M+ Timer is extremely frustrating for pugs.

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10/07/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Verbatim


Yeah because this is the complain for raid bosses as well , am i right??


I'm positive that the people who complain about timers in M+ are not useful in raids either. If they actually are okay with enrage timers on bosses but not okay with timers in M+ they have a problem that I can't understand and don't care about.


Because a sole timer on a boss isn’t really the same as the timer on the instance. You think it is. But it’s not. But you probably don’t think things thru, do you?
10/07/2018 10:17 PMPosted by Verbatim
...

I'm positive that the people who complain about timers in M+ are not useful in raids either. If they actually are okay with enrage timers on bosses but not okay with timers in M+ they have a problem that I can't understand and don't care about.


Because a sole timer on a boss isn’t really the same as the timer on the instance. You think it is. But it’s not. But you probably don’t think things thru, do you?


When making a statement like that you should point out why it's true. Because to me....

Kill the Boss before enrage timer
Complete the instance for completion timer

...seems like they're close to the exact same goal. Do the thing before the thing happens.
git gud
MMO is about you grouping up with people overcoming what is thought to be an impossible challenge.

M+ represents everything about MMO. What you talking about?
10/06/2018 07:06 AMPosted by Tunkaningan
10/05/2018 01:36 PMPosted by Paeldryth
What an amazingly dramatic post.

Oh no, you didn't beat a timer, now you have to suffer the consequence of having a key that is 1 level lower.


Eh, it's not as simple as that. M+ does bring out quite the toxic people. You have to either A) Be just as toxic back, B) ignore it or C) don't bother with M+ altogether.


Uh, you're missing the most obvious choice of all.

D) Do M+ with guildies and friends who are willing to work together and not be a garbage human being at each other.

Finding a good guild to play with is the most important part of this game, IMO.
10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
That timer runs counter to everything that a multiplayer rpg is supposed to be about. It completely counters communication at all but the most base level, it completely counters adapting tactics or strategy. It nullifies everything except barreling through at a breakneck pace and praying that everyone already knows exactly what to do.
Not my experience. At all. I have a regular group of friends I run M+ with. We've been together since 7.2, getting together twice a week to run keys. We hang out in Discord, make small talk, and spend a fair amount of time planning our runs. M+ does NOT counter adapting tactics or strategy; it encourages both of these things by presenting challenges that can only be overcome by adapting tactics and strategy. And teamwork. More than anything else, pushing high keys requires teamwork. M+ is the best addition to WoW since transmog.
10/05/2018 01:39 PMPosted by Aesadai
This is exactly why I don’t do mythic dungeons. I actually don’t do anything in any games where they add an abstract timer as a way to increase difficulty. It’s not my jam and never will be. I just raid and do other activities.


Lol you do realize raiding has a timer right? Enrage timer.

Nothing wrong with wanting more M+ modes but I find the irony in your comment hilarious.
10/06/2018 09:18 AMPosted by Twangg
I hate the timers too. The extra affixes are enough.

And raider.io is cancer to the game as well. We've been through all this before, and it will end badly. That site is going to force a brutal design change. You watch.
Like Blizz internalizing the scores? Like they did with gear score?

All Raider.IO does is link your relevant experience so it's visible in game.
That's only a problem if you don't have relevant experience, and yet are determined to apply to groups of strangers rather than making friends and pushing your own keys.
10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
It removes my favorite thing about the game, making friends and attacking challenging content and working through it.
How so? I have a group of friends I made from running M+; these are my best friends in game at the moment. We met through M+ back in early Legion and still meet twice a week to run M+ together. We went from struggling to get our +10s done to completing a couple of +20s because of our improving teamwork. I don't get what you're saying here at all. My experience has been exactly the opposite.
10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
you cannot use the only means left to communicate by typing
Well there's part of your problem. Why aren't you hanging out in voice comms with your friends?
10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
Allow them time to strategize cc and interrupts.
We absolutely strategize CC and interrupts. We just don't do it on the clock. That's mostly stuff you discuss before you put the key in. You can make adjustments on the fly, like someone calling out that they can't get their interrupt because X, so the next person in line gets it, but most of the strategy happens before you start.

10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
Allow them to play the game the way it has been played for 90% of its life.
For 90% of the life of WoW, dungeons have become obsolete within weeks of expansion launch. Legion was the first expansion ever to keep dungeons truly relevant the entire expansion. M+ is one of Blizz's best improvements ever.

10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
magically find other perfect people to play with that will always be available when I am.
Not magic. It's called making friends. Then you talk to your friends about when they are available, and you eventually find 4 friends who can meet once or twice a week to do M+. Is that so hard?

10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
I am supposed to somehow communicate my thoughts and tactics telepathically with my pugs.
Nah. You buy a headset and download discord. :D

10/05/2018 01:30 PMPosted by Tinder
That timer creates the toxicity that is rampant in M+ (not just pugs even my static groups are more awful to each other because of the stress of the timer).
That's on you and the people you game with. Nothing about M+ requires you to be bad people. My friends and I may get stressed by the challenges of M+, but it's healthy stress. We support each other, own our mistakes, and work as a team to improve. We are not elite but we have fun together.
I actually prefer the timer as it keeps the runs short and more satisfying. Spending hours in a dungeon because people keep dying to the same mechanics is more of a headache than anything else and leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth.

Completing a key on time is an affirmation of the effort you put into learning a dungeon.
10/06/2018 07:06 AMPosted by Tunkaningan
Eh, it's not as simple as that. M+ does bring out quite the toxic people. You have to either A) Be just as toxic back, B) ignore it or C) don't bother with M+ altogether.
No.

You put the rude people on ignore and send friend request to the nice people.
Soon you have a friends list full of people you can enjoy M+ with.
And eventually maybe you find 4 friends to make a regular team with.
Then you never have to pug again. :)
I think they should change it to be a maximum amount of deaths and require 1tank 1 healer and 3 dps to start.
The timer aspect is crucial to the system. Without it you could just infinitely upgrade the key by spending 3 hours hard CC'ing every mob and pulling 1 by 1.

It wasn’t fun in TBC and it’s not fun now. You should be rewarded for optimal play, not victory by attrition.
Go play diablo.
Mythic+ literally ruined WoW. The level of elitism and toxicity are higher than they've ever been.

I'm sure you'll love this game with no one but you left in it.
10/08/2018 01:56 AMPosted by Velexy
Mythic+ literally ruined WoW. The level of elitism and toxicity are higher than they've ever been.


No they're about the same. Players that don't like raider io can just run their own keys.
10/08/2018 01:56 AMPosted by Velexy
Go play diablo.
Mythic+ literally ruined WoW. The level of elitism and toxicity are higher than they've ever been.

I'm sure you'll love this game with no one but you left in it.

Did you start playing a week ago or do you play with your eyes closed? Elitism has been in the game since Vanilla and was worse back then because the barriers of entry were much higher.
10/08/2018 01:56 AMPosted by Velexy
Mythic+ literally ruined WoW. The level of elitism and toxicity are higher than they've ever been.
M+ brought my team together and we've become good friends. None of us are elite and none of us are toxic. We're just some nice folks who enjoy M+ together.
10/08/2018 01:56 AMPosted by Velexy
Go play diablo.
Mythic+ literally ruined WoW. The level of elitism and toxicity are higher than they've ever been.

I'm sure you'll love this game with no one but you left in it.


I feel like this could go down on a list of the dumbest things that people have ever said, and makes me wish downvoting still existed.

It's such a weak assertion that it may as well be self refuting.

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