Serious Question for PvPers

General Discussion
It is no different the the people who get their jollies kicking people in dungeons because they don’t have high enough dps to be leet.

But sides of this coins have dumbos on it.
08/02/2018 12:03 PMPosted by Aruenn
You are getting baited hard by everything.

There is obviously no skill involved, it's just to irritate people and have fun irritating them. When people say get good, they are trolling you.

/thread


So Blizzard allows and encourages trolls then? They don't do anything about this, they encourage the griefing of others?

Sounds like I need to revert my attention to the real problem, Blizzard.
I haven't PvP'd much in the last 2 expansions. I did Warmode in a raid group the other night in Darkshore and had a BLAST!!!! That said, in the past I have seen things you will never see in a raid environment.

Before CRZ when we had battle groups, there was an Undead Mage that was just unbelievable. He could take on half the BG by himself. Really skilled with his class and did things I didn't know were possible with a mage.

Then there was the Orc Warrior that took on 15 people in Westfall during Wrath and killed everyone of them at least 5 times a piece before they left. It was fun to watch even while losing.

There are many more examples, but these two show the skill some people have at PvP.
08/02/2018 12:03 PMPosted by Aruenn
You are getting baited hard by everything.

There is obviously no skill involved, it's just to irritate people and have fun irritating them. When people say get good, they are trolling you.

/thread


How am I getting baited? It's a question, it's dumb comments and wording like this that doesn't' make sense.

You call it baiting, but it's literally just a question that came into my head. This "baiting" or simply responding like "Haha, I just trolling" means you literally weren't trolling and were very serious, but then couldn't think of anything else to say.

I notice these trolls become "trolls" or were just baiting people when you start using logical/common sense thinking.

It's a defense mechanism for these "trolls". They automatically revert to acting like they were trolling because their actions were destroyed with common sense. What doesn't work along common sense? Oh right, "trolls".
I do it to keep the Horde vs Alliance spirit alive. I am also more inclined to engage in player vs player conflicts (gank is such a crude and one dimensional description) now because you essentially have zero reason to get ganked. You actually have to opt into PvP to get ganked.

So if I happen to see you, and one of us gets ganked, go find some friends and ill get mine, and together we will turn Azeroth into a garden of skeletons.
08/02/2018 12:08 PMPosted by Babeolicious
Then there was the Orc Warrior that took on 15 people in Westfall during Wrath and killed everyone of them at least 5 times a piece before they left. It was fun to watch even while losing.

There are many more examples, but these two show the skill some people have at PvP.


There was a character named Ladaa (Spelling may be wrong) on Earthen Ring. Back in Wrath she/he used to Own Stormwind by themselves or with 5 others, including destroying the boss and players alike all at the same time.

I really enjoyed fighting against them, I really enjoyed trying to ward off this "elite" warriors in my eyes. I loved attacking this crew and would die many many times.

I don't care about dying, that's not the issue here. I just dislike the imbalance upon things. People complained about uneven sides... yet when the opportunity arises to actually do some even playing field games and wars... nobody even does them (people do, but it's more rare).

People say they want fun world PvP, they want to gank and gank and gank it seems. That's my point.
What war fantasy is this crushing for you.

The John Wayne hero fantasy where theres honor in battle and one great and skilled hero can persevere?

Never true and won't ever be true.

Overwhelming force, voice coms, and organization, almost always wins.

And the exercise doesn't have to be fun - just profitable. As long as the game makes it advantageous from an achievement and/or resource collection perspective to gank there will be ganking.

If you have an issue with it you have two choices. Avoid being a victim by not PvPing or join a group and be the ganker.

Its never been easier to avoid PvP if you don't like it.
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth
Do you think it's actual skill to gank someone? Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?


The disconnect couldn't be more obvious in this one sentence.

Who thinks its skill to gank someone? It's fun. That's it, there's no more to read into it.

