How accurate were PS compared to Classic?

Classic Discussion
11/14/2018 03:10 AMPosted by Lhyme
11/14/2018 01:00 AMPosted by Kinetics
I never played on Nost, but it speaks volumes that Blizzard shut them down.
Blizzard didn't shut them down. The Nost team had discussions with Blizzard before shutting themselves down and met with the Blizzard team at their headquarters to discuss legacy servers. Nost shut themselves down in good faith that Blizzard would provide Vanilla fans with an official legacy game. The Nostralius team is actually responsible for helping Blizzard figure out things they couldn't on their own.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cii97VwcK6o


They did send them a cease and desist letter. Normally pservers will just open under a new name, it's pretty hard to actually keep them shut down.

Nost did agree to shut down and not reopen in order to talk to blizzard, and they are largely responsible for getting us to where we are now.

Of course they eventually released all of their data and another project reopened the servers along with some news ones. That project has since split into two different projects, two very corrupt drama filled projects.
11/14/2018 03:23 AMPosted by Skjaldbjorn
They did send them a cease and desist letter.
Yep. I'm sure they had tons. All private servers get those. C&D's are merely an intimidation tactic and if they're being sent out of the U.S. they're about as useful as toilet paper.
11/13/2018 08:41 PMPosted by Bandulu
Lights Hope is way more authentic than that trash demo.


That's because the demo was more or less a pre-alpha to show the community how far they've gotten.
At this point my man. IMHO. The private servers are more Blizz like than what blizzard showed us at the Con. Blizz is still catching up to these illegal servers if you ask me.
11/14/2018 02:51 AMPosted by Karkaran
11/14/2018 02:00 AMPosted by Hazzay
No ones answered however how the pservers know all the database values to use for mob attack rates dodge chances etc.

Surely many values were not calculable and shown on all the thottbot etc. Websites so how did pservers get a hold of all the database values to host vanilla servers accurately?
I'm genuinely curious also.


And if you want to believe blizzard, they lost all their old data too. I'm sort of 50/50 on Blizzard being able to out do a private server ATM. Specially knowing blizzards track record as of late with games.
Nah, Blizzard have the correct data from 1.12. They found it in their backups, so all the accurate values would be there.
I can sum up how accurate pservers are real easy for you...
There are people claiming Pservers have 50% warrior and 25% rogue and only 25% combined for the other 7 classes. LMAO that tells you right there they are not even close.

Then you see pserver posts about warriors in blue doing more DPS than any other class in full epics...lol

clearly at least some of the pservers are modified crap.
Private servers are trash. Run by horrible, greedy people and filled with drama. Private server developers and players wouldn't know what was Vanilla-like if it hit them in the face.

Of course, you'll have people here defending it, paid shills, just like in the wowservers reddit where shills of one server attack players of other servers. It's humorous to watch actually.

In short: Don't take private servers or their players seriously. They're nothing like Vanilla beyond using the client.
11/14/2018 02:00 AMPosted by Hazzay
No ones answered however how the pservers know all the database values to use for mob attack rates dodge chances etc.

Surely many values were not calculable and shown on all the thottbot etc. Websites so how did pservers get a hold of all the database values to host vanilla servers accurately?
I'm genuinely curious also.


They didn't. They guessed. That being said the demo was trash and pservers were much better.

The issue with private servers is when it comes with raiding. 1.12 wasn't around long enough in order for anyone to know how it was like. If you were still hardcore raiding and not looking at tbc around the corner you were in naxx. Not mc or bwl.

I don't think we will ever know what 1
12 was like. Classic is going too have different numbers. This applies to pservers as well.
THe speed which guilds wreck naxx is very suspicious.
It depends on the server, a lot of them where terrible but some of them get it right by using information collected from addons and the cache folders at the time.

Theres also more values in the client then people think, all the spell values and damages are in the spells.dbc file in the data folder mpq files before Blizzard switched to casc.

The only thing that was missing was scripted events which private servers had to recreate on their own.
I started wow in 2005 just after the holidays. i quit retail wow a month or so into pandaland. I have played on Elysium before it split and China's Hope was born. I've leveled at least half the classes to 30 on China's Hope.

