Some numbers proving how broken 1.12 is

Classic Discussion
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08/04/2018 08:35 AMPosted by Gruoranfang
08/04/2018 06:43 AMPosted by Rahkur
What people forget about Vanilla is that Warriors were the most painful class to level by a large margin. Slow and VERY gear dependent.
Those 81,864 Warriors are powerful in the end but they worked their butts off to get there.
agree also private server the character is boost level60 having all the gear , i invite all crying baby making warrior for classic lolol be prepare for a hard awakening , so much retail noob post using low level make me laugh and think to know everything about classic :)
no change classic is alright

Gesundheit.
08/04/2018 08:35 AMPosted by Gruoranfang
08/04/2018 06:43 AMPosted by Rahkur
What people forget about Vanilla is that Warriors were the most painful class to level by a large margin. Slow and VERY gear dependent.
Those 81,864 Warriors are powerful in the end but they worked their butts off to get there.
agree also private server the character is boost level60 having all the gear , i invite all crying baby making warrior for classic lolol be prepare for a hard awakening , so much retail noob post using low level make me laugh and think to know everything about classic :)
no change classic is alright


"Warrior so hard"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPBsAyzuZgM
08/04/2018 09:09 AMPosted by Dëathjëster
08/04/2018 08:35 AMPosted by Gruoranfang
...agree also private server the character is boost level60 having all the gear , i invite all crying baby making warrior for classic lolol be prepare for a hard awakening , so much retail noob post using low level make me laugh and think to know everything about classic :)
no change classic is alright


"Warrior so hard"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPBsAyzuZgM
you play warrior in classic ? in 2004 ? me yes i know what i`m talking , you idk :)
08/04/2018 08:02 AMPosted by Dëathjëster
08/03/2018 05:32 PMPosted by Åpocalypse
...

You don't level fury with dual weild, you use a 2hander which makes it exactly the same hit rate as arms, only better because you deal substantially more damage..via better damage boosting talents.

Arms is pretty substantially inferior pre 40.... and arguably even pre 60 given how it pigeonholes you into a weapon type.

That of course assumes the sit to proc enrage thing actually worked in OG vanilla (never played a warrior back then), and isn't just a pserver only thing like Rogues being able to strafe-backstab mobs... but yeah the Fury tree substantially improves leveling speed/killing power better than anything arms really has until weapon specs and mortal strike..... Tactical Mastery is required later on, but you rarely if ever, stance swap pre beserker stance that I've seen.


Nope. This is the only talent tree you need before 60 and raiding and you can use this for tanking 5 mans, ranking pvp. I don't think you people realize just how powerful sweeping strikes whirlwind is or realize how many dodges you get where you can overpower mobs. In addition the range on demo shout with this is stupid. You will wtfpwn every rogue you see and reveal them on their restealth and they will panic. It's actually pathetic how bad warriors are at their class. I blame one handed fury, which made the class playable by people who had no idea what they were doing.

https://classicwowtalents.appspot.com/?talent=11215875_1_80230502133251d3155c0131005x
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzQ4P6huu6M

In before you talk about dpsing in a 5 man, when if you are dpsing in a 5 man you are playing the class wrong and wasting time for no reason when you could say "LFM tank" and have a group within a minute.

The funny thing is you don't need the broken fury spec to level fast, pvp. It's the WRONG SPEC anyways. It just a raiding spec that breaks raids and lets bad players compete in pvp and people are defending it and or don't want something that never happened in real WoW (broken fury talents with threat not mattering) nerfed.

I guarantee the people who ran the 1.12 privates or donated the most money mained warriors. It's the only explanation for the idiocy and broken state they have warriors in.

What's worse is a lot of the big streamers who will be playing warrior will also inject their BS bias into this and are claiming this is "no changes".


I used that build a lot for max level PvP in vanilla, but that is NOT the best spec for leveling especially early on. Not sure why you are insisting that it is I guess you just really hate fury! From levels 1-30 your crit rate is not high enough for deep wounds and impale to happen much...most mobs dodge 5% of the time so overpower won't be seeing much action either. The real advantage of going arms at the early levels is tactical mastery and anger management. But by doing so you lose piercing howl, blood craze and enrage and that really sucks. Mobs will crit you a lot more at the lower levels that's why I consider fury the best below 30.

