Patch 7.3.5 and the Dungeon Experience

General Discussion
Wall of text crits you for 15 million ouch

But yeah, Dungs at low level don't give enough xp for the difficulty and the time spent for them
bumping this effortpost
Bumping. This post is presented in a clear and well thought out manner. Dungeons are currently something I am avoiding completely at low levels.
01/23/2018 10:45 AMPosted by Ornyx
Thanks for the feedback and thoughts so far.

The Refer-A-Friend system is intended as an option for players who want to invite a friend to play WoW with them and experience the game together. When it was first introduced, we gave it a hefty bonus to experience gain as a way for both players to reach endgame content as quickly as possible.

Nowadays, purchasing the latest WoW expansion includes a free character boost, so the need to rush your friend to max level is no longer there; you can jump into the latest content with your friend right away. This meant that the only players who were using the Refer-A-Friend system in its intended way – leveling alongside their friend – were those who had decided that they wanted to experience that content together. We realized that, for those players, the 300% XP bonus was a disservice; we were cutting that shared experience short by making them finish it far too quickly.

Now, we certainly recognize that the majority of people using the Refer-A-Friend system before these changes were doing so in order to level alts quickly. If anything, we take that as a strong indication that the system needed to change: the best method to level a character in WoW shouldn’t be “buy a new copy of the game, put it on a separate account, send it a Refer-A-Friend invite, level a new character, and then transfer that character to your primary account when you’re finished.” That’s messy, at best.

That said, we’re certainly taking the feedback about the rate of leveling alts into account as we move forward with the game’s development. We’ve been happy with the changes so far, but if leveling is too slow, we’d rather address that in the game itself than have Refer-A-Friend be some kind of bizarre workaround to an outstanding issue.

The only rewards they should add to dungeons are weapon upgrades imo Bc heirloom weapons don't provide XD buffs anyways
I don't mind harder dubgeons(prefer them actually) but the devs seem to greatly overestimate the "fun" of questing. Dungeons are a blast, questing is... you do them once you've done them all. Why even have dungeons if they're completely frickin pointless?
Just sounds like; " Hello fellow followers".
" I put my ( 5th , 4th, 3rd and 2nd accounts ) on follow, but I only got this much experience.
Boo who..."

Oh the tangled web you weave.

Have fun.
Perhaps the quest xp should be doubled or tripled. It gives an incentive of doing them at least once, but not spammable.

Dungeon quests being equal to regular quests in exp is a bit silly.
It's good that mobs take longer to kill, but XP is way undertuned, especially in dungeons. Also mobs should hit a little harder. It's nice in theory for them to last long enough for you to do your rotation, but in reality it's tedious because they barely hit back. Diablo 3 has this same issue: when you turn up the difficulty, mob health scales much faster than their damage. So if you want to be at the sweet spot where mobs live a few hits but don't feel like you're beating on a brick wall with your bare hands, you need to set the difficulty to where they aren't a threat to you...

If you want WoW leveling to feel like a worthwhile experience in and of itself, then increase mob damage by 30%, XP gain by 30%, and dungeon XP gain by 100%. Something along those lines.
The reason they nerfed dungeon experience is they don't want people to run dungeons. The reason they don't want people to run dungeons is that they need testers for the questing content. They didn't get enough people or feedback on PTR for questing content, but they just instituted huge changes to that content with 7.3.5 level scaling, so they want everybody who is leveling alts to go through the questing route in order to test out the new changes.

In other words, they are railroading everybody into testing the new level scaling.
Patch 7.3.5 and the Dungeon Experience: An Honest Conversation
  • I’m using the 300% increased experience from Recruit-a-Friend benefits on top of everything

  • So sadly something that they did to RAF was nerf the everliving !@#$ out of it.

