Blizzard, You Rushed Battle for Azeroth

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Totally agree. It feels like they pushed out a beta build, and figured they could fix or tune whatever they didn't polish over the next couple of weeks. Which is unsatisfactory in my opinion. But they are probably thinking, why pay people to test their product when paying customers can do it for them instead? Pretty sick mentality, in my opinion. They need to get back to quality over quantity.
07/23/2018 06:02 PMPosted by Furrballs
Huge wall of text, wtb short version that will actually be read

I'll help you understand it. OP is basically saying:


You rushed Battle for Azeroth. You’ve been rushing it since you announced it at BlizzCon in November.

The breadth and depth of the systems changes in this pre-patch were ambitious. As I consider the changes in the pre-patch, it seems this was the largest set of systems changes ever made to the game at one time. I understand that Cataclysm’s Launch re-worked the old world and re-worked all the quest lines in the old kingdoms. But this pre-patch was larger, I believe.

Systems changed in the pre-patch:
Class and Spec Changes for all Classes and Specs
Stat Squish for all Players, NPC’s, Items and Spells in the game
Loot changes for current and legacy encounters
Artifact Weapon removal
Rework of all quest lines requiring a number of Artifact Traits
Removal of First Aid as a Profession but not quests that require First Aid items
Removal of PvP Servers / Addition of War Mode
Conversion of Prestige System to the Honor System
Making Honor Gains Account Wide
New Guild Interface
Introduction of Communities in game
Introduction of New Achievements and Rewards
Removal of Full Screen (For . . . Reasons)
New User Interface
Pet Charm Currency Changes
I’m sure I missed some of the changes

Most of these changes had serious issues at pre-patch. Many of these changes still have issues, a week later.

Legion’s content rollout was amazing – one of your biggest successes. To have content rolling out on a consistent basis was probably a big boost to your confidence regarding how quickly, efficiently and effectively you can roll out new content. I think you have that down pat and look forward to the content roll out of Battle for Azeroth. Unfortunately, pre-patch is not a content update, it’s a systems update.

I imagine there should be a NASA like “Go / No Go” meeting before every major step in the launch process. And every group touching the launch should give a “Go” or “No Go” to move forward with the current launch time line. If you are having those types of meetings, then they failed you this time around. I feel like Ragnaros should have been somewhere saying, “Too Soon!” All the random Pandaren you interact with should be saying, “Slow Down!”

I thought that the Battle for Azeroth announcement at BlizzCon was very light compared to the Legion announcement at GamesCon and especially the presentation at the subsequent Blizzcon. I thought at the time, the earliest launch could happen were the Fall, if Beta started right after Blizzcon. Alpha did not start until January and Beta did not start until April. I believe all of your other Betas started at least 6 months before launch. Legion was announced at GamesCon, presented at Blizzcon, had Alpha released right after Blizzcon, Beta by the first of the year and released in September. Battle for Azeroth’s launch timeline was super compressed. And yeah, you have more people working on the game than ever before but this is also the largest set of systems changes ever made to the game.

With the number of systems changed, some bugs were to be expected, but the large number of prominent bugs in the major systems should have kept this pre-patch from being delivered. It seems many of the major systems were not even fully tested or evaluated. Specifically, the tuning of Legion Dungeons and Raids, the tuning of Mount Dropping Legacy Raids, the Profession Levelling changes, and the new Guild Interface stand out as major failings. There are probably others. I’m sure you’re working on fixing them and I’m sure you’ll eventually get them all fixed. This too, shall pass. And you’ll get back to developing the next content to be rolled out and the next expansions. We may not see this amount of systems changes to the game ever again. We will likely see a stat squish in the expansion after the next expansion (2020) along with other systems changes and class and spec redesigns. Please learn from this and use these lessons for all subsequent pre-patches.

Give yourself enough time. Plan for a long tail to the expansion. Embrace a long tail to the expansion. Give players something new to do in the tail of the expansion. Create crossover content in other games with in game WoW rewards (Primal Flamesaber, Graves, etc.). Introduce a new dungeon or raid (Ruby Sanctum). (Could the Silithis quest line have been a dungeon with replayability and sweet loot rather than a quest line?) Introduce a new brawl. (Could Seething Shore have a new Brawl associate with it?) Introduce a “Loremaster Buff” that gives you four times (or ten times) the experience in specific regions of the world (Eastern Kingdoms or Kalimdor, Outlands or Northrend, Cataclysm or Pandaria, Draenor or Broken Shore – not the whole world so people can choose to take advantage of or to not take advantage of the buff). These are just a few ideas. Don’t rush the pre-patch, again. Don’t rush the launch again. Don't make these mistakes again.

I’m counting on you and believe in you.

Neall on Medivh
Guys even Ion Hazzikostas said during the Q&A that the patch that was delivered was not up to Blizzard standards. Don't harp on the OP because they're a Forum MVP that is being critical of Blizz. This patch was one of if not the most technically broken patches Blizz has ever put into the game. It's not a game killer by any means it's just a patch where Blizz bit off more than they could chew but still tried to anyways.
07/23/2018 06:06 PMPosted by Azerite
Also, honestly this. Pre-patch was buggy. Yes. It's having some issues.

