Prot warriors in 8.1?

Battle for Azeroth Items and Classes
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Shamans got a blue; Here's to hoping Warriors get one.

I won't make a massive OP, there's been tomes written on how broken prot was since earliest stages of BfA beta. It's common knowledge that warriors make up for under 5% of all tank representation after 2 weeks of Uldir, in ALL types of content;

They're weak, they lack a niche, their kit has been massively hurt by the GCD change, and they need a lot of love to become viable. Like. Without exaggeration, it's easier to heal a shadow priest who pulls aggro in a dungeon, than a prot warrior in that same dungeon...

Blizzard? Are you doing this one class at a time, or can prots hope for some love as well? Cause it honestly feels really bad when the most iconic tank in the game is just so far behind it's not even worth using any more...
Just level your DK and tank with that instead. They stopped caring about prot warriors years ago.
FWIW, when deciding what to main for BFA, i really WANTED to main warrior. But watching the tragedy that was prot warrior beta unfold (with days where talent tree was missing selectable abilities, watching IP go on gcd, back off, completely removed, etc etc) I knew I needed to steer clear of warrior-- at least initially.

Sadly, i then chose destro lock because it was recommended in an official guide from Method and sponsored by Wowhead (lol.)

I finally settled in shaman (resto/ele) which has been a tragedy all its own.

I really hope for the OP and so many other completely undertuned and garbage afterthought specs that we do get some real feedback, similar to the attention that feral has been receiving and/or the huge affliction thread a while back where a dev went point by point discussing new talents, interplay within the spec (rotational minigame etc.)

The blue post for shaman isn't complete imo, but its a great start. I look forward to seeing the design team show some love to these other specs.

@Lina, wish you luck! <3
09/18/2018 03:11 PMPosted by Hutta
Just level your DK and tank with that instead. They stopped caring about prot warriors years ago.


I actually play a DK on my main account, but my best friend & offtank is a dedicated warrior main who's on the verge of quitting the game because of how depressing tanking as a warrior has been since 8.0 dropped... =/

The blue post for shaman isn't complete imo, but its a great start. I look forward to seeing the design team show some love to these other specs.

@Lina, wish you luck! <3


Thank you!

Honestly at this point it would be nice to just get a "We hear you. We're working on it. Be patient.". This radio silence is the literal worst thing they can do. I don't think prots got as much as an acknowledgment since Beta started, of any of the myriad of issues the spec has.

I'm hoping for the best, of course, but this unbreakable silence is unnerving...
Fingers crossed. Unfortunately so few people are playing prot now there aren't that many calling for changes :)
09/18/2018 03:08 PMPosted by Lina
Shamans got a blue; Here's to hoping Warriors get one.


It was pretty meaningless post which didn't address any of changes or what they are actually trying to fix or even what is the problem with the class. Better get your tin foil hats.
I wish you all luck with getting a response. 8.1 Elemental changes are controversial to say the least, but hey at least blizz knows shamans exist!

Us neglected specs/classes gotta stick together, see you on the other side of 8.1 friends.
Prot Warrior is my favorite class in this game and It saddens me how bad it feels to play in this expansion.

This really needs addressed.
09/18/2018 03:21 PMPosted by Lina
I actually play a DK on my main account, but my best friend & offtank is a dedicated warrior main who's on the verge of quitting the game because of how depressing tanking as a warrior has been since 8.0 dropped... =/

I honestly feel this same pain except I also main a Guardian druid.

I leveled my BrM and I find it miles ahead and way more engaging and fun to play than the druid. I feel like the transition from artifacts/legendaries and into BFA did a disservice to both Protection Warriors and Guardian druids - they both deserve some QoL fixes so they're desired.
Aye, I do feel prot needs some buffs thrown in our direction to make us on par with some of the other tanks.
09/19/2018 06:31 PMPosted by Rythorn
Aye, I do feel prot needs some buffs thrown in our direction to make us on par with some of the other tanks.


More like the class needs a near-complete overhaul because it's kit is just outdated.

Like... Why does devastate even still exist as a button? It needs to either: 1) generate rage 2) have defensive value (ignore pain rolled into it?) 2) to be removed, with devastator becoming baseline. With how GCD-starved prot is I just find it hard to ever justify pressing it...

Or ignore pain TBH because it does nothing for the opportunity & rage cost. I still press it because there's nothing else to press to not die as fast, but comparing it with my DK where pressing death strike does both amazing damage and amazing heal is just kinda depressing.
Ignore pain is the equivalent of popping a level 100 trinket on GCD that eats half your rage bar.

Arms until prot is fixed... or unless I'm really bored and feel like doing 5x the work and risk vs an overpowered DK or DH.
09/18/2018 03:14 PMPosted by Starcasm
Sadly, i then chose destro lock because it was recommended in an official guide from Method and sponsored by Wowhead (lol.)

Destro lock still isn’t a bad choice. It has a really solid design for the most part. What it suffers from is bad tuning.

As for warriors Blizzard needs to just look back earlier in the alpha. Warriors were looking to be the strongest tank until some changes were made.
Prot warriors have been a joke since Cata and have only gotten much worse since legion.
09/18/2018 04:53 PMPosted by Riidatar
Better get your tin foil hats.

I'm expecting a DPS nerf and no QoL improvements in 8.1.

