Official: Can't Complete Raid Quests Cont'd

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09/27/2016 05:02 PMPosted by Meryll
This seriously sucks. It probably sucks quite a bit for other classes who just have a weapon appearance or three locked behind this nonsense, but druids have their freaking' forms locked behind it. To be shown those forms since legion launch and be given a month's time to daydream of having them only to be told %$!# you sucks.


Get good. Rewards used to mean something. Challenge is NOT a bad thing. Normal raids aren't even that hard, join a pug.
Stupid idea. I cleared normal last week, but it doesn't mean I want to every week. I have to pug because I can't commit to X days/times etc.

Pugging is stressful, sometimes I want to relax and do LFR. ESPECIALLY for alts.

Dumb mistake, since it would also help raiders like myself DO LFR.

Make LFR great again =(
People have known since beta that LFR heroes weren't going to get the raid skin for their artifact. Just delete the quests from your log if you don't intend to do them. Problem solved.
09/27/2016 05:04 PMPosted by Wolflink
09/27/2016 05:02 PMPosted by Meryll
This seriously sucks. It probably sucks quite a bit for other classes who just have a weapon appearance or three locked behind this nonsense, but druids have their freaking' forms locked behind it. To be shown those forms since legion launch and be given a month's time to daydream of having them only to be told %$!# you sucks.


Get good. Rewards used to mean something. Challenge is NOT a bad thing. Normal raids aren't even that hard, join a pug.


good thing there is a 15 level keystone one for you to get or can't you get that and want to be a special snowflake with normal modes?
09/27/2016 05:06 PMPosted by Wolflink
09/27/2016 05:04 PMPosted by Xiata
Stupid idea. I cleared normal last week, but it doesn't mean I want to every week. I have to pug because I can't commit to X days/times etc.

Pugging is stressful, sometimes I want to relax and do LFR. ESPECIALLY for alts.

Dumb mistake, since it would also help raiders like myself DO LFR.

Make LFR great again =(


LFR was never great. Always cancer, always will be cancer.
If you're allergic of content that's designed to be easy, why are you playing WoW? It is now and always has been a casual game for anyone that doesn't live on the cutting edge.
My $0.02 for whatever it's worth.

In a few months a new raid will be out and our gear will make normal emerald nightmare trivial, and it will become even more and more trivial as this expansion goes on.

[/quote]

Normal mode is already trivial, without stepping into raiding through a combination of world quest, world boss, and mythic dungeons a player can easily be sitting on a ilvl of 845 to 850 without legendary's.

The raid is tuned to an ilvl of the low 840's with the gear dropping starting at 850
09/27/2016 04:53 PMPosted by Daniarra
We're 4 pages into a continuation thread of another one that capped almost faster than anything I've seen since the RealID argument.

Yet have we received a response from anyone at Blizzard? Watcher? Our sole remaining CM ("A Blue") on General Discussion? Anything on Twitter? Reddit?

What did we get? We got an announcement on a Battle.net page (not even stickeyed on the forums; if it weren't for someone having started the thread this one continues, I'd have logged in tonight and tried to zone into LFR thinking I could start working on my quest), and utter silence since.

Just like the utter silence we've had since before Legion's launch on when the full Legion Pathfinder meta-achievement can be completed so we can use our flying mounts. Not a single peep.

"Every voice matters", Blizzard's corporate philosophy says... except apparently the players', when they make their case known in reasonable fashion (and some not so reasonable) on the central place Blizzard has given us to interact with them: the discussion forums.

You know, where Bashiok, Lore, Lyllira, and (dearly departed) Ghostcrawler used to regularly engage with us. Even when we were behaving like twatwaffles (and often many posters were).

Worse, this "announcement" indicates the quest text will be fixed in an upcoming patch. So how many players are going to log on this evening, attempting to zone into LFR to work on that quest, only to come to the forums after they clear the first wing and ask if it's bugged somehow, since not a single Essence dropped for them?

