Classic WoW: You want the feel, not the gameplay

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Most people probably realize it won’t be the same as when they played back then. I don’t think blizzard is trying to create a true classic experience (mechanically) or it would have been released already. They don’t need to stick their grubby fingers in and tailor it to todays player. Big mistake imo.
It will be fine and do good I just do not want to play it,and it is a great thing Blizz is doing for their oldskool players makes me think they still give a sht a little.
10/18/2018 11:28 AMPosted by Gurgles
Classic WoW will fail, there is no denying this, and people who say otherwise are so deluded and disconnected from reality, but they will learn a harsh lesson in due time.

What players want and miss from Classic WoW: The world, the community, the familiarity, and the challenge.
What players dont yet realize are gonna get: A complete deletion of 15 years worth of quality-of-life changes, balance and visual enhancements.

I dont need to list it, you all know the gigs, no transmogs, no LFG, no account-wide progression, and all your favorite specs will play like hot garbage.

Whats sad is blizzard listened to the vocal minority, and classic WoW will face the same fate as Wildstar did... the *hardcore* target audience is so little compared to the casual majority, and the casual majority will quit after wanding the 35'th satyr to death.


This makes no sense. Why can't I trade in some quality of life things for the things I want (which you actually listed in your OP)?

You defeated your own argument.
10/18/2018 11:39 AMPosted by Exuri
10/18/2018 11:32 AMPosted by Poynty
Gotta hand it to OP, this is much better thought out than "you think you do, but you don't".


If this turns out to actually be the case.
I wonder how many classic players will stay there (even though they don't like it) or quit all together because they can't swallow their pride.


Its already not going to be a reboot of the actual classic. Its coding and whatever else they said they had to change to make it work on the current server infrastructure will make it different than it WAS way back in 2004.

So yeah, i can already hear it now.
10/18/2018 12:40 PMPosted by Tetsubin
To some extent, QoL features and declining sense of community went hand in hand though.


QoL changes caused the decline of community. It is beyond denial.
10/24/2018 07:54 AMPosted by Nawak
10/18/2018 12:40 PMPosted by Tetsubin
To some extent, QoL features and declining sense of community went hand in hand though.


QoL changes caused the decline of community. It is beyond denial.
I have to disagree. The decline of the conmunity was caused by players who do not value that aspect of the game. Not sure if you realize, most players play this game just like Diablo. Action loot grinding. The developers have embraced this playstyle and have been catering to it for over a decade. QoL mechanics have nothing to do with it imo.
10/18/2018 12:06 PMPosted by Duskwraith
Please take this to the classic forums, we get enough of this spam in GD as it is.

That aside, Classic WoW won't "fail" because there will always be some people who want to play it. After they finish it, it's basically set forever and costs as much to maintain as any other realm(s). Can't deny that there is an audience for it.

Still, people have some serious rose tinted beer goggles on if they think that Classic is going to be some magical wonderland and will fix everything forever. It has a lot of flaws and is destined to stagnate forever.

How many people are honestly going to pay $15 for old content that will never change? How about months later when the nostalgia starts to lose its luster? Eventually it's bound to shrink into a niche community really.

People who played vanilla are aware of it's flaws. We want it anyway because it's better than what I'm playing right now.
10/18/2018 11:28 AMPosted by Gurgles
Classic WoW will fail, there is no denying this, and people who say otherwise are so deluded and disconnected from reality, but they will learn a harsh lesson in due time.

What players want and miss from Classic WoW: The world, the community, the familiarity, and the challenge.
What players dont yet realize are gonna get: A complete deletion of 15 years worth of quality-of-life changes, balance and visual enhancements.

I dont need to list it, you all know the gigs, no transmogs, no LFG, no account-wide progression, and all your favorite specs will play like hot garbage.

Whats sad is blizzard listened to the vocal minority, and classic WoW will face the same fate as Wildstar did... the *hardcore* target audience is so little compared to the casual majority, and the casual majority will quit after wanding the 35'th satyr to death.


wow, another thread where someone who's never experienced classic will tell us whether we'll enjoy it or not.
10/18/2018 11:39 AMPosted by Exuri
10/18/2018 11:32 AMPosted by Poynty
Gotta hand it to OP, this is much better thought out than "you think you do, but you don't".


If this turns out to actually be the case.
I wonder how many classic players will stay there (even though they don't like it) or quit all together because they can't swallow their pride.


It won’t be pride, most Classic players hate the current game. BFA is a dumpster fire, but they left long before, and haven’t liked retail since Cata, some even disliked Wrath.

Classic is going to be additional revenue for Blizzard to recapture some of the over 100 million subs who have churned through the game over time. They are making like 8 servers per region, they’ll have no problem keeping them up.
Believe me I want Classic. No stupid scaling = Win, No stupid warmode that makes it hard to find world pvp at low levels = Win
10/18/2018 11:28 AMPosted by Gurgles
Classic WoW will fail, there is no denying this, and people who say otherwise are so deluded and disconnected from reality, but they will learn a harsh lesson in due time.

What players want and miss from Classic WoW: The world, the community, the familiarity, and the challenge.
What players dont yet realize are gonna get: A complete deletion of 15 years worth of quality-of-life changes, balance and visual enhancements.

I dont need to list it, you all know the gigs, no transmogs, no LFG, no account-wide progression, and all your favorite specs will play like hot garbage.

Whats sad is blizzard listened to the vocal minority, and classic WoW will face the same fate as Wildstar did... the *hardcore* target audience is so little compared to the casual majority, and the casual majority will quit after wanding the 35'th satyr to death.


Since I have no idea what I want and am disconnected from reality, could you give me your number so I can consult you on every decision I try to make? You are clearly much more qualified for life than I am.
I have to disagree. The decline of the conmunity was caused by players who do not value that aspect of the game. Not sure if you realize, most players play this game just like Diablo. Action loot grinding. The developers have embraced this playstyle and have been catering to it for over a decade. QoL mechanics have nothing to do with it imo.


No way, my friend. The very first QoL change was server transferring. We all thought that would be a great idea at the time. Turns out it wasn't, and we immediately recognized that. By summer 2006 servers had ossified into a social hierarchy among guilds where everyone knew everyone. Server transfers opened and whole guilds left servers and showed up on others.
The disruption to the game's community was massive. Before if your guild was the best on the server you felt secure in your position; afterwards, you never knew if a better guild was going to just magically appear out of thin air one day. And that happened.
Before server transfers, when you saw an Ashkandi or any prized item in Orgrimmar you could easily find out how that person got it. Maybe they got it in their guild, or maybe they spent all their DKP on it in their last guild and immediately gquit and joined another, or maybe it was ninja'd, or maybe the guild that achieved that level of progression had disbanded. Every piece of gear had a widely known story. With server transfers, new gear just appeared. Our server only had a handful of Ashkandis for example and everyone knew exactly who had them and how they got them. Then people just started showing up with absolutely no backstory and all this incredible gear. Even a hunter had one. He swore he didn't ninja it, but there was no way to verify his story. It was the beginning of social disruption.

Then came cross realm battlegrounds. Once again, everyone thought this was a great change. We had been crying for it for months as the solution to reduce battleground queue times. Blizzard had been slow to introduce the feature but they finally did at the end of vanilla. Instantly we realized what had been lost. Never again would you queue up for BGs and end up on a team of people you knew, some of whom you admired, some you looked down on, some you had grouped with, some from your former guilds, some from rival guilds, etc. Maybe it was your chance to see that Sulfuras you've been ogling in Orgrimmar actually in action. Maybe it was your chance to outdo the warlock officer from a rival guild. Never again would you face the same enemy players over and over again, learn their names, develop rivalries etc. A Paladin named Soysauce on my server learned to equip his shadow reflector whenever he saw me in a BG. We never spoke but we would emote each other in BGs. A genuine organic rivalry developed.
I came to personally know many of the Rank 14s on my server on both factions simply because we played with/against each other so often. With cross realm battlegrounds, those organic interactions were COMPLETELY GONE.

