Remove ilvl scaling and NEVER bring it back

General Discussion
Prev 1 5 6 7 26 Next
Idk why everyone else is complaining because this scaling sucks worse for us priests than anybody else. We are the slowest leveling/questing class in the game and takes us forever to kill anything. Shadow can't even survive mobs so their dps is out of the question. I'm 338 disc priest and it takes forever to do world quests it absolutely sucks with scaling due to no AoE dps. I'm forced to have warmode on otherwise my dps is so trash it would take even longer. On top of killing things slow I am also forced to PvP every alliance in my path doing WQ in Kul Tiras and sometimes getting jumped by groups. The only work around for me is to team up with somebody to kill the mobs faster. At least I can offer a +15% dps increase and heals to whoever I team up with but it sucks that I can't really do anything solo in a timely manner. I literally logon everyday and I look at all the WQ for the day and it makes me just wanna log out and go play something else. But we all know that we are gated behind content if we don't do these chores so we do them anyway. I literally need a few beers and music to get through the few hours of daily world quests.
08/23/2018 05:16 AMPosted by Huggablysoft
08/23/2018 04:59 AMPosted by Byucknah
Know whats funny, is that I have said several times that I agree that the scaling is off and it needs to be tuned and yall seem to be ignoring that part completely just to keep an argument with me up.

And I've said that the tuning is irrelevant when the entire point of the scaling is to drag out content that became boring a year ago. Rather than create a stable ladder of difficulty for progression, where you meet a challenge, overcome the challenge, and proceed to the next challenge the design philosophy is to keep moving the rungs of that ladder while putting nothing at the top. That is horrid design.

ilevel scaling is a bad, lazy mechanic that has been tried in other games and has failed in every instance. It has nothing to do with being "good for the game", it has to do with dragging out bland, boring content. What would be good for the game is realizing that outdated content IS outdated and providing a variety of newer, more difficult content to replace it instead of rehashing the same boring garbage that people are sick to death of.

I have yet to hear an argument telling me why ilevel scaling is superior to providing new, more challenging content but am eager to hear it.


...as opposed to letting people remove the challange of the world in ~2 weeks...which would require 52 major patches per expansion since "release new challanging content!"
08/23/2018 04:19 AMPosted by Byucknah
I know that its a heated argument, and I know a lot of yall hate it, but hear me out.

While I think its currently overturned, it does kinda serve a purpose. Lets face it, in Legion and now in BfA iLvL is out of control. We are gaining so many iLvL compared to previous expansions that we quickly become unstoppable powerhouses in older content. By the time 7.3 rolled around I could 1 shot many of the 7.0 WQ enemies with my Judgement, and if it was not a one shot it was a 2 shot. All because iLvL gain was so out of control.

It does not help that there are so many different difficulties of content that they have to distinguish them somehow and as such inflation is through the roof!

While I get its hated, iLvL scaling helps with that issue by not making content extremely easy to out gear while also still being able to grow stronger. The alternative to scaling would instead be crunching ilvl gains between difficulties to the point where maybe normal dungeons gives 295, heroic 300, and mythic 305. At that point does that even feel rewarding or worth the extra difficulty.

Its a strange place we are in where there are just so many difficulties to content, Warforging and Titanforging, ect that the ilvl growth is out of hand.

I think it needs to be tuned, don't get me wrong. Its overturned in my opinion right now but the system serves a purpose and its basically to counter the absurd inflation of iLvL from all the different content difficulties.

Think of it this way, fresh 120 you have roughly 280-285 iLvL. Once raids open you will be able to get up to 400 iLvL. This is the first raid of the expansion, the Emerald Dream of the expansion. We probably have 4, give or take, more raids to go. I wouldn't be surprised, from a guess, if we don't end the expansion with an iLvL cap of close to 600, more doubling what you start 120 at! Without that scaling you would be able to sneeze at current expansion, previous patch, enemies and they would die.

Again, I understand the hate but it does serve a purpose. Even then, I agree its a bit rough right now and needs to be tuned. Its worse than when it was first introduced in Legion :S Some of the enemies just feel like damage sponges and then there are some that if you pull more than 3 you just get torn apart.


I'm not even going to agree or disagree with any of this. It really doesn't matter, the problem is that it still has problems. There were issues with it in Legion and we are having them in BFA.

I haven't really run into not being able to kill stuff. But if I can take gear off, and it's easier to kill something. Then the system is broken, it's just that simple. Now I know it's not that simple to fix, but they should have made sure it was working before they implemented it.

