"Reserved"

General Discussion
I have just recently started getting back into raiding after a long hiatus (I raided a bit in SoO but before that it was Cata.) I've been hitting up the LFG and every thing has the raid leader reserving gear.

I realize this has always been a thing. I've been playing since release. I also realize there is nothing mechanically that can be done to stop this behavior. I'm just curious, if you're one of the people that create groups to reserve gear; why?

I used to run a pug in BC that did Gruul/Mag/TK/SSC every week and nothing was on reserve. I've raided since then and I've seen the occasional "on reserve" but nothing like it is now. It honestly just seems like modern ninja looting.

tl;dr why are you reserving everything like a lazy raider if you're one of these people.
My guild sometimes reserve gear if we're only pugging a couple people. We haven't run one of these in a while where we needed to pug, but back when I had just come back to the game and decided to raid again they would reserve pieces to gear me up.

That being said, it's only ever 1 or 2 pugs and not a full pug group. I feel like if the entire group is almost completely full of pugs gear reservations are unfair.
Well at least they are up front and honest. And really they are reserving it because they need it. It is pretty fair for someone that is going through the hassle of setting up the group and leading it.

It's better than the old, drop group when specific item drops and run with the loot. Saw that happen so many times with dbw or dfo in ICC.

Also wouldn't call them lazy, they are bothering to set up a group.
It's done because there's nothing in the current system preventing it, and there are no rules forbidding it.

It's socially a murky thing to do, but you always have the option of ignoring that group and moving on to the next one, or starting your own group.

At least they're up-front about which item you won't be eligible for if it drops. If you must join a group with an item you want on reserve (whyyyyyyy would you subject yourself to this heartbreak?) come armed with a bonus roll token.
Its simple, people who form the raids make the rules. Its not some new modern age "ninja looting", it's the raid leads perogative.
For an actual reason, if it's a guild, then gear that goes into their guild will contribute in the long term. Reserving a bit so that the run isn't gear neutral after the PuGs have left doesn't seem unreasonable.

Kinda annoying when you're looking through when you need tier gear though.
I don't lead, but I understand why they do it.

They are leading, they expect compensation to bringing along total strangers for the ride. For guilds, their primary intent is to gear the guild out.

I rather have raid leaders reserve gear rather than not say a word and ninja it. It gives me an item of what he/she wants and I know I won't be wasting my time locking out a boss.

Either way, I pick the groups I want to join. If they are reserving something I want, I don't join.
I'm ok with a few things on reserve, but I've seen some absolutely ridiculous amount of things on reserve that ends up with a party that either can't do the fights or is not even worth going to because of the amount of competition on a tier token or for an item.
I never run with groups that reserve anything. Even if something is reserved that is totally of no use to me and even if it is just transmog gear being reserved I still don't run with that group. Of course they can do what they want, but personally I just don't believe reserving loot is in good taste and I avoid such groups at all costs!

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12/04/2015 12:21 PMPosted by Tsurupettan
I'm ok with a few things on reserve, but I've seen some absolutely ridiculous amount of things on reserve that ends up with a party that either can't do the fights or is not even worth going to because of the amount of competition on a tier token or for an item.


I remember seeing a group, no joke, "All healer gear reserved."

...That group was listed in the group finder forever. I wonder if it ever filled and went on to kill stuff.
I'm guessing they reserve loot because that's their fee for setting up and leading the group.
12/04/2015 12:11 PMPosted by Tailynasura
I feel like if the entire group is almost completely full of pugs gear reservations are unfair.


You can always not join them, or make your own group.
12/04/2015 12:05 PMPosted by Augun
I have just recently started getting back into raiding after a long hiatus (I raided a bit in SoO but before that it was Cata.) I've been hitting up the LFG and every thing has the raid leader reserving gear.

I realize this has always been a thing. I've been playing since release. I also realize there is nothing mechanically that can be done to stop this behavior. I'm just curious, if you're one of the people that create groups to reserve gear; why?

I used to run a pug in BC that did Gruul/Mag/TK/SSC every week and nothing was on reserve. I've raided since then and I've seen the occasional "on reserve" but nothing like it is now. It honestly just seems like modern ninja looting.

tl;dr why are you reserving everything like a lazy raider if you're one of these people.


I'm really, really doubtful that you led TK and SSC pugs in TBC. You are not even a hand of a'dal. Anyways the answer if you can't find a group you like is to start your own.
Usually every pug group, someone's reserving like an entire spec gear.

12/04/2015 12:14 PMPosted by Gongam
And really they are reserving it because they need it.

This isn't even an argument.
12/04/2015 12:59 PMPosted by Kawaii
Usually every pug group, someone's reserving like an entire spec gear.

12/04/2015 12:14 PMPosted by Gongam
And really they are reserving it because they need it.

This isn't even an argument.


Its nowhere near every pug group having reserves and most go nowhere near having a whole spec on reserve
leading a pug is a giant chore. i think a good leader deserves one or two things on reserve.

screw those guys who reserve an entire tier set for themselves though.
Just as mentioned before, It's the leader prerogative to put something on reserve if he desires. After all, the leader usually has to provide a vent server or team speak server in order for him/her to lead a good raid and have communication between tanks and healers. Not only that, it can increase stress levels when you're having to maintain group set up.

If you want, you're more than welcome to try and lead a group, but chances are, you won't know the fight thus making yourself an ineffective leader.
Varying on the group, it could still be beneficial.

For instance, say you need 16 possible upgrades and you can choose between 2 groups. The first group has nothing on reserve but has someone in it that needs all 16 pieces of loot that you need. The second group has 1 item on reserve that you need, but no one needs the other 15 pieces of loot that you need. They reserved that 1 piece knowing full well that they need nothing else. Overall, your loot chances are better with the group that reserved 1 piece but needs nothing else.
12/04/2015 02:07 PMPosted by Deepchill
Varying on the group, it could still be beneficial.

For instance, say you need 16 possible upgrades and you can choose between 2 groups. The first group has nothing on reserve but has someone in it that needs all 16 pieces of loot that you need. The second group has 1 item on reserve that you need, but no one needs the other 15 pieces of loot that you need. They reserved that 1 piece knowing full well that they need nothing else. Overall, your loot chances are better with the group that reserved 1 piece but needs nothing else.


You are still best off not joining any groups with reserves as it encourages the behavior. The game would be much better off if they were not willing to lead rather than lead with reserves.
12/04/2015 12:05 PMPosted by Augun

I also realize there is nothing mechanically that can be done to stop this behavior.


Incorrect. Forcing all groups to use Personal Loot (though an unpopular action) would kill this behavior deader than dead.

12/04/2015 12:05 PMPosted by Augun

I'm just curious, if you're one of the people that create groups to reserve gear; why?


I don't do this, but I can tell you why: because they feel that they deserve something above the authority and power that comes with being the "raid leader" to "compensate them" for the "work" of running a raid.
Incorrect. Forcing all groups to use Personal Loot (though an unpopular action) would kill this behavior deader than dead.


'I dont like how other people play, so everyone should be forced to suit my play style.'

Not all groups reserve, so if you dont want to "lose", then make your own PL group, or join a PL one.

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