So you see, what seemed like an obvious QoL improvement to the game had unintended destructive consequences for the game's community. This trend would only continue with first flying mounts, then being able to have a million alts so you never recognized anyone even if you DID see them twice, then teleporting all over the world, LFG/LFR, etc.
10/24/2018 08:12 AMPosted by Nawak
I have to disagree. The decline of the conmunity was caused by players who do not value that aspect of the game. Not sure if you realize, most players play this game just like Diablo. Action loot grinding. The developers have embraced this playstyle and have been catering to it for over a decade. QoL mechanics have nothing to do with it imo.


No way, my friend. The very first QoL change was server transferring. We all thought that would be a great idea at the time. Turns out it wasn't, and we immediately recognized that. By summer 2006 servers had ossified into a social hierarchy among guilds where everyone knew everyone. Server transfers opened and whole guilds left servers and showed up on others.
The disruption to the game's community was massive. Before if your guild was the best on the server you felt secure in your position; afterwards, you never knew if a better guild was going to just magically appear out of thin air one day. And that happened.
Before server transfers, when you saw an Ashkandi or any prized item in Orgrimmar you could easily find out how that person got it. Maybe they got it in their guild, or maybe they spent all their DKP on it in their last guild and immediately gquit and joined another, or maybe it was ninja'd, or maybe the guild that achieved that level of progression had disbanded. Every piece of gear had a widely known story. With server transfers, new gear just appeared. Our server only had a handful of Ashkandis for example and everyone knew exactly who had them and how they got them. Then people just started showing up with absolutely no backstory and all this incredible gear. Even a hunter had one. He swore he didn't ninja it, but there was no way to verify his story. It was the beginning of social disruption.

Then came cross realm battlegrounds. Once again, everyone thought this was a great change. We had been crying for it for months as the solution to reduce battleground queue times. Blizzard had been slow to introduce the feature but they finally did at the end of vanilla. Instantly we realized what had been lost. Never again would you queue up for BGs and end up on a team of people you knew, some of whom you admired, some you looked down on, some you had grouped with, some from your former guilds, some from rival guilds, etc. Never again would you face the same enemy players over and over again, learn their names, develop rivalries etc. A Paladin named Soysauce on my server learned to equip his shadow reflector whenever he saw me in a BG. We never spoke but we would emote each other in BGs. A genuine organic rivalry developed.
I came to personally know many of the Rank 14s on my server on both factions simply because we played with/against each other so often. With cross realm battlegrounds, those organic interactions were COMPLETELY GONE.

So you see, what seemed like an obvious QoL improvement to the game had unintended destructive consequences for the game's community. This trend would only continue with first flying mounts, then being able to have a million alts so you never recognized anyone even if you DID see them twice, then teleporting all over the world, LFG/LFR, etc.
You can’t force players to value community. No amount of erasing QoL features will change that. You can make people depend on each other more, but current players do not enjoy that for the most part, which is why so many QoL features were added in the first place. Those guilds that transferred servers are examples of those that do not value community. If you made server transfers free, it would be rampant to the point of only one or two servers with all the players on it. And the community would still suck.
Those guilds that teansfered servers are examples of those that do not value community. If you made server transfers free, it would be rampant to the point of only one or two servers with all the players on it. And the community would still suck.


I transferred. I didn't realize what I was giving up. My server was laggy around raid times so I imagined I could simply transfer to a server that didn't lag every night at 8pm. I certainly valued community; that was what I loved most about WoW. I just didn't realize the consequences of convenience.

