State of Shadow, 8.1 Edition

Battle for Azeroth Items and Classes
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Yeah I've pretty much let mine do its thing looks like everyones birthday was recently mine just past in late October. Don't worry though ill still fight for everyone and their classes including the ones I hold dear to myself.
Just checked in on wowhead after a while of being unsubbed and not caring about wow

I actually feel so bad for all the story developers who worked there asses off making all that content for everyone to play through

It's just too bad the class developers never realized they destroyed any chance of fun combat, and as a result nobody is even going to play all of this new content without feeling terrible about how not fun there class is to pilot.

every class on here complains like it's just their class but I couldn't find a single spec I liked after tons of leveling different characters

This is coming from someone who had a max level of almost every class back in MoP because I couldn't decide on what to play I loved them all so much
11/04/2018 05:47 PMPosted by Lucksniipe
Just checked in on wowhead after a while of being unsubbed and not caring about wow

I actually feel so bad for all the story developers who worked there asses off making all that content for everyone to play through


Yea I completely agree. This has been the best story expansion launch to date by far, and I'm excited to see what comes in 8.1, 2, 3, 4. Not just the story to date, but the story potential in this expansion is amazing, 10/10.

Unfortunately, the game is intentionally not fun. There is no other way I can fathom why class design could be this bad short of malice. Incompetence or disinterest would be more random, some specs would be good, others bad - but for so many specs to feel so bad? Something in Blizzard is rotten.

It's just too bad the class developers never realized they destroyed any chance of fun combat, and as a result nobody is even going to play all of this new content without feeling terrible about how not fun there class is to pilot.

every class on here complains like it's just their class but I couldn't find a single spec I liked after tons of leveling different characters

This is coming from someone who had a max level of almost every class back in MoP because I couldn't decide on what to play I loved them all so much


Yea I've been hopping around too, trying to find something that can keep me in WoW. I gave up, Shadow is my heart, I can't do this anymore.
Yeah I got my mage pretty geared in like 2 days but it just isnt shadow...
Gearing up my DH. Hit 120 last week. Every part of the process including leveling felt infinitely better than Shadow. I just hate that the rotation has so few buttons to hit... But the burst and movement feels amazing, plus my raid will benefit from the 5% debuff way more than anything Shadow brought to the table, except for Zul (I'm switching back to priest for Zul -- yay gimmick fights...).
11/04/2018 05:55 PMPosted by Yvaelle
Yea I've been hopping around too, trying to find something that can keep me in WoW. I gave up, Shadow is my heart, I can't do this anymore.
That is the part I don't think Blizzard understands...

a players chosen class and spec, is a personal experience, the User Interface is not our portal into this world... its our chosen avatar. If the class feels bad, the game feels bad, if the spec feels broken, the player feels broken.

To be handicapped straight out of the gate into a new expansion, is brutal.
Their comments at Blizzcon were deflective and showed no real progress in their opinion or any drive to fix classes as soon as possible...

"next patch" is being sidelined not by your raid, not by your mythic runners, or your arena squad... "next patch" is Blizzard sidelining me cause I am too difficult to deal with now, I am a paying customer and the class/spec I chose is wrong and its my fault, cause Blizzard couldn't find the time to do a second pass of 5 specs in Beta.

Its heartbreaking Blizzard, you should understand your players and realize class balance is key to our personal avatars, our game experience, and important to us as customers.
rip
11/05/2018 03:25 AMPosted by Dirtymind
11/04/2018 05:55 PMPosted by Yvaelle
Yea I've been hopping around too, trying to find something that can keep me in WoW. I gave up, Shadow is my heart, I can't do this anymore.
That is the part I don't think Blizzard understands...

a players chosen class and spec, is a personal experience, the User Interface is not our portal into this world... its our chosen avatar. If the class feels bad, the game feels bad, if the spec feels broken, the player feels broken.