Except they don't really learn! people give feedback on alpha/beta and they just ignore it and here we're paying the consecuences (AGAIN) because they dont like the feedback or just don't care.

"some issues" is way too kind here.. specially when the game was fine before the pre patch.. the only thing I do enjoy from the patch right now is the legacy loot on old raids

because class wise we're ALL playing twinks right now.
07/23/2018 06:03 PMPosted by Ramshad
Believing that most of the developers have a great deal of say in when/how an expansion is launched is naive. The major shareholders, board members, and business leaders are the ones who make these types of calls in any publicly-traded company (unless, of course, the developers are also these same people!).

For reasons we do not know (and cannot know without insider knowledge), they estimated that the financial gain of releasing BFA at this time was higher than delaying it. They likely also estimated that any potential loss of subscribers due to early bugs would be either: A, temporary; B, not enough to cancel out the positive cash flow of releasing the expansion now.

So, while you can say, "Oh Blizzard, please take your time and release games later when they're perfect" all day long, that completely ignores the real and infinitely more pressing financial concerns of the company at large. The only way the company will change its policy is if, and only if, the drawbacks to releasing games "early" (in whoever's opinion that is) are more financially deleterious than any positives from releasing "early."

This philosophy is the opposite of how Blizzard started.

I don't think BfA sales will live up to expectations.
I cant help but applaud this post OP. I would also add that camera anchor points for short races
07/23/2018 06:08 PMPosted by Dliver
07/23/2018 06:03 PMPosted by Snowfox
Maybe that's just how it is for disc priests though.

Well disc was spoiled in beta, which is kind of fair because Legion 7.0 wasn't kind to the spec. But disc isn't representative of most classes.

I gotta admit I like having an aoe again.
07/23/2018 06:14 PMPosted by Tresska
I cant help but applaud this post OP. I would also add that camera anchor points for short races
Please help us friends!

For those not aware, the anchor point got changed. Though it's likely a bug that it was changed for everyone, Gnomes, Dwarves, and Goblins got our point changed so our characters are super out of focus and the camera focuses on the dead space like 3 feet over our heads. It's even worse on vehicle quests or on certain mounts, like the Rogue class hall mount, and we end up playing being shoved down into the action bars.

This is our life now on the default cam. Zooming in and out replaces it with even worse issues.
07/23/2018 06:00 PMPosted by Clobberntime
Greens can disagree and are encouraged to. They just have to actually constructively post.

I do, of course, realize that. But how could I resist commenting on an exceedingly rare green criticism.
07/23/2018 06:02 PMPosted by Furrballs
Huge wall of text, wtb short version that will actually be read

Sad commentary on attention spans these days.
Rushed it? No way. I just returned from a 9 month hiatus and did 9 months of content in about 4 hours on Sunday. I hated Argus. Now I read that I have to do all this BS so that I can get the new races. I specifically did not plat 7.3 because I hated the content. Now I have to do that content to play new stuff in 8.0?? So dumb.
I play wow for the story lately the last time i got into raiding was wotlk i started in bc for a bit but eve online took most of my time when i read this i agree this patch sucked and they rushed it .....but i know they will get it right its very much like cata the dungeons ......yeah it was tough but they fixed it and now they are streamlining the stat smash so next time it wont suck...

I am not defending blizz they needed more time more testing its gonna suck ...but as long as they fix it ill stay if not ...well eve online, ff14, and a host of other games will make me happy

Wow is like a marriage and right now we are having a fight its not the 1st one but we hope its the last
07/23/2018 06:01 PMPosted by Vercalis
I expect more than doom and gloom and pessimism from an MVP.


It's quite refreshing to see one that isn't a Blizzard mouthpiece.

I agree with the OP 100%.
We need more greens like this one, greens that actually speak up for what they think instead of ones just trying to keep the color of their text.

I'd give you a +1 even if I didn't agree with you, OP, except I do agree with you.
Anyone who thinks shareholders and board members dictate release dates and the speed of development have zero clue on this good earth how corporate governance works,
I couldn't agree with the OP more. BfA was too fast and was like, rushed right into it, and it wouldn't off bothered me if they took there time, looking at everything. After all, WoW is a big game, and if the devs took the time to see through the prepatch, test everything right, there wouldn't any issues, or only small issues that aren't a biggy.
How long til that pretty green text is revoked now yeh figure?
Contrary to what is apparently a popular belief -- that Blizzard is deliberately just halfway slapping stuff together and shooting it onto live servers in some drunk redneckish 'here goes nothing!' fashion, and then lapsing into frenzied laughter when something doesn't work right -- I actually think that the problems we experience are not planned, are not always preventable, and that every effort is made to remedy them quickly.
07/23/2018 06:31 PMPosted by Derka
Anyone who thinks shareholders and board members dictate release dates and the speed of development have zero clue on this good earth how corporate governance works,

throwing some "humanity" here is throwing more fuel to the fire..

it's a big company there's not enough communication right now and they said they would improve that the result is it's worse now.

how complicated can things be when you could send your CMs (ALL OF THEM) to the alpha/beta and start interacting with feedback.. not only on certain feedback.. I don't get paid to help them to deal with this things it's on them.

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