Dungeon queue should be performance-based

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01/09/2011 12:27 AMPosted by Zandelar
so you think a dps mindlessly focusing on doing tons of damage on a target is a good thing? At least thats what you are saying with the whole dps should be able to kill the target dummy in x amount of time.

An arcane mage could do that even if he macro'd arcane blast to every key bind on his keyboard, and sat on it. Does that make him worthy of grouping with you? What about when he pulls a mob off of you, or fails to cc that one add, does it make it ok since he was able to pass some mundane task of killing a dummy that doesnt move, attack, dodge, parry, agro, evade? lol, most people can do what you ask to a dummy anyway, and still cant dungeon or raid worth a crap.

I mean if you seriously have a problem with the over all quality of random people from the random dungeon finder, then theres only one logical answer. Dont use the random dungeon finder, put your own groups together, and take only people that you know and trust that are up to your standards.

Did you even read the post?
I would really like this. Paying a big bill to repair is a whole lot better then getting yelled at and verbly abused by others. This would do wonders for my moral. I'm trying really hard but Im not seeing where I'm missing it. With something like this I have something to help work on my skill more. I want to have proof thats says I can deliver what my class is supposed to deliver.

Im personally not afraid of failure but I hate how other people act when people make mistakes. I make them more when I feel terrible. Yes, I have even cried. It's just a freakn game but if this ends all that for me so I can actually enjoy it then I'm all for it.
Even if there is no actually keying - lets at least have the group practice instance!

It'd be cool if you were required to run through it just once as a tutorial, and it gave you a grade. Then, it'd be up to you to decide if you were ready or not.

I bet most people would try again until their grade was higher, or try a dungeon once, fail, and realize the grading was useful. It'd be better than force-cutting people out, but we'd still have a place to practice.

Mind you, this would just be for BASICS, like getting rotations down and discovering spells in your spellbook. If you jump into group mechanics with no foundation and unhelpful guildmates, it's very hard to learn.
01/09/2011 2:45 AMPosted by Vercinitrix
Performance metrics are a GOOD THING.

Really ????
So how does segregation based on performance differ to that based on race or religion? My god are you listening to yourselves. This is a game and you want to place yellow stars on every underperforming player.

Think long and hard before going down this road, were supposed to be evolving into a more tolerant and accepting society yet most of you want to segregate players based on skill.

THIS is another reason Wotlk was better than Cata we never had any of this crap going on, sure people complained it was to easy but to create an atmosphere of us and them?!?!

very sad

You are REALLY comparing keeping underperforming players from being a burden on those of us who care enough to learn our class, read strats, and know how to play to @#@! Germany? You have a SERIOUS analogy problem.

This is more akin to that guy at work that everyone knows can't do his job and forces his co workers to pick up his slack not being chosen to work on a coveted special project.
01/05/2011 5:58 AMPosted by Margolotta
Dear OP:

None of your "quests" require DPS to avoid damage.
None of your "quests" require DPS to use threat dumps.
None of your "quests" require DPS to save the healer from stray mobs.
None of your "quests" require DPS to off-heal/off-tank.
None of your "quests" require DPS to pop survival abilities - Drain Life, healthstone, health pot, etc.

None of your "quests" require Tanks to mark targets.
None of your "quests" require Tanks to move targets.
None of your "quests" require Tanks to clean a room before pulling the boss.
None of your "quests" require Tanks to watch out for patrols.

Your Healer "quest" implies that NONE of the npcs will use any survival strategy whatsoever. Hence, you think a decent Healer is only one that has enough mana to keep stupid DPS and tanks, who don't move out of avoidable damage or use survival abilities, alive.

Sorry dude, your "quests" will not keep stupid people out of LFD. In fact, they'll have the same effect that raising the AIL bar to 359 would.

Stupid people with BoE purples would still get in, easily.

