NElf/Troll Paladins

Story Forum
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An'she is the sun, and shares a popular sun and moon mythological origin story with elune/mu'sha in tauren mythos
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" As the children of the earth roamed the fields of dawn, they harkened to dark whispers from deep beneath the world. The whispers told the children of the arts of war and deceit. Many of the Shu'halo fell under the shadow's sway and embraced the ways of malice and wickedness. They turned upon their pure brethren and left their innocence to drift upon the plains.

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The Earthmother, her heart heavy with her children's plight, could not bear to watch them fall from grace. In her grief, she tore out her eyes and set them spinning accross the endless, starry skies. An'she and Mu'sha, seeking to ease the other's sorrow, could only chase each other's faint glow across the sky. The twins still chase one another with every turning of the world.

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Though sightless, the Earthmother could not long stray from the world of her heart. She kept her ear to the winds and listened to all that transpired across the fields of the dawn. Her great heart was always with her children - and her loving wisdom never fled from them."

I know perfectly well that for the tauren, An'she is the sun. Just like Elune is the moon for Night Elves, but when examining the myth, Velen commented on how similar it was to a naaru.
What humans call the Light could perfectly well be the power the tauren atribute to the sun.

It most likely is. What I'm try to say is that my question stems from that very contradiction. The holy light and the an'she may be the same entity in a literal sense, but the holy light could never act in the way that the Tauren describe in the myth. Which Perhaps it's just a myth and nothing more but it's hard to be sure in a fantasy setting, in which all these deities are actually real.

Anyway does that make sense? The Holy Light as we have seen it in lore dors not act like the An'she the Tauren describe in their stories.
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Your question has a false premise. The holy light powering paladins is not a deity, or even a intelligent force.

It is magic. plain and simple. The only difference between it and Arcane magic is that Holy magic is powered by faith. Weather you have faith in a real God or your front door, as long as you feel your cause is just you can wield it..


This is my least favourite part of Warcraft lore. It's Midichlorian levels of dumb. I don't want a Judeo-Christian "God" or anything necessarily, but at least a pantheon, or at least a certain virtue, have it work like the Force or Karma. But now it's just literally yellow-y arcane magic that requires a strong delusion. Boo. Probably my least ignored and downplayed part of lore, TBH.


I don't see it like that. While yes the Light is not a literal diety, but it acts in unexaianbe ways considering that it isn't. The sundering caused by Darian's sacrafice, tirion's breaking of Arthas's bonds, the simple existence of the Naaru make it fascinating to me. It is the most inconsistent and spontaneous magic their is in my opinion. Allowing it to stay unconscious allows it to be used for corrupt and evil purposes as well, which leads to various ethical questions about those who have faith in it, another thing that I think makes the story around it more interesting.
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I know perfectly well that for the tauren, An'she is the sun. Just like Elune is the moon for Night Elves, but when examining the myth, Velen commented on how similar it was to a naaru.
What humans call the Light could perfectly well be the power the tauren atribute to the sun.

It most likely is. What I'm try to say is that my question stems from that very contradiction. The holy light and the an'she may be the same entity in a literal sense, but the holy light could never act in the way that the Tauren describe in the myth. Which Perhaps it's just a myth and nothing more but it's hard to be sure in a fantasy setting, in which all these deities are actually real.

Anyway does that make sense? The Holy Light as we have seen it in lore dors not act like the An'she the Tauren describe in their stories.

Ah yes, I understand your question now - IF this is true and they are the same, how do we reconcile both myths?
All I can come up with is, we have seen how the Light works, but we haven't seen any manifestation of An'she (other than this very Light). Personally, I think tauren legends are just that, in this case - an interpretation of reality. What caused the Earth-Mother to despair could be the tauren losing their way - when they embraced war, they abandoned these deeply rooted traditions and beliefs that allows any paladin to wield the Light. When returning to a righteous path in which they firmly believe, they get to use it again.
08/17/2015 08:21 PMPosted by Vizelvius
Also, to that one person who said Pandaren and Druidism has no connection... well, mostly true I think. In-game, there were Horde Druid NPCs helping to heal Shen-zin Su's wound. So it's not like it's not plausible to have Pandaren druids based on lore. Druids were there. Druidism and finding balance in nature go hand in hand like Orcs and Warriors. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that Pandaren could have learnt to be Druids... much like how they learnt to be Shamans, or Priests.


I'd think it would take many years, as in possibly decades, to teach the Pandaren how to be Druids. It's been just over a year since Pandaria was rediscovered by the outside world, that's far too short of a time for them to pick up on how to be a druid.

It also brings up the question of why any Pandaren or race of Pandaria would be one? Remember the only centers for training druids is outside of Pandaria, under the Cenarion Circle's control. Even the troll druids train with/under the CC's tutelage. For them to accept being druids, they would have to accept being under the control of someone outside of Pandaria, who doesn't necessarily have Pandaria's interests in mind. I do not seeing any of the Celestials being the type to guide or give the druids their power. Their focus is too much on Pandaria and a form of balance that is not always compatible with the druidic sense of balance.
08/18/2015 07:18 PMPosted by Huën
This is what I have been saying repeatedly, it is the difference between a source of power like the light and a diety like elune.


