DW Frost is pointless.

Death Knight
It's two straight patches now that DW has been flat out uncompetitive. It's no better with the NP buff. The gap with Necroblight is massive, and the gap with 2h is as bad as it was pre-patch.

Suggestions:

-- Remove DW from the game, like you did with shaman 2h play. If it's uncompetitive and you can't balance it, don't put it in as a trap to players. Just like you got rid of the old talents that nobody took, get rid of DW if you can't make it competitive.

OR

-- Make some obvious tweaks that would benefit DW frost. You could either tweak Might of the Frozen Wastes to affect Howling Blast for DW, or increase its buff to Frost Strike, or make changes to Rune of Razorice -- allow it to stack to 6, for instance, or buff the stacks it does have. Changes to Razorice would have the benefit of being isolated to DW.

Point is that as it stands, DW is one of those "traps" that we heard so much about in the Cataclysm talent redo. Either take it out, or make it work.
I think the problem is trying to balance two subspecs within one spec while trying to keep their playstyles different. If they just reduced weapons in Frost to simple preference, there might be a lot more room for improvement. As it stands, DW and 2H are each only half of a fully working spec.
How to fix DW frost:

>Crank up Mastery scaling. Mastery is strongest stat for DW (by far), so make it go farther.
>Make Frost Strike's and Howling Blast's frost damage scale more alongside a mastery buff. Make Obliterate worth the runes spent rather than just a dump to get rid of those gross unholy runes and to try and get procs.
>Avoid over-tuning.

There you go OP. That's what they have to do.
02/24/2015 05:01 PMPosted by Wwel
-- Remove DW from the game, like you did with shaman 2h play.
no
if they are going to remove one of the two theyd better remove the abomination that has been 2h frost since might of the frozen wastes became a thing. axe the spec that historically has always scaled like crap because nothing in the spec supports itself.

dw is the more iconic subspec and frost was originally the dual wield oriented tree in wrath. then dual wield frost could effectively be tuned without pvp being completely screwed over by the LOLoblit damage 2h can put out and maybe dw can be made effective in pvp in the process of pve tuning that actually can help the spec as a whole.
02/24/2015 07:23 PMPosted by Kaiyuni
Make Obliterate worth the runes spent rather than just a dump to get rid of those gross unholy runes and to try and get procs.
Maybe give Oblit crits double the chance to proc Rime.

I'm also liking that chaos bolt treatment with a frost dot on the end of it.
Please bring back DW to relevance Blizzard T_T

I just dont like playing UH
02/24/2015 08:58 PMPosted by Rueban
Please bring back DW to relevance Blizzard T_T

I just dont like playing UH


This is my thing, too. We're close to Vanilla levels in terms of a spec being flat-out useless in raiding. Dual-wield is that bad. I don't want to choose between tanking, unholy, and being useless.
02/24/2015 08:58 PMPosted by Rueban
Please bring back DW to relevance Blizzard T_T

I just dont like playing UH


I agree. I'm happy with what I could put out with Unholy, but it's just not my flavor. DW Frost. Now that is a flavor I love.
02/25/2015 01:35 PMPosted by Wwel
We're close to Vanilla levels in terms of a spec being flat-out useless in raiding.


Not even close.
How to fix Frost: Remove 2h when frost specced and can now balance without pvp whines..
To be fair, DW Frost has better cleave than 2H, so not totally useless I suppose.
I do want DW to be viable as frost but I hope to god they don't take out 2H. I like being able to switch specs without having to have twice as many weapons and if I want to go the extra mile to get cool transmorgs having to get twice as many of those as well.

I think being able to wield a giant 2H weapon even while tanking is nice and flavorful for the class compared to having to swtich to sword and shield like on the Pally.
Meh, like I’ve said earlier – I won’t abandon DW, I still do decent enough damage and dps with my team. Bring the player then the class, half the people that are whinging don’t even raid competitively so there really is no basis to their argument.

IF you do raid seriously then perhaps Unholy is for you, other than that, if you love DW – then stay DW.
They(blizzard) should just give us Frost Titan's Grip and be done with it. Problem solved.
Probably could use better off-hand damage on Frost Strike and Obliterate or at least split Obliterate's damage Frost/Physical so mastery is of use although it might nerf PvP Frost. Something has to give though or the spec will have to be tweaked every raid encounter.
I wish they would just buff the mastery by a flat %... duel wield DK makes so much sense and looks so badass, nothing more fun about ranged melee class. I would play it as well as many others if it wasnt so darn weak.
If DW Frost is removed I'm quitting DK, !@#$ it. I'm only 2H now in the hopes DW will be viable again later on, like it usually is near the mid/end of the expac, but if they were to outright remove it I'd just go play my shaman.

A possible fix would be splitting 2H and DW as two sub-specs similar to what they did with Feral.

Druids for the longest time had problems with balancing between tank and dps specs, then they just split the two and it made things so much easier for everyone involved.
http://us.battle.net/static-render/us/caelestrasz/249/127473401-profilemain.jpg?alt=/wow/static/images/2d/profilemain/class/6-1.jpg Amazing mog, Auron.
I agree I raid quite a bit as unholy for the simple fact it does significantly more damage. I would love for Dual wielding to become viable again because its so much more appealing! It sims 5k below my Uholy spec so the choice is obvious for me... although I keep the 1 handers in my bank in hopes that it will one day be worth a &$#%!

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