I was all for xfers, x-realm bgs, and flying mounts until I saw their effects. I never imagined how disruptive they would be for community, for player interactions. So I don't blame anyone who called for these changes and I don't blame Blizzard for implementing them. They seemed like a genuinely good idea at the time. And I don't blame any relatively new players who even today still call for/praise QoL changes because I know personally how difficult it can be to see the cost at which they come.

It reminds me of when I was like ten years old and playing Baldur's Gate II. The game was hard and confusing so I used cheats. It was thrilling for literally five minutes, but then I got bored and realized there was nothing to do and stopped playing. I realized then that the !@#$ty inconveniences are what actually make the journey worth going on; if you just type in the cheat codes and teleport where you want and win every encounter and always get the best drops then the game is actually boring and not even worth playing.
10/24/2018 08:25 AMPosted by Nawak
Those guilds that teansfered servers are examples of those that do not value community. If you made server transfers free, it would be rampant to the point of only one or two servers with all the players on it. And the community would still suck.


I transferred. I didn't realize what I was giving up. My server was laggy around raid times so I imagined I could simply transfer to a server that didn't lag every night at 8pm. I certainly valued community; that was what I loved most about WoW. I just didn't realize the consequences of convenience.

I was all for xfers, x-realm bgs, and flying mounts until I saw their effects. I never imagined how disruptive they would be for community, for player interactions. So I don't blame anyone who called for these changes and I don't blame Blizzard for implementing them. They seemed like a genuinely good idea at the time. And I don't blame any relatively new players who even today still call for/praise QoL changes because I know personally how difficult it can be to see the cost at which they come.

It reminds me of when I was like ten years old and playing Baldur's Gate II. The game was hard and confusing so I used cheats. It was thrilling for literally five minutes, but then I got bored and realized there was nothing to do and stopped playing. I realized then that the !@#$ty inconveniences are what actually make the journey worth going on; if you just type in the cheat codes and teleport where you want and win every encounter and always get the best drops then the game is actually boring and not even worth playing.
I feel you. I’ve made the same mistakes. And now it’s just too late, I feel. There might be a few little pockets here or there, but for the most part that aspect of the game (and genre) is gone forever.
10/18/2018 11:36 AMPosted by Currency
to be fair, the specs now play like garbage.


I don't really have a dog in the fight other that a small concern about the development resources this may pull from the current game. That being said one thing I hated about vanilla was the lack of choice when it came to certain classes, I mean forget DPSing if you are a class that has any kind of healing tree and forget tanking on anything but a Warrior. Some classes didn't really get fixes until closer to BC, Hunters for instance.

Also, what about the casual scene? Vanilla is where the phrase "Raid or Die" was coined. Once you've leveled maybe an alt or two what are you gonna do, grind silithus rep for mediocre rewards?

I will try it out for nostalgia to see if the old vibe is there though.

Then came cross realm battlegrounds. Once again, everyone thought this was a great change. We had been crying for it for months as the solution to reduce battleground queue times. Blizzard had been slow to introduce the feature but they finally did at the end of vanilla. Instantly we realized what had been lost. Never again would you queue up for BGs and end up on a team of people you knew, some of whom you admired, some you looked down on, some you had grouped with, some from your former guilds, some from rival guilds, etc. Never again would you face the same enemy players over and over again, learn their names, develop rivalries etc. A Paladin named Soysauce on my server learned to equip his shadow reflector whenever he saw me in a BG. We never spoke but we would emote each other in BGs. A genuine organic rivalry developed.
I came to personally know many of the Rank 14s on my server on both factions simply because we played with/against each other so often. With cross realm battlegrounds, those organic interactions were COMPLETELY GONE.

So you see, what seemed like an obvious QoL improvement to the game had unintended destructive consequences for the game's community. This trend would only continue with first flying mounts, then being able to have a million alts so you never recognized anyone even if you DID see them twice, then teleporting all over the world, LFG/LFR, etc.


