Why are they called "Specializations?"

General Discussion
At this point they feel more like subclasses. In fact, base classes don't even exist anymore. Using Rogues as an example, a Rogue used to be a master of stealth, poisons, and guile. Every Rogue could do these, but some chose to specialize in poisons, some in stealth, etc. Now learning one means you almost completely forget the others. It feels very akin to the subclasses of other MMOs.
Because Assassination Rogues are specialized in toxins, knives and assassination. Subtlety Rogues are specialized in walking in the shadows and ninja skills and Outlaw Rogues are specialized in pirate stuff.

The name "Specialization" works pretty well.

Now the word "Talent", that makes no sense at all since talent means "natural aptitude or skill" and that's not something you should be able to change freely by going to a city or reading a book.
Actually rogues are probably the best example of Specializations

A Subtlety rogue specializes in stealth and mastery of the shadows

An Assassination rogue specializes in using poison, and causing their opponents to bleed

An Outlaw rogue specializes in dueling with their opponent and using their skill with blades (and when things go wrong an underhanded pistol shot) to win.
05/26/2018 10:01 AMPosted by Laethra
At this point they feel more like subclasses. In fact, base classes don't even exist anymore.


Agreed completely.

Specialization to me, sounds like: something that is available to ALL specs, but some have more of it.

Take warlocks or death knights, for example, there's very few (damaging) abilities shared between specs.

In BfA, demo locks won't even have a baseline DoT! Locks have dots since, like, forever.
Specialization are analogous to what your class specializes in.

I’m a Death Knight first. That’s unchangeable. However, my focus, expertise, or specialization currently is Frost.

I would agree that you could rename it focus, expertise, but it works well. A subclass - to me - is more analogous to a different type of class. The specializations aren’t types of classes - they’re the focus of the class.
05/26/2018 10:19 AMPosted by Synekwanox
05/26/2018 10:01 AMPosted by Laethra
At this point they feel more like subclasses. In fact, base classes don't even exist anymore.


Agreed completely.

Specialization to me, sounds like: something that is available to ALL specs, but some have more of it.

Take warlocks or death knights, for example, there's very few (damaging) abilities shared between specs.

In BfA, demo locks won't even have a baseline DoT! Locks have dots since, like, forever.


The only comment I have is that a player can’t JUST be a death knight - they always have to perform a set focus/specialization. If classes could just BE death knight and then youd have the ability to further delineate by the current specs, I can see your point.
Name is arbitrary. Yiu know what it is. A name change can happen but then people would need to get used to the new name which is also a non-issue.
05/26/2018 10:11 AMPosted by Apocrypha
Actually rogues are probably the best example of Specializations

A Subtlety rogue specializes in stealth and mastery of the shadows

An Assassination rogue specializes in using poison, and causing their opponents to bleed

An Outlaw rogue specializes in dueling with their opponent and using their skill with blades (and when things go wrong an underhanded pistol shot) to win.
The difference is they're not specializing in them-- they're the only ones able to do it. An Assassination Rogue isn't a Rogue that specializes in poisons and bleeds. It's a Rogue that's able to utilize them. It was a specialization when other specs could do it, but they just did it better: they specialized in it. Now it feels like an offshoot of the incomplete Rogue class.
Yeah... I guess maybe "type" or something lame like that would work better now.
I think I see what you mean, but I think the way it is now makes more sense honestly.

Back in Vanilla every mage had the option of all mage spells, barring those that were unlocked with talents like pyroblast or presence of mind. So you could still shoot off frostbolts, even if you were specced into fire. But why would you? Sure, back then there were mobs with resistance or immunity to certain damage, but that pretty much doesn't exist anymore.

So on one hand, yes. There's not much shared between specs. But on the other, it makes sense from a story and gameplay perspective to have characters leveraging what they're best at.

Edit: spelling
I still call outlaw, combat to this day, so call it whatever you want.
Should just call them "specs that get you in raids", and "other".
Completely agree. Tried doing BGs on my rogue... I completely rolled people as Assassination, the spec feels good.

Outlaw feels awkward and has a strange playstyle. I like it more in PVE than in PVP, but just my personal opinion.

Subtlety makes no sense. This is what got me frustrated. You're supposed to be a master of control... yet, half the classes in the game can CC/control quicker and better than you. Take Holy Priests, they can Chastise stun you for 5 seconds, or Boomkins can 5 second Bash you from Moonkin form. Zero skill required or setup. Yet for a Kidney Shot, you need points, energy and timing. Because your damage is tied to your points, so its a major trade off. You're not just hitting a button for stun, like a DH, and then that's it, you get to DPS.

That's why you don't see Sub Rogues owning people regularly in BGs. They take more skill to play with none of the trade off. Your burst isn't better than Assassination or Outlaw, and your control isn't much better. What is the honest point? You're just a "shadowy rogue" with shadow attacks.

My grand point behind this essay... if they hadn't taken poisons away, Sub wouldn't have that problem. But now only the "Masta of poisonz" can use poisons, and no one else has the brain capacity to apply them. Oh please.

DISCLAIMER: Not saying Boomkin or HPriest are OP. Idk, they might be. But I'm just pointing to those specific abilities to attest to what I'm saying about Sub. Im not in the rated scene or arena scene, because PVP has become so goofy.
Like, from a long time WoW player. This is my 2nd account so my early days of Wrath and the end of TBC aren't gonna show up on my characters' achievement page or whatever. But I've never seen PVP so imbalanced across the board. It's just not 1-4 classes rolling everyone, there are so many OP specs that it creates this giant cluster you-know-what of a PVP scene. As soon as you have 2 melee on you, and can't get any peels as a healer or non-OP ranged... you are 100% going to lose if they are competent with gap closers/burst/etc.

