The Unofficial High Elf Discussion Megathread

General Discussion
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We may not see any new ARs announced until near the end of the expac.
11/14/2018 11:32 PMPosted by Idun
We may not see any new ARs announced until near the end of the expac.


Yeah. That's what Blizzcon told me by the lack of announcements for anything. They'll prob announce them like they did with the ones we have now for legion.
I'm not even mad or upset about Blizzard in regards to High Elves anymore

it's just a quiet disappointment edging closer and closer to apathy as the long list of disappointments with them continues to grow
11/14/2018 05:29 PMPosted by Iratio
Some high elves here, some high elves over there, a smaller group in that other place, and so on.

With no distinct nation (like Kul'tiran and Dark Iron) - they are dispersed -, no distinct racial difference (like Void elves, Dark Iron, and by lore alone the Lightforged) - every Blood elf except the very young remembers being a High elf, the name change was so recent -, no distinct culture (like Dark Iron, Kul'tiran, and Lightforged) - some of them are deathly opposed to the Sin'dorei and some of them desire unification -, there is no compelling reason High elves should be an allied race for alliance (or the Horde).

One reason not to do them for the Alliance is faction identity. Blood elves are a big deal in the Horde. Rolling the same on alliance with death knight colored eyes is not a good idea - it's a bad idea.


The argument that High Elves have no culture of their own [Iratio - doesn't mention Void Elves, so what follows isn't a counter point, it's mis-direction]
when Void Elves where BE just less than a year ago and their "culture" boils to being forcefully changed it's so disingenuous.

High Elves have been living, assimilating into other cultures, that by DEFINITION changes their culture. To say [Iratio - I'm quoted above, what I say is they have no distinct culture - notice you used the plural form of cultures - and I don't say their culture is the same as the blood elves. The text that follows gives us another mis-direction - no counter point here]they have the same culture than Blood Elves literally dismisses their different context.

High Elf culture, or call it Silver Coveanant culture if the semantics bother you, is staying in the alliance, in a human city, over returning to Quel'thalas, and maybe it's also porking humans.[Iratio - Thanks, yes maybe this, that, all over the place - as I'm quoted above, no distinct culture (as for semantics - since we all know what you mean by High elves, let's use 'High elves' ]

Really, the claim that HE have no culture when the reasons they are no longer part of Blood Elves because of of ideological and political differences is so... silly.[Iratio - calling a point I didn't make silly is not a counter point - I've claimed they lack a distinct culture qua High elves]

Highvale Elves even have their own light/nature thing going on, and the SC is a highly militant Dalarani group. What of their culture even remotely resembles Blood Elven culture?[Iratio - no counter point here, High elf culture being the equivalent of Blood elf culture was never claimed or said]


Belf culture not equal to HE culture - check, if anyone claims there is no HE culture they are being silly - check, any claim that HE have not been "assimilating into other cultures" "literally dismisses their different context" - check, it's "disingenuous" to claim HE have no culture and use Void elves for contrast - check.

No compelling argument for, and no riposte or counter argument to the argument against.

I don't blame anyone for employing rhetoric, the topic can't survive a strictly rational discussion.


<span class="truncated">...</span>
Man, the fact that Ion said that must really burn. <3


WeW. I get that people are starting to really get passionate over the topic at hand, but once we start getting passive aggressive with one another, it hurts your credibility and sincerity while also making a slippery slope that goes straight from being somewhat productive and an interesting topic, to just plain old mud flinging that will only further entrench everyone to their base opinions.

It's safe to say that while you have evidence to support your claim that there are some sympathetic High Elves that wish to rejoin with their people, there are just as many, if not more counter points to ensure that this peaceful resolution never comes to pass.

When comments like what I just read above start sprouting, it's clear that there really isn't anything left of value to be shared on the subject, and nobody is going to likely agree with anyone else. I suggest that people agree to disagree on this subject and just let it go.


For the record I apologize to the thread for continuing the argument until it reached that point.

I need to take my own advice and just dismissed that stuff.

Also is anyone having a hard time getting this thread to load?
11/14/2018 01:25 PMPosted by Mowachassa
Hmm, no. The Night Elves are part of the Alliance for like, 10 years? The High Elves about 3000.


Since when was the Alliance 3000 years old?
11/15/2018 12:49 AMPosted by Iratio

I don't blame anyone for employing rhetoric, the topic can't survive a strictly rational discussion.


"This discussion can't be a discussion without employing trolling."