  • "To align the Recruit-A-Friend XP bonus with the upcoming leveling changes, we have reduced the XP boost gained from the Recruit-A-Friend program when playing with a linked friend down from 200% (300% XP vs. base XP) to 50%* (150% XP vs. base XP)."
  • "If you’re already actively participating in the program, fear not! If you either sent or received an invite before the change went into effect today, once the invite is accepted you and your friend will still receive triple XP* (200% XP bonus) until the link between your accounts expires (90 days from the date the new recruit’s account was first created)."
  • "Heirloom gear XP bonuses will no longer stack with the RAF boost (i.e., the maximum XP boost you will see from today onwards is 50%). If you were already on the program, Heirloom gear will still stack."
  • TLDR: So if anyone in the future that wants to use RAF as a means to get past this huge leveling nerf, don't. It no longer stacks with heirloom gear and only gives +50% more xp which is how much you can get with heirloom gear.

    (If you want to read the full changes to RAF go to this post)
    I actually bought a subscription to wow again after a month long hiatus, me and my buddy decided to level together and when we began leveling our new toons the next day we opened wow to the patch notes and once the whole patch finished patching. I realized the drop of xp gain significantly in dungeons, we would only do dungeons or specific dungeons for the quests inside the dungeon and refused to run it more than once. Whether its because someone would pull and wipe our group multiple times or the healer would consistently fail at healing. We resort to questing nonstop unless we level and can do a new dungeon, personally not a fan of new patch. Hope we can find a better solution
    its faster for my level 70 to mine in Wintergrasp than to do dungeons :(.
    Here is my opinion on the matter. Blizzard has worked real hard to create a unique and immersive environment for characters. Although we are many many expac's in, the end game is not but a portion of the larger picture of what makes up the WoW experience. It is understood that people really want to get to high lvl and play with their friends and whatnot, but to leave out the complete experience of the world itself means you are not really playing "World" of warcraft, you are just looking for certain aspects of it. I think they started to understand this with the previous patches being dung spam fests to getting to end game areas, and in turn decided to make leveling as dynamic as our talent choices. Where you give up one thing to do something, you gain something else. You gain better gear from doing dung, but you gain less xp. As some have mentioned, it is still worth going into dung to get the quests done, but for pure lvling, it is better go out in the world and quest. I think they have done a good job of finding that balance without making it an absolute burden to lvl a char.
    this is the same as always. questing is faster. good it will encourage people to quest instead of just spamming dungeons.

    good thing questing in the world is now more more fulfilling than before, even i am doing it.

    someone should do a podcast from the podcast of an old school wow player who likes a challenge versus the entitled whiners of contemporary gaming...

    seriously most of you should just go play assasins creed or some other easy garbage like *shouldn't* be the game for you
    01/28/2018 10:34 AMPosted by Bééfadin
    this is the same as always. questing is faster. good it will encourage people to quest instead of just spamming dungeons.

    good thing questing in the world is now more more fulfilling than before, even i am doing it.

    someone should do a podcast from the podcast of an old school wow player who likes a challenge versus the entitled whiners of contemporary gaming...

    seriously most of you should just go play assasins creed or some other easy garbage like *shouldn't* be the game for you

    I'm from classic. Even learn to bounce back from between Kalimdor and EK to get things done without greying out on quests. Even going through the effort to get the hammer to hit the gong in zul'furrak. Also played Everquest, ff11, and other pre-wow mmos. I play wow to play wow. I play current wow to play current wow. If I wanted to earlier experience, I would go on the privates or wait for the upcoming classic server.

    The "challenge" is all what made up classic wow either. Classic was made of a bunch of gamers, including from other blizzard games, that did previously game before, and had a great community going into classic. Right now, that is gone other then guilds who do somehow stick together and especially chat up or hang in voice, and that tends to happen in the end-game. Not to mention a good amount of players heading into Wow in current day aren't exactly avid gamer types.

