It's time they acknowledged Warmode is a failure...

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Issues with wow pvp will never be resolved in its current framework.

It has 2 sides...that are not balanced. It will always have issues.

Open world pvp needs to be just that. Like eve. 4 core races and no sides by and large. Lore wise yes...in practice not really. There is an optional faction warfare setup.

that is even open. If you are caldari race and want to go Gallente FW have at it. The punchline here being in the lore caldari are at war with gallente. This does not stop you from playing what ever you want.

Where you get the alliance/horde disparity. I did not want to be a blue/purple elf at first. I wanted fair skin. Blood elf was my only option. +1 horde for cosmetic reasons.

Beyond that...eve is a free for all. I was in eve's 0.0 space soap opera for years. Many sides. I shot goons (famous crew there). I was a goon pet working for them. I was not locked to a side the take away. I

And why the pvp is more fun...its dynamic. Grr alliance must hate horde. No, you hate the horde for 6 months then say my boy is horde side in a cool guild....I will roll with him now.

here is wow's pvp problem. I can't shoot blues (friendlies). By nature of the 2 side system if a horde heavy server....more than 50% of the server is blue to me. This is how pvp gets stale.

We call it the blue ball effect in eve. Your alliance has blue'd major chunks of the server...you get less fights. Your fights become the small crews who won't blob it up. They hate it as it sucks being picked on. I was in the blob and hated it since it got old fast.

gee lets go beat up the same people again since nothing else to do. can we fight this crew? Nope...they are blue as of yesterday and just waiting for DT for server to reset standings. this crew? nope they are renters now.

Dude where can we roam for a fight then? All the waaaaaaaay over here. 30+ jumps for a fight? seriously?

Open pvp, horde or alliance not a big blue ball of protection...it gets more fun. Orc pisses off my blood elf. fine...I handle my business. Either I or the orc will walk away.

the saurfang backers...can live the dream of horde revolt at least in player run content. Game may have its own path, you can find your own if only for a few hours of head cannon fun.

This is how it gets interesting imo.
On my realm is seem most horde player who are in warmode only care about the bonuses you get and not actually pvping. I get ganked and camped by alliance groups and when I report or ask for help the usual response is "Turn warmode off you crybaby" I want to pvp but it seems the rest of my realm's shard is full of little wussies. I am good but even I can't take on a full groups by myself (while also fighting monsters at the same time)
Worgheart's entire argument: Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Cross server instancing is what killed this mode, its dumb to have 40 horde/alliance spawn into a instance with 7 questers on the opposite faction and then proceed to kill them over and over, Blizzard needs to disable 40 man premades and leave it at 5 man teams for warmode
08/27/2018 06:00 PMPosted by Fedras
Warmode is a failure b/c it removed the tension from playing. In argus, there was always a light tension when ally and horde would share a boss. Is someone gonna start ganking? Before or after the boss is dead? Then one person would start something, crazy pvp would happened between everyone then we'd all go off to the next world boss.

After the first two days of having WQs being non-stopped camped by raid groups of 5+, I turned it off. I loved WPVP, or at least what it used to be, but the rewards aren't worth it and, at least on my server, its always a 1/2v8 for either one side or the other. I turned it off and it made doing rep and WQs so much easier, but I will say it's a ton more boring. I liked the old wpvp

You are high as a kite if you think wpvp was any better before war mode. I mean, really really high
Let me guess.

You didn't travel in a premade group? If you don't assemble a group to fight off people then obviously there's no point of turning on warmode. Wpvp is never about 1v1, it's about giant zerg rushes lmaooo
You're joking about more Horde players, right? Right?!
08/27/2018 05:54 PMPosted by Solanaria
Every time I look at a wow pop estimate it shows slightly more ally players than Horde, so I don't know why the insistence that there are more Horde players.

Perhaps there are more Horde players willing to pvp, though. I don't know. I'm not one of them.


This is because most census sites record all unique accounts. However, they do not record active players usually. Some do however, and you can tell which accounts are active and playing by looking at achievement completion rates. And Horde outnumber Alliance 70:30 with achievement completion rates on the same easy achievements. This means there are way more active Horde than Alliance.
08/27/2018 06:00 PMPosted by Daxtrovian
I mean guys. HE is not wrong. Its even confirmed by blues that theres an incredibly overabundance of horde in warmode compared to alliance.


Could you provide links to the blue posts that confirm?
08/27/2018 05:53 PMPosted by Eregar
Alliance players are cowards. Blizzard Can't fix that

Pragmatists tend to live longer.
Source?


I noticed that you were asked for a source and despite the amount of time you spent crafting a post to say "I am right you'll see." you did not provide any sources to validate your argument's foundation.
08/27/2018 07:04 PMPosted by Marlaina
Source?


I noticed that you were asked for a source and despite the amount of time you spent crafting a post to say "I am right you'll see." you did not provide any sources to validate your argument's foundation.

I wouldn't expect a citation.
08/27/2018 06:47 PMPosted by Duvainel
Issues with wow pvp will never be resolved in its current framework.

It has 2 sides...that are not balanced. It will always have issues.

Open world pvp needs to be just that. Like eve. 4 core races and no sides by and large. Lore wise yes...in practice not really. There is an optional faction warfare setup.

that is even open. If you are caldari race and want to go Gallente FW have at it. The punchline here being in the lore caldari are at war with gallente. This does not stop you from playing what ever you want.

