+ 7 Mythic Tuning: Concerned.

General Discussion
10/23/2018 09:24 AMPosted by Reshyk
10/23/2018 09:14 AMPosted by Rastlin
1) It was a real, slow, painful slog. The trash was very, very hard. With the exception of the last boss, the trash was much worse than the bosses. That really should never be the case. And with Grievous, keeping people up really stressed my mana. Drinking literally after every pull was a must.

The trash is a significant part of the challenge in M+, deliberately so. Knowing which packs to pull and which to avoid as well as how to deal with some of the more dangerous packs is part of the whole package. Especially on a Fortified week it is 100% intended that the trash be harder than the bosses.

In raids the challenges are segmented into the individual bosses. In M+ the challenge is the dungeon.

10/23/2018 09:14 AMPosted by Rastlin
But again, this unforgiving tuning was all for a +7.

A Seven!
Beating a +7 rewards you with gear on par with a Heroic raid. It’s not supposed to be easy.

Ultimately though it’s hard not to read your post as, “my group didn’t perform mechanics correctly and got punished.” Which is... expected? Are you proposing that mechanics not be punishing in high level content? (And make no mistake, this is high level content.)


Thanks for the reply.

Sure, you should be punished. But any little mistake was a wipe.

And it really doesn't seem like a +7 is "high content". That should be reserved, in my humble opinion, for +11 and beyond.

Compared to last expansion, the +7 is much, much, much harder.

Couldn't we just tune it the way we did then?

Thanks again for the reply.

Best Regards,
Rastlin
10/23/2018 09:35 AMPosted by Reshyk
I think Shrine is my least favorite dungeon of the whole set. I avoid that one like the plague.
I'm with you there... Not a fan of the council boss at all...
10/23/2018 09:14 AMPosted by Rastlin
I did my first mythic +7 yesterday in the Motherload. It just didn't feel right.

The group was a PUG, with an advertised ilevel minimum of 350. We had a tank right around that level with myself at 363 and the dps about the same.


Since +7 will drop 360 at the end of the dungeon and 370 at the end of the week, it sounds like it was just about exactly the right difficulty level for your group.

When you're ready to do +10s, you'll be able to do +10s, and get the appropriate rewards for that difficulty level.

10/23/2018 09:37 AMPosted by Rastlin
Compared to last expansion, the +7 is much, much, much harder.


Agree that lower-level keys are harder.

10/23/2018 09:37 AMPosted by Rastlin
Couldn't we just tune it the way we did then?


Why? +7 is just a number. If it's getting you upgrades it's working as intended.

Back to the Sunday threads with ye!
10/23/2018 09:21 AMPosted by Synsha
10/23/2018 09:16 AMPosted by Undeadaf
started reading, then realized this is a rastlin post
This.

Still rocking Darkmoon Deck: Blockades as an enhancement shaman eh? Sorry to say it, but I sorta see why you couldn't finish a 7...

I told you last time this came up... Get fathoms...


He plays resto in dungeons. Can you picture it?

Yes we know already, OP. Anything challenging to you must be nerfed into the ground to suit your needs, heck the rest of the world who might not want everything to be easy.
10/23/2018 09:37 AMPosted by Rastlin
Thanks for the reply.

Sure, you should be punished. But any little mistake was a wipe.

And it really doesn't seem like a +7 is "high content". That should be reserved, in my humble opinion, for +11 and beyond.

Compared to last expansion, the +7 is much, much, much harder.

Couldn't we just tune it the way we did then?

Thanks again for the reply.

Best Regards,
Rastlin

"High content" is relative... a +7 is out of reach content for a new 120... it's chump change for my druid. It seems that, for your groups skill level, a +7 is high content for you.

