Tap rules creating very toxic behavior

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04/09/2017 10:11 PMPosted by Gigabear
04/09/2017 10:04 PMPosted by Azevara
I highly doubt the tap rules are going to be loosened any time soon, given the way WoW's systems work outside the area.

I'm fairly certain variables like faction tapping and tap limit are on a per mob basis. The changes could be made solely to the mobs spawned by the portals and not change anything beyond that.

Probably not, actually. There are only really three categories of mobs:
1. Regular mobs. These are faction limited, 5 person tap mobs.
2. Major quest mobs. These are cross-faction taggable. Not sure if 5 people still applies as it rarely gets tested.
3. Rare mobs/ World Bosses - These have no tagging restrictions afaik.

I would be very willing to believe that WoW does not have a per-npc variable for these kinds of things, but just sorts them into one category with a universal rule set.
04/09/2017 10:15 PMPosted by Ningjinq

For 2. Now, they could just remove items from sentinax mobs to make it unlimited tag but, the rules currently are in place to prevent runaway inflation because of the amount of resources generated if everyone could tag mobs.


Then they can determine the amount of shards based on the number of taps on the mob when it dies, BUT, until you code such a fix, remove the tap limit entirely.

When the new fix is enabled, I would expect shard gain to be at least what it is now, without competition.

I would love being able to hit then Sentinax in a full raid and just go to town. I sought out raids before they killed shard looting while in them, because the large player counts kept portals rolling freely all the time.

04/09/2017 10:16 PMPosted by Azevara

Probably not, actually. There are only really three categories of mobs:
1. Regular mobs. These are faction limited, 5 person tap mobs.
2. Major quest mobs. These are cross-faction taggable. Not sure if 5 people still applies as it rarely gets tested.
3. Rare mobs/ World Bosses - These have no tagging restrictions afaik.

I would be very willing to believe that WoW does not have a per-npc variable for these kinds of things, but just sorts them into one category with a universal rule set.


Did some digging, and found a few hotfixes showing it is indeed a variable on a per mob basis that can be flipped:

Warden Tower captains no longer have a limit on the number of eligible players who can simultaneously tap them.


Creatures

All world bosses in Mists of Pandaria are no longer tap-to-faction. Players from both factions that engage the world boss at the same time are now eligible for loot.


The second is from 2014, still, you can't make a world boss not tap to faction if it was already an innate property of being a world boss. Also, removing the tap limit on warden captains shows definitively it CAN be done on a per mob basis. This is very recent.
04/09/2017 10:11 PMPosted by Zalayna
I don't really keep up with the lore on this game but it seems like the alliance and horde are working together to beat the legion or something?

Two things....

1) There should have been no faction tap on mobs in this expansion. I would be fine with never having faction tap too but knowing Blizzard, I doubt it would happen.

2) The same faction player limit per mob tap was just a stupid idea to begin with and shouldn't be in the game ever.

Both of these fixed and the questing and world experience would be so much better.
Agreed. It isn't just the faction tapping that's a problem, but the faction player limit too. My server is 10:1 in favor of horde with no ally around and all I see are grey mobs under Sentinax. It's ridiculous. I completely ignore Sentinax when I see it.
04/09/2017 10:15 PMPosted by Ningjinq

For 2. Now, they could just remove items from sentinax mobs to make it unlimited tag but, the rules currently are in place to prevent runaway inflation because of the amount of resources generated if everyone could tag mobs.


Then they can determine the amount of shards based on the number of taps on the mob when it dies, BUT, until you code such a fix, remove the tap limit entirely.

When the new fix is enabled, I would expect shard gain to be at least what it is now, without competition.

I would love being able to hit then Sentinax in a full raid and just go to town. I sought out raids before they killed shard looting while in them, because the large player counts kept portals rolling freely all the time.

04/09/2017 10:16 PMPosted by Azevara

Probably not, actually. There are only really three categories of mobs:
1. Regular mobs. These are faction limited, 5 person tap mobs.
2. Major quest mobs. These are cross-faction taggable. Not sure if 5 people still applies as it rarely gets tested.
3. Rare mobs/ World Bosses - These have no tagging restrictions afaik.

I would be very willing to believe that WoW does not have a per-npc variable for these kinds of things, but just sorts them into one category with a universal rule set.