Where you get the alliance/horde disparity. I did not want to be a blue/purple elf at first. I wanted fair skin. Blood elf was my only option. +1 horde for cosmetic reasons.

Beyond that...eve is a free for all. I was in eve's 0.0 space soap opera for years. Many sides. I shot goons (famous crew there). I was a goon pet working for them. I was not locked to a side the take away. I

And why the pvp is more fun...its dynamic. Grr alliance must hate horde. No, you hate the horde for 6 months then say my boy is horde side in a cool guild....I will roll with him now.

here is wow's pvp problem. I can't shoot blues (friendlies). By nature of the 2 side system if a horde heavy server....more than 50% of the server is blue to me. This is how pvp gets stale.

We call it the blue ball effect in eve. Your alliance has blue'd major chunks of the server...you get less fights. Your fights become the small crews who won't blob it up. They hate it as it sucks being picked on. I was in the blob and hated it since it got old fast.

gee lets go beat up the same people again since nothing else to do. can we fight this crew? Nope...they are blue as of yesterday and just waiting for DT for server to reset standings. this crew? nope they are renters now.

Dude where can we roam for a fight then? All the waaaaaaaay over here. 30+ jumps for a fight? seriously?

Open pvp, horde or alliance not a big blue ball of protection...it gets more fun. Orc pisses off my blood elf. fine...I handle my business. Either I or the orc will walk away.

the saurfang backers...can live the dream of horde revolt at least in player run content. Game may have its own path, you can find your own if only for a few hours of head cannon fun.

This is how it gets interesting imo.


Points for a constructive and interesting, if somewhat confusing response. Wish there was more of this.
08/27/2018 05:53 PMPosted by Eregar
Alliance players are cowards. Blizzard Can't fix that


Sadly too true... I've only ever turned off warmode twice... Once to help a friend with world quests who doesn't do warmode and then today because I was fighting a group of Horde and some Alliance coward decided he wanted to run away (he was full life and the Horde was stun locked down).

I watched this player run into a whole group of Horde at the mouth of the cave and die who then interrupted the 1v1 and ended me. I don't mind dying... I die and kill plenty but that had me so infuriated!

I HATE the 10% bonus because too many people pop on warmode for that reason with no intent to actually pvp.
Before level scaling was added to PvP as well, I often ended up Death Gripping corpse-camped Horde levelers away from level capped Alliance no-lifers griefing them.

Not to say I haven't had my share of corpse-camping by Horde, myself; there's a reason I level so many alts together. If they didn't look likely to move, I swapped to the next character and just kept leveling a zone over.

But, it goes both ways. The main issue is that in competition it is always better to be imbalanced than balanced, and WPvP has none of the limiting factors to prevent that. Imagine if you could have the same portion of population representation at relevant levels in your Battlegrounds? 20 vs. 8 WSG ftw. Why be Horde if you could just trample as Alliance or vice versa? There needs to be something to filter players towards a fairer fight, and to better integrate that fight as that?

War Mode as it stands rarely ever feels like a real mode or anything like war. It just feels like a generalized bounty system. Oddly enough, that has actually almost worked in some areas: those that allowed for in-faction PvP as well, such as Gurubashi or that strip of land in Stormheim. But even they lacked the reward proportionate to difficulty to encourage or permit any true balance.
I'm Alliance and i like it. When i turn on warmode, its because i want to fight horde. So, if there is more horde than Alliance, even better.

Edit: I also turn it off when i will do World Quests or any grind. If i'm doing those things, i want peace. So if you run by me and wave thinking i'm just there doing questing with warmode on, i will roll you to hell.
08/27/2018 06:26 PMPosted by Worgheart

you could get every alliance player in the zone in that raid and they'd still be outnumbered something like 8 to 1 at any given hour on any given day. that's what you're refusing to hear...because it doesn't effect you. wm to 110? groundbreaking. go do the last 10 levels so you can have a valid opinion.


First off, I clicked like up there bc you offered a suggestion for adjusting War Mode instead of merely declaring it a failure. Having said that I still do not agree with your original premise.

And you know what? I don't agree with this one either. You are assuming that every horde member engages in wpvp. I do not. I have War Mode on but I avoid opposite faction as much as possible. That's right folks I use it for the rewards as slight as they are.

So what you have actually done is cried wolf based on a presumed faction bias that you have not given any actual evidence of but that even if it exists, does not automatically mean all of those horde are participating in War mode and of those that are, you have no idea how many actively gank.

That makes any argument you make pointless.

What happened to the days when people had to support their opinions with facts?
We have zero problem with Horde. We form nice little 40 man raids and hit their cap city often.
People like you shouldn't be allowed to toggle it on. You're probably one of those people who will walk by without helping an ally in a fair fight "But muh world quest" is probably your reply when they ask you why you just stood there.


This gave me food for thought. I do stop and help people complete quests. I never thought to do this when someone is engaged in PvP though. I think there are two main reasons.

1. My ally is usually not trying to get away.
2. I just really stink at PvP. All that would happen is both of us dying. Trust me. I never win PvP.

Now, if someone was trying to get away and my death would make that possible, it could be worth it.

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