Demonology still garbage?

Warlock
4th patch in a row, about to be 5th where demo is on the bottom. Not to mention still no baseline interrupt. I don’t want to play affliction Blizz but looks like I’m still going to have to.
Weak? A bit, yes. Garbage? No.

We can use some improvements but the spec is not unplayable by any means.
yep keep playing aff
09/24/2018 09:53 AMPosted by Chucklebolt
Weak? A bit, yes. Garbage? No.

We can use some improvements but the spec is not unplayable by any means.


From a performance standpoint, it is garbage.
I just want them to figure out if we are supposed to be mobile or tanky. Neither right now.
No not garbage, it can be decently competitive on fights like Zul, Vectis, or any Mythic plus environment, simply due to how powerful it's cleave can be.

Really a few tweaks and the spec would be perfect, a netherportal shard consumption change, a little bit more demonbolt damage, doom not requiring a kill shot to summon a doomguard.

Hell, even fel flame from cata would be nice to have just for an on the move ability, (although soul strike has get delicious in that role)

Literally just a few minor changes and the spec would perform as it is expected to.

Although, I do admit that in the future, as haste gets higher, we will naturally perform better, which is really why only minor tweaks are necessary right now.
09/24/2018 01:37 PMPosted by Revlol
No not garbage, it can be decently competitive on fights like Zul, Vectis, or any Mythic plus environment, simply due to how powerful it's cleave can be.

Really a few tweaks and the spec would be perfect, a netherportal shard consumption change, a little bit more demonbolt damage, doom not requiring a kill shot to summon a doomguard.

Hell, even fel flame from cata would be nice to have just for an on the move ability, (although soul strike has get delicious in that role)

Literally just a few minor changes and the spec would perform as it is expected to.

Although, I do admit that in the future, as haste gets higher, we will naturally perform better, which is really why only minor tweaks are necessary right now.


Because being 13th or dead last is a viable option ...

Man, get the hell out of here with this nonsense.
There’s a difference between dead last and useless and dead last and still contributing. The distinction is rather moot when you have affliction as an easy alternative but the hyperbole of “completely useless” is not helpful. I’ve put up and posted in several threads with improvement ideas so it’s not like I’m saying everything is fine as is. For a more direct anecdote, I’m nearly always top two DPS and ahead of our 3 affy warlocks during Zek’voz progression, one of the situations Revlol pointed out. Is that enough to wipe our hands of it and say Demo is fine? Hell no, but a truly useless and garbage spec wouldn’t even have a single fight they excelled at.
The problem I have with Demo currently is that you are literally a turret and every CD has a cast, without feeling powerful. Vilefiend, is cool, but he adds barely anything, I'd like to see his spit be an aoe DoT, then he jumps in to single target. The demoncore charges from SdS be instant after they are gone instead of a small delay. Also SdS's cd reduced to 18 secs with haste scaling, or a flat 16 secs.

I dont wan't to see % damage increases, I want to functionality changes. The spec flows relatively well, but it just feels a little awkward at times. Also, can we get felguard to have 80% damage reduction during empowered felstorm or something...I don't know how many times ive had to resummon him in a M+ during trash because he pulls off the tanks, even after a few seconds of aggro.
09/24/2018 02:30 PMPosted by Chucklebolt
There’s a difference between dead last and useless and dead last and still contributing. The distinction is rather moot when you have affliction as an easy alternative but the hyperbole of “completely useless” is not helpful. I’ve put up and posted in several threads with improvement ideas so it’s not like I’m saying everything is fine as is. For a more direct anecdote, I’m nearly always top two DPS and ahead of our 3 affy warlocks during Zek’voz progression, one of the situations Revlol pointed out. Is that enough to wipe our hands of it and say Demo is fine? Hell no, but a truly useless and garbage spec wouldn’t even have a single fight they excelled at.


And anecdotal evidence is meaningless in the larger scheme of things. Just because you do well in YOUR guild, doesn't make everything peachy.

Demo is 14th on that fight (with a large enough sample size to back the numbers). That is the BEST fight Demo has in Uldir. That's it. I'm sorry, but there is no sugar coating any of this. Demo is bad. Even on their best fight, they're mediocre at best. That's not acceptable by any means.
09/24/2018 09:53 AMPosted by Chucklebolt
Weak? A bit, yes. Garbage? No.

We can use some improvements but the spec is not unplayable by any means.


Almost 0% representation in +10 keys, so yes, garbage.
gonna agree with above dude some of yall are straight doo doo just because your top dps in your guild doesnt mean the spec does well

my paladin alt who is holy main dps as ret and i top dps with pure crit and like 5percent haste( utter !@#$ stats for ret)
I've had some better luck with demo lately.

I'm not sure I'm ready to call it awesome, due to mobility concerns, but at this point, I don't feel bad bringing demo to a raid.

- P
09/24/2018 03:52 PMPosted by Alkii
And anecdotal evidence is meaningless in the larger scheme of things. Just because you do well in YOUR guild, doesn't make everything peachy.

Demo is 14th on that fight (with a large enough sample size to back the numbers). That is the BEST fight Demo has in Uldir. That's it. I'm sorry, but there is no sugar coating any of this. Demo is bad. Even on their best fight, they're mediocre at best. That's not acceptable by any means.


https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/rankings/19#class=Warlock&boss=2136 ?

Not saying it's good, it's just not as garbage as you people claim. It has a very small niche which is huge AoE with demonic strength other than that it doesn't have anything to call its own atm.
Demo is DEAD last in heroic Uldir. Over 99% of people are not running mythic Uldir yet so I think Heroic is a good benchmark where the majority of raiders are now. Demo is still bottom 5 in mythic though.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/19#sample=7&difficulty=4
Demo is garbage
Yet I am garbage as well
It is destiny

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