Someone explain me whats "wrong" with Ret

Paladin
I've been seeing a lot of Ret Paladins complaining, but they're pretty dominant right now from what I've seen PvP wise.

Haven't seen many in PvE but I hope this is what they're all complaining about and not the PvP side of Ret.
I honestly don't have too much of a problem with RET in PvP. I do fine in BGs, and fine in skirms. Even against guild premades in 3s. I've won far more than I've lost. Our sustain is fine and back to back 500k JV Crits with DP/wings/stun are nothing to !@#$ around about.

Alot of people get kited and blow it out of proportion a tad bit imo. Our mobility isn't great by any means. But I've beaten plenty of hunters/frost mages in both BGs and Arenas.
09/19/2016 02:09 AMPosted by Pluere
I've been seeing a lot of Ret Paladins complaining, but they're pretty dominant right now from what I've seen PvP wise.

Haven't seen many in PvE but I hope this is what they're all complaining about and not the PvP side of Ret.


We are MAYBE slightly undertuned. We just have !@#$ty %^-*ty cleave and since most content is dungeon trash people are feeling the worst of it. In reality other classes are probably just overtunes. We are mid pack on patchwerk fights which is fine, and within like a standard deviation of most classes on Sims. And mind you simcraft doesn't take into account the BoM on other players.

So really, this class is fine, it's fun, and we will have mythic raid spots. And we get a !@#$ing ashbringer? Wow class forums are just always full of negativity for many reasons but it hardly ever reflects reality. People just feed off each others woe is me stories even though they had weeks to re roll.

I come here to hope I see some meaningful theorycrafting for ret but never do. But I come hoping none the less.

Plus , blessings are dope.
09/19/2016 02:09 AMPosted by Pluere
but they're pretty dominant right now from what I've seen PvP wise.
There dominant in 2's which literally means nothing, they pretty chill in 3's atm though.
In PvP we have low mobility. Unless we're completely overpowered there will probably be a lot of complaints about our PvP performance.
well as much as i love pally and pvp, I just feel like a punching bag in battle grounds..
I can either do alot of alittle aoe damage to "pad" the metre or I can go for a busrt every 2 min build.. but normally I just get kited when someone noticed i'm trained on them.. every now and then you will get lucky and find someone thats been focused by someone else and has used their trinket / racial / cds ect and you will get a kill..

or you will find someone that doesn't know how to use their classes cc / mobility against us.
So very tempted to play my druid RIP 10 years of paladin
1) The worst talent tree in the game
2) Mid-range single target, subpar AoE means there's no real niche ret fills that warrants taking them.
3) Shoddy utility
4) Can't target switch

It's not unplayable by any means, and I still prefer it to WoD, but after playing so much enhancement shaman, ret's weaknesses are so very glaring and apparent - which is the main problem. You should be feeling the strengths of the character you play, not its weaknesses.
I think a lot of people need to adjust to the new spec. Ret is nothing like before. We went from squishy, bursty, fast shiny plate wearer to shiny arms warrior with less mobility but much more survivibility. Burst is pretty much the same. Atm, imo, we have a much more interesting rotation than arms warriors do. That's for sure.

That being said, we do have a terrible talent tree. No real choice, an abomination of a last tier talent with Holy Wrath... PvE DPS is low / average. Extremely dependent on secondary stats (Haste and crit (which I is extremely rare for me))

Generally the play style is much different in PvP. We need to make sure we don't waste time getting kited, swapping targets often, hoping for RNG DP procs while wings is active and we can stun for those sweet 500-600k JV crits.

Do I love it? Yes. Do I often get frustrated by it? Yes. More than I'd like.
The biggest problem ret has right now is people creating stupid threads in the paladin forums.
09/19/2016 05:42 AMPosted by Invincible
The biggest problem ret has right now is people creating stupid threads in the paladin forums.


Glad to see you're on my side now Vincy!

Welcome aboard.
1) Awful mobility
2) Few ranged attacks
3) Utility gutted

These are the primary reasons why ret feels bad right now in pvp.
To add to what people are saying here, greater blessings are a mess. That we can't cast them in combat makes it feel really clunky, and counting on other players to deal a portion of our damage feels strange. Why we're the only class that kept buffs in Legion is anybody's guess, but not many people like it.
09/19/2016 07:15 AMPosted by Osmigos
That we can't cast them in combat makes it feel really clunky


I bet you'd say even worse if we could ^_^.
09/19/2016 07:21 AMPosted by Berith
09/19/2016 07:15 AMPosted by Osmigos
That we can't cast them in combat makes it feel really clunky


I bet you'd say even worse if we could ^_^.
Perhaps right after running an instance with a tank that chain pulls immediately and doesn't stop I might use stronger language...
09/19/2016 09:47 AMPosted by Osmigos
Perhaps right after running an instance with a tank that chain pulls immediately and doesn't stop I might use stronger language...


Or a raid fight where you're constantly swapping Might around depending on who's CDs are up, and who's trinkets procced.
09/19/2016 09:47 AMPosted by Osmigos
Perhaps right after running an instance with a tank that chain pulls immediately and doesn't stop


The language I'd use is THANK YOU.

Pull the whole damn dungeon and blow all your cds to get the trash out of the way. I can't stand tanks who want to pull mobs 2 at a time and make a 20 minute dungeon run take an hour.
I think alot of ppl just find it boring .
I think in PvP were looking great and I can't wait to try it myself. The footage I've seen is decent.

I'm a raider first and foremost, and I will not stop hating on Eye for an Eye, current Holy Wrath and Shield of Vengeance taking up space in my PvE kit.

Before you jump all over me like you're going to do, I can use them for PvE sure but come on.... we don't need to talk about how trying to lose health and steal aggro from your tanks is a horrible idea do we?

Take away those 3 abilities from PvE Ret and give us some of our self buffs or healing back. Instant flash of lights, seraphim, clemency (which would be AWESOME to have stacks of blessings. And ffs either make Greater Blessings worth a damn or remove them and buff our base damage already....
09/19/2016 10:45 AMPosted by Maverick
Shield of Vengeance taking up space in my PvE kit.


...

SoV is absolutely insane in PvE. What are you babbling about ?

09/19/2016 10:45 AMPosted by Maverick
we don't need to talk about how trying to lose health and steal aggro from your tanks is a horrible idea do we?


...

SoV is an absorb. Use it to survive the boss big attacks. The damage it deals is not its primary function.

09/19/2016 10:45 AMPosted by Maverick
Take away those 3 abilities from PvE Ret


If you take away my SoV I will hunt you down personally. GTFO with that.

09/19/2016 10:45 AMPosted by Maverick
give us some of our self buffs or healing back.


That stuff is trash in PvE. Self buffs and Healing in PvE are worthless.

Go spec Holy if you want to play buffer/healbot. Retribution is not a healing spec.
09/19/2016 10:23 AMPosted by Invincible
09/19/2016 09:47 AMPosted by Osmigos
Perhaps right after running an instance with a tank that chain pulls immediately and doesn't stop


The language I'd use is THANK YOU.

Pull the whole damn dungeon and blow all your cds to get the trash out of the way. I can't stand tanks who want to pull mobs 2 at a time and make a 20 minute dungeon run take an hour.
Sure I like tanks who pull that way, but being unable to cast your blessings the entire time feels bad.

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