State of Shadow, 8.1 Edition

Battle for Azeroth Items and Classes
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10/30/2018 01:50 PMPosted by Kaloran
10/30/2018 12:45 PMPosted by Qaccy
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Who to listen to, though? For all of their missteps, Blizzard does a pretty good job of making sure to keep players separated from the development process, and threads like this are generally about as close as we get. As cynical as we tend to get regarding the game's status as times, try and seriously think about what the game might look like if every 'I can do better' pposter here on the forums was actually allowed to push their ideas into the game.

Not to say that nobody here has good ideas, just that...we don't really get that level of control here and probably never will, despite what some folks may want.


Nobody wants that, nobody has ever said they wanted that, and it's absolutely facetious to present this situation as if that's what people are asking for.

People are making suggestions, ambitious ones, exactly because Blizz has given very little idea of where they want to take the class and because we've been dealing with an extremely hard to balance, very limiting mechanic for years. Nobody expects all their ideas to be picked up.

Hell, I would be happy if Blizzard ignored *every single piece of advice the forums came up with*, went in an entirely different direction for spriest, but it was at least an overhaul of current systems. I would wonder what they were doing, but at least it would show that they understand that current shadow is deeply flawed game design and they're doing something to try and fix it. But that's not what they did. They made some commonsense QoL changes, and then "buffed" our damage, counteracted by hidden aura nerfs and CoI nerfs.

It was an extremely tepid series of changes, and absolutely unjustified waiting months and months for.


The nerf really seemed like they are fine with how our damage is but are completely clueless to the actual problems.
10/30/2018 02:46 PMPosted by Maybeitsroxx

The nerf really seemed like they are fine with how our damage is but are completely clueless to the actual problems.


Yea doesn't really fix anything mechanically. We'll have longer voidforms on longer fights, so if you really liked pressing 2 buttons before, now you get 25% more of that sweet Voidform gameplay before you have to go back to doing no damage for a bit to get back into your 2-button groove.
It still seems like you drop out pretty fast anyways.
10/30/2018 01:50 PMPosted by Kaloran
Nobody wants that, nobody has ever said they wanted that, and it's absolutely facetious to present this situation as if that's what people are asking for.

People are making suggestions, ambitious ones, exactly because Blizz has given very little idea of where they want to take the class and because we've been dealing with an extremely hard to balance, very limiting mechanic for years. Nobody expects all their ideas to be picked up.


The post I quoted implied exactly that, though...hence why I quoted/responded to it.
That's what the point is I think... in the massive endless echo chamber that is the internet as a whole. Maybe the community and Blizzard have both lost perspective of the direction this game takes.

Focus group testing has been a corner stone of Western business for half a century, it works (most of the time - when done correctly, just dont New Coke it!)... the fans are concerned Blizzard is not even listening especially with the last Beta.

Consider how tepid those changes were for a 4 month delayed "second pass", that only really served as a rollback to repair the damage, a lot of players have commented that it doesn't fix what they see as the core issues. Are they wrong to feel thats what's wrong when they push the buttons... we are not designers, but we know what feels good.

I think there are some brilliant and well spoken, researched people and in the community, you probably bookmarked their posts, subscribe to their channel and what not. Blizzard knows who these people are (they invited most of them to Blizzcon) I just think Blizzard can use them to get some focused feedback and stop listening to the echo chamber.
Looks like latest ptr trying to pump a little more damage into void torrent. Too bad it still likely won't compete with lingering insanity or mind bender.
After we checked some of the math in the other thread, confirmed it still won't be competitive. Wah wahhhh
Still not competitive, still with some of the worst utility in game, still lacking survivability compared to what the class should have.

Games still bleeding priests who are either quitting and unsubbing, or switching classes after seeing whats expected in 8.1 (Shadow/Disc especially).
11/01/2018 10:28 PMPosted by Toxn
Still not competitive, still with some of the worst utility in game, still lacking survivability compared to what the class should have.

Games still bleeding priests who are either quitting and unsubbing, or switching classes after seeing whats expected in 8.1 (Shadow/Disc especially).