I remember vanilla and these two servers (based off of Nost) are super close. I am not a paid shill, but just a fan of vanilla. The only time either have not felt authentic was when quests were bugged (not too often, few times on the way to 30, but when it happens it really sucks and you realize this is not blizzard).

as far as mobs, I honestly do not notice any difference in their hit points, dps output, etc. Same with instances.

Spawn rates can be a bit off. Namely caves. But this is done since sometimes there are quite a few people in an area. I would rather have a populated busy world with dynamic spawn rates than sharding tho.

One thing i def notice with these ps vs vanilla is how busy some areas can be. i dont ever remember vanilla being so busy in the world as these ps. i prefer more activity in the world and in that sense the ps have been even better than vanilla. vanilla wow questing is much more fun with lots of other human interaction, be it friend or foe. hopefully the sharding keeps the pop heavy and not too light. if its too light then ps have already beat blizz. ymmv, jmho.
11/14/2018 05:07 AMPosted by Lorissa
I can sum up how accurate pservers are real easy for you...
There are people claiming Pservers have 50% warrior and 25% rogue and only 25% combined for the other 7 classes. LMAO that tells you right there they are not even close.

Then you see pserver posts about warriors in blue doing more DPS than any other class in full epics...lol

clearly at least some of the pservers are modified crap.
No...
You have it wrong...

If classic WoW was just patch 1.12.... that is what the class demographics would be. Classic was never just patch 1.12.

In the late couple patches threat was buffed significantly and gear kept scaling... the biggest issue warriors had was they pulled too much threat(Not an issue in 1.12) and they are very gear dependent(Not an issue in 1.12)...

pre patch 1.11 dps warrior wasn't really a thing.
11/14/2018 05:08 AMPosted by Natiari
Private servers are trash. Run by horrible, greedy people and filled with drama. Private server developers and players wouldn't know what was Vanilla-like if it hit them in the face.

Of course, you'll have people here defending it, paid shills, just like in the wowservers reddit where shills of one server attack players of other servers. It's humorous to watch actually.

In short: Don't take private servers or their players seriously. They're nothing like Vanilla beyond using the client.


You've never played on a private server so in the words of the great Matt Wilson.... SHUUUUUUSH.
11/14/2018 06:15 AMPosted by Tundren
11/14/2018 05:07 AMPosted by Lorissa
I can sum up how accurate pservers are real easy for you...
There are people claiming Pservers have 50% warrior and 25% rogue and only 25% combined for the other 7 classes. LMAO that tells you right there they are not even close.

Then you see pserver posts about warriors in blue doing more DPS than any other class in full epics...lol

clearly at least some of the pservers are modified crap.
No...
You have it wrong...

If classic WoW was just patch 1.12.... that is what the class demographics would be. Classic was never just patch 1.12.

In the late couple patches threat was buffed significantly and gear kept scaling... the biggest issue warriors had was they pulled too much threat(Not an issue in 1.12) and they are very gear dependent(Not an issue in 1.12)...

pre patch 1.11 dps warrior wasn't really a thing.

So what you are saying is 1.12 ruined threat, unbalanced everything, and with threat gone made the game 100 steps closer to the live version? ... and this is the patch they choose to use?
11/13/2018 06:22 PMPosted by Brockthorn
I did some lookup for mobs/quests/experience/gear as I leveled on ND.

I used a few vanilla DB sites out there.

I found it pretty accurate. Mob health, quest experience, rep gained, gear itemization matched the DB sites.


Well I mean of course they matched up with vanilla database sites. I'm sure that's where they got the data from.
11/14/2018 02:00 AMPosted by Hazzay
No ones answered however how the pservers know all the database values to use for mob attack rates dodge chances etc.

Surely many values were not calculable and shown on all the thottbot etc. Websites so how did pservers get a hold of all the database values to host vanilla servers accurately?
I'm genuinely curious also.