You should probably stop. If I misunderstood I'm sorry, but that's what I just picked up that you said.

11/15/2018 12:55 AMPosted by Drede

Also is anyone having a hard time getting this thread to load?


Loading a-okay for me! Probably because it's +4k comments now :D (I know it's not.. but what other discussions are beyond this number, anyways?)

Is there an actual thread cap limit on these forums?

11/15/2018 01:12 AMPosted by Vivette
11/14/2018 01:25 PMPosted by Mowachassa
Hmm, no. The Night Elves are part of the Alliance for like, 10 years? The High Elves about 3000.


Since when was the Alliance 3000 years old?


I think they were saying that the High Elves were around and in common mingling with humans for 3k years. Not that the Alliance was a formal agreement for 3k years.
11/15/2018 01:52 AMPosted by Arisran
I think they were saying that the High Elves were around and in common mingling with humans for 3k years. Not that the Alliance was a formal agreement for 3k years.


No I'm pretty sure the post I quoted mentioned Alliance specifically when referencing Night Elves as being part of the Alliance for 10 years. If it were just mingling, Night Elves have been mingling ever since WC3 when Jaina landed her refugees on Kalimdor unto the Battle of Mount Hjyal.
11/15/2018 01:55 AMPosted by Vivette
11/15/2018 01:52 AMPosted by Arisran
I think they were saying that the High Elves were around and in common mingling with humans for 3k years. Not that the Alliance was a formal agreement for 3k years.


No I'm pretty sure the post I quoted mentioned Alliance specifically when referencing Night Elves as being part of the Alliance for 10 years. If it were just mingling, Night Elves have been mingling ever since WC3 when Jaina landed her refugees on Kalimdor unto the Battle of Mount Hjyal.


Then they are either misinformed or mistyping their point, or you are misreading what they said.

If I were to try and figure out what they were saying at a glance, it would be that the warnings that come from a group of Night Elves that they've known since the inception of the Alliance 10 years prior or w/e does not hold water to the relationship shared between humans and elves for the past 3000 years.
11/15/2018 02:00 AMPosted by Arisran
Then they are either misinformed or mistyping their point, or you are misreading what they said.

If I were to try and figure out what they were saying at a glance, it would be that the warnings that come from a group of Night Elves that they've known since the inception of the Alliance 10 years prior or w/e does not hold water to the relationship shared between humans and elves for the past 3000 years.


Misreading? The entire post was to compare NElves relation to the Alliance, not specifically humans.

As for poster I quoted mistyping or misunderstanding their argument, yes I would agree very much. Alot of misinformation is spreading hence my benign response of calling into question the supposed "3000 years in the Alliance" by pointing out the actual longevity of the Alliance to date not even being half a century.
11/15/2018 02:04 AMPosted by Vivette
11/15/2018 02:00 AMPosted by Arisran
Then they are either misinformed or mistyping their point, or you are misreading what they said.

If I were to try and figure out what they were saying at a glance, it would be that the warnings that come from a group of Night Elves that they've known since the inception of the Alliance 10 years prior or w/e does not hold water to the relationship shared between humans and elves for the past 3000 years.


Misreading? The entire post was to compare NElves relation to the Alliance, not specifically humans.

As for poster I quoted mistyping or misunderstanding their argument, yes I would agree very much. Alot of misinformation is spreading hence my benign response of calling into question the supposed "3000 years in the Alliance" by pointing out the actual longevity of the Alliance to date not even being half a century.


Sorry, by misreading I meant misunderstanding, haha. Either way I meant it in regards to myself being able to surmise easily enough what the OP was inferring when they mentioned High Elves' relationship with the humans, not the Alliance with humans, because there was no 3k year alliance with humans, but there was a relationship there. So it's likely just a misunderstanding on your part, and written in a way that is easily misunderstood on their end.

EDIT: I just went back and actually read the original post and yes, it seems you misunderstood what was being stated. They were not saying that there was an Alliance between helfs and humans for 3000 years. They were stating that there was a relationship present that meant the warnings from the night elves would hold little sway over what the humans already knew.
...

Do the broken hilt quest for the Alliance, they severely distrust Auric and any Alliance High Elf for that matter

I did do the Broken hilt Quest on both sides. The only confrontation between the elves is present between the Silver Covenant and the Sunreavers, not Auric Sunchaser, the High Elf pilgrims, and the Blood elves. There is no dialogue, or body language that suggests otherwise. The High elf pilgrims are walking around, and milling about with the Blood Elves, bathing in the light of the Sunwell. They are not be cornered, or harassed, or showing any signs of discomfort of fear for their well being.

