Sylvanas ordered Wrathgate to happen?

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11/09/2018 06:36 PMPosted by Kazala
Blizzard absolutely did not have a problem with his "the players just don't know what fun is" mentality. That's become the Blizzard ethos more or less across the board.


::He would gaze at dual wield Frost DK and not receiving the brand new Frostmourne model.::
If you're going to release 3 different lore books to set the record straight, why go out and contradict them?

Whatwhatwhat are you doing?
11/09/2018 06:42 PMPosted by Gladwell
If you're going to release 3 different lore books to set the record straight, why go out and contradict them?

Whatwhatwhat are you doing?

Considering the book says Saurfang jr died to blight, maybe they are changing history to what he said now?
Or maybe continuity is hard to maintain for blizzard?
11/09/2018 06:48 PMPosted by Granfaloon
Or maybe continuity is hard to maintain for blizzard?

I think they said recently that they simply don't care about continuity, and in fact view it as a hindrance.

I mean they didn't need to outright say it, they've made it clear enough on their own over the years, that's hardly something new for them. But I do think they said it upfront recently.

Which makes you wonder why they even hire lore historians.
11/09/2018 06:48 PMPosted by Granfaloon
Or maybe continuity is hard to maintain for blizzard?

I think they said recently that they simply don't care about continuity, and in fact view it as a hindrance.

I mean they didn't need to outright say it they've made it clear enough on their own over the years, but I do think they said it upfront recently.

Which makes you wonder why they even hire lore historians.

I won't accept that without proof. It would make me feel even worse about caring about the story. If they are saying they don't care why should anyone? So thinking it was just a misquote or something is easier on my brain.
11/09/2018 06:48 PMPosted by Granfaloon
Or maybe continuity is hard to maintain for blizzard?

I think they said recently that they simply don't care about continuity, and in fact view it as a hindrance.

I mean they didn't need to outright say it they've made it clear enough on their own over the years, but I do think they said it upfront recently.

Which makes you wonder why they even hire lore historians.


While the italics are correct, the context is important. Iirc it was in reference to /generally/ obscure pieces of lore getting in the way of the story they wish to tell. An example of this in action would be Derek P having been torched to cinders in war2, now a mostly preserved corpse in BfA.

Yes It can lead to...significant problems as we are seeing, but slavish devotion to each obscure lore aspect can be extremely limiting as well. Imo they have really flubbed to hard to the disregard side of the pendulum, but atleast they still have not created yet their own in universe event to actually allow any and all lore retcons they choose (here is looking at you elder Scrolls)...yet
I'll try to find the thread it was posted in.

Edit: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20768516940?page=2#post-22

This is where I remember it, but upon googling the quote I can't find a source. So maybe it's not true.
but I do think they said it upfront recently.
https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/08/14/a-look-inside-how-blizzard-maintains-world-of-warcrafts-lore

“My team believes that continuity exists to enhance a story, not to tie the hands of creators.”

That's Sean Copeland-- the guy in charge of protecting the integrity of the setting.

It's like having Scott Pruitt heading the EPA.

There are quotes from Ion in the article along the same lines, but that's the infamous quote that got memed at the time.
11/09/2018 06:56 PMPosted by Reignac
I'll try to find the thread it was posted in.

Edit: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20768516940?page=2#post-22

This is where I remember it, but upon googling the quote I can't find a source. So maybe it's not true.

Looks untrue, but I understand ignoring derek being ashes to use him as a plot device. They do things like that all the time. Although there is a prominent example of them backtracking on that with Falsted. Kuradin is still trapped in cata I think, right?

I guess the question is, can we avoid it and keep the same story? If no, then what do you expect them to do? re-write the entire expansion because they don't like a minor part within a book?

Now re-writing the wrathgate, a major event that had lasting effects in the current game we are playing? That's not minor. That's a critical detail I LIVED through. Very frustrating.
11/09/2018 06:36 PMPosted by Kazala
which ended up revitalizing the game and making it worth playing.