I compare it heavily to Mists of Pandaria PVP, and I think that's what they were shooting for with this xpack's style of PVP... ok, we can't balance the classes? Just make everyone OP! Except a few... make them eat dirt the entire expansion. Better yet, buy a boost! Go back and look at MoP PvP...*almost* everyone has insano burst at the touch of 1-2 buttons. The game was more balanced then though. This is actually worse. And melee own ranged, HARD. Coming from a "melee guy", I mostly play melee. They're way over the top.

EDIT: Fury is a perfect example. Oh man, it's the Fury SPEC. We have to make it ALL about burst damage, and little to no consistent damage. They will not resemble a Warrior, but more of a poor man's Demon Hunter with low defense. Why not make Fury an actual, viable spec, instead of a one-trick pony. Let me tell you this... my first main in Legion is Fury, I quit him because the PVP was so faceroll. But that's all you can do. You're not a Warrior, you're a Fury Thing. Lol
05/26/2018 11:45 AMPosted by Jourdan
Like, from a long time WoW player. This is my 2nd account so my early days of Wrath and the end of TBC aren't gonna show up on my characters' achievement page or whatever. But I've never seen PVP so imbalanced across the board. It's just not 1-4 classes rolling everyone, there are so many OP specs that it creates this giant cluster you-know-what of a PVP scene. As soon as you have 2 melee on you, and can't get any peels as a healer or non-OP ranged... you are 100% going to lose if they are competent with gap closers/burst/etc.

I compare it heavily to Mists of Pandaria PVP, and I think that's what they were shooting for with this xpack's style of PVP... ok, we can't balance the classes? Just make everyone OP! Except a few... make them eat dirt the entire expansion. Better yet, buy a boost! Go back and look at MoP PvP...*almost* everyone has insano burst at the touch of 1-2 buttons. The game was more balanced then though. This is actually worse. And melee own ranged, HARD. Coming from a "melee guy", I mostly play melee. They're way over the top.

EDIT: Fury is a perfect example. Oh man, it's the Fury SPEC. We have to make it ALL about burst damage, and little to no consistent damage. They will not resemble a Warrior, but more of a poor man's Demon Hunter with low defense. Why not make Fury an actual, viable spec, instead of a one-trick pony. Let me tell you this... my first main in Legion is Fury, I quit him because the PVP was so faceroll. But that's all you can do. You're not a Warrior, you're a Fury Thing. Lol


I think you missed the point of this post. Which I guess was to argue semantics.
05/26/2018 11:45 AMPosted by Jourdan
Like, from a long time WoW player. This is my 2nd account so my early days of Wrath and the end of TBC aren't gonna show up on my characters' achievement page or whatever. But I've never seen PVP so imbalanced across the board. It's just not 1-4 classes rolling everyone, there are so many OP specs that it creates this giant cluster you-know-what of a PVP scene. As soon as you have 2 melee on you, and can't get any peels as a healer or non-OP ranged... you are 100% going to lose if they are competent with gap closers/burst/etc.

I compare it heavily to Mists of Pandaria PVP, and I think that's what they were shooting for with this xpack's style of PVP... ok, we can't balance the classes? Just make everyone OP! Except a few... make them eat dirt the entire expansion. Better yet, buy a boost! Go back and look at MoP PvP...*almost* everyone has insano burst at the touch of 1-2 buttons. The game was more balanced then though. This is actually worse. And melee own ranged, HARD. Coming from a "melee guy", I mostly play melee. They're way over the top.

EDIT: Fury is a perfect example. Oh man, it's the Fury SPEC. We have to make it ALL about burst damage, and little to no consistent damage. They will not resemble a Warrior, but more of a poor man's Demon Hunter with low defense. Why not make Fury an actual, viable spec, instead of a one-trick pony. Let me tell you this... my first main in Legion is Fury, I quit him because the PVP was so faceroll. But that's all you can do. You're not a Warrior, you're a Fury Thing. Lol


I think you missed the point of this post. Which I guess was to argue semantics.


Umm...I think you mean thread.

:D
05/26/2018 11:54 AMPosted by Lilywhite
Umm...I think you mean thread.

:D


I see what you did there. Clever.
05/26/2018 10:01 AMPosted by Laethra
At this point they feel more like subclasses. In fact, base classes don't even exist anymore. Using Rogues as an example, a Rogue used to be a master of stealth, poisons, and guile. Every Rogue could do these, but some chose to specialize in poisons, some in stealth, etc. Now learning one means you almost completely forget the others. It feels very akin to the subclasses of other MMOs.

This could only come from a Rogue, the class that was basically single-spec for most of WoW's history. Now suddenly your specs are ALMOST* as diverse as every other class's specs have been for the whole game and it feels weird to you.

Cue dramatic eye roll.

(*I say "almost" because sub & assassination are still basically the same thing. "I stealth with dots!" "I stealth with on-hit damage!" They should merge them and bring back combat as a true swashbuckler spec. Then it would be Pirate, Ninja, & Swashbuckler. Poison ninja vs stabby ninja is a talent tier, not a new spec.)
non issue. your question is not the point of thread

either its a veiled thread 'HOMGENIZED CLASSES / NO BUTTONS'

or trolling.
05/26/2018 10:06 AMPosted by Mortis
to change freely by going to a city or reading a book.


and magically forget how to do the last one

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