MM feels terrible

Hunter
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I am such an idiot. I leveled from 110 to 120 using Marksmanship purely. It actually started off not too badly, but once I got to level 115 I noticed I was feeling weaker every level.

At 120, it was just pure hella. I was doing terrible damage and in the dungeon people who were 114 were doing more damage than me at 120.

I only wish I had known Beast Mastery was the bomb and I would have used that for leveling instead of MM. The moment I pulled more than 2 mobs in MM, I was usually for sure dead. In BM I can pull 10-15 mobs without a problem. My goodness, I could have leveled in HALF the time.

Blizzard--I am very angry with what you did to Marksmanship. MM used to be the Hunter standard, and now it's just pathetic.
I like being able to move around. I played mm in legion through the first two raids and just switched. I had had enough. Ive played mm on the dummies, and like this iteration more than the vulnerable nonsense last expansion. But I dont think I will play it this time around. Once you get used to movement its hard to go back to the turret.
08/16/2018 03:35 PMPosted by Sylvaron
08/15/2018 06:58 PMPosted by Eckoh
Is BM easier, sure...


Are you serious? Not saying BM is hard, just have to get the timing down on Barbed Shot.. but MM is door knob stupidly easy to play. It’s a pretty brain dead spec IMO.


This, BM takes more skill than MM, IMO. Getting barbed shot of at the very last second with this long GCD change is way harder than just glancing down to see if aim shot is off cd and if its not just spam arcane.
I'm enjoying MM, tho losing the stun on Binding shot hurts. And it feels very bad for pvp, to the point I walk in the word on BM.
08/16/2018 06:01 PMPosted by Lori
I'm enjoying MM, tho losing the stun on Binding shot hurts. And it feels very bad for pvp, to the point I walk in the word on BM.


BM and Survival both have 4 sec baseline stuns. I would check out BM however i completely understand standing by the ranger lone wolf play style as i usually prefer it.

The rotation is a little bit too bland for me at the moment and BMs utility is too strong compared to MM in pvp.
08/16/2018 06:18 PMPosted by Chillmeister
08/16/2018 06:01 PMPosted by Lori
I'm enjoying MM, tho losing the stun on Binding shot hurts. And it feels very bad for pvp, to the point I walk in the word on BM.


BM and Survival both have 4 sec baseline stuns. I would check out BM however i completely understand standing by the ranger lone wolf play style as i usually prefer it.

The rotation is a little bit too bland for me at the moment and BMs utility is too strong compared to MM in pvp.


thats my issue personally, ive always enjoyed the feel of marks because to me it was always that archer/rifleman fantasy, but with its utility issues ive been debating on bm, but ive never really enjoyed the flavor of it (i guess i can use my hawk pet and pretend im a falconer but still)
08/14/2018 09:10 AMPosted by Eckoh
08/14/2018 09:03 AMPosted by Kabbie
MM feels...odd while questing. Opening with a two second cast doesn’t feel all that great.
but that first shot kills the target


Sometimes... most of the times it will hit for like 7 k
MM feels very clunky and slow. Aimed shot needs to go back to instant cast.
I actually find MM AOE quite decent in group content, and it's pretty much the only reason my dps is competitive there though, due to how often Trick Shot is up.

MM feels incredibly slow and weak while questing/doing world content. Sure, you're gonna get through it all with nary a scratch, 'cause you can use a pet to tank everything, but man...you don't realize how bad it is until you start leveling your other dps class alts.
MM hasn't felt good since WoD, and MM+SV in general feel like specs that Blizzard doesn't know what to do with, so they just throw misc changes at the wall and see what sticks. At least SV is feeling decent now, although I'd still trade it for WoD SV in a heartbeat.
08/16/2018 05:37 PMPosted by Volley
I am such an idiot. I leveled from 110 to 120 using Marksmanship purely. It actually started off not too badly, but once I got to level 115 I noticed I was feeling weaker every level.

At 120, it was just pure hella. I was doing terrible damage and in the dungeon people who were 114 were doing more damage than me at 120.


The way the scaling works for leveling characters means that a <120 char is actually more powerful than a 120 without it. Basically they get scaled to an ilvl significantly higher than a new 120 will probably have.

In legion I was romping all over rares while leveling, but hit 120 and I was getting racked up by them. I also ran some dungeons where another hunter who could never touch me for DPS, was actually beating me on some fights when I was a new 110 and they were still leveling. I don't think things were back to where where I was when leveling until I hit about 840-850 ilvl.

I haven't hit 120 just yet, but should tonight and I'm pretty sure it's the same thing.
08/17/2018 01:00 AMPosted by Winafred
MM feels very clunky and slow. Aimed shot needs to go back to instant cast.


In current tuning that would be the most overpowered thing ever
08/14/2018 06:55 AMPosted by Hayted
I’m having fun with 1 shot 33k crits lvl 112 PvE wise I haven’t tried in PvP and I’m scared to do so with the recent nerf it is slow. They can leave it the way it is but increase the damage a bit make it on par with top dps spec that’s all I ask since is hard to dps on mobile fights.