It was from datamining vanilla. That's the only way they could have accurate data. Thottbot probably had a lot more data than what was displayed on their website. I imagine those who made private servers got their hands on pretty much everything that was ever obtained from datamining, which would be basically everything including a lot of stuff that you can't directly see with the default UI.

Quest text, NPC hit point values, mage frostbolt damage values, number of experience gained from killing x level mob, etc... All of that sort of stuff was datamined.
11/14/2018 07:06 AMPosted by Dealloc
11/13/2018 06:22 PMPosted by Brockthorn
I did some lookup for mobs/quests/experience/gear as I leveled on ND.

I used a few vanilla DB sites out there.

I found it pretty accurate. Mob health, quest experience, rep gained, gear itemization matched the DB sites.


Well I mean of course they matched up with vanilla database sites. I'm sure that's where they got the data from.


At one point they didn't though. pservers were using TBC quest experience values.
That was uncovered by some players and quite a few of the pservers redid the values to be in line with vanilla. This was just recent within the last couple of months. When ND launched they said they fixed their DB to reflect vanilla values.

Won't post any links but you can find that issue using google.
11/14/2018 02:51 AMPosted by Karkaran
And if you want to believe blizzard, they lost all their old data too. I'm sort of 50/50 on Blizzard being able to out do a private server ATM. Specially knowing blizzards track record as of late with games.


No. They did not lose their data. The lead classic developer explicitly stated that they did indeed have a 1.12 database backup.

They have 1.12 data. They have 1.12 client and server source code. They have a 100% authentic 1.12 server running and they're using it to compare their new and improved Classic to in order to ensure it's authentic.
11/14/2018 06:19 AMPosted by Lorissa
<span class="truncated">...</span>No...
You have it wrong...

If classic WoW was just patch 1.12.... that is what the class demographics would be. Classic was never just patch 1.12.

In the late couple patches threat was buffed significantly and gear kept scaling... the biggest issue warriors had was they pulled too much threat(Not an issue in 1.12) and they are very gear dependent(Not an issue in 1.12)...

pre patch 1.11 dps warrior wasn't really a thing.

So what you are saying is 1.12 ruined threat, unbalanced everything, and with threat gone made the game 100 steps closer to the live version? ... and this is the patch they choose to use?
Yes...patch 1.12 only lasted a few months too xD
Played on Scriptcraft, Emerald Dream / Feenix, Kronos 1/2/3, Nostalrius, RetroWoW, Elysium, Light's Hope, and have 11 60s to my name on both factions, aside from the 2 auto 60s you get on RetroWoW.

Some were good and true like Vanilla was, and others weren't. Early on a lot of servers had bad scripting. Mobs pulling through dungeons or falling through wings in a raid. Escorts tethering to anything in a 500 unit radius forever. Damage and spell coefficients horribly off.

But then come the Nostalrius core. And it was pretty damn good. Good enough it blew up the private server world and put Vanilla back on everyone's radar. It bound together old friends and enemies and even garnered enough attention from our champion Blizzard to go after it directly. And even then those guys got an audience with Blizzard.

The Nost core is virtually Vanilla. I played from November 29th, 2004, 9 days after the US release, all the way into BC. And I played *a lot*. Server-firsted a lot of content in Vanilla for <Apathetic> on Shadowsong.

The Nost core is what current Light's Hope / Northdale is run on. There are some things that were changed and definitely not Blizzlike, such as Lupos. But on a whole, the questing / dungeons (LoS pulls, pathing, alpha and beta mechanics on bosses like Shredder in Deadmines actually using his fear) / ranking system is par-to-none.

If I was Blizzard, I'd be taking the popular streamers/content creators like Monkeynews, Esfand, Tipsout, Payo, Staysafe, Big Musk, the boys from Dreamstate, and everyone on *every* private server staff (and I do mean all of them), and I'd get them under 1 roof in 1 room and simply ask them, "ok, how do we do this? Monkeynews, let's start with you." Hire a monitor and a court transcriptionist and get to work on the notes.

I would hold that session every day, for 4-8 hours, for months. I would log into private servers and try them out. They're good enough of reference points to do so.

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