aren't raiding or pvp want more things to do? Let them farm. Not the rep for nothing kind of farming, but farm for mats they or other people might need. And while you're at it buff comet storm.
I do miss ga the ring my herbs around the world. It felt like a drag before, but when I compare it to my run through my garrison, it's just not the same. I just buy my stacks of 200 /2 for 100 now, sincell every single player has the possibility of farming it.
01/10/2015 06:48 PMPosted by Adelphie
Yes, it is. There is significantly less content than the last two expansions. There's almost no content if you remove garrisons.


I spend virtually no time in my Garrison, and yet i haven't noticed a reduction in the amount of time i play at all. I'm not seeing the lack of content. My wife isn't seeing the lack of content. No one else in our guild is seeing the lack of content. It's clearly not a fact that there's no content. It's subjective. If you don't like the available content, it appears that there is no content.

01/10/2015 06:48 PMPosted by Adelphie
Quests are content. Grinding random mobs is not content.


Killing mobs isn't content. Killing mobs and then getting 20g from an NPC is content.

Got it.

01/10/2015 06:50 PMPosted by Aharon
Calm down with the LFR hero titles there bub. You've cleared normal, aka flex, once, and LFR how many times?


I'm absolutely an LFR hero. I'm not the one complaining about how i need to optimize my game-play to get gear as swiftly as possible from every available avenue even if i'm not having fun doing it so i can clear LFR Highmaul.

01/10/2015 06:50 PMPosted by Aharon
Garrisons are a very new feature that is a total departure from previous game play styles. If we don't like it we need to let the developers know and let them know specifically what we don't like so they can consider that for future content creation.


That's 100% true. Constructive feedback is awesome. It's not helpful for the devs if that constructive feedback is hidden under a mountain of inaccurate, hyperbolic garbage.

WoW isn't suddenly a crappy mobile App because Follower missions aren't the pinnacle of interactive gaming experiences. Professions are not gated behind dailies or behind work orders. Nothing in the Garrison is mandatory. Garrisons did not use up 5 raid dungeons worth of art resources.

It's actually ok to shoot down posts that aren't helpful to the discussion.
01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
I spend virtually no time in my Garrison, and yet i haven't noticed a reduction in the amount of time i play at all. I'm not seeing the lack of content. My wife isn't seeing the lack of content. No one else in our guild is seeing the lack of content. It's clearly not a fact that there's no content. It's subjective. If you don't like the available content, it appears that there is no content.


I assume you're doing mostly instance content, because there's nothing out in Draenor.

01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
Killing mobs isn't content. Killing mobs and then getting 20g from an NPC is content.

Got it.


It's almost like quests have story and doing them progresses the story. While mob grinding is just boring and progresses nothing.
I'm just disappointed there aren't racial specific garrisons and they aren't more alt friendly. I don't mean to make everything account bound but things like followers and resources should be.
01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
WoW isn't suddenly a crappy mobile App because Follower missions aren't the pinnacle of interactive gaming experiences.


If you're an LFR hero, as you've admitted, and as I am then garrisons comprise the bulk of the remaining end game content. Maybe it's not as noticeable for you since you PvP as well. But I do LFR on Tuesday, kill the world boss on Tuesday, and then there's no current content to mention for the remainder of the week. I do my apexis daily and then everything else is garrison. So yeah, from where I sit, the majority my current content playtime every week is tied to the crappy mobile app clone.

01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
Professions are not gated behind dailies or behind work orders.


Anything worthwhile to do with them is. Though honestly that's really not that different from previous expansions. The only difference is that I can't by, for example, truesteel bars from anyone else to speed up my crafting process or even get them from alts. This is as time gated as professions have ever been. They've slightly regressed in the quality of professions when they could have taken a new expansion as an opportunity to make them better.

01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
Nothing in the Garrison is mandatory.


And again, nothing else in the game is either. But if you want to play then garrisons are what you've got.

01/10/2015 07:10 PMPosted by Kazala
Garrisons did not use up 5 raid dungeons worth of art resources.


Now who's being hyperbolic? No, garrisons didn't use up five raid tiers worth of resources, but they certainly used up one or two at the least, or numerous dungeons, or daily hubs, or a better crafting system, or combination of things that would have been better.
01/10/2015 05:44 PMPosted by Lightning
[li]Fully customizable garrisons allow for you to stand out from the rest.


Are we playing the same game?
01/10/2015 07:27 PMPosted by Aharon
If you're an LFR hero, as you've admitted, and as I am then garrisons comprise the bulk of the remaining end game content. Maybe it's not as noticeable for you since you PvP as well. But I do LFR on Tuesday, kill the world boss on Tuesday, and then there's no current content to mention for the remainder of the week. I do my apexis daily and then everything else is garrison. So yeah, from where I sit, the majority my current content playtime every week is tied to the crappy mobile app clone.


Right, whereas i'm really glad Follower missions aren't more involved, because if they were, they'd be eating up more of the time i want to spend doing other stuff. Right now they're in a state where i can quickly drag and drop missions on a couple of alts, open my crates, and jet. I can understand wanting the system to have more depth if it's something you're actually interested in, but it sounds like you're totally not interested and are just stuck trying to turn Follower missions into serious content when they're not intended to be.

01/10/2015 07:27 PMPosted by Aharon
Anything worthwhile to do with them is. Though honestly that's really not that different from previous expansions. The only difference is that I can't by, for example, truesteel bars from anyone else to speed up my crafting process or even get them from alts. This is as time gated as professions have ever been. They've slightly regressed in the quality of professions when they could have taken a new expansion as an opportunity to make them better.


This just happens to be one of my biggest pet peeves in the realm of WoD complaints. The only thing that's gated about WoD professions is the acquisition of recipes, and that's never what anyone is talking about when they say the professions are gated. You can farm Primal Spirits without limit to increase the rate of BoP mat generation. If you can grind a resource without limit, that's the opposite of gated. Like most things in WoD, though, when it's suggested that farming Primals is one of the many things a player can leave his Garrison for, the response is always, "i don't want to do that".

01/10/2015 07:27 PMPosted by Aharon
And again, nothing else in the game is either. But if you want to play then garrisons are what you've got.


Again, this is not a fact. I spend virtually no time in my Garrison. You are limited to your Garrison because you're not interested in the majority of the game's content. That's not the same thing as the content not being there, and it's an issue with the rest of the game, not with Garrisons.

It's also totally RELEVANT that you and a ton of other folks don't have content available to you that you find engaging. That's a worthwhile thing to talk about. However, "there's no content, there's nothing to do, Garrisons are the only content, i hate Garrisons" isn't really helpful. It's also relevant that there are players out there, like myself, who enjoy a lot of the systems changes that came with WoD, and who are also finding plenty of things to do.

01/10/2015 07:27 PMPosted by Aharon
Now who's being hyperbolic? No, garrisons didn't use up five raid tiers worth of resources, but they certainly used up one or two at the least, or numerous dungeons, or daily hubs, or a better crafting system, or combination of things that would have been better.


There was a post earlier in the thread that i replied to, where a guy was complaining that he would've preferred the 5 raids and 10 BGs that they could've given us with the resources they spent on Garrisons. That's what i was referencing.

It's worth noting that 5-man dungeons are one of the worst places to spend development resources in a post-Valor WoW, and Valor was just a cheap trick to keep Heroics relevant. They get out-geared very swiftly and they don't scale. Either you have the MoP situation, where the same dungeons get run into the ground for the entire expansion, or you have an even worse situation ala WotLK and Cata where a handful of higher ilvl Heroics are introduced, and you grind 2-3 dungeons into dust instead of 8-12.

Honestly, some sort of complete system overhaul that would make 5-mans an engaging, scaling progression path is very close to the top of my WoW wishlist, but the horrible MoP Scenarios and the removal of any scaling incremental progression ala rep or Valor tied to 5-mans in WoD suggests they're moving in the opposite direction.
Direct response to OP's thread question:

People will never be satisfied. "Garrisons are bad", yet the majority of people never leave. Blizzard isn't holding our hands this expansion so far. Unlike in MoP where you're pointed to daily zones you actually have to find things to do.

People are just so used to being hand-held through 'what to do' that they don't know what to do and act like chickens with their heads chopped off in their garrisons.

Edit: I do have friends that are actively out in the WoD zones doing whatever they want and their garrisons are level 2 because they don't feel like upgrading them to 3 yet, despite having the resources to do so.
01/10/2015 08:10 PMPosted by Kaiyuni
Direct response to OP's thread question:

People will never be satisfied. "Garrisons are bad", yet the majority of people never leave. Blizzard isn't holding our hands this expansion so far. Unlike in MoP where you're pointed to daily zones you actually have to find things to do.

People are just so used to being hand-held through 'what to do' that they don't know what to do and act like chickens with their heads chopped off in their garrisons.


No, we've just been left in a tiny lab-mouse maze, with the illusion of choice, to scurry around for cheese to our hearts content.
01/10/2015 05:44 PMPosted by Lightning
Fully customizable garrisons


I love garrisons, especially the follower aspect, but I wouldn't go that far. Certain aspects are mandatory such as the mines and that battle pet area.(You cant get rid of them or replace them) Also, many buildings feel mandatory, such as the Barn to get savage bloods or a War Mill for Seals. And im also stuck with the stereotypical "orc building style" that I would replace with undead buildings in an instant.