If I gave you a button that took 3 seconds to cast and did 50k msg and nothing else in the toolkit would this be fun to you?

I don’t understand the logic of big hits = fun.
08/14/2018 01:04 PMPosted by Insanium
Dude. I've been feeling it OP. Our ability pool feels very limited at the moment. I was leveling a rogue till launch and it's 57.. at that level i have more control in fights than this hunter does at 112. I've been playing hunter since BC but skipped out of WoD. Came back and the whole class is GARBAGE now. Thinking about switching to rogue entirely.

PS, mobility is dead and running away from other players is MUCH harder now days.


Playing not marks is pretty good straight to 120. BM is just kinda boring, marks is bad, and survival is good, but it really doesn't feel like a hunter, more like my warrior dipped their sword in poison.
08/14/2018 02:58 AMPosted by Chillmeister
I am maiming survival in hopes they do something. I really want mm to be fun but i don't think they will give it anything.


survival here as well but to be honest I dont think mm has ever been fun. it's been good, but fun ehh
All these complaints about movement (or lackthereof) when MM is arguably more mobile now...
Here are changes I would make:

Don't have Rapid Fire be the focus-gainer. Instead, make that Steady Shot. Make Steady Shot an instant cast with no cooldown. Make it so that it can be spammy and used to buff focus. It's more fun to continually use it instead of a channeled move like Rapid Fire.

Instead have Rapid Fire be the primary AoE attack after using Multi Shot. Make it like it was in Legion where you just hit all the targets in quick succession, its more satisfying than the channeled move that it is now.

That said, I generally do like the class. I think its pretty fun to quest with. Its surpsingly satisfying to use Hunter's Mark and then do big damage with Aimed Shot then using the Precise Shots proc with Arcane. I actually mostly like it over the Legion version. I just think Rapid Fire needs to be improved, because its current iteration is kind of lame.
Definitely not fun to play
They need to bring back aspect of the fox for mm and make it last the same amount of time as hawk does for sv now.
They need to stop basing the entire damn spec around Aimed Shot. Aimed Shot being a long cast time is fine, but ONLY if you make it work.

Cataclysm and Mop MM were some of the most fun iterations of the class I have played thus far. Aimed Shot, at the time, had a very long cast time during both of those expansions. But you know what else we had?

We had Arcane Shot that actually did a decent amount of damage by itself.

We had Kill Shot that felt insanely good to use, because it had no cost and actually allowed us to finish off a target once we'd depleted our focus.

We had Serpent Sting, which allowed us to maintain a sustained amount of dps and pressure even while we weren't bursting or dumping focus.

We had Tranquilizing Shot, which allowed us to purge enrages and later magical buffs, giving us great utility against classes like Priests and Druids.

We had Scare Beast, which felt awesome to use against a Feral or BM Hunter that was pumping out damage. It was an AMAZING niche tool.

We had Scatter Shot, which allowed us to RELIABLY cc an enemy target with traps, which at the time had COUNTERPLAY because of their arming timer.

I don't think I need to explain Readiness. VASTLY lifted the skill ceiling, and made it very easy to play around lesser skilled Hunters that wasted it.

And last but absolutely not !@#$ing least, my absolute favorite button to push in the game, that was arbitrarily removed because of a rule that ONLY HUNTERS had to follow, and that which felt ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE and has made MM not feel the same ever since, Chimaera Shot (pre-wod). MM isn't allowed to have "Chimaera Shot" because Chimaeras are an exotic beast that only BM Hunters can tame. Still trying to figure out why Fire Mages can use Frost Nova and Frost Mages can Blink.

Chimaera Shot was the pillar that made this spec. Before most of our stings were pruned, it provided an incredibly fun interaction between the different stings, dealing more damage with Serpent, disarming with Scorpid, and regenerating mana with Viper. Even though those interactions were removed with Cataclysm, the button still just felt so INCREDIBLY satisfying to use, even when it wasn't as fun with the weird cleaving in WoD.

It was the most reliable damage button we had that allowed us to actually kite. It dealt consistent damage against all armor types, it looked cool, sounded cool, and felt even better when it crit, because that was our main stat.

Each expansion now has MM gaining something, but losing something else. In WoD, we lost Arcane Shot as a dump because "all 3 hunter specs play too similarly, so naturally the solution is to remove Arcane Shot from only MM". In Legion, we lost Steady Shot, Chimaera Shot, Kill Shot, and Serpent Sting. To alleviate this, we got Arcane Shot "back", as a tickle button to regenerate 0.5 focus, or we could use this COOL new ability that DEFINITELY didn't just get slapped on in a later build because of how terrible of a mechanic Vulnerable was called Sidewinders, that completely trivialized the rotation. And now, here we are, in BFA, still asking for the same things, not getting what we want.

Which is quite simply "give back all of our shots please". I don't care if you have to rename everything to fit this weird fantasy, but we clearly want the FUNCTIONALITY of Marksmanship back, the Marksmanship that I and tons of the Hunters I know fell in love with before 2014.

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