What's funny is that if you had asked for help and explained what you were doing during the fight, I'm willing to bet people would step up to help you overcome the challenge. Instead you posted in typical Rastlin fashion: I couldn't do it, nerf it.
Your only option is to stop making silly mistakes. Seek perfection or fail. Do what is required of you and pass. Stay or leave. Test your might or lose. GITGUDREEEE
Oh yeah Rastlin

We are at it again :)

10/23/2018 09:39 AMPosted by Noblessé
Test your might


Now i have to watch the mortal combat theme song
10/23/2018 09:37 AMPosted by Rastlin
And it really doesn't seem like a +7 is "high content". That should be reserved, in my humble opinion, for +11 and beyond.

Compared to last expansion, the +7 is much, much, much harder.
If you’re comparing it to the end of Legion it gets a little wonky there since at the end of Legion, rewards capped out at +15 while here they cap out at +10. So while numerically a 7 is a 7 it’s comparatively greater in terms of how hard it is in relation to other content. So a +7 now would be comparable to ~+11 at the end of Legion. (Mostly going by what difficulty dropped the ilvl of the Heroic difficulty of whatever the current raid was at the time.)

Plus I would like to add that since the 3rd affix pops up at +7 that’ll typically be a massive difficulty jump no matter what you do.

If you wanted to retune it you’d also have to adjust the rewards for M+ and what they cap out at.
10/23/2018 09:31 AMPosted by Synsha
10/23/2018 09:28 AMPosted by Setheus
You say you are 363 but the armory has determined that was a lie.

No privacy settings for Armory so sorry.
He said he was healing and he's in his enhancement set. He may have a separate higher ilvl resto set.


Thanks.

I just logged in to be sure (don't tell the boss at work!) and my enhancement set is 359 and my resto set 363. (Trinkets T'zanes Barkspines and Doom's hatred.)

I do world content in enhancement and usually end up logging out in that set.

And, while checking, I got yucky 355 shoulders in my loot chest....bummer.
And a +3 key for Atal'Dazar with Tyrannical.

Best Regards,
Rastlin
10/23/2018 09:44 AMPosted by Rastlin
And a +3 key for Atal'Dazar with Tyrannical.
Tyrannical Atal’Dazar is one of the less intense ones out there so that should be an easy key to grow. The Totem boss and the last boss may be a bit stressful but the dungeon as a whole is one of the easier ones I think.
I agree a +7 is overtuned for the type of person that buys or crafts a tank trinket for a dps spec. But for the other so called "elitist" that actually know how to play the game an can perform simple mechanics , no it's not overtuned.

Now rastlin I get it this is a video game an you dont want to have to think you just want to have fun an that's why there is lfr, pet battles, warfronts, lfg battle grounds, heroic dungeons, mythic plus up to a 4, etc. All this content aimed at players like youself.

butif you want to start doing higher end content expect it to actually take coordination, an expect mistakes to actually have a price.

I wont tell you to get good theres no point you dont want to improve a that's perfectly fine. but stop trying to ruin challenging content just because you cant complete it
10/10 would read again. Please do a write-up for every dungeon thanks.
Have you ever considered that each time you post a +x is over tuned that it is just you pushing your limit?

10/23/2018 09:14 AMPosted by Rastlin
The timer-just impossible to beat. Impossible.


That is why people don't beat 15+?
Install raider.io
What's the problem? M+ is designed to eventually present a wall, you group at the time hit that wall on a +7 key. Not being able to complete it doesn't mean it's overtuned, you don't deserve to complete it just because you did +7s in Legion.
I just wonder if he is using his correct gear.
10/23/2018 09:37 AMPosted by Rastlin
Compared to last expansion, the +7 is much, much, much harder.


At this time, +10 is comparable to mythic raiding (385)

So +7 is about heroic (370)

+7 should be challenging especially if your group is 350ish and not doing mechanics well.

If you expect +7 to be the same difficulty as LFR you just have the wrong expectations.
I would say try it on a different week. I've done Motherlode up to an 8 and to me it is the easiest Mythic dungeon to clear, timer or not.

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