I just ended up getting into a new battle royale game lol. Gogo Ring of Elysium. Super fun haha.
Just wanted to bump so I will say something not to be banned:

Blizzcon is currently the most important thing for blizzard, so I hope they will delay 8.1 accordingly. Quality > all.
11/02/2018 07:23 AMPosted by Aimou
I just ended up getting into a new battle royale game lol. Gogo Ring of Elysium. Super fun haha.
Ive been so exasperated with WoW and Blizzard as of late I have been spending more and more time in other games. I have even been considering reinstalling Sims 4... thats how bad WoW has been. Sims 4 sounds more intriguing.
10/24/2018 02:55 AMPosted by Dimeetri
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One of the things that's potentially killing voidform uptime is the god awful synchronicity of the SWP and VT durations. The only way I could avoid having to refresh my dots mid-voidform was to recast both dots before void eruption, even if they had a decent amount of duration left on them. The spec still feels clunky and there are still some core mechanical issues with the class that these current changes do nothing to address.


Please consider having voidbolt extend dots a little bit longer for smoother flow and to prevent the issue quoted.
From the short-hand MMOChampion posted on the WoW Q&A
It is entirely justified to blame Blizzard when a class gets the reputation for being bad, and they want to address these bad reputations. However, community perspective is often increased when players of a class constantly speak negatively of themselves.

Seriously are they reflecting some of this back on us!

You want to address these bad reputations... priortise fixing the classes with earlier patches. Stop tying class/spec patches to the content release windows.

Its been 4 months since June 14 (5 months between then and 8.1) when Ion said 5 dps specs in Beta were not getting their second pass before 8.0 and will need to "wait till next patch" for Large Changes.

NEXT PATCH!!! IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH!!! A whole patch is a whole raid, its a whole pvp season and this time around it was a major leveling, gearing and reputation grind of a brand new expansion... Blizzard you can start to improve bad reputation classes by NEVER SAYING NEXT PATCH AGAIN!!!
11/03/2018 06:21 PMPosted by Dirtymind
Seriously are they reflecting some of this back on us!
I expressed similar thoughts in the other thread. I read that transcript, and just... wow.

I may as well cut and paste to here as well:

From the Q&A's transcript:
It is entirely justified to blame Blizzard when a class gets the reputation for being bad, and they want to address these bad reputations. However, community perspective is often increased when players of a class constantly speak negatively of themselves.
So while I agree that community perspective is based on feedback given, in most cases it is directly tied to horrible design. Yes, the players absolutely blame Blizzard for the stigmas behind a class because in most cases, the design is flawed, feedback is given, and improvements are not considered.

Yes, there is a difference between constructive feedback, and negative players. The blame for both is still squarely on Blizzard from lack of insight behind design and communication as increased negativity has clearly followed behind (and fed from) seemingly ignored feedback. The negativity is a direct reaction to feedback ignored, leading from the poor design choices and lack of communication!

Where are the watercoolers? Where are the back and forth discussions behind design intentions behind a spec? We've given specific feedback of the issues behind Voidform in a non-raid setting only to be met with an increased gap between forms, showing the message is not being heard!

Straight up, to Blizzard:

Are we to expect a decoupling of Eruption from Voidform which improves on gameplay flexibility and player control?

Is there any consideration into rolling the 2 charges of Shadow Word: Void into baseline Mind Blast to avoid CD conflict from Voidbolt?

The overwhelming bloat in the talents to cover the lack on controlled baseline AoE is completely ridiculous! Will this be rectified?

Players are absolutely sick and tired of issues within specs (not just Shadow) where clear and solid feedback has been given for years, and met with assumed ignorance from design that exacerbate the issues even further with no such discussion in intent.
I just I unsubbed, that too on my birthday! .... Was paid up for a few months longer, will let it run the course and maybe try something else.

Enough has been said on classes and mechanics. The Devs are time gating things for artificial and superficial 'active players'. Not going to give them that satisfaction.
11/03/2018 06:41 PMPosted by Crosshairs
I just I unsubbed, that too on my birthday!
Happy Birthday mate. You've dropped some awesome feedback along with setting me straight with how Silence actually works.

Take care ♥
They should just make void torrent baseline imo
I fell for the whole 8.1 thing.... Honestly, the only thing that will fix this game is just players walking away. Don't pre purchase, don't buy into subs, don't do any of the things that gives this dev team a reason to keep their jobs.

Trust me, when heads roll, they'll pull their act together.

My RL friends who were guildies are mostly all gone.. I'm most likely gone 100% until they announce a major major overhaul of the game.
Yea, I'm unsubscribing after being subscribed since 6 months into Vanilla. After years of my life spent in /played game time. After being a hardcore Blizzard fanboy for decades.

I'll be around, I will always care about Shadow. But, I can't give them money anymore for this product.
I too have unsubbed and my game time ends in exactly 16 days. The only thing at this point that will get me to renew my subscription is some miracle where they give us some actual and meaningful changes to shadow.

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