    My thoughts are I like how people can get more use to their classes now through dungeons or leveling, but Blizz did not one but several whammies against leveling speed. This was the case where I posted on the PTR some of the more extreme bugs or the xp shortage in the earlier levels (like being level 4 before Bloodhoof Village in Mulgore), and done without heirlooms so I could replicate a newer player getting into the game.
    01/22/2018 05:26 PMPosted by Drogosh
    Low level dungeons are relevant because they provide very good gear which helps speed up your questing. I'd take a buff to do dungeon XP, but the design here is pretty clear: remove all "mindless" gameplay from leveling. Leveling is now a much more involved experience, and gaining a new ability or piece of gear is much more satisfying. This change has been excellent.

    Obviously you have not paid attention to gear upgrades or you would not spout this nonsense. Low level gear scaling is miniscule at most. The difference between a rare piece of armor (ilvl 112) belt [Girdle of Gale Force] and (ilvl 384) rare belt [Venomtail Girdle of the Peerless] is 3 Agility and 6 total secondary stats. Please explain to me how stuff like this is a huge upgrade speeding up your leveling process. Furthermore, BFA includes yet another stat squish making these margins even smaller. You can go 20-40 lvls without much of a change in overall gear/stats. IMO dungeon gear doesnt make much difference at all.
    Why did Blizzard reduce the XP needed to level during the end of or just after every prior expansion? They realized people were mostly playing for endgame and/or wanted to try a different class. This goes completely against what they had done for the past many years.

    I have played since Vanilla off and on, mostly on. I enjoy relevant content first and foremost. I used to raid with a guild and now am mostly casual raiding/BGs and love to Gold Farm/play the AH. I dont need to see a zones story to be engaged in WOW and dont see anything that stopped people from doing so pre patch 7.3.5. I want to grow powerful as I go through the world, not have the world adapt to my level.

    It amazes me how many people QQ about having to travel to a new zone when leveling, yet bemoan flying. I get you want to finish the zones quests/story while collecting relevant XP, this is exactly how the pre-patch dungeon levelers feel. Me Included.

    I prefer to level through dungeons/BGs in the older content, because I have traveled and quested in most zones through out the years and dont care to do it for the 100x time. Why should half+ the wow pop have to suffer because of this. If the content actually was relevant to the current xp/gaming exp I wouldnt have a problem. Just my opinion on the matter. I like forward looking progress, not taking steps back in the current game.

    Now for the classic servers I am a huge fan. All this content will be current, relevant, and amazingly fun challenge again! Thank You Blizz for this!
    I just came back to the game after a 4 year break, was leveling alts just to get to know the game better and have a relaxing time. It is no longer relaxing, it is work to level. I don't care that they increased the leveling xp, it takes twice as long as it did before to level. Up until I quit I had played since open beta, I still have my day 1 release character. This patch will probably make me quit the game again, I dont want to spend weeks upon weeks getting to max level for 1 character, and I will not pay for any boost to 100.
    I know it's a hard transition from the super fast dungeon leveling to the state it is now, but it's not really about what the veterans who looove to speed level tons of alts want. It's about the integrity of the game. You've got to step outside of your box and think ok, what does this look like to a new player, because having new players is important for the survival of the game especially when people complain about EVERY CHANGE blizzard makes.

    Even in vanilla and bc, dungeons were never designed to speed run through them and gain XP. They were designed to get players used to playing in groups, form community, perhaps recruiting for guilds, and ultimately get that amazing blue gear that you couldn't get anywhere else.

    So then WOTLK comes and its easy to run through dungeons but NOWHERE NEAR THE EASE OF THE DUNGEON RUN NOW. Now it's just rediculous and laughable.

    But dude... you have no excuse. If you have played for a long time then you should have plenty of alts. If you hate questing and hate dungeons and hate pvp, then purchase a boost!
    I sure miss the good old days.... fun memories, but I also love flying around, high stat gear, and heirloom high stat for faster leveling. Been playing since beta (or a year after beta )

    If you want to enjoy the content, mmmm don't buy the heirloom and also don't use your mount till you are 40 just like vanilla.

    And please, don't fly. ever!

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