Please, if you're going to make such claims I would ask you provide proof beyond just your word. You've responded with empty conjecture several times and have ignored everything I've said to repeat the same things. I ask for proof of your claim, not another post with another uncited claim.


Notice how quickly the Blood Elves are to jump to conclusions and blame Auric and the player for Quel'delar rejecting Lor'themar. Something went wrong, and they immediately shout, "Auric, what is the meaning of this?!" to which Auric explains that it was Lor'themar's fault, and that Quel'delar chooses it's user. They then tell Auric to watch his tongue. I don't know about you, but I definitely sensed some hostility there

Unless I'm remembering it wrong...?
11/15/2018 04:25 AMPosted by Lorithyn
...
I did do the Broken hilt Quest on both sides. The only confrontation between the elves is present between the Silver Covenant and the Sunreavers, not Auric Sunchaser, the High Elf pilgrims, and the Blood elves. There is no dialogue, or body language that suggests otherwise. The High elf pilgrims are walking around, and milling about with the Blood Elves, bathing in the light of the Sunwell. They are not be cornered, or harassed, or showing any signs of discomfort of fear for their well being.

Please, if you're going to make such claims I would ask you provide proof beyond just your word. You've responded with empty conjecture several times and have ignored everything I've said to repeat the same things. I ask for proof of your claim, not another post with another uncited claim.


Notice how quickly the Blood Elves are to jump to conclusions and blame Auric and the player for Quel'delar rejecting Lor'themar. Something went wrong, and they immediately shout, "Auric, what is the meaning of this?!" to which Auric explains that it was Lor'themar's fault, and that Quel'delar chooses it's user. They then tell Auric to watch his tongue. I don't know about you, but I definitely sensed some hostility there

Unless I'm remembering it wrong...?


Nope, you're correct. That happens, I posted a reply think it was 2 pages back in relation to the scenario.

Double checked too via watching others on YT complete the scenario.
Just saying that High Elves have been requested for 14 years and going strong, what I’d never understand is people against adding more races to a game....

This game use to be immersive, when your character was unique, I grown attached my character and people are looking for their race to grow with, I have no idea why people are against diversity in a video game, who are you to say “no you can’t play this race”, like get a grip...

If anything this game going to be 14 years old and should have more races, more customisation for both original and Allied Races, WoW is living in its own shadow and when people are against adding customisations and races your the reason why we are still in this shadow...

World of Warcraft needs to aim forward and progress, not continue what it’s been doing for 14 years, people will get bored, why do you think sub numbers are down?, most my friends have left for better things because every wow expansion it’s the same... I’m sorry but the “same” isn’t going to make WoW more popular, change has to happen...

Why do you think activision-blizzard is expanding into mobiles? Because it needs change to thrive what we have already is slowly fading.. it just pains me to see that the people arguing against adding races and more class combinations...they are the reason why this game is slowly dying.. don’t you realise this?.

High Elves, Ogres, Wildhammer, Vyrkul are all Allied Races being requested, this will bring back more players, especially those who want to be those races and have been waiting, people need to understand visuals/customisation and diversity is was what WoW needs the most now especially to compete with other games which have gorgeous customisation and graphics...

We should stick together and make changes happen not split into two groups bickering back and forth, we need change.. we need more, I’d hate to see WoW fade and stay in the shadow it’s already sad to see many guilds disbanding because players aren’t renewing subs.. I’m for High Elves and every Allied Race, I don’t mind you know why? Because if I don’t like that race I just won’t play as one and let the people enjoy themselves.....IN A VIDEO GAME..
...

Notice how quickly the Blood Elves are to jump to conclusions and blame Auric and the player for Quel'delar rejecting Lor'themar. Something went wrong, and they immediately shout, "Auric, what is the meaning of this?!" to which Auric explains that it was Lor'themar's fault, and that Quel'delar chooses it's user. They then tell Auric to watch his tongue. I don't know about you, but I definitely sensed some hostility there

Unless I'm remembering it wrong...?


Nope, you're correct. That happens, I posted a reply think it was 2 pages back in relation to the scenario.

Double checked too via watching others on YT complete the scenario.


https://youtu.be/NHsiVES1fQs - You can see it here, around the 30:40 mark.
...