Which will turn into complaints about grinding. Blizzard also said we wouldn't be grinding to finish the reps needed for Pathfinder in Legion, but damned if those World Quests aren't starting to feel awfully grindy as I go out there mindlessly killing mobs, collecting up "ancient mana" to feed to crack elves, and wander Suramar hoping not to be seen by too many guards at once so I can just finish my damned quests and get out of there.

Silence. We're greeted with utter silence. Nothing from Blizzard on ANY of the issues people are bringing up.

Silence.

But damned if we don't get email from them if we close our account, or if something doesn't clear on the auto-renew. Wow, we certainly get some effing communication THEN.

We get some communication when they tell us all about an upcoming Mythic-only dungeon so people who use Dungeon Finder are locked out of it.

We get some communication when they apply nerfs to nearly every class.

But when they drop a bomb on release day for LFR that it can't be used to complete a quest?

Silence.

But you really like that subscription fee, don't you, Blizzard? You like our money. You just give us a big effing middle finger when we first ask, then plead, then start demanding, then start rudely insisting that you just ACKNOWLEDGE OUR EXISTENCE AND OFFER A LITTLE EFFING CLARITY ON WHY YOU'RE MAKING SOME DESIGN DECISIONS THAT IMPACT PLAYERS IN A FASHION THEY THINK IS NEGATIVE.


I love you. You made my week.

Blizzard, WAKE THE !@#$ UP AND PAY ATTENTION! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? You need to read every letter of this post. Quoting to ensure you don't miss it.
There are 2 things glaringly wrong with this, that a lot of people are overlooking:

1. Alts. Balance of Power is NOT an account-wide achievement. Emerald Nightmare will be like Highmaul. As soon as Nighthold is released (likely ~4 months from now), it will cease to exist in most guilds minds. Titanforged gear is not enough to draw most guilds to spend time in the place. You'll find the occasional transmog run for it, but that's about it. There's no tier, and the trinkets are meh. So guilds have no reason to run it once a tier/better trinket dropping raid comes out (especially with Trial of Valor being out as well) This quest requires a -MINIMUM- of 4 weeks of Emerald Nightmare, but a more realistic approach of 6-8 weeks (and for the unlucky, it can take 15+ weeks)

Now, considering we've been told that artifact weapons are legion-only and the appearances are as well, and would likely become unlocked for us ONLY if we unlocked it during legion, then most of us were fine grinding out the quest in LFR for our alts. (even if we did Normal or Higher on our main). However, they for some reason, think we'll have the patience to locate enough groups to PuG normal emerald nightmare (AND COMPLETE IT) possibly 8 weeks total for up to 12 toons. What? Lol.

This is a very alt-unfriendly expansion, and LFR was going to be the saving grace when it came to quests like these. This is pretty much the final nail in the coffin of alts when it comes to Legion.

2. The alternate colors. You may complete the achievements to unlock the alternate colors associated with the skin for Balance of Power... but you didn't complete the questline on an alt because of the aforementioned issues?

Well, too bad. You went through the arduous task of completing Glory of the Legion Hero? Welp, sorry. No Skin Reward for you until you go through PuG hell. You spent 2+ months downing 8 different world bosses on an alt? Sorry, you didn't PuG Emerald Nightmare every week so you don't get the reward for it. You downed a level 15 Mythic Keystone Dungeon? Damn, that's amazing! But sorry, you don't get that reward either. You need to go PuG some Emerald Nightmare.

This is by far one of the worst decisions I've seen made this expansion so far, because it's counter intuitive to the core design of the game. If Balance of Power and Unleashed Monstrosities swapped locations, so Balance of Power was simply a color unlock and not the skin itself, then I'd be more lenient. But no, it's the entire skin. You can unlock the colors all you want but until you unlock the skin on your alt, you can't use it.