Except Elune is not a power source, priestesses of elune get there power from the same source as everyone else, their faith in their region, and belief that their cause is just.

No matter what religion is "right" they all get their powers from the same place.
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You've failed to present a lore reason for why a Priestess of Elune couldn't wear heavy armor and fight in melee. Nor have you provided an explanation for why the differences you've mentioned would make the class play mechanically different from a human paladin.

Without providing at least one of those two reasons, you haven't made an argument against Night Elf paladins.

If what Vesiana just said is true, then it's not that the Priestess' of Elune CAN'T wear heavy armour, it's just that they DON'T. I suppose if you want to talk about mechanical differences that much, then idk what to tell you, cause everybody here knows that a Troll or Night Elf Paladin would play exactly the same as any other Paladin race, bar racial abilities having a small effect.

At that point it's just pedantry lol.

Someone mentioned Human Shamans. Is there a lore reason to have them in the game, or is it just wishful thinking by a few Shaman pvpers that want a leg up via EMFH?


Ahh, the claims of pedantry. The accusation of the logically incapable. Pedantry is focusing on minor, unimportant details. What I'm telling you is what it would take to make your point relevant to the discussion. Relevance isn't an unimportant or minor detail, relevance is what it takes to connect your disparate fact to the discussion at hand. Without indicating why Elune being different from the Light would make Night Elf paladins impossible, then all you've done is made an unrelated observation. I gave you a lead on two ways you could do that, you've dismissed one as untrue and the other as pedantry because you didn't understand the question. So I'll ask it more simply.

What mechanical difference in the worship of Elune makes Night Elf paladins impossible?
Nothing would, Dorcy . I'm aware the comment's not directed at me, but it's something I've been saying for years: there is really no reason not to have Nelf paladins, especially since we have Tauren paladins. Blizzard won't care about aesthetics; they only particularly care about mechanics, and to a lesser degree, racial balance.

Nelf and Draenei warlocks are far less likely to happen, but again, that's only a lore issue. Mechanically, both nelf warlocks (cultists) and draenei warlocks (Sargerie/Eredar) already exist in game.
08/19/2015 05:03 AMPosted by Phlynch
08/18/2015 07:18 PMPosted by Huën
This is what I have been saying repeatedly, it is the difference between a source of power like the light and a diety like elune.


Except Elune is not a power source, priestesses of elune get there power from the same source as everyone else, their faith in their region, and belief that their cause is just.

No matter what religion is "right" they all get their powers from the same place.


Priestesses of Elune do not wield the holy light, so I'm not quite sure what you're implying.
A Nelf Paladin is super interesting...A probably female Sentinel/Priestess of Elune, full plate armor with a glaive and shield, throwing moonfire all over the place? Would be awesome.

The problem is how different that would feel from the Holy Warrior of the Humans and Dwarves, with their Librams, and eagles and chargers and hammers, etc. Since they wouldn't be able to distinguish the Nelf race Paladins as much as they would need to in order to "feel" right (with moon-themed spell effects), I'd rather they just not do it.

But it's a great concept!
Im all for Night Elf Paladins. But i also would say if they do do that they need to start color coding Paladin spells per Race. Blood Elves get an Orange Yellow, Tauren get a Sunny Bright Yellow, Humans get a tad muted yellow, dwarves would get the Human Color, and Night elves would get Silver colored. Trolls im not exactly sure what color theyd be as i dont know what their source of light would be. Also i dont know why people are saying Night Elves cant be Paladins because they dont weild the Holy Light when Blizzard is more than willing to make the Sun a source for Tauren Paladin's Light. Its also my personal head canon that Pandaren get their light powers from Hope that Chiji taught them to wield.
08/19/2015 10:27 AMPosted by Faendel
Trolls im not exactly sure what color theyd be as i dont know what their source of light would be.
Zandalari paladins have a teal theme goin' on.

http://www.wowhead.com/npc=69927/zandalari-prelate#abilities
08/17/2015 09:51 AMPosted by Valinel
08/17/2015 07:38 AMPosted by Vesiana
The biggest hit is lore, not mechanics.

Mechanically, Nelves already have paladins. If one calls a paladin nothing but a 'pious, light-wielding warrior'm then the Priestesses of Elune all qualify.

But, from lore, paladins began as the Order of the Silver Hand, and follow the Light, not Elune. Tauren paladins are basically just armor-wearing druids who worship the sun and get their Light from there. Aesthetically, they should behave very differently, but mechanically, there is no difference.

So, if we have solar-cow druid-paladins, I see no reason why we can't have Nelf priestessadins.


This is something i've been thinking a lot about lately. If WoW ever dies or get a total revamp (so, basically, a de facto WoW 2, one way or another) I don't think they should do "classes" like they have now. Instead, they should learn from the Demon Hunter (and Warhammer Online) and design unique classes for each race. Hell, they don't have to be totally unique, just different effects, postures, weapons, etc. So, rather than "Warrior" we get a Troll Berserker, a Knight, a Mountain King, etc. Rather than "Paladin" or "Priest," we get Knight of the Silver Hand, Priestess of Elune, Sunwalker, etc.


Not a fan of that, it feels like it's moving backwards, especially if races are crammed into factions as well.

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