SotT is a terrible, terrible instance

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09/16/2017 07:44 PMPosted by Dagher
Oculus at least tried to innovate. I do feel like visually and thematically SotT is very weak.


Oculus was one of the best dungeons of WotlK, after Nexus and Halls of Reflection.
It's short and sweet in M+ and feels reasonably balanced from what I've seen. There are two short pieces of unskippable RP. It's not the greatest instance of all time, but I'd say I like it more than a solid half of the Legion launch dungeons and a million times more than cathedral. I don't have any idea how people can complain about this place when launch cathedral was a thing,
09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Boring bosses.
Yep. Not exciting in the least, and like most I'm sure, I have no idea what their actual mechanics are because they die so quickly. Not that I have any desire to do them on M+ because it's not an exciting place.

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Tons of unskippable RP.
Has Blizzard learned nothing in 13 years? We don't mind RP the first time, but there always needs to be a way to skip it. Then again, DS is still 75% RP and 25% killing, so I doubt they'll change anything.

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Ridiculous amounts of trash.
I don't mind the trash, it feels fine to me. On higher difficulties though there may be too much of it, or people will try to skip certain packs.

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
An infuriating daily that requires more trash cleaning when it's active.
Bad daily is bad, but it's no worse than any other dungeon WQ.

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Enormous.
To me it's not so much the size, but how open-world it feels. It doesn't feel like an instance, it feels like a longer WQ with strangers. We should really have spent more time inside the SotT instead of wandering around outside it. Instead we get a tiny little room of void, with some void creatures and a void naaru. I guess at least it's not Fel?

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Uncompelling plot.
There's a plot? I didn't pay any attention to the trash that was the Argus story (too many Paladins, Drain-eyes, Illidan and NPCs I've never heard of) except that some Naaru went evil and made the Broken more insane. Or something. Then we kill this supposedly uber being in like 10 seconds and an elf eats it soul.

09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
Honestly? I think this is the worst instance since Oculus. No, I am not exaggerating - this is simply a poor effort, especially coming on the heels of both Karazhans (which felt very strong).
SotT isn't as bad as Oculus, but it's not great. I'd rate it about on par with Coen, Kara and CoS. Which is to say I'd rate it about 2/10. Making Kara a spammable 5-man dungeon was awful. It ruined the fun of what was once the greatest raid Blizzard had made, and turned into somewhere I will actively AFK in if I get it for the random dungeon. Still infinitely better than Black Morass though.
The only time I ran it, the tank was oblivious to most trash outside of the single mob he was tunneling, and one, sometimes 2, of the DPS were lost and getting killed.

I wasn't interested nearly enough to go back on any character.
It wasnt Cathedral. It wasnt great, but it wasnt anywhere near bad
09/16/2017 07:51 PMPosted by Trousseau
For me, it is a fact

That's not how facts work.
The location and layout is bad and boring. That about sums it up/
09/16/2017 09:29 PMPosted by Nixxea
Blizzard has only produced a couple of decent or better dungeons in like the last decade. Both of them were revamped raid instances.


I disagree, both CoS and Arcway are pretty cool and interesting and I'd say even Vault is really good.
Anyone notice how WizzFizzle didnt respond after he was put in place?

*Laughing internally*
09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
  • Boring bosses.
  • Tons of unskippable RP.
  • Ridiculous amounts of trash.
  • An infuriating daily that requires more trash cleaning when it's active.
  • Enormous.
  • Uncompelling plot.
  • Honestly? I think this is the worst instance since Oculus. No, I am not exaggerating - this is simply a poor effort, especially coming on the heels of both Karazhans (which felt very strong).


    K.

    How many times have you done the dungeon?

    Once?

    Almost all dungeons have trash you can skip.

    if you honestly think Kara had a strong plot you must love film reboots too such as the Ghost Busters or Fant4stic or The Amazing Spiderman.

    You just contradicted yourself by complaining SotT is too big, but praise Kara? REALLY?

    I mean, okay, you're allowed your opinion. I'm also allowed to ask you think before you type.

    Name 5 dungeons that are better than SotT in every category you've just listed.
    09/16/2017 08:01 PMPosted by Sinnabun
    Dont get your panties in a twist because he didnt state it was his opinion. If you can't tell the difference thats on you.

    Funny enough, the OP even admitted that he was expressing the opening post as fact.

    09/16/2017 07:51 PMPosted by Trousseau
    or me, it is a fact, and I don't give a fig what kind of contrary viewpoints you maintain, or how my statements upset the kettle.


    Now, I don't know what posts you were reading, but that statement right there is pretty clear that the opening post is not opinion in their mind, but indeed 'fact.'
    09/16/2017 07:41 PMPosted by Trousseau
  • Boring bosses.
  • Tons of unskippable RP.
  • Ridiculous amounts of trash.
  • An infuriating daily that requires more trash cleaning when it's active.
  • Enormous.
  • Uncompelling plot.
  • Honestly? I think this is the worst instance since Oculus. No, I am not exaggerating - this is simply a poor effort, especially coming on the heels of both Karazhans (which felt very strong).

    I enjoyed Oculus.
    I won't judge it till I tank it on a high level key. It's hard to get a feel for the boss fights when they die before you really understand their mechanics. Friend of mine has a Seat +11; hoping we can run that Sun or Mon.
    Gonna be honest, when I did SoTT, it really wasn't a good dungeon. The layout - while the shift from Fel was great - was uninspired, and honestly? The bosses were simply meh.

    Honestly, SoTT could have been much better, there is so much potential for an Argus dungeon and the laziness of the design really squanders it.

    THAT BEING SAID....

    SoTT wasn't bad, it was just completely forgettable. I didn't find it more tedious than most Legion dungeons, nor did I find it all that enjoyable. In the end, if for whatever reason I get a CoTT key/quest/queue pop, I'm not going to dread doing it, just solid apathy.
    09/16/2017 08:52 PMPosted by Têt
    halls of reflection...worst instance ever..wasnt boring or anything your mentioned...it was just hard...only the skilled could shine there..and then it got nerfed 5 times.

    Halls of Reflection was the best dungeon Blizz has ever done, with the possible exception of Return to Karazhan. I guess some like challenge and some don't.
    09/16/2017 07:51 PMPosted by Trousseau
    For me, it is a fact

    This ladies and gentlemen is why we are in the situation we have.
    I quite enjoyed it as an end-of-storyline dungeon. I just wish Alleria stuck around after the cinematic in the dungeon instead of ninja-logging.

    Trash seems similar to Eye of Azshara, which felt interesting the first time I did it.
    In this regard it wasn't entirely unavoidable gunk like in CoEN.

    It's a four* boss thing which I'm fine with. Gonna try it on +10 soon with the key i got.

    If it's overtuned it might suck.

    Feels like it could be a pre-cursor to a 1/2 tier raid with more developed void bosses like TOV.

    Oh well. I suppose I was far more excited to finish the quest line because of the hype i got from unlocking the Netherlight Crucible.
    09/17/2017 12:06 AMPosted by Hardur
    Halls of Reflection was the best dungeon Blizz has ever done
    Sure, if you enjoy hiding in a corner for 20 minutes.

    09/17/2017 12:06 AMPosted by Hardur
    I guess some like challenge and some don't.

    Once that first part was over, the rest was a bit of a joke. I didn't dislike it because it was difficult though(in fact ZG/ZA and PoS are still among my favourites), I disliked it because it was bland, boring, used bad mechanics (add waves) and was unforgiving for pugs because if the tank/healer died you had to start those trash waves again. It was also the dungeon where it was guaranteed that 2-3 people would leave immediately, making your queue times pretty miserable.
    09/16/2017 11:34 PMPosted by Averyx
    I disagree, both CoS and Arcway are pretty cool and interesting and I'd say even Vault is really good.


    Yes, but that's because most people don't like actual dungeons and just like want 15 minute content blitzes.

    09/17/2017 12:06 AMPosted by Hardur
    Halls of Reflection was the best dungeon Blizz has ever done, with the possible exception of Return to Karazhan. I guess some like challenge and some don't.


    HoR was a joke. We roflstomped it on release day while I tanked in the middle of the room because we didn't know about the nook. That anyone actually struggled with that dungeon is pretty much inconceivable.

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