Old Gods?

General Discussion
Where are all the (Good) Old Gods? Why is everything evil and dark? Anyway, just my 2 cents. Id like to see the script flipped because that Azshara story was garbo. There is no explanation to it.

A godly evil being makes her the Queen of water lizards because....no reason really, just because. Cool story bro.
The "good old gods" are the Naaru, I think.
This is a meme right?
Elune seems like an okay lady.
08/24/2018 06:29 PMPosted by Tavend
Where are all the (Good) Old Gods? Why is everything evil and dark? Anyway, just my 2 cents. Id like to see the script flipped because that Azshara story was garbo. There is no explanation to it.

A godly evil being makes her the Queen of water lizards because....no reason really, just because. Cool story bro.


The Azshara "story" has been established canon lore for years. It's just a dramatization of events we already know, only now we get conduits into the personalities and characters of Azshara and N'Zoth.

In what way was it garbo?
As far as I know, they're based off Eldritch gods, which are gods of chaos and humanity's worst traits amplified.

Old gods/Eldritch gods aren't entirely horrible... They just like to make deals that will not only empower themselves, but loan power to those who have traits they can exploit. They all have reasons for existing and yada yada.

Edit: Not saying Old Gods are good, especially not in WoW lore. They are just beings that are a bit more complex.
I honestly cant tell if this is a troll or not...just in case though...

N'zoth made Azshara the Naga Queen because she is a tool to his ends. For him to be released and rebuild his empire . Did you not hear her? "Take my people. With them, I will raise a army. Conquer your enemies. Build a empire." ETC. That's exactly what he WANTS and she played right into that due to her arrogance. I fail to see how you saw this as him doing it for "No reason".
08/24/2018 06:29 PMPosted by Tavend
Where are all the (Good) Old Gods? Why is everything evil and dark? Anyway, just my 2 cents.


What 2 cents? That phrase usually indicates an opinion. You asked two questions, you did not state an opinion.

08/24/2018 06:29 PMPosted by Tavend
Id like to see the script flipped because that Azshara story was garbo. There is no explanation to it.



Read some lore.

08/24/2018 06:29 PMPosted by Tavend

A godly evil being makes her the Queen of water lizards because....no reason really, just because. Cool story bro.


Again, read some lore, then form an opinion.
N'zoth had 2 choices:
let the most powerful mage on the planet die and the power go to nothing
corrupt the most powerful mage on the planet to (eventually) free himself
My issue is that the most powerful empire in the word with arguably the strongest caster in the world did not see or in any way prevent a !@#$ing tidal wave from hitting the city?

All those casters and no alarms or anything?

Give me a break.
"Old Gods" is a term used to describe specific type of gods. These are void spawns and evil altogether. Their goal is the destruction of all life.

However, there are other Gods in lore. A lot of them have specific group names such has "Wild Gods" or "LOA" or "Titans". These are usually good gods.

On top of these there is only one confirmed true deity, which is Elune.

and the main confrontation of Wow lore seems to be centered on Void vs Light atm.
08/24/2018 07:00 PMPosted by Mørbid0EB852
My issue is that the most powerful empire in the word with arguably the strongest caster in the world did not see or in any way prevent a !@#$ing tidal wave from hitting the city?

All those casters and no alarms or anything?

Give me a break.


Uhhhhhh.

The tidal wave is from the world exploding because the well of eternity just blew up. It's not, like, just a random wave.
08/24/2018 06:49 PMPosted by Azly
As far as I know, they're based off Eldritch gods, which are gods of chaos and humanity's worst traits amplified.

Old gods/Eldritch gods aren't entirely horrible... They just like to make deals that will not only empower themselves, but loan power to those who have traits they can exploit. They all have reasons for existing and yada yada.

Edit: Not saying Old Gods are good, especially not in WoW lore. They are just beings that are a bit more complex.

I always thought they were based on H.P. Lovecraft.

Like... C'Thun, C'Thulu... y'know...
08/24/2018 07:10 PMPosted by Gaidenrah
08/24/2018 06:49 PMPosted by Azly
As far as I know, they're based off Eldritch gods, which are gods of chaos and humanity's worst traits amplified.

Old gods/Eldritch gods aren't entirely horrible... They just like to make deals that will not only empower themselves, but loan power to those who have traits they can exploit. They all have reasons for existing and yada yada.

Edit: Not saying Old Gods are good, especially not in WoW lore. They are just beings that are a bit more complex.

I always thought they were based on H.P. Lovecraft.

Like... C'Thun, C'Thulu... y'know...