Please Blizzard, fix this. This is coming from someone who will -eventually- down all the bosses in Normal on this toon at least, from my guild regardless. But I do still believe it needs to be fixed. My alts deserve to get their skins without needing to PuG god knows how many Emerald Nightmare raids in the future.
09/27/2016 05:08 PMPosted by Kyveli
09/27/2016 05:06 PMPosted by Wolflink
...

LFR was never great. Always cancer, always will be cancer.
If you're allergic of content that's designed to be easy, why are you playing WoW? It is now and always has been a casual game for anyone that doesn't live on the cutting edge.


I enjoy content with a little bit of edge, WoW provides that. LFR is a bubble bath filled with rainbows and unicorns.
It is intentional that the quests “In Nightmares” and “Essence of Power” cannot be completed on Raid Finder difficulty. That quest chain is intended to provide a cosmetic reward for participating in organized, non-matchmade content. As such, we wanted to keep this step in line with the previous steps in the chain, which require completing Mythic Dungeons.

This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.
If getting into a raid group were easier, I'd likely be able to do this quest due to my item level. However, most raid groups expect you to have perfection and be a veteran raider and expect you to know the fights as well.

As I've found out that the quests cannot be completed on LFR, I have no desire to attempt LFR as a result, since most items are below my average item level currently unless I get Titanforged on all the pieces.

I keep hoping that my WQ will show up with more 840+ gear, but it's been not been happening lately, despite information being told that World Quests' rewards are supposed to scale to your item level to allow for improved equipment. Instead, all I'm getting are 825-830, which is BELOW my average item level.

I'd understand if they said "Oh, it only scales up to this much" at the very start, but they never said such. Occasionally, I do get the dungeons that give me Mythic-level gear for performing on any difficult, but that's only one piece and those are far and few between.

I would hope that, for folks who aren't as fortunate to get into raiding groups/guilds, that there will be ways for folks to still improve their item level and obtain various other rewards while avoiding the stigma of elitism among many raider groups.

In the case of this quest, I feel that perhaps giving some sort of boon to players who are consistently denied access to Normal+ mode by elitists so that they can be able to actually attempt Normal mode for the purpose of getting this. Not even PUGs are immune to elitism or folks with biased against/towards certain race/class, as often, you'll be denied often and have to sit and wait putting in applications for PUGs. Putting together your own is often just as much of a head-ache.
09/27/2016 05:14 PMPosted by Ornyx
This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.


Good to have confirmation on Stuff of Dreams, at least.

But you guys had a lot of time to tell people/update the quest to show that it couldn't be done in LFR, why wait until the day-of?
Also, why would this not be the 2nd or 3rd one in the row, so as not to be required to unlock the rest? If you can never do normal, you're locked out of 4 entire appearances.

Why?

The decision making for some of the things in this expansion is really, really questionable.
09/27/2016 05:14 PMPosted by Ornyx
It is intentional that the quests “In Nightmares” and “Essence of Power” cannot be completed on Raid Finder difficulty. That quest chain is intended to provide a cosmetic reward for participating in organized, non-matchmade content. As such, we wanted to keep this step in line with the previous steps in the chain, which require completing Mythic Dungeons.

This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.


Thanks for not caving blue :D. Can't wait to get my raid appearance unlock without feeling compelled to LFR.
09/27/2016 05:14 PMPosted by Ornyx
It is intentional that the quests “In Nightmares” and “Essence of Power” cannot be completed on Raid Finder difficulty. That quest chain is intended to provide a cosmetic reward for participating in organized, non-matchmade content. As such, we wanted to keep this step in line with the previous steps in the chain, which require completing Mythic Dungeons.

This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.
this makes no sense, why not make it the last color, why lock colors that are easier to get do to being outside of organized rated apart of that row?
09/27/2016 05:14 PMPosted by Ornyx

This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.


You should have probably communicated this bit of information in the first place. It's no wonder people(myself included) were really upset.


