Charger now 8 second duration on PTR?

Paladin
09/29/2018 01:33 PMPosted by Estrath
@Divenity
To me if steed removed root/snares and prevented it for the duration of its use it would be more than good enough without it being broken.
Agreed, but it would still just be a reskinned sprint... Homogenization is bad, would much rather have unique mobility.

Give what you are asking and Paladins will be able to kite most melee around thier defensive cool downs, those same classes that can't dispell hinderance.
We'd be able to do that with a steed that suppressed roots and snares too... We can do it right now to every melee except Shaman because they can't dispel Freedom. We'd actually be worse at this with just PoJ for a movespeed buff since Steed is so much faster.
09/29/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Córax

Think we had a discussion before. Let's try it in a different way. What is your ideal for ret paladin? Please try to keep in mind pvp is rock/paper/scissor for good or bad.
You come across as an actual ret player not a fotm reroll. I'm curious on what longtime paladins more specifically ret players. Actual want from their spec. What they would consider balanced and fair for ret to have and not have.


Remove Divine Steed entirely, give us back [http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Emancipate] and [https://www.wowhead.com/spell=26023/pursuit-of-justice], nerf Divine Shield and BoP back to what they were before Legion (DS -50% outgoing damage while active, BoP disallowing outgoing physical attacks while active).

This is the exact same thing we had for mobility for 12 years before the Legion revamp (plus or minus a few% on PoJ's speed buff, it was 8% in vanilla, 15% from TBC to Cata, and as you see above during MoP and WoD). It worked, it wasn't considered OP at any point during those 12 years, and it was unique to us instead of just being a reskinned sprint.
09/29/2018 01:42 PMPosted by Divenity
09/29/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Córax

Think we had a discussion before. Let's try it in a different way. What is your ideal for ret paladin? Please try to keep in mind pvp is rock/paper/scissor for good or bad.
You come across as an actual ret player not a fotm reroll. I'm curious on what longtime paladins more specifically ret players. Actual want from their spec. What they would consider balanced and fair for ret to have and not have.


Remove Divine Steed entirely, give us back [http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Emancipate] and [https://www.wowhead.com/spell=26023/pursuit-of-justice], nerf Divine Shield and BoP back to what they were before Legion (DS -50% outgoing damage while active, BoP disallowing outgoing physical attacks while active).

This is the exact same thing we had for mobility for 12 years before the Legion revamp (plus or minus a few% on PoJ's speed buff, it was 8% in vanilla, 15% from TBC to Cata, and as you see above during MoP and WoD). It worked, it wasn't considered OP at any point during those 12 years, and it was unique to us instead of just being a reskinned sprint.

That's reasonable. Didn't see you mention divine shield or bop before, maybe I missed it.
Blizzard still needs to fix other specs though lol.
Should had been a immune to roots & stuff instead of a duration increase; no1 ask for that.
09/29/2018 02:00 PMPosted by Córax

That's reasonable. Didn't see you mention divine shield or bop before, maybe I missed it.
In this thread, no, I have mentioned it in others...I have said in this thread that I'm happy to take a damage nerf in exhange for this, I'd be fine with whatever form that nerf came in but this would just be my preferred method, BoP and DS had those limitations on them for a reason, they never should have been removed.

Blizzard still needs to fix other specs though lol.


They need to fix soooo damn many specs... this expansion is a disaster for class design. Blizzard really needs to start actually listening to feedback during alpha and beta, the classes that need fixing right now never should have made it out of beta in the state they are now.
09/29/2018 02:00 PMPosted by Córax

That's reasonable. Didn't see you mention divine shield or bop before, maybe I missed it.
In this thread, no, I have mentioned it in others...I have said in this thread that I'm happy to take a damage nerf in exhange for this, I'd be fine with whatever form that nerf came in but this would just be my preferred method, BoP and DS had those limitations on them for a reason, they never should have been removed.

Blizzard still needs to fix other specs though lol.


They need to fix soooo damn many specs... this expansion is a disaster for class design. Blizzard really needs to start actually listening to feedback during alpha and beta, the classes that need fixing right now never should have made it out of beta in the state they are now.

Funny thing is Blizzard managed to ruin more specs between prepatch BFA and right now then fix the ones that the previously messed up.
09/29/2018 01:42 PMPosted by Divenity
09/29/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Córax

Think we had a discussion before. Let's try it in a different way. What is your ideal for ret paladin? Please try to keep in mind pvp is rock/paper/scissor for good or bad.
You come across as an actual ret player not a fotm reroll. I'm curious on what longtime paladins more specifically ret players. Actual want from their spec. What they would consider balanced and fair for ret to have and not have.


Remove Divine Steed entirely, give us back [http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Emancipate] and [https://www.wowhead.com/spell=26023/pursuit-of-justice], nerf Divine Shield and BoP back to what they were before Legion (DS -50% outgoing damage while active, BoP disallowing outgoing physical attacks while active).

This is the exact same thing we had for mobility for 12 years before the Legion revamp (plus or minus a few% on PoJ's speed buff, it was 8% in vanilla, 15% from TBC to Cata, and as you see above during MoP and WoD). It worked, it wasn't considered OP at any point during those 12 years, and it was unique to us instead of just being a reskinned sprint.


If they nerf DS and BoP they need to remove mass dispell from the game, make DS what it was before the ultimate defense that cant be remove like in vanilla unless they do that then they need to leave DS as it is because on the crazy cooldown it has its a dumb defensive ability to begin with. And remove spell steal from the game, with mana not being a resource to manage for caster dps anymore this spell should not be in game anymore unless it does what old lay on hand did & uses 100% of mana; but mana being how it is now it should use 100% mana & reduce mana regen by 50% for 1 min.