01/10/2015 05:57 PMPosted by Igoricus
I'm your boss dammit, I don't need to pay you!


Actually...I Believe that you do have to pay him. Kind of how jobs work, right? :P
01/10/2015 08:10 PMPosted by Kaiyuni
Direct response to OP's thread question:

People will never be satisfied. "Garrisons are bad", yet the majority of people never leave. Blizzard isn't holding our hands this expansion so far. Unlike in MoP where you're pointed to daily zones you actually have to find things to do.

People are just so used to being hand-held through 'what to do' that they don't know what to do and act like chickens with their heads chopped off in their garrisons.


In other words: There is no content so you have to make up your own things to do.
I think an RTS mini-game in the style of WC1-3 would have been great. The thing is, garrisons aren't a warcraft RTS, they're one of those crappy facebook games.
1) Not fan of RTS games so I never played the WC games.
2) Blizz said they would not be mandatory. I guess that is true in the same sense that leveling to level 2 is not mandatory.
01/10/2015 05:44 PMPosted by Lightning
I've been a Warcraft fan since WCII, and I feel that garrisons were one of the biggest steps to bringing back the original Warcraft feel.

  • You are a commander of a small base of operations, from which you send soldiers to carry out missions for you.
  • Fully customizable garrisons allow for you to stand out from the rest. If you want to focus on resources like lumber, or supply Azeroth with gems, it is entirely up to you!
  • Invasions! Invasions are amazing in bringing back the original Warcraft aspect. Just as you would get invaded during WC1-3, you must protect your buildings (and followers) from the enemy forces.
  • All I see with this addition to the game is an homage to the great games that started this trilogy.

    Thank you Blizzard for staying faithful to the origins of WoW.

    Is this a joke? Original Warcraft feel? Origins of WoW?

    WoW is_not_an RTS. It's an MMO. They are very different. You have workers to harvest resources in an RTS, not the player character. NOT THE COMMANDER. And sending unreliable soldiers on missions with lucrative rewards is just stupid when you could go do it yourself with better results.

    "Fully customizable?" HA! Everything looks the same. There's no racial architecture. No representation. The Alliance and the Horde each have SEVEN races under their standards. They are all represented solely by the Humans and the Orcs. The most you can do to customize your base is choose a handful of buildings to construct that don't differ from any other players' at all, and the eventual possibility of racial guards, available ONLY by maxxing out one of those buildings. Even if the placement of the individual structures may differ, the actual layout of the Garrisons are identical. The locations of the Garrisons are identical. The chores and upkeep of each Garrison are identical. This does not in any way sound like a customizable feature. I can't even choose to paint the rooftops.

    Invasions? They may evoke a base falling under attack in an RTS but the gameplay is drastically different. I don't feel the same doing a Garrison Invasion at all. For one thing, I have absolutely no control over any of my soldiers. They all attack randomly and I can't tell them all to zerg rush the summoners or necrolytes. I'm not able to train reinforcements. I can't construct static defenses. My buildings are never in any actual danger. It doesn't in any way resemble the Warcraft RTS's gameplay apart from the simple fact that a base is under attack.

    While I appreciate nods to the lore and RTS, if it conflicts with the gameplay of the MMO, it has to go. This is coming from a huge lore junkie. I love lore. I love story in video games. But Blizzard has made it abundantly clear that they're not concerned with being consistent with their lore. Brown orcs being one of the biggest pieces of evidence.
    With that said, Garrisons may well be able to give us a great MMO gameplay experience. Do they? Mmmm...I'm not so sure. I think they have a long way to go before I would endorse as much emphasis WoD places on them.

    If you like Garrisons, that's great, but it isn't because of any resemblance to the Warcraft RTS.
    i feel i be punished for ignoring all that my garrison has to offer..

    garrisons=solo player

    solo player in an mmorpg???? thats WRONG!
    01/10/2015 06:23 PMPosted by Kazala
    Garrisons are optional. Completely optional


    I quite like some aspects of garrisons and dislike others, but they are definitely not optional.

    Every player levelling through questing must build a garrison. They might not do anything with it, but they cannot be avoided.

    Any player looking to make items is hobbled without a garrison producing mats. Again, you can just not do it, but you're at a real disadvantage.

    Raiders can get a free re-roll token from the garrison. Not using their garrison means that they will spend either 500G, 300 resources (which won't be possible once they've completed the treasures) or 1000 honour, and these amounts go up very quickly for the 2nd and 3rd token. Again, not using a garrison means your costs are higher.

    Every type of player benefits from garrisons, so their impressions of them are important. For some people, it really does feel a lot like a phone app. For others it's a nod to the original Warcraft games, and for others it's fun in itself.

    Building a garrison is mandatory. After that, anyone not using it is intentionally limiting themselves.

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