Did some digging, and found a few hotfixes showing it is indeed a variable on a per mob basis that can be flipped:

Warden Tower captains no longer have a limit on the number of eligible players who can simultaneously tap them.


Creatures

All world bosses in Mists of Pandaria are no longer tap-to-faction. Players from both factions that engage the world boss at the same time are now eligible for loot.


The second is from 2014, still, you can't make a world boss not tap to faction if it was already an innate property of being a world boss. Also, removing the tap limit on warden captains shows definitively it CAN be done on a per mob basis. This is very recent.
Just for fun, I can in fact counter both your claims. Regarding Wardens tower captains, there's no way to prove that their category hasn't been changed to a raid boss target, which would eliminate the tag limit without changing it specifically for those NPCs.

Regarding the MoP bosses, that could have been a global change to the properties of the World Boss category, not to individual NPCs in any specific manner.

But like I said, this wild speculation is purely for fun. Debate is exciting.
04/09/2017 09:26 PMPosted by Wuthappen
one of the main reasons i stopped doing the portals


Yeah, I mean really what is with the cross faction tagging still were both on the same island working together to stop the legion not fighting amongst ourselves, well it can also be a max of 5 people tagging it as well so they should just remove that too.
Welcome to life as a Skinner in Legions Wow...
This is a good reason and fuel for me getting on finishing the ivory talon chain.

Between this, and same faction skinning bots and just all around douchebags who think because they're the same faction they can just ride by and get a few free items off my work because "lol legion is a grind" is a perfect reason to make them experience a corpse run.

Unfortunately for me I followed a friend to a pve server so that's even more reason to catch people unaware that there will be consequences for being a douche on the internet.

I've been saying for some time now I need to get on doing that ivory talon quest chain and this is just another reason.

Part of the reason people act this way is because you are no threat to them. Become a threat and they'll leave you be.

Also perhaps we could just zone into our own summoned portal in an instances version of what we're doing. Regardless, it helps to have an item that allows for instant justice.
They made this mob scaling tech, then just throw it out the window where it's actually needed like sentinax.

And then they decide the best way to use it is to punish people in solo play for having a higher ilvl via mobs scaling to ilvl.

I love this game, but sometimes I scratch my head in disbelief.
Yea there is nothing fun about portals. I tried earlier today I even joined a group and we were fighting with a bunch of other people.

Can thank tap limits and of course good ole CRZ/Sharding for this. So glad the benefits outweight the negatives *eye roll*.
I really dislike the 5 player tap limit. If I don't have a boomkin keeping starfall up on our portals I don't even go over there and it's not fun.

I've literally had to tell people hogging the portals I summoned, "Hey buzz off or I'm going to summon lieutenants here for the next hour," which in itself is another big problem that needs to be addressed. Sentinax saga has been a complete mess.
04/09/2017 10:40 PMPosted by Azevara

But like I said, this wild speculation is purely for fun. Debate is exciting.


While you're clearly reaching here, it doesn't matter. Even if you're right, they can still just flip whatever switch they used on the warden captain for all of these mobs and be done with it.

The point is this CAN be fixed, and probably pretty quickly once they sit down and decide to do it. As per usual, convincing them to actually do that is the hard part.
I just dumped all of the beacons out of my bag. That thing is a waste of time.
04/09/2017 09:33 PMPosted by Yayayayayaya
I have probably 40-50 portals in my bank from killing bosses on BS. I don't plan on using them or going to Sentinax until this is fixed and I'm sure a lot of other people are doing the same. It might be never.

Unfortunate this is still a huge and easily solvable problem after 2 weeks, but things the players enjoy (the MT AP buff that lasted a few hours) are nerfed immediately.


Same here but I haven't even used a portal yet so thanks for the info. They can easily remove the cap and just have mobs scale in health depending on how many people tag it. They do this now with elite world quests and those assassination world quests for non-elites
04/09/2017 09:41 PMPosted by Beastlyhor

Having people from the opposite faction coming in and stealing the portal your group is standing on is kinda STUPID design.


It just isn't the opposite faction. Its your own faction too.
04/09/2017 09:26 PMPosted by Wuthappen
one of the main reasons i stopped doing the portals


That and of course they nerfed the number of crystals.
On top of everything else, the drop rate on nether shards makes it a complete waste of time.