DS is already a stupid ability, the best thing to do to it is make a 50% dmg reduction on a 1 min c/d; this is more defensive than a 5min c/d immune for a few sec & easy target afterward. Also give us blessing of spell warding as a baseline ability.
09/29/2018 02:43 PMPosted by Toushin
If they nerf DS and BoP they need to remove mass dispell from the game
Divine Shield existed alongside Mass Dispel in it's nerfed(correct) state for years without issue. There is no reason Mass Dispel should need removing.
09/29/2018 02:54 PMPosted by Divenity
09/29/2018 02:43 PMPosted by Toushin
If they nerf DS and BoP they need to remove mass dispell from the game
Divine Shield existed alongside Mass Dispel in it's nerfed(correct) state for years without issue. There is no reason Mass Dispel should need removing.

This, removing mass dispell that has multiple applications besides removing DS and BoP would be a horrible idea.
09/29/2018 12:40 PMPosted by Airc
No. It's 3 seconds on the PTR. Sorry, no buff.

Coming from a Demon Hunter, this is especially funny.


I've played Ret since MoP, moron.
I hope Blizzard doesn't actually think that this fixes the ret mobility problem. It utterly ignores it. It doesn't address it at all.

There has never been a problem getting to your target within the duration of the charger. I imagine the number of people who have hit the button and failed to reach the person running away from them, assuming some other crowd control isn't present, is in the single digit percentages.

The problem is when the charger isn't available. It's that you can simply walk away from a paladin, or slow the paladin, and the paladin becomes a null threat. Cut the cooldown to 20 seconds and you're starting to look at some progress at the actual problem, but even that has never worked for another class; demon hunters, rogues, warriors, deathknights, monks, those melee classes only managed to solve the problem through spells that simultaneously move the player quickly and suppress/ignore movement impairing effects (or in reverse, in the case of the deathknight).

Mind you, I know that if Blizzard does address the problem correctly, they'll make it a talent. And so the problem won't be fixed, because taking the talent will create another problem through what you give up to get it. Such is the perpetual problem of the paladin, the only class forced to have a one-tool toolbox.
09/28/2018 12:56 PMPosted by Myrilana
Now if only it would clear roots and snares......or you know they can just give Ret the prot pvp talent that does that.


Seriously if they would just do this we wouldn't need the charger to be so ridiculously long that itll get nerfed within a week
I feel like historically, Blizzard has always beat around the bush with Paladin issues. We always get these gimmicky fixes that no one asked for. All I've ever wanted on my Pally was a reliable gap closer, a baseline reliable snare, and an interrupt which we did get after a ridiculous amount of time. 8 seconds is too long and completely irrelevant if freedom is gone the instant it comes up anyways.
All i want is a little bit more mobility with a tiny bit more aoe damage, then ill be happy
I'm excited to this to actually last. I wish they would address the fact that it can be snared, immobilized, slowed, and basically rendered useless in PvP if we don't have HoF up but I'll take what I can get.

Someone above mentioned a glyph to change DS to a run animation? I'd love that. LOVE that.

It's friggin' obnoxious to pop DS and then not be able to get into a building cause even the horse makes me too tall -_-
https://twitter.com/Wowhead/status/1046095314103480322

Nope. Just found this thanks to another thread.

Cause f&@$ us, I guess
10/01/2018 09:57 AMPosted by Benjimar
https://twitter.com/Wowhead/status/1046095314103480322

Nope. Just found this thanks to another thread.

Cause f&@$ us, I guess


So what is it? I'm at work on my phone and for w/e reason Twitter goes into an endless refresh loop.
10/01/2018 10:15 AMPosted by Lathander
10/01/2018 09:57 AMPosted by Benjimar
https://twitter.com/Wowhead/status/1046095314103480322

Nope. Just found this thanks to another thread.

Cause f&@$ us, I guess


So what is it? I'm at work on my phone and for w/e reason Twitter goes into an endless refresh loop.


Wowhead basically shows that the 8sec thing was a tooltip bug and that the tooltip was fixed and put back on 3sec. No mobility buff for us
10/01/2018 10:20 AMPosted by Benjimar
10/01/2018 10:15 AMPosted by Lathander
...

So what is it? I'm at work on my phone and for w/e reason Twitter goes into an endless refresh loop.


Wowhead basically shows that the 8sec thing was a tooltip bug and that the tooltip was fixed and put back on 3sec. No mobility buff for us


Tbh we all knew it wasn't going to last, and at best we still would've had 16 seconds ( if specced into Cavalier) of snared or rooted useless horse so. Not much of a loss.
10/01/2018 10:39 AMPosted by Myrilana
10/01/2018 10:20 AMPosted by Benjimar
...

Wowhead basically shows that the 8sec thing was a tooltip bug and that the tooltip was fixed and put back on 3sec. No mobility buff for us


Tbh we all knew it wasn't going to last, and at best we still would've had 16 seconds ( if specced into Cavalier) of snared or rooted useless horse so. Not much of a loss.


Sad but true.

Yeah I mentioned earlier that it's still useless if HoF is on CD or get's stolen/dispelled but the extra mobility still would'a been nice. Idk, I wish we had a leap. I've seen a lot of posts begging for us to get something like the "Heavenly Sword" ability Crusaders in D3 get

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