Which will turn into complaints about grinding. Blizzard also said we wouldn't be grinding to finish the reps needed for Pathfinder in Legion, but damned if those World Quests aren't starting to feel awfully grindy as I go out there mindlessly killing mobs, collecting up "ancient mana" to feed to crack elves, and wander Suramar hoping not to be seen by too many guards at once so I can just finish my damned quests and get out of there.
.[/i][/u][/b]


I love you. You made my week.

Blizzard, WAKE THE !@#$ UP AND PAY ATTENTION! WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? You need to read every letter of this post. Quoting to ensure you don't miss it.


The emissary quest requires you to do FOUR quest to gain 1500 rep. What the hell is grindy about that? If you want more rep there are more quests to speed the process up BUT YOU DO NOT NEED TO DO IT!

If you just merely do the 4 emissary quests you will eventually achieve the rep. You make the choice of the speed of that rep. Blizzard has given you the option. Collect it slowly or grind it fast.

You complain when blizzard creates a system that forces you to rep grind, days of old. Now you have a system that gives you the option to do it slowly or with increased speed and you continue to complain.
09/27/2016 05:14 PMPosted by Ornyx
It is intentional that the quests “In Nightmares” and “Essence of Power” cannot be completed on Raid Finder difficulty. That quest chain is intended to provide a cosmetic reward for participating in organized, non-matchmade content. As such, we wanted to keep this step in line with the previous steps in the chain, which require completing Mythic Dungeons.

This restriction is specific to this quest chain, which has a cosmetic-only reward. Other quest chains, such as “The Stuff of Dreams” from the Suramar campaign, will be completable through Raid Finder. We’ll be making some additional changes in Patch 7.1 to more clearly communicate when and where these restrictions apply.


As stated, there are some big issues with this.

Mainly, alts. Unless you make "Balance of Power" unlock account-wide, you have hands down made Legion the most alt-unfriendly expansion ever. (it was already VERY close due to artifact power/knowledge, but this by far pushes it over the edge)

You expect us to find an Emerald Nightmare group for 12 different classes, when the drop rate can take 4-5 months, if you're unlucky, if not more? Really?

This is REALLY unacceptable. The sooner you guys realize this, the better. This is NOT something that is going to go away like the #NoFlyNoBuy stuff. This is something that will be kept alive until it's fixed, either by making Balance of Power account wide, or by making it available from LFR. (Even if you make it available from LFR if you complete Balance of Power on another toon).
OK... I have loved Legion.... Up until now. I stopped with the Hardcore Raiding stuff years ago... Life, work... it all interferes with doing 3 nights a week of up to 8 hours NOT including running alts so the whole guild gets a chance. The strain of a Hardcore Raider was too much and almost made me quit because it simply stopped being fun. Too much drama, too many people that couldn't make a run...

Then came LFG. A way to raid with the time availability that suited a person..... you know... with a life. So here I am, enjoying the game... Busting butt getting quests done. leveling. Getting Rep. Ooohhh... a quest to modify the weapon looks more. But hey... **** you to all non-raiders, casuals, people that "retired" from the hellish drama that was raiding. You know... a LARGE MAJORITY of the playing population. This is perhaps the biggest F-U I have seen to date.

I have been at this game since BC and put up with the changes. i liked some... some I could do without, but I adapted. This has no "Adapting" except to force people to go back into Trade Chat and turn it back into "LFG." Well goodbye to the whole thought of "getting people out of garrisons." Now they will just sit in Dalaran or Org spamming trade chat trying to find a group of people to go into a raid with instead of hitting the "LFR" while actually playing and doing quests outside of the cities.

BAD MOVE Blizzard and you should be ashamed to have said such a big F-U to a large amount of your players. you just took an expansion I was really liking for people like me... the casual, non-guilded player that still had fun. yes, I can still have fun, but you just put crap in my quest log I will have to wait until 3 more expansions are done to go solo this crap.

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