To be handicapped straight out of the gate into a new expansion, is brutal.
Their comments at Blizzcon were deflective and showed no real progress in their opinion or any drive to fix classes as soon as possible...

"next patch" is being sidelined not by your raid, not by your mythic runners, or your arena squad... "next patch" is Blizzard sidelining me cause I am too difficult to deal with now, I am a paying customer and the class/spec I chose is wrong and its my fault, cause Blizzard couldn't find the time to do a second pass of 5 specs in Beta.

Its heartbreaking Blizzard, you should understand your players and realize class balance is key to our personal avatars, our game experience, and important to us as customers.
This. Rolling shadow for BFA has forever tarnished the game for me. After some thought after the "changes" were announced I've unsub'd. I'm not going to play a joke spec in 8.1 again, and I'm not just going write off my priest and reroll, !@#$ that. I've spent too much time and effort getting to where I am now on it.
Thats one of the biggest problems I faced right off the bat I rolled shadow this xpac and it was a horrible experience to the point where my guild forced me to go healing to get more people gear. So that being said I left alliance side and went to horde.
I'm guessing major reworks summer 2019, when classic comes out haha. To try to get the most out if it since the subscription will count towards both games. Always seems like a bait and switch since wod. Advertise x, givem y, and tell them z is coming. I'm just canceling my sub tonight after how blizzcon has been. Who knows, maybe they'll eventually get their heads out of their asses and get in touch with the community.
Shadow was unique for years with our massive self healing from dmg and strong DoTs, balanced by lower raw dps output and mobility. Since they removed this, it seems there has been a constant search for exactly what our role is supposed to be...
11/05/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Ulrah
Shadow was unique for years with our massive self healing from dmg and strong DoTs, balanced by lower raw dps output and mobility. Since they removed this, it seems there has been a constant search for exactly what our role is supposed to be...
The worst part is Blizzard has no clue either. So they changed what defined us, but have not been able to figure out how to define us. Its like someone taking something that worked, and trying to change it just because they can and then being upset about how they wish it worked. IT WAS WORKING, at least to some degree, and it just needed tweaking but you took a sledgehammer to it and screwed it.
11/05/2018 04:29 PMPosted by Toxn
11/05/2018 03:28 PMPosted by Ulrah
Shadow was unique for years with our massive self healing from dmg and strong DoTs, balanced by lower raw dps output and mobility. Since they removed this, it seems there has been a constant search for exactly what our role is supposed to be...
The worst part is Blizzard has no clue either. So they changed what defined us, but have not been able to figure out how to define us. Its like someone taking something that worked, and trying to change it just because they can and then !@#$%ing about how they wish it worked. IT WAS WORKING, it just needed tweaking but you took a sledgehammer to it and ^-*!ed it for good.


Eh, I wouldn't call the hybrid tax something that worked. The rest of your point though certainly, shadow has been through more mechanical iterations than any other spec (I think), and none of them have stuck.
11/05/2018 04:33 PMPosted by Hpellipsis
11/05/2018 04:29 PMPosted by Toxn
...The worst part is Blizzard has no clue either. So they changed what defined us, but have not been able to figure out how to define us. Its like someone taking something that worked, and trying to change it just because they can and then !@#$%ing about how they wish it worked. IT WAS WORKING, it just needed tweaking but you took a sledgehammer to it and ^-*!ed it for good.


Eh, I wouldn't call the hybrid tax something that worked. The rest of your point though certainly, shadow has been through more mechanical iterations than any other spec (I think), and none of them have stuck.
Fair enough. I mean worked more in the sense that it wasnt a series of reworks that had major issues each and every time. In other words, it could have been tweaked then and been fine, instead of torn down for repeatedly worse reiterations.
11/05/2018 04:33 PMPosted by Hpellipsis

Eh, I wouldn't call the hybrid tax something that worked. The rest of your point though certainly, shadow has been through more mechanical iterations than any other spec (I think), and none of them have stuck.


Moonkins have also received mechanical changes every expac since BC.