The revitalization came long before that. It was a long process that continued with Reaper of Souls, but by then he was following the new direction.
11/09/2018 07:58 PMPosted by Nairdrix
The revitalization came long before that. It was a long process that continued with Reaper of Souls, but by then he was following the new direction.
That may very well be the case. I'd quit playing loooong before RoS, came back when it released, and found the game much improved.

In any case, whenever the game started getting better, Jay was at the helm.
11/09/2018 07:02 PMPosted by Kazala
but I do think they said it upfront recently.
https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/08/14/a-look-inside-how-blizzard-maintains-world-of-warcrafts-lore

“My team believes that continuity exists to enhance a story, not to tie the hands of creators.”

That's Sean Copeland-- the guy in charge of protecting the integrity of the setting.

It's like having Scott Pruitt heading the EPA.

There are quotes from Ion in the article along the same lines, but that's the infamous quote that got memed at the time.


We have had disagreements, but you are killing it today with the relevant info on this subject, Kazala.

The info you brought up on the Wrathgate and the context of this quote have been weighing heavily on me, in light of the announcement mentioned in the title.
11/09/2018 08:06 PMPosted by Cursewords
We have had disagreements, but you are killing it today with the relevant info on this subject, Kazala.


I swear its like he went super sayian lore god mode. That power level tho.
11/09/2018 08:03 PMPosted by Kazala
That may very well be the case. I'd quit playing loooong before RoS, came back when it released, and found the game much improved.

In any case, whenever the game started getting better, Jay was at the helm.


My main point in all this is that Jay Wilson could have been the one running Diablo 3 from beginning to end, but it was only after the team started listening to the community that the game started to improve as much as it did. I mean, maybe they weren't listening and they just happen to come up with ideas that coincidentally matched with what the community had been asking for. I find that unlikely, but ultimately, it was their blatant disregard for community complaints that made Diablo 3 flop at the start. So I believe they should know better by now.

Of course, I'm operating from the assumption that the story really does matter for WoW's future. I do believe that they tend to have a more positive response to gameplay issues, which is likely what really drives the majority of the game's playerbase to come back or stay. It's very easy to appease me in that regard. So I rarely complain about the gameplay.
11/09/2018 12:12 PMPosted by Bronnix
Afrasiabi just forgot the lore again nothing new he flubs it constantly. Remember when he thought Falstad was dead?
"I have been writing Sylvanas for years." literally very next second says something wrong about her
It is both vindicating and saddening watching people’s faith in the writers crumble.
11/09/2018 10:03 PMPosted by Arlifrex
It is both vindicating and saddening watching people’s faith in the writers crumble.
That's precisely how I feel.

Folks like Curse who took Blizzard at their word that they weren't doing exactly what they're doing and have been doggedly defending the Dark Lady deserved better.
11/09/2018 02:32 PMPosted by Treng
I mean, she's villainizing the Horde. Of course I'm not going to like her.


I am just amused at the whole metaness of it all. Look just keep supporting your boy Saurfang and I'll keep cheering for Anduin, with any luck they both get the chance to wipe the floor with Sylvanas.
11/10/2018 11:28 AMPosted by Zerde
11/09/2018 02:32 PMPosted by Treng
I mean, she's villainizing the Horde. Of course I'm not going to like her.


I am just amused at the whole metaness of it all. Look just keep supporting your boy Saurfang and I'll keep cheering for Anduin, with any luck they both get the chance to wipe the floor with Sylvanas.


Its only fitting that Anduin and the Alliance nor Saurfang and pals can't defeat Sylvanas on their own.
11/10/2018 11:41 AMPosted by Deathisfinal
Its only fitting that Anduin and the Alliance nor Saurfang and pals can't defeat Sylvanas on their own.


To any true fan of the Alliance, its not a slight when you needed others to help you, especially against an evil such as Sylvanas. Nor will it ultimately matter for the bad guy. People will remember the bad guy failed to complete their goal(and possibly died) not that they needed a group of people to take down.

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