Eldritch gods are Lovecraft's gods.
I wouldnt say it was garbo per say. There is a long history of lore behind Azshara. May be difficult and random for people who dont follow it because it would be like...k what just happened?

While I thought the trailer was awesome, I am not really a fan of how they made N'Zoth. This Old God has been watching her for thousands of years and he comes into a deal like "serve under me, etc" and shes like na. Like dude you obviously need her and you know how she is lol. I think maybe they threw that in there to show Azsharas personality since we have never actually seen to much of it like that outside of reading lore or hearing hints about it.

How I think it would have went down in reality is N'Zoth would have played into her ambitious personality. He should know her very well (he has been watching her a loooooooong time). N'Zoth needed her so why come at the deal like that? He knows her story and how she is. He should have just came in, tell her what she wanted to hear and feed into her personality/emotions. It was not his cinematic though so I guess I get it from that point of view. I would have made it more of a mutual agreement with N'Zoth having his part but nothing crazy. He comes in, does his thing, then leaves so he is still kind of a mystery but you still get the main focus on how Azshara became what she is. They made N'Zoth too predictable and whiney in my opinion. I sense some betrayal coming down the road though. I think N'Zoth will let Azshara do her thing then make his move when the time is right. That or Azshara will try to take out N'Zoth so he is no longer a part of their "team".
08/24/2018 07:18 PMPosted by Azly
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I always thought they were based on H.P. Lovecraft.

Like... C'Thun, C'Thulu... y'know...


Eldritch gods are Lovecraft's gods.


That's... not really accurate.

Lovecraft had two types of entities: The Great Old Ones, and the Outer Gods.

The Great Old Ones were beings that existed on Earth long before humanity.

The idea was that Earth had been visited and populated by extraterrestrial creatures who built civilizations. Among them were some powerful, godlike entities. It's pretty vague - but the most memorable of them, Cthulhu, was just a particularly powerful leader of an extraterrestrial race.

The Outer Gods are semi-related, but are essentially Gods of Space. Far beyond Earth, there are ancient, vast things that exist on a far bigger scale than anything we can imagine. These are basically the Void Lords. The most important one, Azathoth, is... essentially the creator-god of the universe. But instead of being benevolent, or even something with a plan, he's this mindless, mad thing.

Elder Gods, what you might be thinking of, aren't really Lovecraft. August Derleth wanted some clear cut morallity and good-over-evil in this cosmology, so he used Nodens (a benevolent figure created by Lovecraft) to create an entire type of being. The Elder Gods are essentially a "good" counterpart to the Outer Gods, and once defeated and imprisoned them. Warcraft essentially renames them Titans, and uses the idea with very few changes.

None of them are "humanity's worst traits amplified", since even the Great Old Ones, who are at least creatures who lived on Earth, were something meant to be older and bigger than humanity.
08/24/2018 07:18 PMPosted by Azly
...

Eldritch gods are Lovecraft's gods.


That's... not really accurate.

Lovecraft had two types of entities: The Great Old Ones, and the Outer Gods.

The Great Old Ones were beings that existed on Earth long before humanity.

The idea was that Earth had been visited and populated by extraterrestrial creatures who built civilizations. Among them were some powerful, godlike entities. It's pretty vague - but the most memorable of them, Cthulhu, was just a particularly powerful leader of an extraterrestrial race.

The Outer Gods are semi-related, but are essentially Gods of Space. Far beyond Earth, there are ancient, vast things that exist on a far bigger scale than anything we can imagine.

Elder Gods, what you might be thinking of, aren't really Lovecraft. August Derleth wanted some clear cut morallity and good-over-evil in this cosmology, so he used Nodens (a benevolent figure created by Lovecraft) to create an entire type of being. The Elder Gods are essentially a "good" counterpart to the Outer Gods, and once defeated and imprisoned them. Warcraft essentially renames them Titans, and uses the idea with very few changes.

None of them are "humanity's worst traits amplified", since even the Great Old Ones, who are at least creatures who lived on Earth, were something meant to be older and bigger than humanity.


Absolutely and a much better description than I could offer. I've heard many explanations of the whole Lovecraftian and expanded texts from other authors that it all gets muddled. And I guess my DM's last campaign with us kind of has convoluted my view with our postmortem discussions and his views.

Thanks for clearing it all up!
"good" gods beat the "bad" gods down, that's why they are considered bad, they lost. The winners are the new gods, the losers are the bad old gods. Winner's write the history books.
you are two days too early....
i Hope he becomes the last boss of the expansion would suck if he wasn't and they make another expansion just for him instead.

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