I'm pretty sure this thread is about the suggestion of these types of quests/NPCs, and not the details. If such a thing was to be talked about @ Blizz, I'm sure details like those you're hinting at would be in the discussion. Don't get on OP for having the basis of a pretty good idea just cause he didn't pre-think every detail.
Even if you forget about making it a requirement for heroics, I've always thought it would be a good idea to have "practice rooms" for the three roles.

You walk in and find yourself in a party with 3 NPC's. They start taking damage, especially the one acting as a tank.

You would progress to higher and higher levels. In the more advanced settings, various forms of fire or poisons would appear on the floor. You might get achievements for attaining certain levels.

I think that allowing people to practice like this, outside of the scrutiny and possible derision of strangers, you greatly improve the skill of the general population.

I personally like vagrants idea, a practice room with other npc's with different abilities and you're tank / healer / dps . A place to practice w/o people jumping down your throats would be nice and help in the long run :P Oh and I think it's kind of wrong to do the "you're sucky, no dungeons for you thing" while practice rooms would help you improve. Also the idea of grouping people with their own skill level or level of awesomeness is wrong b/c i know i wouldn't want to be grouped with a whole bunch of people as sucky as me b/c then that way you don't learn and you don't advance b/c they aren't gonna help you out. so it's nice that the noobs can group with the leets b/c they can help them and tell them what they are doing wrong
01/04/2011 8:22 PMPosted by Zarhym

You shouldn't have to say that you are always looking for ways to improve the system, but thank you for the response, hopefully this will somewhat quieten the masses :)

Well, I felt compelled to respond because I actually had a conversation with Ghostcrawler today where he brought up this very point on his own.

I don't mean to placate by responding. It's something we really want to do. :)

It will be interesting to see what you finally come up with. My only concern would be smashing a target dummy or healing a target dummy doesn't add in all the mechanics of a fight that have to be avoided, dispelled, interrupted, etc., etc, you get the point.

Also, how will this affect players that might not be everyday players, even though they are good, they might not be great, would they not be stuck with groups that might fail repeatedly? I guess I don't want to see the personal touch taken out. I have a warlock I don't play much, a guildmate who plays his warlock great, went on a run with me (he was on his hunter) to see what I was doing to help me out.. It worked great, much more than I got from just reading and hitting a target dummy.

I saw someone mention a dungeon with NPC's as the rest of the group, so that a person could go in and basically practice fights to put their spec's, rotations to the test in a more realistic situation. That I would like to see, to be able to compare your against an NPC set at that specific level.

Zarhym is gunna claim credit for this idea when its put in...
youre high
On the one hand, I can see how a system like this would be beneficial.

On the OTHER hand, running through 'tests' like this is why I have little to no patience with sim games like *shudder* Gran Turismo.
Yeah... why doesn't blizzard implement some sort of system for teaching players to use their class. Maybe something where you start with just one ability and then they add more and more until you're exposed to your cllasses full potential... oh wait. They do.l its called leveling. if going 1_85 doesnt teach you your class, nothing bllizzard can implement will. they arent going to lock players out of content, because when players stop progressing, they get bored and cancel subscriptions. the mosst important thing is and alwaysbwill be $$$
I think from 1-10 it should start with quest that instruct us to use each spell as they are given. This should be how its done between each 10th lvl. At the end of each 10th should be a dungeon senerio that requiers you combine what you have learned between each 10.

Now since you have passed the last test at say lvl 10 by the time you have to do the final test at level 20 you should already know when to use serpent sting even though its not listed as the main objective. The quest should requier you to use what you have learned between 10-20. If you failed to see where you should have used serpent sting or arcane then it might have you thinking what you missed. So when you go back and retake the test you know better.

Each 10th I think should be like that. As we level is should be expected that things would get more challenging. I don't care if the reward is exp or some prize but the real reward is it gose on your record and its proof that you take your class serious and you will put yourself through the test to prove it. The real reward would be actually getting to go on raids and actually haveing fun.

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