Now I will agree with you that once arms gets sweeping strikes it becomes the most efficient...that ability really speeds things up with pulling 2 at a time. That also happens to be around the time you get the whirlwind axe heheh.
08/04/2018 05:02 AMPosted by Koushi
08/04/2018 04:59 AMPosted by Caelle
They were a heck of a lot easier to level when you had a main that could bank roll them and keep them in good gear.

Or willing to tank dungeons on occasion.


That also requires a certain level of luck, which sadly in Vanilla the RNG gods did not love me. However, you could get items off the AH that really filled in gaps and made things much easier.
Are those max-level stats? I only ask because I remember during classic that warriors were extremely popular until about level 40, when they started to disappear over time.

At 60, only the ballers were still warriors.
08/01/2018 02:42 PMPosted by Padrepwn
have the healer rip threat from the tank and wipe the group. It happened. lol

[/quote]

...I may or may not have had that happen, yes....>.<
08/04/2018 07:19 PMPosted by Idun
08/01/2018 02:42 PMPosted by Padrepwn
have the healer rip threat from the tank and wipe the group. It happened. lol

...I may or may not have had that happen, yes....>.<

I may or may not have used my heals to generate threat on my paladin before they ner*cough* I mean fixed threat on paladin heals.
08/04/2018 10:30 AMPosted by Ziegfried
08/04/2018 08:02 AMPosted by Dëathjëster
...

Nope. This is the only talent tree you need before 60 and raiding and you can use this for tanking 5 mans, ranking pvp. I don't think you people realize just how powerful sweeping strikes whirlwind is or realize how many dodges you get where you can overpower mobs. In addition the range on demo shout with this is stupid. You will wtfpwn every rogue you see and reveal them on their restealth and they will panic. It's actually pathetic how bad warriors are at their class. I blame one handed fury, which made the class playable by people who had no idea what they were doing.

https://classicwowtalents.appspot.com/?talent=11215875_1_80230502133251d3155c0131005x
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzQ4P6huu6M

In before you talk about dpsing in a 5 man, when if you are dpsing in a 5 man you are playing the class wrong and wasting time for no reason when you could say "LFM tank" and have a group within a minute.

The funny thing is you don't need the broken fury spec to level fast, pvp. It's the WRONG SPEC anyways. It just a raiding spec that breaks raids and lets bad players compete in pvp and people are defending it and or don't want something that never happened in real WoW (broken fury talents with threat not mattering) nerfed.

I guarantee the people who ran the 1.12 privates or donated the most money mained warriors. It's the only explanation for the idiocy and broken state they have warriors in.

What's worse is a lot of the big streamers who will be playing warrior will also inject their BS bias into this and are claiming this is "no changes".


I used that build a lot for max level PvP in vanilla, but that is NOT the best spec for leveling especially early on. Not sure why you are insisting that it is I guess you just really hate fury! From levels 1-30 your crit rate is not high enough for deep wounds and impale to happen much...most mobs dodge 5% of the time so overpower won't be seeing much action either. The real advantage of going arms at the early levels is tactical mastery and anger management. But by doing so you lose piercing howl, blood craze and enrage and that really sucks. Mobs will crit you a lot more at the lower levels that's why I consider fury the best below 30.

Now I will agree with you that once arms gets sweeping strikes it becomes the most efficient...that ability really speeds things up with pulling 2 at a time. That also happens to be around the time you get the whirlwind axe heheh.
One thing I do remember as a Tauren, sweeping strikes did not add extra attacks to adjacent mobs. That's right, whether you used sweeping strikes or not, you would do exactly the same damage, same damage to your current target, and zero damage to the mob next to it. I believe all other races did NOT have the same problem, and sweeping strikes was amazing.

Wonder if this bug will get fixed.
08/04/2018 01:23 PMPosted by Caelle
08/04/2018 05:02 AMPosted by Koushi
...
Or willing to tank dungeons on occasion.


That also requires a certain level of luck, which sadly in Vanilla the RNG gods did not love me. However, you could get items off the AH that really filled in gaps and made things much easier.


You make up for the lack of luck by being able to spam exactly what dungeon you want over and over. I've never had issues gearing up tank's and coudl normally gear up my dps spec at the same with hand me downs from my group mates.
08/01/2018 12:54 PMPosted by Felslayer
Anecdotal evidence is worthless.


but hundreds of thousands of data points as provided by the OP offer statistical significance.
Good Luck trying to gear out a warrior.