BC-> WOTLK was the RNG fest with wrath having a 60% (or 40?)chance to process lunar eclipse, and Starfire having 100% chance on crits. Then the actual eclipse state lasted for 10-12 seconds from memory.

WOTLK > Cata was the energy bar system with peak eclipse at 100 energy. Remember farming critters before boss pulls for 100 solar energy lol

Cata > MOP was the charge system eclipse? Can't remember 100%. On and how I miss you mushrooms + symbiosis.

Mop > WOD was the 'sine-wave' eclipse with peak power - which I hated and was forced to reroll.

WoD > Legion saw the sine-wave removed, and normalised the damage at peak eclipse.

Haven't played Boomy now to know what's it like in BFA.

The eclipse system is just like our Voidform/insanity mechanic.... Blizzard can't seem to figure out what to do with it :(
11/05/2018 04:33 PMPosted by Hpellipsis
The rest of your point though certainly, shadow has been through more mechanical iterations than any other spec (I think), and none of them have stuck.
Iterative changes... but not Innovative.

The dumbest thing is I tried to think about what changes really made Shadow Priests feel really good to play... and they weren't shadow priest changes, they were mechanical changes for all classes. The End of Burning Crusade when they removed most of hybrid penalities and normalised damage to 10% within the core dps classes... 3.0 in Black Temple made you feel like a god. (especially when they didn't rescale VT and you topped DPS and Healing meters :P)

3.3 Bought Shadow Priests haste scaling for DoTs, which meant we stopped being on the bench at the Tournament (3.2 sucked) and we got front row seats to Icecrown Citadel.

4.0 when they made DoTs Crit and allowed clip recasting... Icecrown was epic especially with a Shadow Apparition army proccing off every crit :P

At the end of the day, the Shadow Priest is the same class but Blizzard panics in the 11th hour of the Beta and throws something weird into the mix like a new resource mechanic or another gimmick... they need to stop that and work the class and see the problem underlying the class, cause when they see that problem under the game code, big changes happen!!!
10/27/2018 09:58 AMPosted by Kassiray
The biggest problem that most have hinted at is with other classes. There is an second spec or third that can also do dps. With shadow you choices are two healing specs (yeah disc kinda feels like a dps spec) but if shadow dps is not competitive then your forced to play another class. You cant just re spec.


Druid's have 4 specs, give priests 4 specs. 2 damage and 2 healing? O_o
11/05/2018 01:55 PMPosted by Aimou
I'm guessing major reworks summer 2019, when classic comes out haha.


I honestly don't have any hope for substantial class changes until 9.0. I hope I'm wrong though.
Class design was sacrificed due to Azerite armor traits. Blizzard probably thought the "fun" of the class would come from a tertiary system but that's where they fundamentally messed up.

Make the class fun FIRST, then you focus on secondary systems like stats scaling to make sure it's still fun, once you have those two items PERFECTED then you add a tertiary system like Axerite armor to add FLAVOR.

Instead they build Asserite armor as the primary system, then added class abilities, then factored for stat scaling.

A collosal and fundamental mistake that a 15 year old AAA game should never have had.
I think they could solve this issue if they adopted a class design like the one from Destiny (of course, not being so hollow), but have sub specs that you can choose what will define your class. Bringing an example to wow, shadow priests had a lot of iterations through the years, you could choose a sub spec in Voidform, unlocking all its traits, or in Devouring Plague as well. Or as a Demo lock, you could sub spec in summoning an army of demons, or in becoming one itself (meta, miss you).

There wouldn't be the need to remove things each expansion, but rather, you could keep adding new iterations, and let players choose. And of course, you could let the class base spells standard. Also, there wouldn't be the need to keep adding levels, just put quest chains each expac to unlock the new features.

If the guys at Blizz want, they can do! They just need to be more transparent, and communicate with us, that they are aware of all our complaints. The main issue that I have with the devs is that feeling of blindness towards some issues that are blatantly exposed by the community.

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