Now to the OP, someone seems to think they are pretty important. I'm not sure who you think you are. In my experience, Blizzard and most people don't react well to ultimatums. There are streamers out there that tens of thousands of viewers at a time that don't have that kinda juice. Who are you?
08/23/2018 05:24 AMPosted by Ephrael
08/23/2018 05:22 AMPosted by Hallinar
...

So literally the thing you've been denied every expansion?


I missed that bit in Cata where I had to wait to make a Worgen or a goblin...

Or that bit in MoP where I had to wait to make a pandaren ...


"Everything that is gated or not released" not
"The races to mot be locked behind an arbritary system"
08/23/2018 05:16 AMPosted by Huggablysoft
And I've said that the tuning is irrelevant when the entire point of the scaling is to drag out content that became boring a year ago

Scaling is a simple way to keep outdoor content like WQ's relevant for a longer period of time. Sure, it stretches out content but that's what MMO's do.

I like that we get scaled gear rewards and I understand the price of that is scaled mobs. The gear rewards cap eventually and it seems that the iLevel of the mobs does as well. Once you get to 340 iLevel and beyond the mobs and quests get easier and easier.
08/23/2018 04:19 AMPosted by Byucknah
Think of it this way, fresh 120 you have roughly 280-285 iLvL. Once raids open you will be able to get up to 400 iLvL. This is the first raid of the expansion, the Emerald Dream of the expansion. We probably have 4, give or take, more raids to go. I wouldn't be surprised, from a guess, if we don't end the expansion with an iLvL cap of close to 600, more doubling what you start 120 at! Without that scaling you would be able to sneeze at current expansion, previous patch, enemies and they would die.
As Ion said, "the fact that unequipping a piece of gear can ever be helpful is a bug in the system."
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20753795863?page=26
Scaling is too steep and needs to be adjusted.
08/23/2018 05:16 AMPosted by Byucknah
08/23/2018 05:05 AMPosted by Ephrael
Excuse me?

You are excused.

08/23/2018 05:05 AMPosted by Ephrael
I'm expecting to get the game I paid full price for.

What exactly are you not getting, what is it that you feel entitled to? To be able to 1 shot current content enemies in the 2nd week of an expansion launch for an MMORPG?
WE ARENT GETTING WHAT A MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERS WANTED AS CLEARLY EXPRESSED IN THE FORUMS. WE DIDNT GET WHAT WE WANTED WE GOT WHAT THE MODS WANTED.
08/23/2018 04:55 AMPosted by Ephrael
08/23/2018 04:38 AMPosted by Byucknah


Growing stronger is not a 0 or 1 situation of "0" not being stronger and "1" being stronger.

There is room for exponential growth where a fresh 120 in iLvL 295 may take 30 seconds to kill a single enemy while a 340 can do it in 20 seconds. That is still growth no matter how you look at it. And considering its only the second week and come September people will start working towards that big old 400 ilvl... What are you honestly expecting from week 2 of the expansion?

There are ways to express character growth outside of "Can I or can't I one shot this thing?" It can be a gradient of growth instead of large jumps, with the gradient becoming far more apparent in later patch cycles.

Its literally the second week of the game, you shouldn't be expecting to one shot anything. Like I said above though, I agree that the scaling may need some tuning right now though.


What a copout.

hey guys It's only the second week

...

hey guys it's only pre-patch

...

hey guys it's only beta

...

I think some can be forgiven for being a bit miffed that the game they paid for (in full) is being given to them in small doses over several years. That whole, "you'll get stronger just not right now" crap is the lowest form of sleaziness.


Cop out? Going into this expansion is like getting back into working out at the gym after getting out of shape. However, people want to be able to lift the largest weights and do the most intense workouts and think they are entitled to that because they used to work out and because they pay a gym membership.

Sorry, bud. You get stronger over time and eventually you'll be doing the things you want. You have to work at it. This isn't a one week process like some entitled people think it should be. If one week was all it took in an MMO to be the strongest, then said MMO would crash and burn because people would get bored QUICK. It's a grind, like an MMO should be. Just like the gym analogy.
08/23/2018 05:28 AMPosted by Krypollo
08/23/2018 05:16 AMPosted by Byucknah
...
You are excused.

...
What exactly are you not getting, what is it that you feel entitled to? To be able to 1 shot current content enemies in the 2nd week of an expansion launch for an MMORPG?
WE ARENT GETTING WHAT A MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERS WANTED AS CLEARLY EXPRESSED IN THE FORUMS. WE DIDNT GET WHAT WE WANTED WE GOT WHAT THE MODS WANTED.


