If AOTC was removed...

General Discussion
I don't do heroic BECAUSE of aotc. Makes the heroic+ raiding scene more toxic
11/28/2017 08:20 PMPosted by Avabelle
Would you still do Heroic?

As for me, I wouldn't. I would just play alts more/keep doing normal mode. In fact, the only reason I still push myself to do Heroic is because I haven't ever missed an AOTC achievement and I feel like it's something I /have/ to do. Like I know Antorus AOTC gives a reward of a mount(so I read) so that's motivation for me to care to clear.

But otherwise, I don't know, I feel like I've went lazy lately and don't want to put in the effort. Gear from there wont matter next expansion anyway.


Likely I would make the attempt since often it is the only thing keeping me from heroic mode. But far more likely something else would be used in its place and I would still be back to where I was without AotC. I blame the others lack of willingness to give me time to let trial and error help me figure out what I missed from my youtube homework on these raids.
AOTC would simply be replaced by checking amount of times you've killed each boss on heroic via armory checks anyways.

PUGSs will have unreasonable requirements no matter what because the objective is to let gear and experience make up for the lack of coordination.
11/28/2017 10:21 PMPosted by Themurlöc
I don't do heroic BECAUSE of aotc. Makes the heroic+ raiding scene more toxic


I hate when people claim this definitively. Sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't.

Find a group or guild you enjoy running with, add to friends, and it's not a problem.
I already don't do heroic. Or normal for that matter. I'll generally run the raid once in LFR once all wings unlock, just to see the story, then go back to my normal business.

I used to do the progression raid game, mostly in other MMOs. Then it started to feel more like a chore than a game, I felt like I had to play at certain times several times per week, and honestly I wasn't getting much out of it, in terms of enjoyment. As I've gotten older, I have other priorities that preclude me setting aside 8-12 hours per week just to dedicate on the raids, not to mention anything else I may want to do on my own, such as level alts, farm old mounts/transmog, or whatever. Since I've quit chasing that horizon, I've gotten much more enjoyment out of MMOs as a whole.

So, no. Removing AOTC would not get me to "stop" doing heroic, because I'm already a filthy casual.
Working for it as a team with friends is fun, and that feeling of accomplishment and joy you get to share with everybody when we finally defeat the last boss is just amazing.

Plus when you're recruiting, having a guild AotC achievement can be a plus factor to some.
Why would someone raid just for AotC specifically? It doesn't really have any prestige or value when Cutting Edge exists.

Heroics raiding is laid back and fun in general.
I think you'd need to do at least H to even get actual boss fights. We cleared N tonight (well I had to leave for work after 7 bosses, but the rest kept going) only half-knowing the fights and still one-shot most of it (two-shot the rest).

On H you get a fuller range of mechanics that bite hard enough to hold your attention.
11/28/2017 10:21 PMPosted by Themurlöc
I don't do heroic BECAUSE of aotc. Makes the heroic+ raiding scene more toxic


I love when people say this.
I’d still do heroic. Requires enough coordination and skill to still be challenging, yet not so challenging that my PuG groups will be stuck on one boss for weeks.

However, with a promotion at work and a significantly more packed schedule, who knows if I’ll have time. I may mostly do normal for the rest of Legion and into BfA just because it’ll be easier to clear quickly/more reliably.
11/28/2017 08:26 PMPosted by Jerauld
I would still do Heroic, I want to do Mythic but we don't have enough players.


This. Oh we've got a ton right now, since the new raid just opened. But several of these guys are the ones who show up early in a tier, have no interest in Mythic, and will be gone in 3 weeks, until the next expac's pre-patch.

AotC doesn't really factor into why I raid. But then, I have a steady raiding guild so it doesn't have to. I see why it's something puggers are concerned with, and why it can sometimes be a source of frustration to them.
AoTC is what keeps me raiding so i'd be upset if it left because of GD forum cry babies
AOTC is a goal for heroic-locked guilds like mine, but it's not 'the goal'.

We raid because we like it, not because we need the Epeen of the tier.

I mean, it certainly helps us with recruiting new blood, but once we get to that first week of clearing it just becomes the Oprah gift of new guildies.

"You get an AOTC, and you get an AOTC, you died at the beginning and you also get an AOTC!"
I don't normally do heroic, so the removal of AOTC wouldn't change what I do.
Honestly don't care about AOTC, nobody has ever asked me to link it lol
Yes, I would still try to do heroic. It would just mean pele wont need to ask for it
I mean, don't get me wrong, I like having AoTC. I didn't raid EN, so didn't care. When ToS came out, I didn't care until I got it. I wanted it in ToS, but it was not a deal breaker. Was happy when I finally got it.

I will go for it in Antorus yes, and expect to get it. But I am not going to whine and cry if I don't.
I don't raid because AOTC or even the gear I get. That is all a nice reward, but I raid because I enjoy the people I play with and enjoy the challenge. I find most party poopers in raid groups are the ones whom do it just for achievements alone or just for the gear because when they do not get the said things they are hoping for they rage quit or toss a fit like a two year old and take it out on the team/guild.
11/28/2017 08:26 PMPosted by Jerauld
I would still do Heroic, I want to do Mythic but we don't have enough players.


Same, except I'm gonna get those damn players to run Antorus on Mythic, it's the most fun raid I've been since Ulduar and SoO.
I seem to be an anomaly since I raid because I like raiding. I don’t care about the rewards. I like the team sport of doing a raid. Heroic is generally the difficulty that’s appropriate for my guild, hard enough to challenge us and not so hard that it’s impossible.

So yes. I would raid Heroic without AotC. I’d raid Heroic if it didn’t drop gear, mounts, or anything. Because for me, the reward isn’t the point.

When I think about it, AOTC is kind of like a trophy from a sporting event. It’s nice to have and it’s nice to look at to remember what you did when you earned it, but you’re not doing it for the trophy. You’re doing it for the competition. When I was in high school I was a member of my school’s marching band. During my freshman year we started competing in the state’s highest class of competition. During my senior year we would constantly come in second to the same school at every competition. At the end of the season at the biggest competition of the state we gave it our all and everyone gave 110%. And I’ll never forget that memory of my last high school marching band competition when the scoreboard flashed up and showed us in first place 1.5 points above our rival. I know we got a trophy but I don’t remember what it looked like. That was never important and the lack of a trophy wouldn’t mean we didn’t just bring our A-game and get first place. That’s what my memory is of. It’s the same with raiding.

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