What are your opinions on Voidform

Priest
I myself NEVER liked it, I just couldn't bring myself to play shadow in legion, I was hoping they would remove it in bfa but I knew they wouldn't. Just wondering what you guys think.
It's the font from which all design problems with Shadow spring.

Voidform is just Clarity of Power gameplay with a visual upgrade, we spam the same two single target nukes (Mind Blast & Void Bolt) for 50-70% of a fight, then throw out some DoTs, then go back to Clarity of Power'ing.

The spec is unplayable it's so clunky:

* because Void Bolt & Mind Blast cooldowns don't align and cannot be delayed, so we don't cast between them

* because the ramp-up into Voidform is not enjoyable and cannot be delayed, denying us any player agency over when our burst occurs, making us feel weak naturally (out of Voidform)

* because once we're in Voidform we're very conflicted about staying in Voidform: Void Eruption is the reward, and staying in Voidform delays any future reward

* because since Voidform & related mechanics amount to 54% of our overall DPS, our DoTs and execute damage are both garbage because that power budget had to come out of somewhere

* because we don't flay minds anymore, we've lost our iconic feel, we've lost the soul of the spec

* because Insanity makes no sense as a resource on its own, Insanity is not a super power its a severe mental disorder. What I originally proposed going into Legion was 'Willpower & Insanity', and Insanity was a heat mechanic, it was supposed to be the "bad resource", our Will was supposed to be our good resource.
I like it for one reason and dislike it for two.

I like it because it was a fun mini-game in a raid environment, and you really feel the impact of both gear and mastery over how you play.

I disliked it because outside of raid environments it was a pain to manage and use, especially when questing. If you don't pop it you feel weak, but if you do it always feels like overkill. Pulling several mobs and popping eruption was a fun risk-reward way to use it, but that's about it.

I really disliked it for thematic reasons. We are SHADOW priests, not void priests. If you want to say your priests draws from the void that's fine, but priest lore used to not have anything to do with that. Forsaken priests wanted to become pure shadow(not void), draenei shadow priests were used to speak with the dead(undeath is specifically different than void), etc. The current iteration would be similar to having paladins all focused around Naruu. That's cool and all, works great for Draenei, but how do you think Tauren would feel about it? I like dark and shadowy things, but space-purple doesn't appeal to me.
It needs to be removed. Maybe then priests can have a dps spec once again.
I like voidform, I like shadowform. I think having both is redundant though.
Voidform as a concept is fine. I don’t want to go back to orbs/Ravens/whatever flavorless nonsense iteration we were before legion.

Mechanically it could use some work but it’s not as awful as many of the doomsayers are saying it is
Void Form is a fundamentally misguided mechanic.

The core issue is that it simply lasts too long. This makes it worthless in every type of content that isn't a boss fight. However, the fact that it exists means that a balancing for boss fights underpowers Shadow Priests in all other content.

I don't think it's a particularly interesting mechanic either. It's just mindless added complexity to a rotation rather than presenting real choices to the player.
I liked it when I could permanently keep dots up on my targets.

I really dislike having to constantly tab target to reapply dots cause they fall off so often.
Legion voidform was the most fun I've had as Shadow in 11 years. BFA voidform is the least fun I've had.
Do not like. Poorly designed mechanics that obviously has a hard time being fixed. Seems like the people who design the class...don’t play the class.

But hey, at least the lore fanatics are happy, right?
I'm in the camp that Voidform can work, it just needs to be more flexible than what it currently is. Having to rigidly adhere to its rhythm is something I'm not a big fan of, because it while it works in theory, in practice it starts to fall apart because things rarely follow that rhythm.

Give it more wiggle room on when and how long we can use it for and it'll play a lot nicer.
10/23/2018 12:56 PMPosted by Skootalloo
I'm in the camp that Voidform can work, it just needs to be more flexible than what it currently is. Having to rigidly adhere to its rhythm is something I'm not a big fan of, because it while it works in theory, in practice it starts to fall apart because things rarely follow that rhythm.

Give it more wiggle room on when and how long we can use it for and it'll play a lot nicer.

Would you be okay if they made it a talent, with the rest of the class not designed around it? That way you can still use it but feel-bad moments don't completely obliterate your DPS?
you are all fools!

Dad form is the best form
I am not a Shadow main, but playing it casually, I like it. It's very fast paced and frantic and I tend to love fast pacing in any spec. I like having to micro-manage and figure out where I can go all in and hit 'em hard (I'm a Disc main, go figure). It feels rewarding in any build and spend spec to reach your spender; it feels powerful, at least visually.

It is the core problem in why it's impossible to balance, and for that reason alone it may have to go, but I would be sad if it left. Other versions felt bland to me.
10/23/2018 12:35 PMPosted by Sneauxman

But hey, at least the lore fanatics are happy, right?


I'm a huge lore fanatic. I've been writing Shadow lore posts since 2006. I hate Voidform & Insanity.
10/23/2018 10:12 AMPosted by Vyskera
Void Form is a fundamentally misguided mechanic.

The core issue is that it simply lasts too long. This makes it worthless in every type of content that isn't a boss fight. However, the fact that it exists means that a balancing for boss fights underpowers Shadow Priests in all other content.

I don't think it's a particularly interesting mechanic either. It's just mindless added complexity to a rotation rather than presenting real choices to the player.


...

(Sigh)

Let me ask you something, since apparently I was trying to troll in Holy DPS.

So not trolling and out of pure curiosity: How many changes have you managed from Blizzard to get implemented with all your nice math, commentary and 2000+ posts? I already knkw your recommendation for Holy DPS, but aside from that, and this is a legit question: How many changes have you managed to get implemented from Blizzard?
10/23/2018 01:05 PMPosted by Obzedat
10/23/2018 12:56 PMPosted by Skootalloo
I'm in the camp that Voidform can work, it just needs to be more flexible than what it currently is. Having to rigidly adhere to its rhythm is something I'm not a big fan of, because it while it works in theory, in practice it starts to fall apart because things rarely follow that rhythm.

Give it more wiggle room on when and how long we can use it for and it'll play a lot nicer.

Would you be okay if they made it a talent, with the rest of the class not designed around it? That way you can still use it but feel-bad moments don't completely obliterate your DPS?

Totally, that was something I was vocal about in the beta. Options are always good to have, especially when it's something as polarizing as VF.

My little 'dream' scenario would be to have a talent that gives the equivalent of old Devouring Plague that costs insanity, one that mimics the playstyle of Legion Shadow (without Mass Hysteria, that'd be fine) and as a final option...I dunno. Something. My gut instinct is a slower VF similar to what we have now, a middle ground between no-VF and mach-speed-VF that feels more 'methodical' and not insane.
It's awful. the most fun I had playing shadow priest was during mop. You could pool 5 orbs and fear into 3orb disarm on the second player > mindblast kill target > 3 orb DP > filler > 3orb DP was a really cool mechanic once you got used to it. We need stuff like this back in the game. You can hardly outplay anyone in this game anymore.
I like how it feels in raids and long fights (or I did in legion where you could actually stay in it for a good amount of time), that part is fun, way more fun that any previous iteration of Shadow Priest imo, and in that sense it would make me sad if it was removed.

that said..

The problem is that the voidform and insanity mechanics also introduce some important issues in the gameplay (which many people already explained very well). Also some abilities, like the burst damage attached to void eruption kind of work against it, in theory I wanna stay in voidform for as long as possible but at the same time I want to cast void eruption for massive AOE so that makes me want to drop out and reset it.
It's a great concept and needs to stay in the game. It just needs to be changed in the way it works. Legion was great.

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