Having so many roll against you.

not only that but having a raid spot will be hard,

Most of the gear at the start SHOULD go to the main tanks since they will need it to hold threat for a progression guild.

I can see being a Healer spec being very good. Specially druids. Druids are gonna get geared up so fast as a healer. i think feral would have to compete with Rogues/hunters so that would suck !@# even more then warriors.

Restro shamans will be a good option.

As for dps i think warlocks will get a nice raid spot since they bring so much to a raid and are less common then a mage. Also they will reach 60 first being raid ready faster.

I don’t see tanks being a shortage in classic this time around. But i do see healers being a shortage.

Being a priest healer on horde is going to be gold.

Ranks on how easy it will be to get into a raid spot
1. Holy priest
2. Restro Druid
3. Restro shaman
4. Warlock
5. Mage
6. Rogue
7. Warrior
8. Hunter

I think hunters are going to have a harder time since you only need a few where you would want more rogues,warriors and hunters scale the worst of any class.

I’d play top 5 classes on my list if you actually want to gear up fast. Or you can be the Guild master and be the main tank and tell the guild you need the gear first and to gear out a priest healer first. But this would be hard.
i created 30 characters across two accounts to keep names for friends that never ended up playing. Guess what class they were...

warrior.

i also had 2 bank alts, guess what class...

warrior.
Pserver and real server representation will certainly not be the game. People on the Pservers tend to already be very familiar with vanilla WoW and have specific goals in mind. Normal servers will be filled with people who want to play something just for the hell of it. And of course, many who get to rise to 60 to find out that no, no one wants your ret paladin or balance druid.
08/30/2018 06:09 AMPosted by Sickn
Good Luck trying to gear out a warrior.

Having so many roll against you.

not only that but having a raid spot will be hard,

Most of the gear at the start SHOULD go to the main tanks since they will need it to hold threat for a progression guild.

I can see being a Healer spec being very good. Specially druids. Druids are gonna get geared up so fast as a healer. i think feral would have to compete with Rogues/hunters so that would suck !@# even more then warriors.

Restro shamans will be a good option.

As for dps i think warlocks will get a nice raid spot since they bring so much to a raid and are less common then a mage. Also they will reach 60 first being raid ready faster.

I don’t see tanks being a shortage in classic this time around. But i do see healers being a shortage.

Being a priest healer on horde is going to be gold.

Ranks on how easy it will be to get into a raid spot
1. Holy priest
2. Restro Druid
3. Restro shaman
4. Warlock
5. Mage
6. Rogue
7. Warrior
8. Hunter

I think hunters are going to have a harder time since you only need a few where you would want more rogues,warriors and hunters scale the worst of any class.

I’d play top 5 classes on my list if you actually want to gear up fast. Or you can be the Guild master and be the main tank and tell the guild you need the gear first and to gear out a priest healer first. But this would be hard.


Given that warriors will also receive more of the raid slots their massive increase in population won’t necessarily make it too much more difficult for them to raid.
People are going to be in for a rude awakening when they expect to be an epicly geared warrior with 2-3 hours schedule.
The more warriors, the less gear to go around as well.
why do people only think of vanilla at endgame?

for the vast majority of players vanilla will mostly be about leveling , alts , and professions.

vanilla class balance was not about end game raiding blizzard stated this at the first bliz con.

stop trying to change vanilla.

endgame is not vanilla. it's a small part of it.
08/01/2018 12:21 PMPosted by Dëathjëster
This is what happens when you have patch 1.9, 1.11 for warriors/rogues in at launch. Compare the combined MC-AQ result to Naxx.
https://legacyplayers.com/Raids/Ranking/Default.aspx

Naxx was why those changes were made and why you see more classes represented. Pretty apparent the game is broken due to 1.12 warrior/rogue and threat changes being inserted into old raids.

What happens due to this. Population from FRESH.
Warrior 81,864
Mage 41,964
Rogue 39, 138
Hunter 37,088
Warlock 28,673
Priests 26,476
Druid 19,460
Paladin 18,215
Shaman 16,263

You can do better than these scuffed private servers Blizzard.


but its still better than live fam.
I'm curious what naxxramas would be like without naxxramas patch threat changes.

I dont want to do raids pre-naxxramas with naxxramas threat changes, so if they fixed it i would be ok with it.

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