Ganking is fun
When wpvp is even numbers it's a lot of fun. When it's unbalanced, it gets boring fast.

I would say ask in general if anyone will group with you to kill a Horde 5 man that just ganked you and see if you get some takers. If not, post Darkshore PvP (or whatever) in LFG. You'll get some help fast. Fight back. They burned our tree, man! Nothing gankers hate more than resistance. They'll run away. They always do.

Not sure if that directly answered your question but it's what I'd do instead of worrying about sharding because I can't do anything about that.
As much as I hate getting ganked by 5 players, it is my fault for going out in the world alone. If you are opted in for PVP you cannot always expect to get a 1 on 1. You have to prepare yourself mentally that you will probably die to a group of players. If you cannot handle that then you should get more friends to play with or call for help.

The enemy is the enemy. Sure it sucks but it is part of the game. If I am rolling in a group and we see a lonely flagged player he is going to die. I don't expect anyone to spare my life as well because to them I am the villain and I am to be killed on site.
OP, I think you are starting with a false premise, namely that you can use logic to embarrass somebody who enjoys ganking. Obviously, it is not a challenge. Some have already essentially said they do it to get a reaction from people. This motivation is something I personally don't understand. I generally leave other players alone. But some do see it as a kind of sport to get a rise out of other players.
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth
This isn't trying to insult or be rude to anyone, I just have to ask straightly outward because I have no idea how to be nice about it.


I'm not either, I'm going to be honest with you, but I am thinking you wont like my answers.

Do you think it's actual skill to gank someone? Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?


They came prepared. They entered world PvP knowing that they would most likely have an advantage against people who were alone, or not with their group. My gear is all welfare gear. I'm also not very good, who knows maybe I'll lose a 2v1, I don't know. So if I go out flagged for World PVP (which is INCREDIBLY easy to turn off now) I go out prepared for it.

I do understand World PvP is hectic and is supposed to be crazy and huge. I understand that you will be singled out because it's smarter to do so. What I do NOT understand is literally running gank squads to power jump on 1 or 2 unsuspecting targets. Where is the fun in this? Where is the skill driven, intricate game play in this?


Again, they came prepared, I normally go out with two or three friends knowing we are going to run across people who might try and stop us. Out of curiosity, where does the line for "skilled" come in? You have better gear than me, so does that mean you're more skilled, even if we agree to a duel? What about class advantages? I'm normally resto, so I don't really output a lot of damage, but to most classes that can't heal in a straight 1v1 it's a game of attrition I win almost all the time. Is it because I'm skilled? No, just the nature of our classes.

I see a lot of responses are "get good", how so?


It's an easy response for trolling, I'd probably ignore them.

How do I prevent being ganked by a 5+ man squad? Say I did, how would I defend against that? Am I able to "get good" enough to defeat a 5-man vs me? I understand it's going to happen, but pretending to be actually skilled in doing so... why do you guys do that?


I'm not familiar with the Warlock as I haven't played in awhile, so I don't know what escape mechanics you may or may not have. If you can't get away and you die, get some friends. Find PUGs. In Vanilla my first real PvP experience that I remember was a 60 Paladin (on his epic mount which was rare at the time) chased me (a 20 or 30 something Shaman) from the shimmering flatts half way up the continent. Was it fair? No, but that's what happens when you're flagged for PvP.

It's not that I don't PvP, I am never a seriously skilled PvP, I occasionally dab in it when I find it balanced and entertaining (Which honestly was really MoP era for me). I love world PvP and huge battles that are pushed back and fourth.

However, this doesn't feel like PvP to me. PvP in my sense would be a battle back and forth, duels or squads battling it out. IT seems PvP in this game means simply ganking or getting more players to overrun them.


Then get something together. If you're going out on your own, and there is a huge Horde group murdering people, half of the equation for a big war is there. Put some time and effort into getting that set up.

Odd random question; why is sharding allowed? Seems to be an abuse of the systems.