Dont flatter yourself. It's right on the front page. And it's getting obliterated like your arguments here lol.

I love to laugh. And reading the massacre over there is actually very entertaining.


You lost any credibility mentionning mmochamp.

The mmochamp forums are a cesspool of anti-alliance anything really. It's really just the same people and that dude with the edgy red eye picture repeating "ION SAID NO", nitpicking at semantics and being super mellow-dramatic.

I feel like you're wasting a lot of energy being this bitter towards a feature that would have no effect on you.

If you disagree with high elves, state your reasons and expect to be countered with obvious ingame and lore evidence.


Don't kid yourself, if the roles were reversed and you were posting pro-high elf things on MMOCHAMP and it was a pro-alliance cesspool, would you even notice or care? Or would you silently or perhaps just as vocally keep on truckin?
11/15/2018 04:50 AMPosted by Grabmytotem
...

You lost any credibility mentionning mmochamp.

The mmochamp forums are a cesspool of anti-alliance anything really. It's really just the same people and that dude with the edgy red eye picture repeating "ION SAID NO", nitpicking at semantics and being super mellow-dramatic.

I feel like you're wasting a lot of energy being this bitter towards a feature that would have no effect on you.

If you disagree with high elves, state your reasons and expect to be countered with obvious ingame and lore evidence.


Don't kid yourself, if the roles were reversed and you were posting pro-high elf things on MMOCHAMP and it was a pro-alliance cesspool, would you even notice or care? Or would you silently or perhaps just as vocally keep on truckin?


I don't frequent MMOCHAMP at all, but if the majority of its users are anti-Alliance then that's the matter at hand. We could talk about what ifs all we want, but that doesn't change what it currently is

You're probably right in that we wouldn't notice or care of it was a pro-Alliance cesspool though. People generally have trouble pointing out flaws on their own side
11/15/2018 04:30 AMPosted by Pepino
Just saying that High Elves have been requested for 14 years and going strong, what I’d never understand is people against adding more races to a game....

This game use to be immersive, when your character was unique, I grown attached my character and people are looking for their race to grow with, I have no idea why people are against diversity in a video game, who are you to say “no you can’t play this race”, like get a grip...

If anything this game going to be 14 years old and should have more races, more customisation for both original and Allied Races, WoW is living in its own shadow and when people are against adding customisations and races your the reason why we are still in this shadow...

World of Warcraft needs to aim forward and progress, not continue what it’s been doing for 14 years, people will get bored, why do you think sub numbers are down?, most my friends have left for better things because every wow expansion it’s the same... I’m sorry but the “same” isn’t going to make WoW more popular, change has to happen...

Why do you think activision-blizzard is expanding into mobiles? Because it needs change to thrive what we have already is slowly fading.. it just pains me to see that the people arguing against adding races and more class combinations...they are the reason why this game is slowly dying.. don’t you realise this?.

High Elves, Ogres, Wildhammer, Vyrkul are all Allied Races being requested, this will bring back more players, especially those who want to be those races and have been waiting, people need to understand visuals/customisation and diversity is was what WoW needs the most now especially to compete with other games which have gorgeous customisation and graphics...

We should stick together and make changes happen not split into two groups bickering back and forth, we need change.. we need more, I’d hate to see WoW fade and stay in the shadow it’s already sad to see many guilds disbanding because players aren’t renewing subs.. I’m for High Elves and every Allied Race, I don’t mind you know why? Because if I don’t like that race I just won’t play as one and let the people enjoy themselves.....IN A VIDEO GAME..


Preach it. I'm in favor of all allied races that make sense, and High Elves for the Alliance most definitely make sense
...

Don't kid yourself, if the roles were reversed and you were posting pro-high elf things on MMOCHAMP and it was a pro-alliance cesspool, would you even notice or care? Or would you silently or perhaps just as vocally keep on truckin?


I don't frequent MMOCHAMP at all, but if the majority of its users are anti-Alliance then that's the matter at hand. We could talk about what ifs all we want, but that doesn't change what it currently is

You're probably right in that we wouldn't notice or care of it was a pro-Alliance cesspool though. People generally have trouble pointing out flaws on their own side


I get that. I feel its worth pointing out though. Maybe in doing so we all take looks inward.
11/14/2018 01:16 PMPosted by Evelira
Back again to continue my support for High Elves in the Alliance


One last post here to make it clear to Blizzard that giving the Alliance another Blood Elf look a like is offensive to Horde players.

Definitely do not support this.

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