Forum opinions have never been a good measure of playerbase wish's

It's an extremely small sample size that flips on a dime
08/23/2018 04:35 AMPosted by Orthane
08/23/2018 04:19 AMPosted by Byucknah
I know that its a heated argument, and I know a lot of yall hate it, but hear me out.

While I think its currently overturned, it does kinda serve a purpose. Lets face it, in Legion and now in BfA iLvL is out of control. We are gaining so many iLvL compared to previous expansions that we quickly become unstoppable powerhouses in older content. By the time 7.3 rolled around I could 1 shot many of the 7.0 WQ enemies with my Judgement, and if it was not a one shot it was a 2 shot. All because iLvL gain was so out of control.

It does not help that there are so many different difficulties of content that they have to distinguish them somehow and as such inflation is through the roof!

While I get its hated, iLvL scaling helps with that issue by not making content extremely easy to out gear while also still being able to grow stronger. The alternative to scaling would instead be crunching ilvl gains between difficulties to the point where maybe normal dungeons gives 295, heroic 300, and mythic 305. At that point does that even feel rewarding or worth the extra difficulty.

Its a strange place we are in where there are just so many difficulties to content, Warforging and Titanforging, ect that the ilvl growth is out of hand.

I think it needs to be tuned, don't get me wrong. Its overturned in my opinion right now but the system serves a purpose and its basically to counter the absurd inflation of iLvL from all the different content difficulties.

Think of it this way, fresh 120 you have roughly 280-285 iLvL. Once raids open you will be able to get up to 400 iLvL. This is the first raid of the expansion, the Emerald Dream of the expansion. We probably have 4, give or take, more raids to go. I wouldn't be surprised, from a guess, if we don't end the expansion with an iLvL cap of close to 600, more doubling what you start 120 at! Without that scaling you would be able to sneeze at current expansion, previous patch, enemies and they would die.

Again, I understand the hate but it does serve a purpose. Even then, I agree its a bit rough right now and needs to be tuned. Its worse than when it was first introduced in Legion :S Some of the enemies just feel like damage sponges and then there are some that if you pull more than 3 you just get torn apart.
That's a fair point, but the problem is that's kind of the point. By 7.3 you were decked out in full raid gear right? You're killing some of the most powerful demon lords the Burning Legion has to offer. So why should you not absolutely decimate some random deer in the middle of Azuna? Our characters SHOULD feel like unstoppable War Machines after we get even just decent gear. That's why they always add an extra area like Tanaan Jungle and Argus near the end of the expansion, so that it's difficult, but with enemies that make sense to be difficult. It doesn't make sense for me to help kill someone as powerful as Gorak Tul and then struggle to kill some overgrowm Spiders.
mmos never make sense. Its required for progression.

!@#$ my priest killed a elemental lord and an old god 60 levels ago.

She should of 1 shot sargeras by herself.

Its sort of like how in the pokemon anime pikachu should legit 1 shot the entire elite 4 by now but doesnt otherwise the story would be boring as %^-*.
08/23/2018 05:25 AMPosted by ßîtshîft
08/23/2018 05:16 AMPosted by Diro
...

Taking your ball and going home has never been an idiom that looked positivity on the child in question.


Acting like an arrogant narcissist who can't cope with someone having a different opinion has always looked poorly as well. In fact, much much worse.


?

o.O

Just because you have an opinion doesn't mean I have to accept it nor does it preclude my ability to argue against it or to point out it's flaws.

For example, I hate reputation grinding so much that I am refusing to grind reputation in BfA. Not even for flight. I can be critical and unrelenting of Ion's War on Flight without resorting to a scorched earth policy.
Remove this ilvl scaleing trash and never bring it back ok!
08/23/2018 05:31 AMPosted by Hallinar
08/23/2018 05:28 AMPosted by Krypollo
...WE ARENT GETTING WHAT A MAJORITY OF THE PLAYERS WANTED AS CLEARLY EXPRESSED IN THE FORUMS. WE DIDNT GET WHAT WE WANTED WE GOT WHAT THE MODS WANTED.


Forum opinions have never been a good measure of playerbase wish's

It's an extremely small sample size that flips on a dime


Actually quite the opposite. But hey, make stuff up to push your false narrative.

It's all the rage in this country over the lat 10 years.
The scaling is so low though. Like for every 10 “power” we gain, they only gain 2.5 “power”.