Sure its fun to do big damage during AOE pulls but Warriors have spent far more time being the lowest DPS tank than the top. Usually being the weakest tank at the same time.
09/20/2018 04:17 AMPosted by Lina
09/19/2018 06:31 PMPosted by Rythorn
Aye, I do feel prot needs some buffs thrown in our direction to make us on par with some of the other tanks.


More like the class needs a near-complete overhaul because it's kit is just outdated.

Like... Why does devastate even still exist as a button? It needs to either: 1) generate rage 2) have defensive value (ignore pain rolled into it?) 2) to be removed, with devastator becoming baseline. With how GCD-starved prot is I just find it hard to ever justify pressing it...

Or ignore pain TBH because it does nothing for the opportunity & rage cost. I still press it because there's nothing else to press to not die as fast, but comparing it with my DK where pressing death strike does both amazing damage and amazing heal is just kinda depressing.


It's not all doom and Gloom but we do need some love thrown our way, I posted this in the warrior forums, so I'll post it here and with some luck blizz will listen.

1. Lack of a self-heal: Look every tank has one, I know some don't want this on warriors but hear me out. I've said this before and I'll say it again: Make Impending Victory baseline for all warriors, this will help both in prot and arms because at the moment that is a talent in the talent tree and this will free up that space for something more useful.

Imo, for prot Legion Gloves (gives a reason to use devastate) or legion bracers (if you need a crutch) would be viable replacements for the talent in the first row and for arms you can give them legion shoulders (gives heroic leap 2 more charges) so they have the option of double charge, triple leap, or a stun.

2. Shield Block: We can mitigate good physical damage if done right but at the moment there is a serious gap in our uptime hence we are prone to major spike damage. Either increasing the duration, lowering the cooldown or giving SB a 3rd charge will go a long way in keeping ourselves alive.

3. GCD: Our class is clunky to play because apparently YELLING triggers a GCD. I mean this for Demo Shout, Ignore Pain and Avatar. Removing at least Demoshout and Avatar would make our playstyle way less clunky to play with since most warriors use the thunderclap azertie trait to keep demoshout up.
As for ignore pain, fine keep it on the GCD but lower the rage cost to 30 and increase the absorb from 50% to 75% to counter bleeds.
09/21/2018 12:12 PMPosted by Rythorn
Lack of a self-heal: Look every tank has one

Varying degrees of self-healing. BRM Monks self-healing isnt anything to write home about. Guardian and Paladin are okay. Veng and Blood are amazing.

Prot sits pretty much were BRM Monks in regards to self healing.

Prot Warrior is an easy fix.

1) Take Ignore Pain off the GCD.
2) Slightly increase rage gen in ST situations.
I can’t speak to any plans for the patch, but I do know that we’re planning to make some tuning adjustments sometime in the next few weeks which should include some defensive buffs for Protection Warriors.
09/21/2018 02:38 PMPosted by Lore
I can’t speak to any plans for the patch, but I do know that we’re planning to make some tuning adjustments sometime in the next few weeks which should include some defensive buffs for Protection Warriors.


Just curious but why can't you speak to any plans for the patch? You explained the tooltips for the proposed ele shaman changes, but can't speak about warriors? Or is it that there is nothing changing in the patch for warriors?

Hate to say it (and hate to nail it to you Lore) but class imbalance is very very bad right now. I think most of us don't want classes that are OP or overtuned-- but we would like to see them fluid enough and competitive enough that we can feel comfortable that our individual investment will ensure us a spot and a chance at current WoW content.

We love the game-- we've loved it for years. Please get on with the tuning and stop having Q&A's that are full of meaningless hyperbole, when changes should have happened weeks ago (or during beta, maybe.)

With love. <3
Groovy. I'm glad to hear it. Hopefully they're meaningful and not just nibbling around the edges. My co-tank of many years, who has played a Prot Warrior since vanilla, finally rerolled to Death Knight last week. He's 15 item levels behind his Warrior and tanking in Mythic Uldir much more effectively. They need meaningful changes.

Here are the tank representation numbers after the first week of Mythic raiding and the first 2 weeks of Mythic+ dungeons. Tank representation is important because it's a broad indicator of how tanks are doing. Players aren't stupid, and will always want people in jobs who are the best available for doing those jobs. Particularly at higher Mythic+ keys, and in Mythic raiding, people are going to bring the best class & spec on each fight.

Mythic Uldir parses for tanks, minus Taloc (who has more kills than Heroic G'huun and is basically a Heroic boss):
1023 Monk
857 Death Knight
399 Paladin
310 Druid
273 Demon Hunter
142 Warrior

On the actually difficult fights, there is a MASSIVE disparity between the top tanks (Monk+Death Knight) and everybody else. With Warriors down at rock bottom.

Now let's turn to Mythic+.

Mythic +10 to +14 keys:
12,888 Death Knight
7,546 Demon Hunter
6,964 Paladin
6,488 Brewmaster
3,513 Druid
2,761 Warrior

Again, a massive imbalance. Almost 5 times as many Death Knights as Warriors are doing 10-14 keys. There are Death Knights, there's the middle of the pack (DH/Pal/Monk), and then there's Druids and Warriors bringing up the rear.

Now let's go a step higher.

Mythic +15 and up keys.
78 Death Knights
39 Demon Hunters
26 Monks
13 Paladins
4 Warriors
2 Druids

I'm glad that hotfixes are coming, and hope that Warrior get meaningful changes. But Druids also need help, both in raiding and M+. And Demon Hunters need help in raiding while not making them even more OP in M+ than they are.

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