Wow has become an Asian grindfest MMO.
04/09/2017 09:22 PMPosted by Gigabear
Went back to do some Sentinax farming. So first thing I open an empowered portal and feed it a few greens. My group sets up on it. Almost immediately another group heads on over and starts nicking all our taps on the mobs WE summoned.

So I asked them to knock it off and was promptly told to kill myself.

Ok, so we move on to another area and are there about 15 minutes when another group does the same thing. I was like..."It's almost like we weren't here first or something." Response: "Shut up idiot."

None of this would be happening without the tap limit on these mobs. Because it wouldn't matter if another group showed up. The mobs would just scale hp and the same net shard gain would be achieved.

This needs to be fixed, pronto.


I love reading the forums each morning with a cup of coffee. This one really made me giggle. Actually more and more of the posts from the patch bugs, etc. do. If I don't laugh I'll throw my computer out my patio window and *that* wouldn't be funny, to me anyhow.

As if the WoW "community" isn't vitriolic enough sometimes, now we're telling each other "go kill yourself" because of Blizzard's mistakes.
04/09/2017 09:42 PMPosted by Duskey
I've been avoiding portals because of this. It's even worse if you're trying to chill there solo and farm shards. I can never get a tag to the point where I've just given up. The tag limit is dumb and should be removed, because I can't see how the way they've designed these events in any way meshes with a tag limit.


This

and

04/09/2017 09:33 PMPosted by Yayayayayaya
I have probably 40-50 portals in my bank from killing bosses on BS. I don't plan on using them or going to Sentinax until this is fixed


This.

I have, 20 of each of the green quality ones (only 17 of the yellow ones) and I've been deleting any additional ones I get because bag space, thats a combined total of 117 green ones. And I have 18 blue quality ones. I just dont care about using any of them.

I'm either completely alone at the portals, in which case theres little point to using the beacons since portals seem to spawn on their own over time. Or there are people around and even if I try to find a quiet corner and just farm a portal alone (easy enough to solo even the blue portals with the normal ST DH build only taking demonic instead of CB, enough little crap spews out of the portal to keep me eating souls for days) inevitably people end up running over to my portal, if its one dude or 5, doesnt matter because the one dude is always in a group and just drops a perpetual aoe on the ground so as soon as stuff spawns, its tagged and grey for me.

Whats worse is when I'm in the middle of a fight because I've been there alone and fine for while, so I'm killing lvl 2 portal stuff, a fresh big mob has just spawned, and THEN they drop their crap on the portal, so everything else that comes out is theirs, meanwhile they dont even bother really attacking it because my blade dance and eye beam will pull everything back onto me anyway, so they just saunter over every 5-10 seconds, drop an aoe, and walk off while I'm left doing all the work now killing mobs with inflated HP pools.. by myself.. until the portal closes and they walk over, probably with the biggest !@#$ing grin on their faces IRL, and loot all the crap I was stuck killing.

WONDERFUL SYSTEM YOU'VE DESIGNED BLIZZARD. This whole patch is literally just a trollfest, either players doing it, or blizzard themselves doing it through all the gating and nerfs and crap content.
I just pick an out of the way portal and start farming it myself.., If a few others come over to help, that's ok,, However, if mobs start going gray, I move on.
04/09/2017 09:37 PMPosted by Gigolock
Blizz will never listen to their paying customers unless we stop paying.


#truth

Sadly they know we will not. They got us hooked on the game and just as with any addiction giving it up isn't that easy. They will continue to ignore the general WoW population that ultimately pads their pockets while only catering to those that bring them as a company publicity aka Streamers, vloggers, Youtubers, and professional gamers/guilds. We the little guys/gals will continue to foot the bill and deal with every poor choice Blizz makes.

Playing since vanilla I can agree that some areas have been successfully improved upon over the years; however, as a whole I still believe Blizz has lost their vision for it's own game and respect for its players.

Legion was a promising expansion to start with one that I didn't even mind the grind or time it required. This expansion was something Lore Buffs had been dreaming about since TBC. Now it's become an never-ending grind with no real reward or feeling of accomplishment.

Furthermore, it is very obvious which class development teams don't know the class they are working on and/or are very lazy. Seems they no longer take pride in their work and what they put out their to those who play said classes.

To quote Medivh "One must not become too complacent."

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