No idea.
No. It takes absolutely 0 skill to gang kill someone. But that's got nothing to do with it.
08/02/2018 12:34 PMPosted by Zharanya
OP, I think you are starting with a false premise, namely that you can use logic to embarrass somebody who enjoys ganking. Obviously, it is not a challenge. Some have already essentially said they do it to get a reaction from people. This motivation is something I personally don't understand. I generally leave other players alone. But some do see it as a kind of sport to get a rise out of other players.


Ding ding but i was told my answer was not a real one when i said i enjoy the reaction. /shrug he said he wanted honest answers and got mad when i gave him one
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth


Do you think it's actual skill to gank someone? Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?


Yes. I will spend a lot of time in stealth working towards an opener that gives me the best chance to survive. My target(s) are almost always at or above par against me with a high chance of failure if I do not succeed. I scout ahead, I track, and I play a heavy game of situational awareness. I spend time itemizing correctly and I have a custom UI built specifically for Hunter stealth. I learn the terrain and most importantly my escape route is behind me - yours is not.

If you are referring to getting an open on an undergeared unskilled player who is at 50% health then no, but I rarely do this. That's your perspective not mine. In BfA War Mode I will no longer be allowing these people time though. The game is changing and "red means dead" is real now. I'm not sorry about that. At all.

Surviving a gank attempt takes skill. This also requires a certain level of preparation and awareness. Are you expecting to be attacked or are you in a lull questing as if you were in PVE? I don't think you have WPVP "skill" if you do not understand all this. I'm not trying to offend. I believe it.

08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth
Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?


I love winning a fight against two other players. It's the biggest rush you can get. What makes WPVP fun is it's situational asymmetry. It's unpredictable and it takes a different skill set to find victory, which is up to the player to define. Battleground fights are easy in comparison.

I think there's plenty of WPVP that "doesn't take skill" as well. But I try not to participate in that.
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth
Do you think it's actual skill to gank someone? Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?

War isnt about 'fair'. its about winning. so I get the gankers who are emotionally attached to the story line.
The ones that just do it to do it outside of that are clearly unable to beat players their own ilvl, so this is how the feel good about their ability to play the game.
its sad when you think about it.
dont hate the ganker. Pity him.
08/02/2018 12:51 PMPosted by Taienna
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth
Do you think it's actual skill to gank someone? Do you think going 2+ to 1 is actually fair or balanced?

War isnt about 'fair'. its about winning. so I get the gankers who are emotionally attached to the story line.
The ones that just do it to do it outside of that are clearly unable to beat players their own ilvl, so this is how the feel good about their ability to play the game.
its sad when you think about it.
dont hate the ganker. Pity him.


Not really. This reads to me like you justifying a loss. A winning attitude handles a loss well. They don't make excuses for it like this. If a skilled player beats you it's not because they were a sad person. If an unskilled player beats you, then that's on you. Good for them.

The death penalty in this game is trivial. BfA run back times are even less than in Legion. Pick yourself up and move. At it's worst 1 v 1 WPVP is a giant game of tag. That's still fun. At it's best it's rivalries with wins on both ends.
08/02/2018 11:55 AMPosted by Synneth


However, this doesn't feel like PvP to me. PvP in my sense would be a battle back and forth, duels or squads battling it out. IT seems PvP in this game means simply ganking or getting more players to overrun them.

[/quote]

That was squad PvP. They brought their squad. You apparently didn't. Group up and quest if that's the type of experience you want. My server has had a really interesting back and forth in Darkshore over the past few days. This morning the Alliance had a full raid group out there killing horde, taking crates, getting assassins on the map, etc. If you're only willing to play solo then you have to expect some resistance in a heavily populated, small zone, with a focus on PvP.
08/02/2018 01:00 PMPosted by Gandrah

That was squad PvP. They brought their squad. You apparently didn't.


I got your squad right here, buddy!

*throws an entire squad at you*

*splat*

:P

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