I mean I can obliterate most things fast or things that the game says I shouldn’t be able to do.
people are addicted to this game and want to feel powerful... scaling doesn't provide that until the NEAR VERY END of an expansion's life!!!....and they are going through Withdrawal like any other addiction!

Same as Legion....when did you start to feel powerful and start smashing mobs. When that happened... guess what,....Argus came out and it started again! lol... like you said there is always this treadmill of power you have to run on
08/23/2018 05:20 AMPosted by Vaeana
08/23/2018 05:17 AMPosted by Heilot
Do you honestly think you are meaningful to blizzard?
Darling this "threatening" is nothing but a child trowing a tantrum.
If you were important to blizzard you would use other methods to communicate with them and not this one.

You may have a couple of followers... But don't you think that you are THAT famous or important


No she is big time. She has made half the price of 1200 dollar graphics card. Guys, that's 600 whole dollars. 600!!!! That's big time folding money.


Lol its a little more than that sweaty.
Marriage proposals , offered a car , computers , money , pets , hair extensions.
This post isn't about me its about ilvl scaling I'm simply mentioning a boycott that's about to take place soon if Blizzard doesn't fix what's broken.
08/23/2018 05:32 AMPosted by ßîtshîft
<span class="truncated">...</span>

Forum opinions have never been a good measure of playerbase wish's

It's an extremely small sample size that flips on a dime


Actually quite the opposite. But hey, make stuff up to push your false narrative.

It's all the rage in this country over the lat 10 years.


Really? What % of the playerbase do you think actively uses the forums in a feedback sense of any kind?

It's not alot, forum engagement has always been minimal, unfortunately even in games where it is actively encouraged via ingame rewards and content catering to it engagement is always low

Most of the playerbase you'll find has never checked the forums, let alone posted what they wish
08/23/2018 05:33 AMPosted by Ashnylia
The scaling is so low though. Like for every 10 “power” we gain, they only gain 2.5 “power”.

I mean I can obliterate most things fast or things that the game says I shouldn’t be able to do.


I hit ilvl 315 on my rogue and it felt like I dropped 10 levels. The difference was that immense.

I haven't been able to login much since. It just simply isn't fun going backwards.

And STILL waiting on a weapon to drop. I haven't even seen a single weapon drop for *ANYONE* in probably 100 dungeons runs between my warlock and rogue.
08/23/2018 04:28 AMPosted by Clinkerbell
08/23/2018 04:22 AMPosted by Vaeana
Ultimatums always work with Blizzard.

But I guess if a bottom tier streamer is gonna boycott, they should be worried.

OP, if you are serious, stream yourself deleting everything and uninstalling the game. Otherwise you are just one of many people throwing and "I quit" tantrum while quietly slinking off to continue playing.

Also, are you sure you want your income to take a hit? Really sure? Because I can guarantee you that in a battle like this Blizzard will come out on top.


Lol a bottom tier streamer?
Oh lord I don't want to brag but lets just say I'm making quite a nice living , receive many gifts and I'm halfway in donations to a nvidia 2800 card.
I will take a hit not streaming wow but if I believe in my beliefs and take a stand others will follow.
Please never call me a low level streamer I'm quite popular.


If you have to brag about the stuff you get you are indeed a low-level streaming.
08/23/2018 05:31 AMPosted by Socra
08/23/2018 04:55 AMPosted by Ephrael
...

What a copout.

hey guys It's only the second week

...

hey guys it's only pre-patch

...

hey guys it's only beta

...

I think some can be forgiven for being a bit miffed that the game they paid for (in full) is being given to them in small doses over several years. That whole, "you'll get stronger just not right now" crap is the lowest form of sleaziness.


Cop out? Going into this expansion is like getting back into working out at the gym after getting out of shape. However, people want to be able to lift the largest weights and do the most intense workouts and think they are entitled to that because they used to work out and because they pay a gym membership.

Sorry, bud. You get stronger over time and eventually you'll be doing the things you want. You have to work at it. This isn't a one week process like some entitled people think it should be. If one week was all it took in an MMO to be the strongest, then said MMO would crash and burn because people would get bored QUICK. It's a grind, like an MMO should be. Just like the gym analogy.


Your gym analogy is terrible. It assumes I gave up my membership and stopped going to work out. If my character can't lift large weights it's because the gym owners (blizz) took away the weights and is expecting me to go run on the treadmill until they let people use the weights again. Despite paying for full gym membership.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum