Go Back to MoP Class Design.

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I'm 100% down with pruning superfluous abilities. Don't need 3 different buttons that all increase my damage by X amount for 15 seconds.

But for some silly reason they decided to chuck out all the unique functions too. The niche ones that made classes feel special.

I really miss spells like Ritual of Doom. Useless 99% of the time but fun to resort to when you hit the Godzilla Threshold.
I just got a chance to scroll through some of the pages that I've missed. I just have to say, the consensus here is pretty heartening, and it's always neat to hear about things that people enjoyed using.

I do want to throw in that, aside from pruning, I think classes have another problem right now.

When WoD came and gutted everything, glyphs, save for cosmetics, were removed. Fun detected, fun nerfed.

But the idea of expanding upon existing classes didn't die there. It came back around with Artifacts in Legion, and now Azerite Armor.

I get that Blizzard wants to have a form of end game progression, but it really shouldn't come at the expense of class gameplay. Really, I think that's the reason classes are so absolute barebones right now.

Blizzard wants a class "Core," and then every expansion they'll add "flavor" by having us progress to something "interesting."

Not only does this actually undermine classes themselves, it's actually really risky.

People were happy enough to stomach artifacts and legendaries in Legion, after how horrible WoD was, but Azerite Armor has worked out horribly thus far.

It's be far better just to revert things back to 5.4, and drop the idea that classes should be radically different and come to full power through a progression system every single expansion.

So, really the reasons for the state we're in right now are:
-Pruning
-"Class/Spec Fantasy"
-End Game Class Progression Systems (Artifacts/Azerite Armor)

I think it's worth pointing out that, assuming Blizzard for once keeps their promise to communicate more, people who are unhappy with the way classes currently are need to push back against all of these things, lest they misinterpret the complaints.

On a final note, I saw someone today on MMO-Champion claiming that Blizzard got class design "right" this expansion, because he can now play with a Steam Controller. This is the state of the game right now, just let that sink in. This is the new low that BfA has brought us to.
The terrible time gating and mortifying thoughts of not using an Az peice that's 40 ilvl's higher b/c i cant unlock the 1st tier of traits due to my necklace level is making me not want to play my main toon.

Oh but i can play an alt right? Too bad the GCD makes most classes feel like a turn-based fighting game.
I agree. MoP was the height of this game for me, classes actually had depth and they weren't specifically going out of their way to design them so even a braindead monkey could play them-you actually had to learn what your stuff did.

I knew the moment I heard them say the phrase 'ability pruning' that it was just going to be all downhill from there, and I don't think I was wrong.

09/17/2018 09:19 PMPosted by Reesespieces

On a final note, I saw someone today on MMO-Champion claiming that Blizzard got class design "right" this expansion, because he can now play with a Steam Controller. This is the state of the game right now, just let that sink in. This is the new low that BfA has brought us to.


Holy cow I'm glad I didn't see that comment, my brain would have exploded.
An MMO with a controller just feels wrong.
Right now we can only wait until 9.0. Which sucks.

There's no time to make major changes now :P
09/10/2018 01:41 AMPosted by Reesespieces
I had problems with certain elements of MoP Class design, namely the new talent trees. But all of my gripes back then are just completely trivial in light of what's come since.

Can this company just realize that they dropped the ball in WoD and classes really haven't been fun since then?

5.4 Class Design should be used as a starting point for abilities/talents going forward.

I'm sick of having niche spells taken away, I'm sick of having baseline utility scrapped and handed back as a talent, I'm tired of my class being reinvented to be completely unrecognizable from what it was when I rolled the character.

Just go back. Don't try to "improve" this mess, don't "iterate" on it. You've been trying that since 6.0, and it's still complete garbage.

Can you toss in Gladiator Stance from Draenor? It's literally the only thing from Draenor I miss.
Pruning makes balancing more fragile and dependent on good developers because it removes options for players to work around dominant strategies being nerfed.
MoP was the most fun I had with my class. I also stayed subbed the longest in MoP. The only issue I see it had is to many classes shared some utility. Shamans should be the only with lust, druids the only with brez. Ect.
They used to call them Wrath babies for people that started playing when the lich king was released.

For all you nostalgia obsessed enthusiasts, you've unlocked the achievement of Panda babies. And maybe if you keep crying Blizzard can build you or own cradle like they are doing for the delusional vanilla fans.

I swear each xpac is becoming a separate wing at a psych ward, and each of you need your own padded room to go along with your tinfoil hat.
MoP babies rofl
09/18/2018 03:12 PMPosted by Hemrug
MoP babies rofl

How's that downtime treating you?

09/18/2018 03:01 PMPosted by Tikisha
They used to call them Wrath babies for people that started playing when the lich king was released.

For all you nostalgia obsessed enthusiasts, you've unlocked the achievement of Panda babies. And maybe if you keep crying Blizzard can build you or own cradle like they are doing for the delusional vanilla fans.

I swear each xpac is becoming a separate wing at a psych ward, and each of you need your own padded room to go along with your tinfoil hat.


Weird that you want to take jabs at x-Babies, while also claiming vanilla players who preferred the game back then are bad, too.

P.S. I've played since vanilla (2005). Class design peaked in Wrath, but was largely enjoyable up through MoP.
09/16/2018 05:24 PMPosted by Drownie
09/14/2018 02:53 AMPosted by Byucknah
I am honestly pretty satisfied with my class design as a Paladin(Prot and Ret). Plays pretty great, enjoyable rotation, good visual design.

The only thing I would not mind seeing return from MoP days is "choice" for classes like Fury Warrior, Frost DK, ect. The choice of Two Hander, One Handers, ect. See that come back for a lot of classes, including Enhancement Shaman.

In terms of rotation and class skills however, I honestly believe Legion was a pretty big improvement for a lot of classes.


Get off the forums you are terrible for the game if you think rotation is fun right now just leave blizzard fanboy
God.

Something tells me he didn't play MM.
4 button specs and boring passives on azerite Armor is here to stay. Blizzard thinks it’s players has low IQ.
Posting just to say I miss MoP too and want it back.

MoP Servers when?
i miss mop so much
09/18/2018 02:39 PMPosted by Tiridan
Right now we can only wait until 9.0. Which sucks.

There's no time to make major changes now :P


They could make the pathfinder achievements optional for flying, and add BfA, Legion, and WoD flight options to the flight trainers. Don't want to do those trash achievements or wait for pathfinder part 2? Just pay the flight trainer a reasonable fee at max level. Not a million gold either you narcissists.

That would be a fun minor change that would make the entire game world more fun.
09/18/2018 02:39 PMPosted by Tiridan
Right now we can only wait until 9.0. Which sucks.

There's no time to make major changes now :P


The issue is, there's never any time.

People complained about pruning in WoD beta. They were ignored. It flopped, and hey, you'd think the experiment was over, right? Nope. In Legion they demonstrated they didn't learn their lesson.

We got Alpha access, this time, since people would continually say "They're not going to make major changes in beta." Did it matter? Nope, BfA brings us to a new low with pruning.

There's really never a "good" time for Blizzard when it comes to this.
You need a major break from the game, holy heck you spam the forums with your rage threads.
I remember running out of hotkeys to map all my abilities as a WARRIOR in MoP. Only Vanilla Shaman exceeded it.

No. Friggin'. Thanks.

OR hell, give every class/spec a ton of skills... but limit how many can be actively equipped at once.

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