The guy who wrote those comments obviously never played on a server where one faction outnumbered the other faction. He obviously doesn't recognize why Blizz implemented battle groups for BGs.

BG queues did not wait for every slot to fill. So after long waits in the queue, you could get put in a new match where it started at 10 v 6 in WSG or 40 v 17 in AV.

Also, even after the patch, if you did enough BGs, you did get to know which players to watch because the realms were locked to a particular battle group. It wasn't random cross-realm like it is today.
<span class="truncated">...</span>

No way, my friend. The very first QoL change was server transferring. We all thought that would be a great idea at the time. Turns out it wasn't, and we immediately recognized that. By summer 2006 servers had ossified into a social hierarchy among guilds where everyone knew everyone. Server transfers opened and whole guilds left servers and showed up on others.
The disruption to the game's community was massive. Before if your guild was the best on the server you felt secure in your position; afterwards, you never knew if a better guild was going to just magically appear out of thin air one day. And that happened.
Before server transfers, when you saw an Ashkandi or any prized item in Orgrimmar you could easily find out how that person got it. Maybe they got it in their guild, or maybe they spent all their DKP on it in their last guild and immediately gquit and joined another, or maybe it was ninja'd, or maybe the guild that achieved that level of progression had disbanded. Every piece of gear had a widely known story. With server transfers, new gear just appeared. Our server only had a handful of Ashkandis for example and everyone knew exactly who had them and how they got them. Then people just started showing up with absolutely no backstory and all this incredible gear. Even a hunter had one. He swore he didn't ninja it, but there was no way to verify his story. It was the beginning of social disruption.

Then came cross realm battlegrounds. Once again, everyone thought this was a great change. We had been crying for it for months as the solution to reduce battleground queue times. Blizzard had been slow to introduce the feature but they finally did at the end of vanilla. Instantly we realized what had been lost. Never again would you queue up for BGs and end up on a team of people you knew, some of whom you admired, some you looked down on, some you had grouped with, some from your former guilds, some from rival guilds, etc. Never again would you face the same enemy players over and over again, learn their names, develop rivalries etc. A Paladin named Soysauce on my server learned to equip his shadow reflector whenever he saw me in a BG. We never spoke but we would emote each other in BGs. A genuine organic rivalry developed.
I came to personally know many of the Rank 14s on my server on both factions simply because we played with/against each other so often. With cross realm battlegrounds, those organic interactions were COMPLETELY GONE.

So you see, what seemed like an obvious QoL improvement to the game had unintended destructive consequences for the game's community. This trend would only continue with first flying mounts, then being able to have a million alts so you never recognized anyone even if you DID see them twice, then teleporting all over the world, LFG/LFR, etc.
You can’t force players to value community. No amount of erasing QoL features will change that. You can make people depend on each other more, but current players do not enjoy that for the most part, which is why so many QoL features were added in the first place. Those guilds that transferred servers are examples of those that do not value community. If you made server transfers free, it would be rampant to the point of only one or two servers with all the players on it. And the community would still suck.


Not sure you speak for what all “current “ players like. I will say that Classic isn’t being developed for everyone. With well over 100 million former players out there, most who clearly are not interested in retail, if a fraction of former players are interested it’ll be fine. We are talking 8 servers per region, they’ll be full.

Many of you seem caught up in the idea that everyone thinks like you do, it’s a common failing in people. The game is down 8-10 million subs since they implemented a lot of QoL systems. You tell me how it’s worked out?
Those of us who want Classic KNOW WHAT WE'RE GETTING INTO.

And we still asked for years for this.
10/24/2018 08:41 AMPosted by Darkynhalvos
Those of us who want Classic KNOW WHAT WE'RE GETTING INTO.

And we still asked for years for this.


Yep! Meanwhile, retail has lost 2/3 of its player base. People are threatened by Classic man, plain and simple. I think what they’re really threatened with is when it’s successful, they’ll be pristine BC servers next, and this retail trash will be a ghost town.

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